Homosexuality

[Defeatist Elitist]

Gay marriage/intamacy is not only against my religion, it's against nature! I mean, come on... Does a plug fit into a plug? Does an outlet fit into an outlet? No. A plug fits into an outlet, and vice-versa. People can be gay if they want, I am tolerant. But I definitely do NOT approve. It is against nature for 1 man and 1 man, or 1 woman and 1 woman.

It makes sense for it to be 1 man and 1 woman. That's my counter-argument.

You're a moron. Seriously, don't fucking run your mouth off about an issue that you have absolutely no understanding of. Especially when it's an issue like this.

First of all, fuck you, polyester and eye glasses are unnatural, do you have a problem with them? What about all the other unnatural things we do?

Second of all, homosexuality IS natural, it is a factor of both environment and genetics, its not something people just choose to do off hand. In addition, homosexuality has been observed in some species of animals.

And even if it was unnatural, WHY THE FUCK WOULD IT MATTER? Give me one good reason why all unnatural things are bad.

Edited February 14, 2010 by ZXValaRevan

[BK-201]

Hika's point, if you don't like unnatural get the hell off the internet.

[Hero]

And even if it was unnatural, WHY THE FUCK WOULD IT MATTER? Give me one good reason why all unnatural things are bad.

He said he doesn't approve because it's unnatural. Obviously he idealizes the 'natural' lifestyle. Since he says he tolerates unnatural things he's probably not an anarcho-primitivist, though his ideas are similar. Perhaps it's eco-communalism?

He's probably only using the internet and other unnatural devices to prepare for his journey back to the land.

Edited February 14, 2010 by Hero

[BK-201]

So he's doing something he disapproves of because he can tolerate it?

[Defeatist Elitist]

I mean, come on... Does a plug fit into a plug? Does an outlet fit into an outlet? No. A plug fits into an outlet, and vice-versa.

Fun fact, a cock does fit into an ass.

[Bryan]

Second of all, homosexuality IS natural, it is a factor of both environment and genetics, its not something people just choose to do off hand. In addition, homosexuality has been observed in some species of animals.

Homosexuality has been around for a long long time. In most ancient cultures, Homosexuality was not only natural, it was encouraged.

Most all men have a gay urge a few times during their lives, it just depends on they act on it.

Gay marriage/intamacy is not only against my religion, it's against nature! I mean, come on... Does a plug fit into a plug? Does an outlet fit into an outlet? No. A plug fits into an outlet, and vice-versa. People can be gay if they want, I am tolerant. But I definitely do NOT approve. It is against nature for 1 man and 1 man, or 1 woman and 1 woman.

It makes sense for it to be 1 man and 1 woman. That's my counter-argument.

It sounds like you have had many gay urges but and are using the Freudian defense mechanism called Reaction formation, and you just pretend to hate gay people because you do not want to be gay.

I am going back to going away.

[Shuuda]

Gay marriage/intamacy is not only against my religion, it's against nature!

Homosexually is as every bit as natural as everything else in the universe. Unlike your god (which only exists in fiction). Please develop your understand of the word "natural".

I mean, come on... Does a plug fit into a plug?

Humans have more than one socket.

It makes sense for it to be 1 man and 1 woman. That's my counter-argument.

No, asexual reproduction makes more sense to me. If we did that, none of this shit would matter.

knowledge of the truth and teach them about God

One cannot obtain truth by believing in fictional characters that they have little understanding of.

If you truly reject/ignore/hate my religion,are NOT sorry for your sins and wrong-doings,and truly harden your heart against God, then there is no hope for you, and I am forced to quit

That's right; people dislike your religion because they're all bad people who are clueless... Yes... That's right.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Shuuda

[quanta]

Homosexuality has been around for a long long time. In most ancient cultures, Homosexuality was not only natural, it was encouraged.

