Loki Laufeyson Posted January 19, 2009 Share Posted January 19, 2009 the Dawn Brigade has Micaiah as the lord, who happens to be one of the most hateful characters of all FE10. at least that is for meand the Dawn Brigade has like almost no personality agreed...i dont like Micaiah at all..shes a waste of space and Sothe turned into an ass in the 3 years between the games... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CGV Posted January 20, 2009 Share Posted January 20, 2009 Its funny how 13 people said no, but there's only 3 no's in the bottom section I chose no. I like how they all come together in the end Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Posted January 20, 2009 Share Posted January 20, 2009 agreed...i dont like Micaiah at all..shes a waste of space and Sothe turned into an ass in the 3 years between the games... actually, i don't mind her much as a unit after all, light magic is my favorite type of all, and i don't have to promote her to use it!!!!. its the personality that she carries which bugs me beyond words. sometimes, i wish i could just drop her in favor of Sanaki. at least she is a more enjoyable character personality-wise. Its funny how 13 people said no, but there's only 3 no's in the bottom sectionI chose no. I like how they all come together in the end no option was added after many peoples had voted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananas Posted January 20, 2009 Share Posted January 20, 2009 agreed...i dont like Micaiah at all..shes a waste of space and Sothe turned into an ass in the 3 years between the games... Sothe's only an ass now because of Micaiah. As soon as he found her after the war he forgot about everything else and went "NO STUFF YOU ALL I HAVE TO PROTECT HER!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEnd Posted January 20, 2009 Share Posted January 20, 2009 No. The three different groups are an important novelty element of this game. I find it an interesting change of game dynamics so far, since I'm still at 2-F. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penitent Posted January 20, 2009 Share Posted January 20, 2009 On the Micaiah-Mary-Sue thing, I know where the people are coming from, but she's still far from being one in my perspective. After all, despite being the advertised protagonist of the game, Ike's still more important than her. A Mary Sue's designed to be the centre of attention, yet she's treated with irreverence by Ike's group in Part III and arguably shafted in Part IV. I also don't like the Apostle business, but in essence it seems to be elaborated plot-device to patch over Lehran's own story. Believe me, proper Mary Sues are a lot more drastic than Micaiah was She's important, but definitely not the centre of attention. If they wanted to make her a Mary Sue, they'd have done a lot more. (e.g. Have her need to kill Ashera first then again with Ike, not demean her when we're following other characters, not have those flaws like her political insensitivity or excess compassion get in the way, pair her up with Ike never mind that it'd be better than canon, etc.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Tarrasque Posted January 20, 2009 Share Posted January 20, 2009 The 3 group thing was fine. They just needed to put some balance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Posted January 20, 2009 Share Posted January 20, 2009 On the Micaiah-Mary-Sue thing, I know where the people are coming from, but she's still far from being one in my perspective. After all, despite being the advertised protagonist of the game, Ike's still more important than her. A Mary Sue's designed to be the centre of attention, yet she's treated with irreverence by Ike's group in Part III and arguably shafted in Part IV. I also don't like the Apostle business, but in essence it seems to be elaborated plot-device to patch over Lehran's own story.Believe me, proper Mary Sues are a lot more drastic than Micaiah was She's important, but definitely not the centre of attention. If they wanted to make her a Mary Sue, they'd have done a lot more. (e.g. Have her need to kill Ashera first then again with Ike, not demean her when we're following other characters, not have those flaws like her political insensitivity or excess compassion get in the way, pair her up with Ike never mind that it'd be better than canon, etc.). because the whole world couldn't be fawning over Micaiah. since this story consisted in multiple parts, you just couldn't have Micaiah be everywhere. but the parts that Micaiah DOES appear are enough. she's so understanding, caring, and perfect in every aspect. she has this amazing gift which allows her to see the future hax anyone?, and always places the people she loves first. she even acts a martyr for a while, the poor thing. everybody who gets to know her loves her. i hate her. she may not be a full-blown Mary Sue, but she's up there. and even if she wasn't, she's still not an enjoyable character. Give me a Serra and a L'Arachel any day of the week. At least they don't pretend to be perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atriel Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) I agree with pretty much all Persephone has said. She is just... i don't know how to properly say it but it's like she's the perfect hypocrite. She seems so fake. At least she's got the looks. Apart from her annoying & hateful character she fails as a unit for me. If anything, her magic is amazing. Well, her luck too but what's the point of that when both her defense, HP and speed are so bad that there is no need for a critical hit to utterly rape her ass. A bit extra dodge i guess. I get so much satisfaction when i attack the Dawn Brigade with the Greil Mercenaries. If only the damned BK was not there... I'll use some fliers my next walkthrough to destroy them all. Of course, Micaiah being the primary objective. I'd like it for her to fall slowly, but with her crap survivability i doubt that will be the case. Ah... sorry, needed to get that out of me. ^_^ Edited January 21, 2009 by Atriel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hibari Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 I like seeing multiple sides of the story to be honest. It adds something in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemini-Saga Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 I still prefer the way it is the various sides of the story was a Great addition, and I don't have problems with DB >_> I Started to like the even more after some Miraculous Bless on Hard mode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Sothe Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 I voted no, It would be like too easy for getting EVERYONE to 20-20-20 if we spent 45 chapter or so with only one group... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penitent Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 Bump. because the whole world couldn't be fawning over Micaiah. since this story consisted in multiple parts, you just couldn't have Micaiah be everywhere.but the parts that Micaiah DOES appear are enough. she's so understanding, caring, and perfect in every aspect. she has this amazing gift which allows her to see the future hax anyone?, and always places the people she loves first. she even acts a martyr for a while, the poor thing. everybody who gets to know her loves her. Again, I respectfully disagree, but respect why you feel that way. And you just described Ike. :o Only we replace the farsight with absolutely ridiculous abs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 (edited) Bump.Again, I respectfully disagree, but respect why you feel that way. And you just described Ike. :o Only we replace the farsight with absolutely ridiculous abs. i really don't like Ike either, but at least he works at becoming godlike, unlike Micaiah who was apparently born that way. he doesn't have a h4x skill like Micaiah with her premonitions. And even though Ike is really important and all that, we know that the Greil Mercenaries wouldn't be as awesomesauce as they are without Soren and Titania. and in this aspect Ike is closer to being a normal person than micaiah, since one person can't be possibly perfect in every aspect. micaiah is the brilliant strategist, the powerful mage, the compassionate leader, the resolute commander, the oracle of the goddess, the humanitarian, the charismatic leader... the list goes on and on. All of part 1 revolves around her, even overlooking other members of the Dawn Brigade as in Nolan, who if you ask me SHOULD have been the brilliant strategist. the small sections in which he appeared showed him as a wise man in fact, storyline-wise, you could probably remove everyone Ike, just like most other lords, received the glorified treatment. IS should really work on improving their lords' personalities for future games, and in that we both can agree, can we not? Edited February 6, 2009 by Persephone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martelé Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 I like the idea of having three groups. It was pretty fun to have the different groups fight each other, imo. But I hate how unbalanced they are. The CRK fail at life, the DB is full of underleveled characters, so they fail, too, and the GMs are just made of awesomeness. They should have given them about the same amount of chapters (and EXP) to the different groups and it would have been pretty awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charmander6000 Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 The DB could have used a couple of more levels in part 1 and another laguz chapter in part 3. The CRK could have used one large chapter to themselves and Ike's team capacity should have increased by about three. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penitent Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 (edited) i really don't like Ike either but at least he works at becoming godlike, unlike Micaiah who was apparently born that way. ...Micaiah isn't godlike. he doesn't have a h4x skill like Micaiah with her premonitions. Two-handed sword in one hand. Fights for his friends. Kills the Black Knight. He's crazy. micaiah is the brilliant strategist, the powerful mage, the compassionate leader, the resolute commander, the oracle of the goddess, the humanitarian, the charismatic leader... the list goes on and on. Seeing that list, I'm not actually impressed. :o Possibly due to the execution of half those traits (see below). All of part 1 revolves around her What about Pelleas, Tauroneo and others? D: even overlooking other members of the Dawn Brigade as in Nolan, who if you ask me SHOULD have been the brilliant strategist. the small sections in which he appeared showed him as a wise man YESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYE SYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESY ESYESYES Ike, just like most other lords, received the glorified treatment. IS should really work on improving their lords' personalities for future games, and in that we both can agree, can we not? Agreed. Alongside that, Radiant Dawn suffered from aiming to be larger than its development team could afford to be, hence narrative and newly introduced plot points of interest weren't fully expanded on. Ike managed to survive this due to previously established relationships and heroics in Path of Radiance, but Micaiah and the Dawn Brigade suffered critically from this - it didn't help that they made the error of prioritising too much on Sothe and Micaiah and not involving the core Dawn Brigade at all, especially when Nolan, Edward or the others could just as easily retreat if wounded in the same way Titania, Mist and Soren do during Ike's chapters. (So in that sense I stay on topic by discussing a flaw with having more than two groups :V ). So with what should have been there absent, it falls to the player to do what s/he has always done - use their imagination to conceive what the character might be saying/doing. Hence the fun returns. And then write angry complaints to do better. Edited February 6, 2009 by Penitent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hibari Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 lol ...Micaiah isn't godlike. Two-handed sword in one hand. Fights for his friends. Kills the Black Knight. He's crazy. Altina used both in each hand and the image show that she was built like Lucia. And Ike was kept alive for the sole reason of being able to kill the Black Knight, it would be pathetic if he couldn't. Seeing that list, I'm not actually impressed. :o Possibly due to the execution of half those traits (see below). What about Pelleas, Tauroneo and others? D: No one really seemed to care about Pelleas. Remember his speech in the engame? YESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYE SYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESY ESYESYES Agreed. Alongside that, Radiant Dawn suffered from aiming to be larger than its development team could afford to be, hence narrative and newly introduced plot points of interest weren't fully expanded on. Ike managed to survive this due to previously established relationships and heroics in Path of Radiance, but Micaiah