Eurykins

S'all good. The main reason why I even ended up targeting you to RB was the fact that, from D1 priorities, I had Clarinets > Marth > You. Figured it would be too predictable if I targetted Marth, so moved down to you lol.

I figured as the game wound down, it was more likely of a chance for me to refresh my shot(s). It was also x10000 safer for scum to assume that I was basically a vanilla and survive another night phase. So yeh, there ya go.

Sigh. Why you gotta make me claim information I would really not like to? I started with 2 shot role. The RB delay. I had a mechanic built in though, that enabled me to refresh a shot if I blocked or otherwise prevented a fatal role from killing someone. N1: As we know, I saved myself from Bart's shot. I was lucky as dog shit with the block. N2: I tried blocking Omega, but fizzled on Weapons instead. -1 shot. N3: Blocked Prims, and enabled success. I did not say anything wrt getting refreshed upon hitting Bart N1 because of the implications of either Vig or scum shot. After N1 flip happened, I assumed Vig was more likely.

Also I totally called something along the lines of strongarm/something that would enable a kill to bypass protection. 10/10 I actually predicted something right this game.

Prims was blocked last night. If I blocked the NK, then he needs to die or two of us die tomorrow.

*Actually, can a watcher see an ascetic kill someone? As they'd be watching over someone being visited by said person? I didn't quite consider that, but that would also rely on us having a watcher, which I don't think we had? Just a tracker? (Unless I'm dumb and missed a claim or whatnot.)

Ascetic gets around RB/redirection/copping. Doesn't get around Doc. Having only one role/slot that can cope with those amounts of means to affect action-disabling roles though, seems unlikely to me. Because literally claiming ascetic, if they ended up being scum ascetic, means that tenfold everyone else on your scum team is going to harbor the risk of being blocked or redirected in some fashion. It's odd though, because unless Ascetic got shot or something by our claimed vig, had that slot survived to be the last one standing, there would be no real way to defend against them? Outside of commuting to safety or doc shots (and assuming these two roles get nullified via TP loss or get killed at some point), the rest of our utility as townside would be null and void. No way to track/see them, or otherwise verify one way or another if/when they kill someone. That's actually pretty nasty, when I think about it. Moreso than a ninja role. PEDIT: This is also probably why we need to not NL this day phase. We just fucking massclaimed, and we're gonna lose a strong power role within this next night phase almost guaranteed.

My point is, there are so many variables that I do not think there is really ANY means of FOR SURE clearing ANYONE in this game thus far. At least in my head. Rolecop is questionable in any game state. Neighbors- one of us- is likely not town. I know from my PoV that I'm town, but Snike/Boron would likewise claim the exact same thing. Not really a means to tell who is telling the truth until one of us flips. Ascetic and Commuter are in the same boat as Rolecop. Liable of being either side, and hard to prove either at this point. (And even then, proving those aspects of the roles don't do much as a whole.) Doc/Omniguard, RB/Role delayer, RB shot (item?), Bodyguard/Redirection/bussing?, and can even include Commuter again as a means of anti-killing. The fuck are the amounts of protection floating around? Not all of these can reliably be stated as being town-sided. Unless scum has means of breaking through them to ensure that there is some means of guaranteeing or highly increasing the chance of succeeding on a NK.

It wasn't specific. Omega's role states that it randomly selects another player to target. Maybe RNG just sucked N2. Also, the timing of Omega's claim doesn't really do much either IMO. If it's a scum gambit, then why wouldn't he claim it sooner than later?

My ROLE/information back told me that I was redirected TO him and my role FAILED. Like, didn't actually RB him or anything. That pulled up two options for me. A. Weapons is telling the truth, which would be fine. OR. B. Omega ended up redirecting me to Weapons. Weapons has a means of being Immune or otherwise unaffected by MY role/ability. Claim/flip wise, 2 sources could have redirected me to Weapons N2. Not just one. Weapons is by no means cleared to me as a result. Also it would not have struck me as odd if Omega had chosen to scramble up my action with his role. He was very much on the fence in terms of being uncertain about me during the latter half of his ISO posts, behind that of Marth. However, given how Marth ended up flipping/being, I wouldn't put it past him to have turned his lense of suspect onto me and looked at me with mild distrust. Could've also contributed the use of that former ability (over his stronger RB one) to the fact that he assumed that I was to die anyways and thus needed to do less to affect my overall affect post N2.

Also, forgot to mention this, but NL probably wouldn't help us at all. I will not vote for NL. I don't see the benefit of it, especially since (according to all of the listed claims) there isn't a direct means of tracking/watching/investigation/etc. for us to be able to for sure weed out people during the next night phase and delaying things. It's going to just open up the doors for us to lose another townie, and it'll probably be someone that's a relatively strong town read across the board. Which will give us little to no help at all in the matter. We need to lock down scum, or we're finished IMO. Can't expect to carve out a townside victory if we think sitting on our hands is really the best course of action here.

