Rapier

Zero Escape. I just think there's too much exposition, but other than that it's one of my favorite mystery VNs. Ace Attorney. One of the most friendly and easy to get into mystery games. It helps that the characters are great and the games are so well written. Project Zomboid looks like the isometric The Sims and deals with survival during a zombie outbreak. It has sneak mechanics, the game forces you to explore the world and find things in order to survive, fighting zombies is seldom ideal and you have to pick your fights. It's great.

that's the spirit

Yes, there are 3 OVAs of the original Gundam. The first part of the first OVA is actually good at recapping things without skipping a lot, but by the time the plot picks up, it starts jumping a lot and skips build-ups. I wonder why no one went with the effort of remaking the original Gundam, since it's such a classic but also a very old anime.

Yeah, when I said "after Wing" I meant "after all of Wings' seasons and there's no more Wing related content to watch". Also, if Endless Waltz keeps up with the quality of Wing's OST (and that incredible intro song), I'm sold. I also miss Super Robot Wars, and two are conveniently on Steam (region locked, but nothing I can't get through). Great.

I made a topic about wanting to get into Gundam 4 years ago, actually watched a bit of the original Gundam (the first movie, at least), which unfortunately jumped around the story and skipped a lot of things, then last week I remembered I had an interest in Gundam (because of a game on Steam). Now here I am, after watching 25 episodes of Gundam Wing. And I just want to share my thoughts/understand others' about it. The original thread had people talking about its issues, but honestly I enjoyed the experience. It portrays war in a very mature way, depicts how it is hell for the citizens and soldiers struggling with it, speaks about coups and military factions and gives an interesting portrayal of space colonies and their views of Earth nations/organizations. I also loved Relena, Zechs (and I honestly love how he isn't another Char) and Treize, although Noin (and even Lady Une after a few episodes) deserves a honorable mention. I agree that the characters take some time to get their build-up and that the plot can take loops, though. Sometimes they seem to have sudden derp-esque motivations that I'm willingly suspending my disbelief because I hope they're explained later. Other than that, I see no issue with the animation whatsoever, since it's expected of a 95s anime to reuse animation, especially when the action scenes tend to be hectic and the Mobile Suits are highly detailed. Plus, the MS designs were very cool overall, the OST was amazing, the overall art (if not the animation) is good. I think I'll jump to Iron-Blooded Orphans after that, or 00.

SD Gundam G Generation Cross Rays (why the fucking long names, dudes?), which is a cool turn-based strategy game not that far [mechanically] from Fire Emblem, and it helped me get into Gundam after ~5 years of being confused by timelines and not being sure which was the best way to get into the series. Now I'm alternating between watching Gundam Wing until I'm far enough to not be spoiled by the game and playing.

Cold Steel spoils a lot of Crossbell, though. 1 spoils important events in Ao right in your face.

Fire Emblem vs Nintendo (featuring Mega Man from the Mega Man series) is a thing though FE & SMT was somehow a good idea, though. Now I want a MMBN-like game except with modern day versions of FE characters as operators and their FE games versions as NAVIs.

Kenshi. It's a game I love and I have no fucking idea how to describe it. I guess I could say it's a real-time (but pausable) RPG in a post-apocalyptic world, iirc not that different from the 2D Fallouts or old C-RPGs in feel and navigation. Your stats develop as you do stuff, but even then you'll play as a tiny character in a huge dystopian world where anything can kill you and they do constantly pursue that goal - be they the nation of religious fundamentalists eager to thump a Bible on your thick skull, the corrupt slaver nation whose nobles would hunt you down for sport, the angry warrior race if you dare insult anyone's horns in public, or the local starving bandits who knocked you out for your last 2 bucks. Or the giant dinosaur giraffe thing that runs faster than a F1 car and that has sharp teeth. It's amazing in producing stories during the gameplay, getting you attached to the recruits you just picked/saved from bandits and see them grow. There's also nothing more satisfying than seeing your scrubby chars becoming badasses who kick bandits, slavers and zealot asses. It's awesome, but grindy and its engine makes the game melt in real time since it's constantly loading a lot of stuff (thank modders for helping me run it at more than 4 FPS sometimes).

RPGs with abundant filler quests, which are more proeminent nowadays in MMOs. I just lack the patience for these quests. Any game that requires a lot of dedication and training to get into. Fighting games in general are like this. Games with excessive description texts, as if they were (and sometimes they *are*) digital D&D campaigns. Old C-RPGs tend to be like this, especially due to graphic limitations. Anything with pre-SNES or early SNES graphics, save a few exceptions. Games whose gameplay doesn't attract me at all, regardless of having good characters, a good story, soundtrack etc. That's why I can't get into Persona. 3's Tartarus bores me, and 4's dungeons might as well not even exist due to how simple designed they are. I want to give 5 a chance, though.

