Character Designs

[mimgrim]

And to make a gender comparison, how would you men feel if they designed a shirtless knight character (so no chest plate either)? that IMO would be a male equivalent of Camilla's outfit.

I wouldn't care.

Well, let me preface by saying that I generally don't care about realism (whether it be through art or story or something else) in a work of fiction (unless it is a piece of fiction that is founded upon realism, something of which I would not really attribute to Fire Emblem at any great length) and thus am not affect by things like Camilla's armor or Femui's thigh holes or poses of characters or things like. I've also never been bothered by fan service, so again those types of things generally have no affect on me. So I'm not particularly picky about art-design beyond my personal preference of thinking of something looking stupid or not.

^And that is why I wouldn't care.

I would also probably find it to be absolutely hilarious. Bonus points if his chest is covered in oil to act as the armor replacement. xD

Edited May 21, 2015 by mimgrim

[Philranger]

For me the main point is that since awakening none female characters ever wear pants.

Maribelle, Anna, Sully, and Miriel are all wearing pants in their official art. As are Noire and Kjelle. I can't tell if Severa or Lucina have leggings or pants so I'm not including them.

[BrandedRogue]

Maribelle, Anna, Sully, and Miriel are all wearing pants in their official art. As are Noire and Kjelle. I can't tell if Severa or Lucina have leggings or pants so I'm not including them.

sully does NOT wear pants, panties and high boots

and severa even looses her pants as soon as she promotes

[Book Bro]

Now that we've seen more art, I have to say I'm liking Hoshido's characters waaay more. I love the designs for all the siblings minus Takumi, his outfit looks a little odd to me but I'm not sure why. Maybe it's the crotch/thigh area. The ninjas are all fucking beautiful. Suzukaze is my fave.

On Nohr, I like the maids, Joker, and Gunter. None of the siblings look that great to me tbh, Marx was my favourite design of any characters but his OA took him down a bit. He and Leon look a lot better than the sisters.

Kamui and Aqua are pretty good.

As for characters without art yet, Tsubaki and Oboro are the two characters I most want to see. Also love Rinka though and I'm liking Elfie and Cyrus. Nyx looks like Tharja 2 so whatever, and Kazahana is nothing special for me. Blonde hero I'm not interested in. Did I forget anyone?

[Tamanoir]

Now that we've seen more art, I have to say I'm liking Hoshido's characters waaay more. I love the designs for all the siblings minus Takumi, his outfit looks a little odd to me but I'm not sure why. Maybe it's the crotch/thigh area. The ninjas are all fucking beautiful. Suzukaze is my fave.

On Nohr, I like the maids, Joker, and Gunter. None of the siblings look that great to me tbh, Marx was my favourite design of any characters but his OA took him down a bit. He and Leon look a lot better than the sisters.

Kamui and Aqua are pretty good.

As for characters without art yet, Tsubaki and Oboro are the two characters I most want to see. Also love Rinka though and I'm liking Elfie and Cyrus. Nyx looks like Tharja 2 so whatever, and Kazahana is nothing special for me. Blonde hero I'm not interested in. Did I forget anyone?

Nyx is waaay better than Tharja was.

You're just jealous of her hair.

[Auroros]

And to make a gender comparison, how would you men feel if they designed a shirtless knight character (so no chest plate either)? that IMO would be a male equivalent of Camilla's outfit.

^ Neither do I care lol

This is a video game, not reality nor representation of reality. Nothing in it even matters for reality.

Besides, didn't we have Vaike, who ran around shirtless with like an 8-pack? I would't call him attractive, personality wise, but he was most definitely drawn oversexualized since it is incredible stupid to be on a medieval-like battlefield without some sort of upper-body Protection and he was of course incredible muscular. Isn't that female fanservice? Are you truly telling me that he was designed for men because he has an 8-pack? Not for the average female that choses an attractive looking man over the ugly, but nice guy? I am not an Expert on medieval battlefields, but getting stabbed in the heart or head was probably not very uncommon, considering that they probably figured out as well that heads kinda are what makes you live, and striking the heart kinda makes them bleed to death, so shouldn't he wear at least a Breastplate, even if it hides his 8-pack?. Also, by the realism logic, shouldn't they all wear helmets as well? Or have short or Ponytailed Hair as well? Just imagine being in the thick of an fight and your hair gets in your face and you fail to see the incoming attack and die. Doesn't happen with short hair.