Ummm... A Nitpick. A) This is kind of irrelevant to the point. B) Please don't use what appear to be made up facts. Some of the Greeks might have been pederasts, and certain cultures might have been more tolerant towards what would now be considered homosexual behaviors (although comparing them to modern classifications of sexuality is a bit like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole sometimes); but I'm pretty sure it's highly inaccurate to say most ancient cultures encouraged homosexuality. I'd wager it'd almost certainly be more accurate to say the vast majority of ancient cultures encouraged some form of heterosexual marriage (possibly involving multiple wives for one husband); the much greater risk of death in childbirth or when young and lower populations meant it made more sense to try to get everyone to reproduce. C) How you would even measure and attempt to quantify such a complex statement would be beyond me; so if you're going to make such a claim you're going to need some serious sources and citations.

[Shamanx21]

Thank god this isn't a rant about the bible lol

Anyway, I don't really care if I can marry a man or not since I don't really see myself settling down anytime soon. Even with a woman, I don't think I could last in a marriage that's supposed to last 'til death @__@

Anyway, I don't think I've ever heard of anyone encouraging homosexual relations... sounds a bit ridiculous, but I have read of same sex relations taking place long long ago.

I guess I'm just "meh" on the gay marriage subject but I do get mad when people quote the bible as if they follow it everyday of their lives or when people say something really stupid like "well then what stops people from marrying dogs"

[Hero]

Homosexuality has been around for a long long time. In most ancient cultures, Homosexuality was not only natural, it was encouraged.

As somebody who has studied a lot of ancient history and anthropology, I can tell you you're (almost) completely wrong if you're talking about ancient Mediterranean cultures. I could go into a lot more detail, things were different in different regions and periods and there were many many exceptions, but in general this was the case: A man who got caught doing it with other men would face death or exile from his city.

I will grant you that among the pre-Christian Greeks and Hellenized cultures things were a lot looser with regards to homosexual acts than they would become in late antiquity and beyond. But don't delude yourself that any of it was encouraged.

Unlike your god (which only exists in fiction).

One cannot obtain truth by believing in fictional characters that they have little understanding of.

This isn't the place for you to wage your little war against religion, save it for 'Question about the Christian God'.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Hero

[Shuuda]

No need for an overreaction. A few jabs is all it is. He's the one who brought God into this, not me.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Shuuda

[Shamanx21]

Still, no need to "Jab" at someones' religion like that :/ It just looks tacky and devalues your point of view. Just saying.

[Shuuda]

It just looks tacky and devalues your point of view. Just saying

I think you're under the impression that my post has any value at all. It's nothing more than a 30 second response to someone who posted a terrible argument. Of course, it was very hard to take his post in any serious manner.

Lets get this back on topic now. Any more posts on this small matter will be removed.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Shuuda

[Bryan]

As somebody who has studied a lot of ancient history and anthropology, I can tell you you're (almost) completely wrong if you're talking about ancient Mediterranean cultures. I could go into a lot more detail, things were different in different regions and periods and there were many many exceptions, but in general this was the case: A man who got caught doing it with other men would face death or exile from his city.

I will grant you that among the pre-Christian Greeks and Hellenized cultures things were a lot looser with regards to homosexual acts than they would become in late antiquity and beyond. But don't delude yourself that any of it was encouraged.

This isn't the place for you to wage your little war against religion, save it for 'Question about the Christian God'.

I don't feel like citing sorces right now. :/

However, the Greeks encoraged an older member of the community (Erastes) to have intercural sex with younger members of the community, untill they were 18, then the younger members would become Erastes to a new "batch" of eromenos. Also, Sparta encoraged gay bounds in their army because it would keep the army strong, besides, men in Sparta did not get married until they were around thirty, and they lived in the barracks until they were around 60. (IIRC, I have to make sure of that exact age.)

But I should have said some, not most.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Bryan

[Hash Jar]

This is one of the reason's the world pisses me off sometimes. This shouldn't be a subject up for discussion. There are much more important things that need our attention. I do agree that this needs to be done as it would be a huge step for humans, but I believe this is something that should already be (but enough of my dream world :( ). The arguments put up against gay marriage are ridiculous and should not be considered at all.

From one side they are just using fear tactics and lying by using arguments like; "gays are pedos," or ,"gays are so immoral they would fuck dogs," or ,"gays are child molesters." These arguments are all clearly untrue and simply there to scare people away from accepting gay marriage. On the other side there are religious people who argue against it through God. Although I do agree with religious people more because at least the believe it just because God said so while the others are just assholes who make up terrible lies :\ They're both fucked up however.