No, they just left 'cause you scared them away. Besides, I like the letter C over B personally. To the rest of the thoughts: Commuter claim feels more like a role based on surviving/protecting themselves over someone else (moreso self-serving). A more scum-sided role of interest than town. Factoring in other protection roles- doc, RB's, etc. seems less likely to be townsided IMO. Via's item-giving role reminds me of Marth's flip, but different utility. Kinda made me wonder in terms of how many item-based roles would actually be considered OK for townside to have, but also comes with the territory/chance of mis-giving items to scum for use. I'm OK with Snike/boron slot removal. At this point, this wagon/slot is probably just being shoved by town and scum side alike since I don't see much interest in saving the sinking ship. We probably won't get much more associative reads coming from their flip sadly, unless it reveals more than just ascetic information/role coming into light. But scum lynch is a scum lynch, and keeps us moving forward. > Though I feel like it would make sense for Snike/Boron slot to be scum, since between a Neighbor pair and Clarinet's Tracker + Messenger role, that leaves a lot of potential conversing outside of the thread for just townside to have. And that some part of it should be scumside (to be able to have some hand in hearing some of the townside thoughts/messages and possibly being able to disrupt the flow of information between players) to level things out. That plus the Ascetic side seems far more scum-sided serving, in terms of avoiding a lot of roles form influencing them. Still having trouble with Weapon's role/claims. Doc + Drive/Bodyguard + RB's in varied means on townside still feels way too convoluted and crowded to allow scum to have a good fluid means of killing townside (though clearly us townies suck royals this game 'cause MYLO things). In this case, either Shinori took a MASSIVE gamble and delayed acquiring a second NK on townside in saving me, or Weapons isn't being honest at all about being the actual NK target. The latter has far less risk in the claim, and outside of my own interaction with his ability (the only real means of proof of his role going off the way he claims it was done), there is no real way to prove what actually happened in terms of targeting abilities and who was ACTUALLY meant to die between Weapons/Omega. Again, something that could easily be manipulated, which is bothering me the more I think about things. Pure rolespec: The fact that I also had no effect on Weapons made me consider another option, though unsure how plausible it could've been. HAD I BEEN MOVED TO WEAPONS VIA OMEGA'S ROLE (and not by Weapons' claimed swapping of himself and Omega), AND MY ROLE STILL NOT BEING APPLICABLE TO GOING OFF, IT OPENS UP THE DOORS/POSSIBILITY OF A STRONGMAN ROLE (or something that enables it). Which, as a result of the amount of RB's/guards/docs/etc. that have been claimed so far, leads my consideration of this being a thing of being fairly possible. > If a strongman is involved in the game, then a commute role COULD be considered almost required to have SOMEONE being able to survive the kill attempt if made on them, so could thus be rendered as being more townside. Especially if it was a one-shot ability that consumed most of the player's (if not all) TP in order to secure an almost guaranteed kill, assuming no commute disrupts their attempt. However, at this point, this is pure muddled role spec that probably does us no good, but has been something that has eaten at me slightly ever since the N2 results came back to me that my ability was rendered as not applying to Weapons that night. Rolecop. I hate being the role, and I dislike seeing the claim for others, in terms of the rep/notions that it gets from people. Gut instinct reads that scum has more to benefit from role copping than townside does, and that the announcement side of the role is moreso for a safer claim to resort to (and seems more townie-ish). Part of this is muddled due to the massive amounts of actual roles this game though (due to the set-up), so I'm not sure how I feel about the slot. I also feel that the gameplay revolving around when Bart decided to claim his shot on my life was really odd, and if it was a scum gambit to attempt to gain towncred (by attempting to "attract" a shot when, as scum, none would really be shot at him anyways), then it was a pretty easy one. @Bartozio To be honest, Shinori is probably the only person who was willing to save me. Hell, I thought I was gonna die, and was like, "Welp, this is it guys" and assumed I was dead come the start of the day phase. I kinda already accepted my fate, so this game kinda threw me for a loop when something/someone bothered to protect my slot. On the other hand, everyone else assuming I'd be dead and things be easier also made things easier for the scum team to aim for mislynches in D2 though, tbh. The main reason why I really wanted to fight against me being lynched and being shot instead was to see if you were what you were, and to be able to try and give townside one last action from me to hopefully prevent a kill. Granted, D2 kinda got fucked over by that modkill thing that happened and forced the end of the day phase, which really put townside in an uphill battle against scum since we have yet to lynch or remove a single one yet by any means. I'm a bit irate at myself for having been stuck on townies thus far (I suck at this game apparently, moreso than I thought LOL), and I bet you anything that scum is rolling on the ground laughing at this point based on how much we're fucking running around in circles like chickens with their heads cut off and miscasing/mislynching townies as scum left and right all game. Also, on a side note, I already claimed about not being bulletproof, deathproof, or any role that had a self-protective measure built into it. Nothing about my role has anything that innately protects me from a killing shot, period. If someone shoots me, I'm dead. Period. Unless an outside source stops it, or I get insanely lucky enough to RB delay the shot, but even then only delays my death by one day phase. That's probably the ONLY thing I've done right in terms of protecting and helping townside so far this game, sadly enough. o_e;; People I would be OK removing this day phase: Boron/Snike slot, Weapons, Athena, Prims maybe? (Reflecting priority as well from Left -> Right/ Highest Interest -> More suspect but not highest priority). People who would have to be pulling a crazy fucking gambit in order to be scum: Shinori (It scares me how much I've not scum read him this entire game tbh, but I still don't feel like he's really scum, because I doubt scum!nori would remove the chance for ez 2 kills for scum last night by saving me from Bart's shot), Bartozio, Via (Not really reading him badly though for the majority of the game. The players to whom he's given items to have matched up pretty well with his reads in-thread too, so would seem hella generous for scum!via to want to give out all of those items like that to non-scum team members.) This game hurts my head. :(