To go even further with realism, shouldn't the DEF values be maxed out instantly because of the Designs for amours? In real life, there is no way for you to get so strong that someone with a knife can't hurt you, and the only thing protecting you would be your clothes/armor. So if fire emblem was realistic, wouldn't the DEF statistic vanish entirely or couldn't grow?

The other way around:

Isn't Vaike badass by taking blades to the stomach (and not getting hurt (if his DEF is high enough))?

Isn't Camilla badass by not giving a single fuck about what others are thinking? (Besides, whats wrong with fanservy anyways, unless, of course, it is out of character, which I understand then. But otherwise...?)

Even if both of them are dumb for having obvious weak spots, as well as the entire cast for not wearing helmets or at least some sort of head protection?

Also, How come there are ugly guys, mostly on the enemy side though, but every female looking either beautiful or hot? Is there even a female with like a scar on her face? Or a Man in ANY fire emblem game that didn't look decent? Why is that? Because nobody, in a game, wants to play as ugly, fat or old guys. Or as an unattractive Woman for that matter. And Again, this goes both ways.

If you dislike it, it is your personal taste. But don't sit there and complain that it was the worstest thing ever because they didn't wear pants and they should have had pants. The Designers chose the design. Let them choose what they like and state your opinion on it. Like it? good for you. Dislike it? good for you. I mean, what is it even with these Pants arguments? Most Women would beat you with a stick for telling them how they should dress. We have no indication that the characters dislike how they dress. Let them. What's this pants thing even? Why the hell does it matter if a character wears pants or not? Someone mind to explain?

Also, what do you propose we do? Design the Characters the way you would like them to be? Include a pants/noPants and feet/noFeet options at the beginning of the game?

So to make my stance clear:

This is a game, realism has no place in the designs. Story and characters --> different issue

Saying this game is more realistic if armor is not fanservy is wrong because then everybody should wear armor, and more importantly, helmets or head protection.

Sexualized Characters go both ways.

Designers design the way they want to design.

we need an Feet/noFeet option

And my favorite Character Designs are probably Felicia, Ryouma, Marx and Elise. I actually like them all, the chosen win barely though.

[Philranger]

sully does NOT wear pants, panties and high boots

and severa even looses her pants as soon as she promotes

You're right on Sully, I just glanced and thought the boots were pants.

I already mentioned I didn't include Severa so I'm not sure why you brought her up.

Even throwing those out, that's still more than none. Also Morgan and the Avatar both wear pants in their official art.

I'm using official art and not in-game character models because that's the official representation of said character.

[BrandedRogue]

Okay whether you want realistic outfits is simply taste. I think the outfits have to make sense, but if you don't feel that way fine.

And my main problem is with fanservicy armored units. I won't complain about a fanservesy mage or healer.

and on the matter of unattractive women I'd bring up meg (RD) she's not ugly but definitely not the usual perfect figure type of woman.

And on Vaike, yes he trades protection for looks, but for the male units his class is more the exception than the norm, unlike for female classes.

[Hoshidokoala]

All these character designs are so cool (especially the ninjas)!! My Hoshido favourite as of yet is probably either Suzukaze or Rinka. I like Sakura too. Hmmm, Nohr as of yet aren't as good but we have hardly seen any yet so I'm liking Leon and Marx the most out of them. Is it just me because Joker's art in famitsu looks really different than the box art (not the clothes, just the eyes and face). Next week I'm hoping for some art for Nyx, Kazahana, Tsubaki, Brave Hero, Elfie and some other as-of-yet unknown characters. As the most important thing for me in any game I play is the characters, Fire Emblem If is not disappointing me. Can't wait to see more!!