These things have already been stated but meh. I personally believe that peace can not be achieved while there is religion in the world, or at least ones that force belief onto others and generate some form of inferiority to those who don't believe. So right now... almost all of them. I'm not saying all religious people are like this, but all religions have these underlying factors. It's up to the people to root these terrible things out of religion.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Rafael

[Bryan]

This is one of the reason's the world pisses me off sometimes. This shouldn't be a subject up for discussion. There are much more important things that need our attention. I do agree that this needs to be done as it would be a huge step for humans, but I believe this is something that should already be (but enough of my dream world :( ). The arguments put up against gay marriage are ridiculous and should not be considered at all.

From one side they are just using fear tactics and lying by using arguments like; "gays are pedos," or ,"gays are so immoral they would fuck dogs," or ,"gays are child molesters." These arguments are all clearly untrue and simply there to scare people away from accepting gay marriage. On the other side there are religious people who argue against it through God. Although I do agree with religious people more because at least the believe it just because God said so while the others are just assholes who make up terrible lies :\ They're both fucked up however.

These things have already been stated but meh. I personally believe that peace can not be achieved while there is religion in the world, or at least ones that force belief onto others and generate some form of inferiority to those who don't believe. So right now... almost all of them. I'm not saying all religious people are like this, but all religions have these underlying factors. It's up to the people to root these terrible things out of religion.

Do they even have any proof?

World peace is never really going to be acheived, we will always be fighting over something...

[Crystal Shards]

Gay marriage/intamacy is not only against my religion, it's against nature! I mean, come on... Does a plug fit into a plug? Does an outlet fit into an outlet? No. A plug fits into an outlet, and vice-versa. People can be gay if they want, I am tolerant. But I definitely do NOT approve. It is against nature for 1 man and 1 man, or 1 woman and 1 woman.

It makes sense for it to be 1 man and 1 woman. That's my counter-argument.

If you're against gay marriage, don't have one. End of story. Your religion is not my religion, and you should not be able to force your religion down my throat. I believe in gay marriage, even though I myself am not gay. And a plug doesn't fit into a plug, but a cock does fit into mouths, asses, and vaginas, believe it or not. Fingers fit in all of those too. So I don't get your point.

Besides, marriage itself isn't natural, so your entire post is contradictory. Even then, marriage was around long before Christianity came around and claimed it for itself, so don't even act like the Pope has the be-all-end-all claim to that throne.

It makes sense to actually think about what you're posting. That's my counter-argument.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Crystal Shards

[Phoenix Wright]

This is one of the reason's the world pisses me off sometimes. This shouldn't be a subject up for discussion. There are much more important things that need our attention. I do agree that this needs to be done as it would be a huge step for humans, but I believe this is something that should already be (but enough of my dream world :( ). The arguments put up against gay marriage are ridiculous and should not be considered at all.

From one side they are just using fear tactics and lying by using arguments like; "gays are pedos," or ,"gays are so immoral they would fuck dogs," or ,"gays are child molesters." These arguments are all clearly untrue and simply there to scare people away from accepting gay marriage. On the other side there are religious people who argue against it through God. Although I do agree with religious people more because at least the believe it just because God said so while the others are just assholes who make up terrible lies :\ They're both fucked up however.

These things have already been stated but meh. I personally believe that peace can not be achieved while there is religion in the world, or at least ones that force belief onto others and generate some form of inferiority to those who don't believe. So right now... almost all of them. I'm not saying all religious people are like this, but all religions have these underlying factors. It's up to the people to root these terrible things out of religion.

There's many things a government can do against religion. But you're right, world peace cannot be obtained while there are still those with different religions, and those who have no religion. If these religions were only tolerable via private study (ie, no churches, or other means of worship besides your own home), world peace would still have no chance because there will always be patriotism. As long as a group of people feel their race is superior, or their nationality is superior, we won't have world peace. This doesn't necessarily have ANYTHING to do with religion.

