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Huh? We've still got more than 24 hours left in the phase; we're not nearing deadline. And yeah, I don't really like the idea of one big wagon. I don't think that town should spread themselves out over like 5-6 people, but 2-3 wagons is good for the first few days, particularly in a game as large as this. I don't think this addresses the case on Proto particularly well. First off, his play is like that as either alignment, so setting him aside due to that makes little sense. And yeah, Proto is often not very active with fewer reads in NOC, but right now even the few reads he does have are filled with inconsistencies (IIRC, Manix pointed out something about what he said about Kevin and Marth).

The game was pretty much over after I got to LEVEL 7 Also Paulina and Bard played pretty well I thought. Bard is Bardiche from MotK, right, or is the name just a complete coincidence? Kay should have pushed the read on me more though.

I agree with the Blitz wagon, but don't really have much to add myself. It's also composed mostly of people I think are town, which is generally a plus point other than c9++ rage; will vote here later if necessary. BT, one thing though. I don't understand why you choose to vote Blitz over Proto if you find Proto worse. Four votes is surely enough pressure for Blitz that a fifth one isn't really necessary if he's not your top read. Also if Xinny has posts but they're forgettable, isn't that worse than people who just don't have posts? Also the more I read Objection's posts the more I think newbscum. His 180 and 182 are part of why people thought Baldrick was scummy. He says that "where I got my info from" might make me scummy. After that he just votes inactives for a while, and his 308 and 414 are basically just sheeping me about Paperblade and Kay respectively. His 310 wrt Rein's post doesn't make much sense to me; hopefully he can clarify it. Marth having a lack of content is not scummy? The second part about Blitz doesn't make sense either, because he talks about the fact that the Blitz wagon had died off confirming his opinion on Blitz- except he'd never actually said anything about Blitz before that post. I'll read Scorri, Proto, and Xinny in a while.

Oh, you saying "I checked his ISO" made me think you were referring to my entire play, including D1. Thoughts so far- if Kay doesn't respond back today I might switch to Fera because no point keeping a vote on Kay for the weekend, especially on a shortened day. IIRC on D1 I mentioned my problems with Fera's 128; he mentions he doesn't like Blitz but chooses to vote SB for a relatively weak reason (because he doesn't have meta on Blitz), especially as SB's vote was pretty RVS. He dismisses the vote in 241 as a prodvote and that he didn't actually choose to vote SB because of the RVS vote. This implies he knew that SB's post was RVS, making the decision to place a prodvote on him even more questionable when there was actual stuff to go for about Blitz. 240 is filler spec about Rapier that I dislike because looking into stuff like editing times implies that Fera spent a decent amount of effort looking into a sort of useless theory that he dismisses at the end of the post anyways. In 303 he mentions that him not having meta on Blitz doesn't let Blitz off the hook, so again, why didn't he vote for Blitz at the beginning? And he provides more stuff for why Blitz is scummy but still doesn't vote for Blitz, choosing to sheep onto the Baldrick wagon instead. Paperblade, what happened to your SB suspicion from yesterday? You sort of just dropped it for no discernible reason. Also some more explanation on why Blitz is weak would be nice, although plenty of people have provided it recently so I'm not sure what you can say now. Also I feel like someone might have pointed this out, but not really a fan of how both Kevin and Proto agreed with Paperblade and said that he was townie, but neither really said much on SB themselves. I guess Kevin's "I agree with Paperblade on every point" could qualify but ehhh. Kevin also mentioned in his overnight post that he was most suspicious of Scorri, SB, Fera, and Objection, and wary of Proto, Blitz, and Rein. So he finds the first group of people worse than the second group, yet his first D2 post involves a vote for someone from the second group? His reasoning here is that Proto's one D2 post was so bad that it caused him to start sympathizing with SB, which is a pretty iffy reasoning for a 180. Also, he doesn't actually say anything about that post by Proto, just that it's super annoying.