[Auroros]

Well, okay, Meg. She would actually be the only special case in the rule, methinks... I have played only Fe8, 10,12 and 13 so I am not entirely sure.

oh and Brom fits in the same category as well. Not truly ugly, but physically speaking not the most attractive person. Okay, we have found exceptions to the standard rules.

On fanservicy Armored units though, yeah somewhat troublesome. :/ though what exactly are the classes in FE 13 that give up protection for fanservice? If I remember correctly, great knights, Armor Knights and Generals had a lot of Armor. Cavaliers a bit less than their Male Counterparts at spots that barely matter (Shoulders and upper legs?), except of course if we look at that realistically, where we probably would need riding pants, and the lack of shoulder Pads are potential targets for archers, who at the same time would probably shoot in the characters face, killing them instantly because of the lack of helmet, where the missing shoulder pads wouldn't even factor in. Realistically speaking, the battlesprites for neither male nor female cavalier should differ, which would make sully and stahl just look like generics since both armors are stupid if the head is exposed.

Besides, they probably wanted to make it look more feminine. Those shoulder Pads would look kinda weird if you are trying to convey a character that is female, at least in my opinion.

Similar thing with Dragon riders and lords and Griffon rider. As Archer, the only Physical unit able to reach those shoulders without a problem, why would you aim at the shoulders if you can just Headshot them? The bare part of the legs is also pretty much out of range for everything.

And Lancer would in all riding cases kill either the mount first, or gang up on the rider, get him off the mount and then, due to having lost balance and being in a fairly thick armor, the rider would be an easy kill, as long as the armor is heavy enough. Griffon rider might be able to recover, but everything else can be strangled to death at that point. And again, no helmet. Lance or sword in the face will due the job as well, not to forget the fall from the stead.

While I think that the armor designs look partly ridiculous in awakening (Generic great knight, knight, general), I wouldn't say that female armored units are that worse protected, considering where realistic threads would be coming from, in my opinion.

In game, Enemy Units attack only the upper body area/mounts anyway, so having a breastplate and some mount armor is in that universe good enough, apparently.

... making Vaike the most ill suited character in the game.

Though, yeah, he is the exception, but truly, are the females, besides shoulders and upper legs which are hard for the enemy to reach anyway and said enemies would attack either with bow the head or with lance the mount, resulting in a quick kill, so differently from the males anyway? Is it even worth debating over this? Debating wether or not include a pants/noPants option?

[Jedi]

... making Vaike the most ill suited character in the game.

Though, yeah, he is the exception, but truly, are the females, besides shoulders and upper legs which are hard for the enemy to reach anyway and said enemies would attack either with bow the head or with lance the mount, resulting in a quick kill, so differently from the males anyway? Is it even worth debating over this? Debating wether or not include a pants/noPants option?

We've had someone with similar clothes to Vaike. Hawkeye.

I mean back in the old days of gaming we loved having Conan like designs to show pure manliness, I mean at least we have Rinka for badass female barbarian look. Kinda Sonia like. :P

I personally don't mind any designs in IF so far other then Camila. Least the busty ninja is a bit more believable (her outfit reminds me of Sheena's from Tales of Symphonia, but less out there.) In the fact that the male ninja's also have the window.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Jedi

[BrandedRogue]

But no-one wears helmets in FE (except for some knight in RD)

And I do think shoulders and legs are good targets to aim for, IMO protection there matters. And the pants option is simply a matter of freedom, a matter of choice and they are forcing (by design) many female characters to wear skirts in stead of pants.

Oh and you mentioned no character complaining about their outfits. There is this servera-Kjelle support where severa says something along the lines of a lady shouldn't shown any skin bellow the neck or up her ankles or something like that. And she's the one to promote to a mini-skirt.

And related to that, the amount of panties shots are starting to bother me ...

[Book Bro]

Besides, didn't we have Vaike, who ran around shirtless with like an 8-pack? I would't call him attractive, personality wise, but he was most definitely drawn oversexualized since it is incredible stupid to be on a medieval-like battlefield without some sort of upper-body Protection and he was of course incredible muscular. Isn't that female fanservice? Are you truly telling me that he was designed for men because he has an 8-pack? Not for the average female that choses an attractive looking man over the ugly, but nice guy?