*Also heading into work now, but I will be back this afternoon/evening.

From my PoV, Shinori is the main reason why today started with 1 townie death instead of 2 (myself). In that sense, his actions don't really make sense as scum, as he really doesn't gain anything from scumside from having saved a townie slot. Despite having confirmed Weapon's NA, I'm personally not reading his slot moreso as a town role currently. With my own role, plus that of Omega's, Via's, AND Shinori being a doc, this seems like way too much protection coming from townside. Unless this game derived from the possibility of townside screwing each other over during the night phase, it seems a bit too excessive to have available to us. Secondly, I am also moreso used to seeing drivers being scumsided moreso than town, and I'm more curious as to why he chose to drive himself and Omega. Part of the reason why I'm skeptical is due to the fact that it would be theoretically pretty easy to manipulate the situation in order to make it seem as though Weapons was an intended NK target and thus clear himself by that means. Am I the only one confused as to what Marth's items in his Role PM were supposed to do? I was wondering if this, alongside Via's items, were too much to be handed out on townside, but what were his items even supposed to do??? Was there someone specific that were made to utilize the items in a specific manner, or something else? (Since according to the role PM he posted, the materials alone don't do anything?) As a side note, I think I know who my neighbor is now, and by the looks of things, it kinda makes sense in the timing/notion I actually saw the other day. Pretty sure Boron/Snike slot was/is my neighbor. If I'm wrong, then I'm dumb, but at the same token I have reason to believe they are.

I'm off to sleep, as I have work at 10am tomorrow morning. Will be on later in the afternoon/evening once I get home from work.

I aimed my last shot of RB delay at Omega last night. Yes, I had enough TP for two shots, not one. Part of the reason why I was OK in being left to get shot by Bart, so I could at least help one last night phase. My results said that I smacked Weapons instead, but that my ability didn't actually affect him. I'm not sure if that was due to the fact that the swap happened, and then there was nothing to block??? But then I got confused, because I had assumed (before weapons had claimed) that I had been random-swapped to blocking Weapons instead of Omega due to Omega's ability, not Weapon's. But if that were the case, then Weapon's ability should've never gone off in the actual swapping thing.

Unless I'm misreading/misunderstanding how the role priority would work. I thought it was possibly caused by Omega's role, but now I'm not sure. I'm so confused.

Long story short: I have something that conflicts with Weapons actively swapping himself with Omega. In regards to what did and didn't take effect last night.

I don't quite understand how role priority works though. I don't know if I'm misunderstanding how something happened or....

Something doesn't add up here.

I don't understand how I'm alive. Did Bart lie about being a vig (was it a gambit or something else???), or did something prevent him from doing so? Several things though: 1. Neighbor responded, albeit with not really much. Still don't know who the slot is, but is someone still alive. 2. I want to know what happened wrt Bart and his claim. Stuff isn't matching up. 3. Something odd happened last night phase, outside of me surviving. Unsure what to make of it though. Also I'm not bullet/deathproof or any variant of that- so an outside source was responsible for me not dying, or there was no shot aimed at me. I don't see scum intending to protect me from the shot in terms of towncred, but I also don't think I was really being townread by most players by the time D2 was forced to end, so I have no idea who the hell might've even bothered doing so.

I am at a loss for words. Was that really necessary?

Whether the reason was good or bad is one thing. So I won't speak for the intent behind Weapon's question. What information it can reveal, though, is something that scum doesn't need to know.

Why do you feel the need to ask how much his shot consumed TP wise, Weapons? The fact of whether TP can be given to other players or not should not be enough validation to warrant asking them the cost of their ability. Especially when scum may have a handful of ideas as to what sort of costs/number of uses that any sort of role can utilize, which may in turn reveal whether Bart has another shot available or not. If he doesn't, he's basically rendered a vanilla/non-threat. If he does, then they're liable to shooting him for it as a threat to the scum team.