Mitsuki

Why do you first vote me, then make a case? I was waiting for something to happen while rereading to give some final read. I also lacked motivation for a while. We should lynch you, of course. Kay is neutral and I'd prefer not to lynch her, her logic seems solid. I have been checking her ISO (on a Bearclaw post, page 6 I think) and yeah. My case on Blitz is not my case on Blitz now, as I explained. What is your basis on saying that I just want to pressure the bad guys? I want to pressure the bad guys and lynch the bad guys. Also, it's bad to bring that up because scum don't actually want to pressure the bad guys. The point is invalid. Where are the moments I say something about somebody and I am totally inconclusive? Please quote or link them, and explain them. I think Vhaltz already spoiled me on that one, sorry. Anyways, if you really were town and wanted to prove me wrong you would just need to wait for this game to end. That actually only makes you more scummy. You don't pay much attention as scum. As town you at least find a solid vote and you make your cases before you vote. I already explained why I thought you could see your gutread as faking conviction (I'm not a self confident person). Prims only uses "weird" on my case, not "scummy", which makes his conviction on my case feel fake. His case overall is also a case on me doing weird stuff, not scummy stuff, and that is scummy. Prims, why are my actions scummy? I'm around and I can switch my vote if required.

Well Prims, you've just made a fool out of yourself. I've actually been doubting for a while and each of Blitz's posts increases my feeling that he's not scum. ##Unvote ##Vote: Prims because he's not contributing at all, he wants me to be lynched just based on a gutread when he has never seen my scum play, he didn't even bother to update his SB case and he never said why I was scummier than him, AND gut from his recent posts. I'm good at reading Prims, out of all the games I've read/played I've only been wrong about his alignment once. Overall I expect much more from a player like him, he's just trying to mess around with me and doesn't seem to be moving the game on a townie direction. If I end up being lynched today, please, PLEASE lynch him tomorrow.

Mitsuki (3): Prims, BBM, SB Refa (1): Proto Blitz (2): Mit, Kirsche Kay (2): Refa, Blitz Prims (1): Kay I think this is the votecount right now. Cut by Prims, lol @Proto: Refa is not getting lynched, what are your opinions on other players? It's fine if you don't read the pages, but if possible I'd like you to at least skim to have a general idea of what has happened. Still, it might be a good idea for you to rest for a while away from your computer and lights off.

No one is counterclaiming me on investigative role, so I don't really see the reason why Prims, SB and Blitz still say that my role could be scum.

If I'm left alive to prove my claim I should prove it to someone who doubts it, right? Anyways, I think that investigative powers should be used on the most neutral players and the ones who are harder to get correct reads on (or on players null leaning towards scum), otherwise you may have almost no information on a certain player. SB fits that profile perfectly. Prims, I hope that you actually read the whole thing and give an updated opinion on me, because you're only voting me on gut when you haven't even seen my scum play.

I prefer to test it on SB because I know from experience it's hard to get a read on him. Also because he's suspecting me and doubts my claim. Using my powers on Kirsche or Kay wouldn't help my situation much.

SB, do you really think, based on the role stuff you've seen me doing, that I would think about faking this role when I crumbed it? I didn't even know a role like this could exist before I read about it in my PM. Also I can prove it if you don't lynch me today. SB, I can be targeting you if that's fine.

Does nobody have something to say about my claim or

Kirsche, Kay is neutral to me. My character is Trixie, and I'm the town active/passive role checker. My reply to BBM here was a crumb, as masons existing in this game means that town won't have many power roles while scum will definitely have at least one each, which makes my role weak enough but useful.

I thought yours was a rethorical question. I've been saying for a while I thought it was scummy, but not too scummy. I don't see why I shouldn't have voted under my circumstances at that time.

Blitz, why is the fact that I defend myself scummy? Also, I'd like you to answer my previous question (Why was voting me better than voting someone who you actually thought was scummy?) I don't really think a 9p game where there are two masons would have a 3rd party. Anyways, I don't think any MLP character specially fits any 3rd party, but that might be my terrible memory. Of course I do what comes from me, that was just a question to SB. By the way SB, that doesn't answer my question. Yeah, I'm at L-2 but hammer is not required, that's why I was asking.