I mean Vaike's art didn't have him in a pose that emphasized his physique or flexing in a sexy way. A lot of females are drawn emphasizing their butts or boobs (Kamui, Tiki) or in ridiculous positions meant to look sexy/cute (Severa, Elise). So I do see a difference.

A better example would be Dieck in his official art from FE6 IMO since he's kinda flexing and looking towards the viewer like Tharja is in her art. Still it's a lot less common.

Also, How come there are ugly guys, mostly on the enemy side though, but every female looking either beautiful or hot? Is there even a female with like a scar on her face? Or a Man in ANY fire emblem game that didn't look decent? Why is that? Because nobody, in a game, wants to play as ugly, fat or old guys. Or as an unattractive Woman for that matter. And Again, this goes both ways.

We have had plenty of old guys and some "ugly" playable characters (Gonzales, Dorothy, Oliver). I'm all for more variety. I don't need everyone to be a cute teenager. More variety in female characters especially since Meg is like the only not thin girl in all of FE.

I mean, what is it even with these Pants arguments? Most Women would beat you with a stick for telling them how they should dress. We have no indication that the characters dislike how they dress. Let them. What's this pants thing even? Why the hell does it matter if a character wears pants or not? Someone mind to explain?

For me it's dumb when it doesn't make sense for the class (but you said you don't care about that) or character. Edited May 21, 2015 by Book Bro

[Wayward Alchemist]

And to make a gender comparison, how would you men feel if they designed a shirtless knight character (so no chest plate either)? that IMO would be a male equivalent of Camilla's outfit.

[/vaike] [/gonzolez] [/barbarians] [/warriors] [/berserkers] [/malesorcs]

But seriously, THE ENTIRE Barbarian Class Tree is shirtless, dating back to GBA, and Berserker is wearing a loincloth in Awakening, so.....

[Book Bro]

I feel like a better comparison would be if all male cavaliers wore tight short shorts and you got constant "butt shots" in battle like with the panty shots.

I'm pretty sure more guys would be complaining then.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Book Bro

[Jedi]

I feel like a better comparison would be if all male cavaliers wore tight short shorts and you got constant "butt shots" in battle like with the panty shots.

I'm pretty sure more guys would be complaining then.

Not really. It would be more fair fanservice.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Jedi

[Philranger]

We need more shorts. Ewan, Ross, Lugh, and Rolf all pulled it off.

They're comfy and easy to wear. Zelda postman bootyshorts plz.

We could go the Sothe route though for some midriff action. Those are starting to become popular in football here.

I'm also trying to remember the last Pegasus knight to NOT wear a skirt. There wasn't one in any of the GBA FE games. I think the FE9/10 Pegs all wore leggings underneath but still wore skirts or whatever Elincia has on, long half pants.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Philranger

[Giratina]

Honestly the designs in this game are a huge improvement from Awakening. They're a lot more aesthetically pleasing in my opinion and if we get to re-class I'm sure it won't be as ugly as Awakening made it. I don't have any particular favorites but Linca and Hinoka are definitely up there. The only one who bothers me so far is that new Brave Hero unit but I like to pretend he doesn't exist, at least at the moment.

[Soapbar]

I don't particularly like a single one and I'm surprised to see that you guys do, honestly. I know this is very subjective, and I hardly know anything about designing characters or art in general, but to me every character just has way too much going on with their look, and for the most part they end up looking overdesigned. I don't even like the armor or clothing of most of the characters, with Ryouma's weird lobster thing and female Kamui's thigh armor taking the cake. I could talk more about female armor and poses in particular as well, but that's not the game's only problem, since I don't think a single character looks visually appealing, men included.

Most memorable characters in gaming have very simple designs, and are therefore easy to remember; I'm afraid I'll just forget what these characters look like after I stop playing the game.

Being a guy who is a fan of the 40K lore (not the tabletop because I don't have the money for that shit), I can appreciate the overdesign a bit needs bigger pauldrons though

That said, some do bother me such as Camila (When was an asscrack considered hot again...?) and Ryouma (Lobster lord is a fitting title) but for the most part I'm fine with it

[hauteclere]

Isn't Vaike badass by taking blades to the stomach (and not getting hurt (if his DEF is high enough))?