@Manix- I reread the thread, but I skimmed a lot and I can't really pay attention to all 21 other people in the thread at once. Plus a bunch of my D1 scumreads had sort of fizzled out by the end, so I was specifically looking for things that would help my read on them. Kay was the person other than me who was voting for Strege at one point, and because I was unsure about my read there, I wanted to see her case. When I saw it I realized that post was kind of bad. What do you mean by "hit the nail on the head" though? I made a post against Kay, and spoke about some other stuff while I was digging around for more, and then fell asleep midway and just woke up. Gimme a bit.

Well, Announcer just sends an announcement right? What exactly are they going to include in that announcement? Their scumreads? They can do that regularly. There's really nothing in NOC that needs to be told to the entire game anonymously. It has some strategic value in OC, but in NOC it's really just a durdle role that can easily prove itself. Except mafia Announcers are a thing so proving you're an Announcer doesn't really clear you either. Insomniac is similar, except it can have some actual effect on the game because what they say during the night could alter what people choose to do with their role. 'Cept you can't guarantee that is going to be helpful to the town so it's not really a much stronger role.

If the potioneer is town, I don't really think it's wise to talk about which colours have effects and which don't.

It's not a standard role; I'm guessing they were calling it Alchemist because alchemists make potions. I got a red-orange potion. Announcer doesn't really have any purpose as a role other than to prove itself. Rolespec doesn't generate proper reads though, so how is it untrue? Also you just said you're rolespeccing instead of scumhunting because it's easier. I assume your point here is that you're not good at scumhunting so you rolespec because it's the only way you feel you can contribute, but that's why rolespec can be scummy. It's also easier for mafia because they can use it to look like they're contributing without generating fake reads.

Someone has the ability to send people potions with messages attached. He sent me (and apparently Paperblade and Scorri) a message that said he was finding Scorri scummy. Don't really see the point of keeping it hidden since if he's sending potions to people he's finding scummy, presumably he doesn't care that they learn a role of that sort exists.

Whoops, ##Vote: Kay Oh, yeah, Kevin, in your Insomniac posts, you mentioned Bizz like two or three times, but Bizz isn't playing, so I'm not entirely sure who you're talking about.

Okay, so. Over my reread, I found the one content post that Kay made to be not very good. Her defence of Blitz gave no actual reasons for why Blitz is town. Hearing someone say a wagon is terrible and stupid without any reasoning given isn't going to make anyone unvote. My gut on people defending others while giving no reasoning for it is mafia wanting to defend town for cred rather than to actually stop the lynch. Her point on Marth was good, but she chose not to pursue it because Marth was already receiving enough pressure. First off, I don't really think that that's a very good reason, and second of all, even if it were a good reason, there were actually no votes on Marth at the time, so that reason makes no sense. Her blurb on Kevin also seems a simplification to the point of misrepresentation. Seems to me that Kevin was saying "It wasn't particularly scummy, just scummier than everything else, so I voted for it" As for the vote, while I didn't really like Strege's rolespec either, Kay barely says anything about it at all.

ugh that modkill An even-day announcer who acts N1? Unless he means the day on which it's posted. Also, ITPs who state their wincons are benign normally ping me because what was the need to even state that? Unless he's going to reveal himself, us knowing there is an ITP Announcer with a spellcard-related wincon doesnt really mean anything at all? Also no kills other than Rapier, who was set to die anyways, which is nice.

Okay, that was a pretty decent breakdown of SB's posts. All of his posts weren't inactive voting or rolespec as it felt like you were claiming before, but it was definitely more than I thought so eh. ##Unvote, too tired to think of a suitable replacement or for a reread. It sort of bothers me though that Baldrick is like the only wagon available. I don't really mind the lynch because a bunch of my scumreads are fizzling out, Baldrick's play has been mostly meh, and this will at least give me good interactions. However, if Baldrick claims something we don't want to lynch (he should claim soon btw), the lack of decent other options is discomfiting, We don't need a hammer, but we do need like 8 or 9 votes IIRC, and the most anyone other than Baldrick has are like 3?

What does that last jab at Baldrick even mean, that you didn't see it coming from a mile away? Why was your Baldrick suspicion not enough to convince you to drop the NNR pressure vote but your Kevin suspicion enough?

