Iron Griffin Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 I prefer a gray-zone to be honest. Unfortunately in this route Kamui has been dropped one too many times on his/her head while eating paint chips since childhood. Its not really a question of good or evil its just the fact the writers have reduced this route to mostly an idiot plot. :/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWerdna Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) In Nohr, she just disappears with a brief scene again in the ending. Just like that, no mention. They wonder where she went, but have no idea why she disappeared. In Hoshido, they mention often that her singing is causing her to fade since earlier and the game, and promises she won't do it to the point she fades. But, she eventually does entrusting the future to Kamui, apologizing for lying to Kamui. Then in the end she is there one more time, saying she may meet Kamui again someday, somewhere. She also says "there are many other worlds we are unaware of" out there, probably hinting to the other path or third path in someway. So there is more exposure in the Hoshido route Really? That's it... god, thats just so lame. Like, no context is given or has really any reason to fit into the story? So the characters are all just left having no idea what the heck is going on or even what happened? What's the point even in this case, it has nothing to do with the rest of the story? Did the writers put any effort into the Nohr route? What the hell. Edited July 1, 2015 by TheWerdna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirokan Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 If it was really more one-sided toward Hoshido, it makes me wonder why they just didn't make Kamui straight-up evil? Having both sides be good doesn't sit right for me on a game that's based on choice... I think they want the choice to be difficult, so making both good in some way may help do that for you. I prefer a gray-zone to be honest. Unfortunately in this route Kamui has been dropped one too many times on his/her head while eating paint chips since childhood. Its not really a question of good or evil its just the fact the writers have reduced this route to mostly an idiot plot. :/ The Third Path is likely this... I agree neutral is good at some times, but usually when portrayed in games, it always becomes the idealistic route and the extremes go out the window. Thinking of SMT. xD Really? That's it... god, thats just so lame. Like, no context is given or has really any reason to fit into the story? So the characters are all just left having no idea what the heck is going on or even what happened? What's the point even in this case, it has nothing to do with the rest of the story? Did the writers put any effort into the Nohr route? What the hell. Unfortunately that is how it is. Nohr makes no mention of her disappearance or possibility thereof before the end when it happens. Hoshido talks about how it happens, but not why it happens, or who cursed her, or where it came from. xD I assume they are saving this for the third path, which is unfortunate because it means no path has a full story of it's own, and one would have to buy all three for a full picture... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DualMix Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) Thinking of SMT. xD I dunno... the older games can get pretty damn extreme. I liked the third path. It's hard to pick between that or Hoshido for me. Nohr though... oh how I wish it was more appealing. If Silas was an exclusive character to Nohr, then the choice would be harder. Silas = Best Bro. Also the one I married to Sakura, one of the Best Sibs. Edited July 1, 2015 by DualMix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWerdna Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 Unfortunately that is how it is. Nohr makes no mention of her disappearance or possibility thereof before the end when it happens. Hoshido talks about how it happens, but not why it happens, or who cursed her, or where it came from. xD I assume they are saving this for the third path, which is unfortunate because it means no path has a full story of it's own, and one would have to buy all three for a full picture... Well, *expletive* *expletive* *expletive**expletive**expletive* me in that case. And there goes the plan I had for a fanfiction that would actually try to clean up the mess created by the Awakening characters being in the game as well as tie the routes together. Long story short the plan was to go post-Nohr route, address the fact that the true big bad was never defeated, and have a sorta crossover even with a handful of extra characters from Awakening showings up (mainly just Robin and Lucina. I intended to first write an entire story following the Awakening cast that would build up shit that goes down that also inevitably leads Severa, Owain and Inigo to end up in Fates' universe), and eventually lead to some sort of time reset . But there goes the entire basis for the emotional state Corrin would be in at the start of the story, as he would have been paired with Azura, so her death and specifically how it went down is important. But now it looks like that and all of the other emotional stuff I was hoping for is all Hoshido route stuff, which I can't do because half the reason I want to do this is give the awakening characters an actual damn reason for being in the damn game! I guess my only choice now is to first write an entire fricken novelization of the Nohr route to first fix this nonsense. Because seriously, I could write a better story than this: my horrible fanficition is already more coherent than the mess the nohr route seems to be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirokan Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) I dunno... the older games can get pretty damn extreme. I liked the third path. It's hard to pick between that or Hoshido for me. Nohr though... oh how I wish it was more appealing. If Silas was an exclusive character to Nohr, then the choice would be harder. Silas = Best Bro. Also the one I married to Sakura, one of the Best Sibs. Ah, I don't know much about the third path, just things I've speculated and a few things spoiled here and there. And by extremes do you mean extreme SMT middle routes? xD Well, *expletive* *expletive* *expletive**expletive**expletive* me in that case. And there goes the plan I had for a fanfiction that would actually try to clean up the mess created by the Awakening characters being in the game as well as tie the routes together. Long story short the plan