Isn't Camilla badass by not giving a single fuck about what others are thinking? (Besides, whats wrong with fanservy anyways, unless, of course, it is out of character, which I understand then. But otherwise...?)

Camilla doesn't need upper chest armor because her boobs of steel can withstand any enemy weapons. If that isn't badass, I don't know what is.

[thetiger39]

Camilla is a tank. Kamui will hide behind her, firing potshots while camilla takes 3 damage per hit from lunatic mode fighters

[Sardonic]

If I'm forced to choose, I'd say I like Marx and Leon's designs best, but the whole "wo/men in black" thing going on in Nohr feels like forced displays of being darker and edgier. Same with the pointy finger gauntlets which I've never been a fan of. I like what little we've seen of Cyrus so far as well as Tsubaki, but still waiting for OA to make any real judgments. Nohr's royal family also seems to value hair decs, but while Marx and Camilla wear tiaras and Elise has her hair ribbons, Leon wears...a headband. Not even a tiara/crown thing like Marth. Just...a headband. ...Okay.

OTOH, not a fan of some of the female designs so far. The only ones I'm alright with are Hinoka and Sakura (but what's up with the pose in her OA...); outside of the royal families, I like Kazahana. Elise is too anime tropified for me with the drill-like twintails and her outfit reminds me of something out of PreCure (and like Sakura, her pose in her OA makes me question some of Kozaki's art decisions past his designs). Kamui and Aqua being barefoot and F!Kamui's thigh holes... Why? Camilla = pantsu but no pants. Literally wearing panties with a bilateral curtain when she's a mounted flying unit.

Side note: I always found it kind of dumb for any female character to be wearing heels into battle. Even if they're on mounts. Why would you ever want to wear heels onto the battlefield? But JRPG character design typically values style over practicality so I've seen this enough times that I'm used to it. Still find it dumb, though.

Edited May 22, 2015 by Sardonic

[Tamanoir]

Side note: I always found it kind of dumb for any female character to be wearing heels into battle. Even if they're on mounts. Why would you ever want to wear heels onto the battlefield? But JRPG character design typically values style over practicality so I've seen this enough times that I'm used to it. Still find it dumb, though.

I really wanted girls to have Stilettoes as an hidden wapon....

And nothing about Rinca ?

[BurningCandy]

Personally, I really like Tsubaki (bishie! Yay, I like bishies! And his personality seems nice too!), Orochi (nice sleek and simple design) , Linca (awsome axe weilding cute looking lady), and Hinoka (pretty, tsundere pegasus knight0.

I didn't really like Marx when I first saw him, but now I'm warming up to him slightly.

Camilla's top half is fine, but the panty window.... No.

Elise is OK. Perhaps a little overboard with Imouto-chan-ness, but fine.

Leon is probably my favorite Nohr character.

Ryouma is OK..... He will always be Lobster Lord.

Sakura is really cute, her design shows her role well.

Takumi, I'm mixed on. I kind of like him but kind of don't...

Hinoka, I really like. She's just right - not too much fanservice but not too plain either.

Felicia is awsome. From her description on SF's character page, she seems a bit like me!

Joker looks nice too, I really like his hair.and cravat....he has one right?

Gunter... meh. Don't care.

I think the designs are done a little better than Awakening's. But I liked Awakening's designs in general, even Nowi (duh) and Tharja (looks wise, at least)

[MediocreLee]

I mostly like the Hoshido designs more than Nohr, mostly because we haven't seen a lot of the Asian style in previous Fire Emblem games. I'm really fond of the ninjas, Rinka, Orochi, Sakura, and Ryouma's designs. The Nohr designs are still really cool looking, there's a bit of a gothic edge to them. I like Felicia, Camilla, and Joker's designs. Kamui and Aqua's designs are also really nice as well, the armor/outfit that Kamui wears looks really cool to me. And, even though they're generally the same, Aqua's white outfit looks better to me.