[Hash Jar]

There's many things a government can do against religion. But you're right, world peace cannot be obtained while there are still those with different religions, and those who have no religion. If these religions were only tolerable via private study (ie, no churches, or other means of worship besides your own home), world peace would still have no chance because there will always be patriotism. As long as a group of people feel their race is superior, or their nationality is superior, we won't have world peace. This doesn't necessarily have ANYTHING to do with religion.

Oh yeah that's another thing. Pride and patriotism needs to be taken a lot less seriously. Seriously who gives a fuck about what land you were born in... I bet I can find some land that looks almost like it... ugh.

[Phoenix Wright]

Oh yeah that's another thing. Pride and patriotism needs to be taken a lot less seriously. Seriously who gives a fuck about what land you were born in... I bet I can find some land that looks almost like it... ugh.

It's how people grow up. It was usual that one nationality felt superior to another...actually, it still is. Anyone can feel how they feel towards another country--even if the view is wrong, inhumane, or ridiculous--as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else. This isn't true for some countries, however. The "Buy *insert your home country here*" isn't just a slogan to improve domestic economy. Patriotism can be important in some cases.

[Fox]

Gay marriage/intamacy is not only against my religion, it's against nature! I mean, come on... Does a plug fit into a plug? Does an outlet fit into an outlet? No. A plug fits into an outlet, and vice-versa. People can be gay if they want, I am tolerant. But I definitely do NOT approve. It is against nature for 1 man and 1 man, or 1 woman and 1 woman.

It makes sense for it to be 1 man and 1 woman. That's my counter-argument.

Congratulations, you are twelve years old.

[Defeatist Elitist]

Congratulations, you are twelve years old.

That, sir, is an insult to twelve year olds.

[Fox]

It sounds like you have had many gay urges but and are using the Freudian defense mechanism called Reaction formation, and you just pretend to hate gay people because you do not want to be gay.

Countless studies have been performed on this matter, and all of them conclude that you're full of shit.

Fun fact, a cock does fit into an ass.

Technically true, but your ass just isn't geared to receive an object. Anal sex is ultimately dangerous and can lead to a legion of problems later in life.

I don't feel like citing sorces right now.

I'll save you the trouble: your parents and/or high school teacher.

[Hero]

There's many things a government can do against religion. But you're right, world peace cannot be obtained while there are still those with different religions, and those who have no religion. If these religions were only tolerable via private study (ie, no churches, or other means of worship besides your own home), world peace would still have no chance because there will always be patriotism. As long as a group of people feel their race is superior, or their nationality is superior, we won't have world peace. This doesn't necessarily have ANYTHING to do with religion.

Wars are started for many, many reasons other than nationalism (which is completely different from ethnic supremacism) and religion. Since the dawn of history most of the world's wars have been fought for the sake of economies, security or simple revenge. Even the great conquests of the Mongols were in their beginnings nothing more than the solution to an economic problem. Before you condemn religion and nationalism you should condemn the concept of security, it's been at the root of many more conflicts.

Real world peace will only come when people trust each other.

Oh yeah that's another thing. Pride and patriotism needs to be taken a lot less seriously. Seriously who gives a fuck about what land you were born in... I bet I can find some land that looks almost like it... ugh.

If you don't 'give a fuck' about your home, what do you 'give a fuck' about? Seriously, outside of your family and your health there's not much in life as important as your country. You don't have to love your government, but you should appreciate the place you come from. I don't know where that is for you, but most people in the world are able to live where they live today because they or their ancestors, near or far, gave their blood for it.

[Crystal Shards]

Countless studies have been performed on this matter, and all of them conclude that you're full of shit.

Not that this is relevant to the subject in the slightest, but this is actually far from true. Freud was off his rocker on a lot of things (hello penis envy), but defense mechanisms are actually pretty well accepted to be at least partially true. One example I can think of off the top of my head is "Is Homophobia Associated With Homosexual Arousal?" by Adams, Wright, and Lohr. While no study is without it's problems (and I could tell you about that one if you're interested), there actually is evidence that homophobes may be hiding homosexual arousal, which would be reaction formation under Freud's terms.