I don't like how Prims is doing almost nothing and posting too little. Then again, even if I have changed my opinion on him from "might be town" to neutral, it stays that way. I'm supposed to be good at gutreading him, but I don't seem to be able to get a read on him like that this time. Upon ISOing I don't like how he dropped SB for a gutvote when he had objective reasoning on him. Prims, why did you think that a vote on me was better? I know you were reaction testing me, but after that your vote stayed. Also, what do you think of SB now? I think it's scummy how Blitz used BBM's recent reasoning to explain why he kept his vote on me when he didn't say anything at the time. Also, Blitz, why was voting me better than voting someone who you actually thought was scummy? I don't know how your latter point explains your first one. Anyways, does this make me scummy? Why? It just feels like you're interpreting everything I say from a biased point of view, because if you stop suspecting me you'll have to think and you don't have many reads. And I've only been lynched once in ~10 games (when I played with IRL friends), while in most of them I've been put at L-1 at some point. Also, Blitz's previous vote on me was still a prodvote, while Prims' vote is gut. I also think that other suspicions on me are either weak or bad. It's not about the amout of votes, but rather about their quality. Also, I asked you a question: what do you think of Blitz's previous vote on me? What would you expect a townie to do if, upon reading the thread, they thought something was scummy but not too much and they had to do other stuff then leave for 24 hours? I'm not new to mafia, just new to SF. Should I claim?

So many posts since I went to sleep, wow. I wanted to see a post, that's part of why I said that if someone wanted me to answer something they should ask then. I thought you'd be writing your post while I was asleep, so what do you want me to do? Get angry meanwhile? I decided not to care much about your vote. I'm quite sure it made it easier to sleep. My conviction isn't fake, but I don't know what else do you expect me to say other than "you're wrong". I'm not very self confident but I try not to let that influence my actions, maybe that explains your thoughts. I voted Refa because it's the best I could do at that moment. I didn't find anything else real suspicious back then. I did think Refa was a bit scummy, don't put words on my mouth. SB, Prims, why are you bringing that up now when it didn't bother you when I voted him? All the votes on me are either weak, due to misunderstandings or because there is not really much content to elaborate. Nice, but I'm not getting lynched so you'd better keep thinking. Also, I see this as a towntell, as scum would probably think that they are not being able to form reads due to being scum, and they wouldn't point out their weakness just like that. I also doubt scum would come up with this to make players townread them.

Ok, now I can say that it was null. Still, I'd have liked to get Blitz to answer. Right now the scummiest thing I think he's done is his votepark, anyways. Prims, answer my question. I'm going to sleep.

I'm going to sleep soon, so if you want me to answer something please ask/say so now. Also, I'll spend morning/afternoon (GMT +01:00) tomorrow out, I'll be back way before the deadline though. I'll try to check mafia before I leave, but I don't know how much I will be able to answer.

I can talk to him about the game, but I don't think it can be considered hydraing. He's given me some advice and checks most of my posts for grammar/vocabulary mistakes. He won't give me any reads. I do think that there's scum intent in some, if not all, of Blit'z actions. Read my posts, I've said that he's voteparked on me when his vote started as a prodvote (Question: how does his vote on me seem to you?), that he tried to stop discussion ED1 and some minor stuff more. I want an explanation for Blitz's change on opinion, and depending on what he says I'll think. There are several things that can make you change your opinion and some of them are scummy while others are not. Defending someone might not be scummy. I was just pointing out that defending someone can go against town's wincon. It wasn't a point against Blitz, and I thought it couldn't be seen as one (I was saying so from town!Blitz's perspective, otherwise "giving explanations to potential scum" makes no sense) I don't think Blitz and Refa are scumbuddies, I'm trying to forget about possible scumteams because I always screw up. Blitz is scummy and Refa is mostly null. I don't really see why people wouldn't say sentences like that as scum. I recall reading scum doing similar things. BBM, I'm a very disorganized person, like, much more than average. Ask Vhaltz about it if you want. It's normal for me to comment my opinions on a player like that. Anyways, let me explain my train of thought. First of all I thought Refa was a bit scummy so I voted him, as I didn't really see something scummier but I didn't have real conviction. After that time passed and Blitz was definitely scummy, so I voted Blitz. Since I was asked, had read the thread and I basically hadn't changed my opinion I said so. My opinion kept being the same, "Refa is a bit scummy but what he did isn't that scummy", and I saw no point on mentioning anything else until I was asked (although I should have mentioned something, I know, but I was going to post after that anyways so it didn't even cross my mind). After that I decided to ISO Refa and my opinion changed, so I said it.