I don't see how this post contains complaining about inactivity or complaining about rolespec. I read this as attacking Proto for not having content in his activity, not for being inactive. I actually would like to see a post-by-post breakdown Paper, because as it stands to me your vote feels like a misrep.

fixed Paperblade what do you think of my criticism of your SB suspicion and now vote?

I'm not arguing that they're lazy. They're lazy as hell and I pointed it out too. I'm arguing that the amount of posts that have elapsed since Baldrick's scummy actions is irrelevant if nothing has happened in the meantime to change that.

Okay, so ##Unvote, ##Vote: Paperblade Other than what I stated earlier, I really don't like Paperblade's last post (the one with content, not the one-liners after). In his first paragraph, after pushing Baldrick as his sole scumread up to this point, he suddenly flips and says that he can't really see scum motive in what Baldrick did. Except he says everything in a pretty unsure and waffly way that includes stuff he still doesn't like about Baldrick. Then when he's attacking the Baldrick wagon, he criticizes people for using things from like a 100 posts ago to start voting for him now, which I don't really feel is a valid criticism, because why does it matter how long ago somebody's scummy actions have been if they've done nothing townie in the meantime? Also, I get the feeling he still thinks Baldrick might be scum, due to the unsure nature of his unvote and the fact that he talked about looking into Strege if Baldrick flipped scum. Despite this, his wagon analysis is kind of from a perspective that Baldrick is more likely town. Moving away from Baldrick, he then calls out SB for just talking about inactives, but then spends time pointing out all the inactives and all the actives with no content, which I don't feel is so different from what SB did. It's also a misrep because it makes out that it's all SB has been doing when it's not.

You can't really summarize three pages that succintly, nor is it prudent to do so. Those might have been the "main" events that let you know what's happening in the thread, but none of those are what's going to help you catch scum. Xinny and Rein might have posted, but that doesn't automatically clear them either. Simply popping in and posting isn't that hard. What did you think of what they posted? Of what other people, say, Paperblade, posted? If one of the main events is that people think Baldrick is scum, what do you think of Baldrick? What do you think of the people voting him? Ugh I'm not sure as to how much leeway Objection should be getting. He has like no worthwhile content whatsoever but first game so bleh.

Yeah, I mixed something up with another game because I'm tired. Ignore that bit. I don't think Paperblade is townie by any stretch- I just think your vote misrepresents his posts. It's wrong to say that Paperblade doesn't have any scumreads when it seems pretty clear to me that he does. My problem with Paperblade is more that he has just the one suspicion. He commented on something to do with the Marth Ninja discussion early on (iirc he agreed that Marth should have outed Ninja) but never really attempted to discern anything from that discussion even though the comment kind of shows he was paying attention to that.

Also, Strege, questions might not be committal, but a vote is.

If highly doubt she's one of the Announcers, because an Announcer doesn't actually visit anyone, so giving it a Ninja modifier is useless unless the person is scum. So if Xinny was a mafia-sided Ninja Announcer, I don't think she'd claim the Ninja. And I got cut by a few posts, so add Zeem to the pile of people with Baldrick as their only scumread.

I don't disagree with the reasons behind the Baldrick wagon, but its speed and sheepiness are really offputting. What I also don't like is that out of the six people voting for him, three (Paperblade, Scorri, and Proto) have Baldrick as their only serious scumread. I want to see Paperblade's response to Strege's arguments before I decide whether or not to move my vote from him. Also want to see what Objection's going to do now that the object of his inactivity ire, Rein, has posted.

When did Xinny ever claim Announcer? I just saw her claim Ninja.

While this game is the most difficult of the three, and would be even with better weapon accuracy, that's still a large part of the difficulty, and not in a good way. I want chapters to be difficult because of the power/placement of the enemies and the design, not because I can't rely on my characters hitting half of the time. And then the HM boosts are outrageous, making the character balance one of the worst IMO. The Seize objectives are difficult only because Roy is just so bad he gets doubled by Bolting, and can't kill anything.