I mean in the sense of having games you enjoy, but there's something in it that demands double or triple of your patience and motivation to get through, and whenever you pick it up again you think "ugh, I'll have to deal with this and this and this again, and it's such a chore". Maybe it's a dungeon you find annoying, or a boss, or a gameplay thing. Elona: Fun roguelike, but its extremely grindy nature, very repetitive quests (there are only 5 types of generated quests and 3 of them are restricted depending on your build/stats) and obligatory game-y ways to get things done efficiently really put me off. Kenshi: Another fun roguelike. It is grindy, but for me that's tolerable enough. What isn't is the huge micromanaging of your base that you need to do - the game's automatization for tasks doesn't work very well and needs the player's attention. And the gameplay ends up becoming more of the same - you have goons mining for hours, or you have someone steal from shops. There isn't much space for different ways to play the game. Age of Wonders 3: Not so much when I'm playing by myself, but playing this in multiplayer became annoying very quickly to me, because turns happen in real time. Many times you'll have to stop what you're doing or lose your trail of thought because one of your friends needs to battle against an enemy somewhere, and as interesting as it is at first, you'll see yourself having to wait 5-10 minutes before returning to your game and also spend a very long time in the game without accomplishing anything at all. Terraria: Loved that game back in the day, but it gets repetitive very quickly. You spend hours mining for ore, make weapons/armor with it, kill a boss, then spend more hours mining for better ore, make weapons/armor... You get it. Exploring is actually fun, but when progressing through the game means grinding for resources to make better equipment, it gets repetitive and boring quickly. Starbound is a perfect example of a game that does this right, imo.

I think 999 got a good enough reception to warrant a sequel, but VLR didn't sell very well (despite being even better, imo) and it was a miracle that ZTD was made (much because of fans backing it up and expressing their love for the series).

The Zero Escape series. I really enjoy its characters and writing, but the games didn't receive good enough sales or even attention. Digimon Card Battle has a fun gameplay, although the AI sucks. Can't tell if it was underrated, though. Rabi-Ribi is a fun, completely non-linear metroidvania with some of the best boss fights I've ever seen, but these qualities are hidden behind its otaku pandering, silly story and ecchi looks.

She knew about crest stuff that she could've shared with Dimitri and Claude in order to face the church's grasp in the continent, but instead chose to trample everyone in her way.

Going through extreme lengths that could've been solved in more peaceful ways because the plot demands she hold the stupid ball.

I didn't say having the authors' preferences not being manifested as they wanted isn't art. The discussion is about whether games are more art than commercial product, and I haven't argued against it being art in any part of my defense of it being more of a commercial product. So, I've been thinking a bit more about this and I think games actually tend more toward art than commercial product. Of course, they're made with the intent to sell, but that isn't exclusive with being art. I don't see much difference between the artistic parts of games being tailored toward the customers' preferences and other commissioned arts having it the same way. If you pay an artist to do something that isn't in their preferences, they will still put their style and inclinations into what they do. If a musician prefers making soundtracks for terror games, nothing stops them from being hired to compose a soundtrack for an adventure game, or a slice of life visual novel. It wouldn't be in their area of expertise and preference, but the songs will carry their own expression that is intrinsic to any art they produce, even if tailored toward their customer's tastes and preferences. So, since art is still art regardless of being tailored to a customer's tastes and preferences, I think modern games are more artistic manifestations than commercial products.

Or just stop being cowards and make a crossover between Fire Emblem and Pokemon already.

For me the biggest factor was how there was too much description and little action. And then, when Silque is turned into a fairy, it takes too long for us to see what she does with them, or how she'll help people next.

Not all, but most, and in a number big enough for a generalization. There are more games made to satisfy the customer's expectations first and foremost than games where the creator's artistic vision takes priority. The latter tends to be subordinated to the former in most cases. And again, this isn't always a dilemma, because a creator can make a game mainly around their vision that also fulfills the customers' tastes and expectations. But when they clash, there are more cases where the market analysis and expectations come above the author's personal tastes and artistic vision than cases where the reverse happens. tl;dr Because video game projects take their commercialization as a priority when there is a clash, I think they're more of commercial products than artistic ones.

I broke the tie by voting him at least a day ago.

I'd agree with you that this is a false dilemma (you can sell art and even make a living off selling art). The problem is when you have to consider your potential clients' tastes and preferences over your own artistic vision. Then it clashes with your personal expression, preferences and vision, thus going against the definition of art. This doesn't mean video games aren't art anymore, but that it's a commercial product more than an artistic one, and anytime when your preferences and your clients' match each other are simply coincidences.

I think we've deviated from the discussion for a bit. It's not about whether games are art or not. It's about whether it leans more toward being art or a commercial product. I argued that it's art while at the same time being a commercial product, and leaning more toward the latter than toward the former because it's main purpose is to sell.

Even Cold Steel 1 heavily spoils Ao, so I really recommend to play the Crossbell games first. There you learn (spoilers for both CS1 and Ao, duh): Zero and Ao have PC versions and the fan translation patches work on them. They're the ones I've played (actually I'm still playing Ao so please no more spoilers)

More toward commercial product, because the intent from the team developing [or working in different areas related to] the game is to add elements that make the game sell. They make a market analysis and apply their own craft's techniques to make the game appealing enough to the target audience they want to sell it to. From the game project's conception, the intent is for it to become a product that will have a high enough commercial appeal. Anything else that comes during the making process of the game is subordinated to that premise. Video games are art, in my opinion, and they obviously have artistic elements over it, and the developers/producers/whatever have their own personal insights and artistic visions poured into their works because you can't disassociate from those when making art (by definition), but there's that big question of "would that sell?" that whoever is working on a game must answer to constantly and it speaks higher than their artistic vision more times than it doesn't (people who make games without the intent to sell them are rarer than people who make games with the main intent to sell).

Can I pick Sonic 2006 three times?