My effort to scumhunt more is mostly rendering useless. Would you want to lynch the other if one of them flipped town but not mason, based solely on their claim? If so, why? I'd like you to elaborate on this, if possible. I've read Refa and now I don't think that his Prims vote was a contradiction anymore, he said that he thought that BBM's point was stronger than his townread and I think that voting like that is legit. However, I don't like how both of his serious votes are based on weak reasons (his Prims vote is based on a reaction and his Kay vote is based on her attitude towards the mason claim). I don't think it's too meaningful for now as there's not really that much content to elaborate, but I'd like him to put more effort into the game if possible.

Dude, I was out for more than 24 hours. This is the 3rd time I say that I would be inactive for a long period of time. I know scum tend to be inactive, but the game has just begun, why don't you wait and see if I keep being inactive or if I actually do something from now on? I think Blitz's voteparking just now, because his vote on me just started as a prodvote and now he's keeping it instead of doing something else. Blitz, answer this as well. Do you think I'm scum? Why? You stated that Refa was somehow scummy to change it to a neutral read later on. That was my point asking you that question and what I want you to answer. Also, stop saying that I voted you because you made me angry, that's ad hominem and not true. What I wrote on my previous post already answers the question. It's definitely a Refa defense because he gave reasons on why Refa would do that as town. I know it wasn't a huge change but there was definitely a change. The answer won't be the most relevant thing ever but I still think it will be useful to know. I never thought that Refa was that suspicious anyways and I don't see anything else scummy in his recent posts. Then again, I still need to focus on him and the other people as well. I'm thinking/reading.

I had a fun afternoon/night with friends, thanks. When I came back home it was like 6:30 am so I went to sleep. Now I'm here. Exactly. That's what I meant in the first place. It's risky as well, which was part of my point. If one of them is lynched because the claim isn't believable the other is confirmed scum, to give an example of what could go wrong. I'm not saying they're confirmed town, anyways. Why is the game moving that early on a Refa attack bad? I highly doubt that someone would quickhammer and even if they did that would be a source of information and discussion. Trying to stop discussion just because even if someone did something scummy they can still be town is scummy as it goes against the conditions that should be fullfilled for this game to run properly for town. Also, defending someone before they say something doesn't move information either as it gives a potentially scum player an explanation for their actions that they can use. It basically invalidates the questioning that was done. If Blitz thought votes on Refa were bad he could have pointed it out insted of defending him, which is what I'd expect town to do. And it's not just this sentence, I feel that he's posting a lot but not being helpful overall. I don't like how Blitz calls Refa somewhat scummy and after that he says that he's neutral. Blitz, what made you change your opinion on how Refa's vote was related to his alignment to thinking the vote was scummy but not the player? ##Vote: Blitz I'll write more when I'm not hungry.

That depends on what you understand by identity. The basics are that I've played mafia on MotK and on Spanish forums, about 10 games. I know BBM, Prims and SB because of MotK. Also, I'm a girl. Why wouldn't you out them in the first place? That's useful to know. BBM and Proto are probably town, I believe the claim is genuine because I can't see scum thinking about such elaborate and risky ways of messing up with players' reads that early. Prims might be town too, although I still don't know for sure. ##Vote: Refa, sheeping. Not super convinced of it but it's the scummiest thing I see so far. I'm meeting some friends this afternoon/night (GMT + 01:00) and it will probably be too late to check mafia when I return, so I won't post for a while. I'm still here for a few hours, though.

I replied to my role PM but I guess I should also /confirm here

I usually play on MotK, but I'll /in and see how mafia games are here. Prims, weren't you going to stop playing mafia?