was to go post-Nohr route, address the fact that the true big bad was never defeated, and have a sorta crossover even with a handful of extra characters from Awakening showings up (mainly just Robin and Lucina. I intended to first write an entire story following the Awakening cast that would build up shit that goes down that also inevitably leads Severa, Owain and Inigo to end up in Fates' universe), and eventually lead to some sort of time reset . But there goes the entire basis for the emotional state Corrin would be in at the start of the story, as he would have been paired with Azura, so her death and specifically how it went down is important. But now it looks like that and all of the other emotional stuff I was hoping for is all Hoshido route stuff, which I can't do because half the reason I want to do this is give the awakening characters an actual damn reason for being in the damn game! I guess my only choice now is to first write an entire fricken novelization of the Nohr route to first fix this nonsense. Because seriously, I could write a better story than this: my horrible fanficition is already more coherent than the mess the nohr route seems to be Ah, that's a shame to hear that. You must have put a lot of thought and effort into how that would go. : \ Sorry it turned out that way. I am sure you could write a story to fix up the flaws here and make it better. : ) The game is limited by the fact that it is still a game on one hand, and aimed for sales, I guess. Some things seemed really feel good, or force you to buy other paths for this reason, rather than giving one grand story with everything else. xD Edited July 1, 2015 by Kirokan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DualMix Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 And by extremes do you mean extreme SMT middle routes? xD You know it. XD And I may or may not have been thinking of Mara. Eh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquakat Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 Mmm, wouldn't be the first time a third route is the only really 'good' one, I suppose... (Record of Agarest War had good, dark, and neutral endings, but the neutral one was the only one that actually seemed to give explanations. ...iirc, though, it was morally ambiguous as all hell. I somehow doubt that'll be the case here.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWerdna Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) Ah, I don't know much about the third path, just things I've speculated and a few things spoiled here and there. And by extremes do you mean extreme SMT middle routes? xD Ah, that's a shame to hear that. You must have put a lot of thought and effort into how that would go. : \ Sorry it turned out that way. I am sure you could write a story to fix up the flaws here and make it better. : ) The game is limited by the fact that it is still a game on one hand, and aimed for sales, I guess. Some things seemed really feel good, or force you to buy other paths for this reason, rather than giving one grand story with everything else. xD Yes, I did put a lot of thought into it so far. Basically after last week when I found out that those three characters were actually their Awakening versions, I had a momentary freak out due to the implications it would bring to retconing stuff from Awakening and otherwise canonizing stuff. So against my better judgement I decided "screw this" and figured I would write a post-game Awakening x Fates crossover storyline that would be written in such a way to avoid contradicting the canon in either game, while simultaneously making those 3 being there make sense and actually be there for a reason. I spent at least 12+ hours in the past week brainstorming and outlining my plan based on the knowledge I had at the time Yeah, I know I could do that. I am just not sure I want to go through the effort nessessary to fix the entire Nohr route. And again. can't just use Hoshido for it, as that complicates the entire reason I decided I wanted to write this in the first place. I suppose I could just retcon Azura's death to play out more like the Hoshido route via a flashback or something in the first chapter, which would at least fix the biggest issue, but not the dozen other things about the route that are kinda really dumb. Also, as mentioned above, I kinda dislike going straight AU with my writting. I prefer to work with canon the best I can in a way that doesn't directly contradict it, which seems impossible now. Edited July 1, 2015 by TheWerdna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbsoluteZer0Nova Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) Nohr chapter 6 is now translated. Edited July 1, 2015 by AbsoluteZer0Nova Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryo Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 This is unfortunate because Nohr really has superior gameplay designs than Hoshido from what I've seen, guess you can't have everything unless you buy all three versions :/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeartTranquil Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 In your opinion, how dark is the Nohr path, is it the darkest FE game to date? How can I save Aqua in the end? Any requirements have to be met to save her? How can I prevent Ryoma from dying? How can I prevent Hinoka from dying? How can I prevent Sakura from dying? This is a spoiler thread. So why all the spoiler tags? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWerdna Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 In your opinion, how dark is the Nohr path, is it the darkest FE game to date? How can I save Aqua in the end? Any requirements have to be met to save her? How can I prevent Ryoma from dying? How can I prevent Hinoka from dying? How can I prevent Sakura from dying? This is a spoiler thread. So why all the spoiler tags? She cannot be saved in either route. However, she lives in the 3ed route. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seifus Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 Dagnabbit, I was so looking forward to playing this route. I know I shouldn't expect the Witcher and Total War levels of ambiguity and complexity, but dang it IS could have tried. What I was expecting, however, was we kill Garon and then have to deal with rebelling duchies and baronies on top of a seriously pissed off Hoshido on top of it all. I'll still play it, despite my dislike of naive protagonists. I hope IS learns a lesson from this and if they decide to do another idealistic protagonist, they will make them in the style of Captain America from the Winter Soldier movie or Giorno Giovanna from JJBA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeartTranquil Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 Wow... Aqua... ok can I save Ryoma and can I save Hinoka and Takumi and Sakura? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirokan Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) This is unfortunate because Nohr really has superior gameplay designs than Hoshido from what I've seen, guess you can't have everything unless you buy all three versions :/ Yeah... It really is unfortunate that you need to play all three to get the whole story, rather than just having things explained in different ways in each one that would give you full knowledge of what's going on. You have to buy all three to do so... Wow... Aqua... ok can I save Ryoma and can I save Hinoka and Takumi and Sakura? No for Ryouma and Takumi, and Sakura/Hinoka don't die. In your opinion, how dark is the Nohr path, is it the darkest FE game to date? How can I save Aqua in the end? Any requirements have to be met to save her? How can I prevent Ryoma from dying? How can I prevent Hinoka from dying? How can I prevent Sakura from dying? This is a spoiler thread. So why all the spoiler tags? Spoiler tags are in case people have not played Hoshido or the Third Route. This is discussing Nohr, so it is safe to assume not everyone here has played Hoshido yet. : ) The Nohr path is not the darkest, and not that dark at all. I would say it's darker than Awakening, sure (even though the future story in Awakening is pretty dark, too!) but it certainly does not beat, say, FE4, or even FE12's side story. By dark, all that actually happens is some civilians get murdered, as do some soldiers who surrendered. That's it. Nameless people. It is tragic, but as far as the player cares, they likely care very little... Both the Hoshido brothers commit suicide. Hoshido had more emotional and arguably "darker" moments which is odd as this was meant to be the darker one of them. xD Edited July 1, 2015 by Kirokan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeartTranquil Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 So it's been 100% confirmed that ryoma, takumi and aqua die in the nohr route and they cannot be saved? Does anyone else die preventable deaths? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirokan Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 So it's been 100% confirmed that ryoma, takumi and aqua die in the nohr route and they cannot be saved? Does anyone else die preventable deaths? These three will always die on that route. In my and many other play through, and the text dump, all point to this. They are the only ones who die, and there are no others who have preventable deaths as far as I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frelia Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) Wow hearing that Nohr is not what I thought it would be is really disappointing. When I saw that the Nohr path was supposedly about "changing Nohr from the inside" I was expecting exactly that. I was not expecting to hear about how Kamui does the opposite until the last part of the game. I really hope IS learns from the criticisms they are very likely receiving and the next time they include another story like Nohr's or another protagonist who is idealistic or really naive I hope they show improvement. I understand though that Kamui has been isolated and abused by Garon for a good amount of their life and it would be nice if their situation is explained somehow. Along with that Nohr siblings have been abused by Garon as well to the point where they are very likely too afraid to rebel against their abusive father which is understandable. Edited July 2, 2015 by Eevonee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vexian Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) Whaaaat ? No... I wanted to start a revolution... God I might end up making a fanfiction where Kamui really changes Nohr from the inside. I wanted to put Garon's head on a spear and impose my autority... I can't stand overly naive characters. I understand that Kamui must be fucked up mentally, since their family history is like the most complicated thing ever, they grew up isolated and their father is abusive... But I'm afraid the game won't describe Kamui's dilemma in a way that would make the players relate to them, or feel compassion to them in someway. With good writing, we could totally understand their choices. It doesn't see to be the case sadly... Well, let's just wait to pay for this game and see... Edited July 1, 2015 by Vexian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B.Leu Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) I wonder just how much it'll take before a fanfic that is about trully revolutionizing Nohr comes out. Eh, I'll wait for the DarkKamui fic that we all want while I'm at it too. I actually can't wait for it. Edited July 1, 2015 by B.Leu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CyberNinja Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 In short, playing the Camus archetype sucks ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blah the Prussian Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 Do they portray it as a flaw that Kamui is going along with Garons orders? Because, in all honesty, it is quite hard to defy authority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thane Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 Do they portray it as a flaw that Kamui is going along with Garons orders? Because, in all honesty, it is quite hard to defy authority. I didn't pick up on all the nuances, like I wrote in the OP, however it's a lot (and I do mean a lot) of just disgruntled agreement with either Garon, Ganz and/or Iago. Defying authority is one thing, but since Kamui does it in the very beginning of the game anyway, it seems like he has regressed as a character rather than developed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blah the Prussian Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 I didn't pick up on all the nuances, like I wrote in the OP, however it's a lot (and I do mean a lot) of just disgruntled agreement with either Garon, Ganz and/or Iago. Defying authority is one thing, but since Kamui does it in the very beginning of the game anyway, it seems like he has regressed as a character rather than developed. Fair enough. I thought it could be interesting to play as the Camus, but the plot was apparently bungled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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