and the Dawn Brigade suffered critically from this - it didn't help that they made the error of prioritising too much on Sothe and Micaiah and not involving the core Dawn Brigade at all, especially when Nolan, Edward or the others could just as easily retreat if wounded in the same way Titania, Mist and Soren do during Ike's chapters. (So in that sense I stay on topic by discussing a flaw with having more than two groups :V ). Agreed. So with what should have been there absent, it falls to the player to do what s/he has always done - use their imagination to conceive what the character might be saying/doing. Hence the fun returns. And then write angry complaints to do better. I addressed what I felt I had to in bold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 (edited) ...Micaiah isn't godlike. Two-handed sword in one hand. Fights for his friends. Kills the Black Knight. He's crazy. Seeing that list, I'm not actually impressed. :o Possibly due to the execution of half those traits (see below). What about Pelleas, Tauroneo and others? D: YESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYE SYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESYESY ESYESYES Agreed. Alongside that, Radiant Dawn suffered from aiming to be larger than its development team could afford to be, hence narrative and newly introduced plot points of interest weren't fully expanded on. Ike managed to survive this due to previously established relationships and heroics in Path of Radiance, but Micaiah and the Dawn Brigade suffered critically from this - it didn't help that they made the error of prioritising too much on Sothe and Micaiah and not involving the core Dawn Brigade at all, especially when Nolan, Edward or the others could just as easily retreat if wounded in the same way Titania, Mist and Soren do during Ike's chapters. (So in that sense I stay on topic by discussing a flaw with having more than two groups :V ). So with what should have been there absent, it falls to the player to do what s/he has always done - use their imagination to conceive what the character might be saying/doing. Hence the fun returns. And then write angry complaints to do better. well, perhaps i was a bit too harsh with Micaiah and may not be a full-fledged Mary Sue, but you have to admit that she is quite an unattractive character personality-wise. i also really hated the way that she and Sothe were prioritized at the expense of the Dawn Brigade. in fact, while i played Part 1 i sometimes had the desire to just completely skip part 1 so that i could go ahead to part 2 and see characters i actually cared about. if we think about it, the only units who didn't suffer from the game split was, ironically, the ones who were the least relevant plot-wise as in the units in Part 2. very few units, varying main characters, and the fact that most of them actually had lines on the script helped. not that i'm over-glorifying them, actually, since they're not really relevant to the plot and could have been inserted as a background information during the game. DX and going back to the topic in question, split paths could actually work if fewer units were available. 70 playable units=/=good game, since we end up not knowing anything about the majority of the units assuming we didn't play through PoR, that is. The support conversations would be tricky, though. you can't have support conversations with every single character as the FE10 system would require, and if the FE9 system would be applied, it might make the support bonuses void in Part 4 when the army splits. the only way i can see that support conversations be available in a multiple-part game is if the teams are predetermined, meaning no customization for part 4 assuming they would still do the split army part Edited February 6, 2009 by Persephone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M-dragon Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 The setup was good. What lacked was balance between groups. Part one should have had a bit stronger enemies near endgame because characters can't raise above 20/5 properly making them heavy underleveld in Part 3. By the time you get the dawn brigade the GM's are close or already 3th tier. If it was more balanced it would have been more fun to fight between groups. Now DB flees and GM's try to rush to kill some DB's. I also think there should have been a base before the splitup of Part 4, so you can swap skills and such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hibari Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 The setup was good. What lacked was balance between groups. Part one should have had a bit stronger enemies near endgame because characters can't raise above 20/5 properly making them heavy underleveld in Part 3. By the time you get the dawn brigade the GM's are close or already 3th tier. If it was more balanced it would have been more fun to fight between groups. Now DB flees and GM's try to rush to kill some DB's. I also think there should have been a base before the splitup of Part 4, so you can swap skills and such. I don't see why they couldn't have to be honest.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral "Bull" Halsey Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 No...what's the point anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dondon151 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 RD did not need to have a 3-tier system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Changed by VASM :( Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I think the games should have had a greater time diffrence (Ten Years or so), as well as focused on mostly new characters (No more then ten returning characters) It should have also had a support system as that would have given most the new characters personalities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charmander6000 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 RD did not need to have a 3-tier system. It could have been possible all you needed to do was change around part 1 unit's starting level and divide the laguz's starting level by 2. Micaiah - 1 Edward - 2 Leonardo - 2 Nolan - 5 Laura - 1 Sothe - 15 Aran - 4 Ilyana - 6 Meg - 1 Volug - 7 Tauroneo - 20/8 Zihark - 18 Jill - 11 Fiona - 6 Tormod - 20/1 Muarim - 9 Vika - 6 Naliah - 16 Rafiel - 6 Black Knight - 20/20 Everyone else just moves down a tier. Though when you look at it in context of PoR many characters moved down from their starting level (Titania and Shinon are first tiers?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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