Official site update + Famitsu 15/3

[Rewjeo]

More spell variety, different specialties, different spell types themselves, IT'S FUCKING OBVIOUS! Don't ask stupid questions like that!

They could do that under one anima type, too. Have fire, thunder, and wind all have different (perhaps very specialized) applications and be rank E Anima magic. Ether brought up a good point about Archanea's magic historically being one group with various types of spells.

[Othin]

I thought paper disproved Spock.

I don't see Krom stabbing any Spocks, do you?

They could do that under one anima type, too. Have fire, thunder, and wind all have different (perhaps very specialized) applications and be rank E Anima magic. Ether brought up a good point about Archanea's magic historically being one group with various types of spells.

It's centuries after FE1/3. None of Archanea's historical features have been shown to have any more impact on FE13's features than those of any other continent's, so there's absolutely no reason why Archanea's magic system would be any more influential than, say, Jugdral's, either.

They could do some of that. They could not keep specialization with just one magic type. That is the one big loss, and it is one thing FE games really need to step up regarding.

Edited March 15, 2012 by Othin

[CrashGordon94]

And exactly how are all those things not possible as one rank?

Again with the idiotic questions...

They could do that under one anima type, too. Have fire, thunder, and wind all have different (perhaps very specialized) applications and be rank E Anima magic. Ether brought up a good point about Archanea's magic historically being one group with various types of spells.

YOU CAN'T DO THAT!! IT DOESN'T FUCKING WORK!!

Different weapons types need to be SEPERATE! They can't be different when they're the same weapon type!

Y'know, this is starting to make me hate FE6, maybe if it just used FE5's mechanics instead this would've never happened...

[Othin]

Crash, please name a variety of spells that could not be so varied in a game with a more condensed system.

Condensing spell types destroys the possibility of specialization. That is a big loss, but it is the only loss.

[CrashGordon94]

All the special specific ones like in the good system. It kills the diversity likes turning Axes/Swords/Lances into a single "Melee" rank would, we couldn't have our diverse weapon triangle then and this is the same!

[Griffen78]

Again with the intensity.... This is almost as bad as Clare on Degrassi.

And exactly how are all those things not possible as one rank?

My cousin forced me to watch that show once......as long as one of the triangles of magic is there...I'm happy.

[luchinania]

I can understand how the magic triangle wouldn't work if magic was all under the same type, but usually there aren't enough enemy mages for the magic triangle to matter. I find it perfectly acceptable for magic(at least anima) to have one rank and to just differentiate between the different tomes by how effective each are against certain enemies.

[Rewjeo]

It's centuries after FE1/3. None of Archanea's historical features have been shown to have any more impact on FE13's features than those of any other continent's, so there's absolutely no reason why Archanea's magic system would be any more influential than, say, Jugdral's, either.

They could do some of that. They could not keep specialization with just one magic type. That is the one big loss, and it is one thing FE games really need to step up regarding.

The point was that within Archanea's history, magic has been varied but used fundamentally the same way. If that continues to be the case, then there really isn't a reason to break up the magic if within that world it's all similar to use. Having one group of magic doesn't mean thunder magic can't be effective against armored units.

YOU CAN'T DO THAT!! IT DOESN'T FUCKING WORK!!

Different weapons types need to be SEPERATE! They can't be different when they're the same weapon type!

Y'know, this is starting to make me hate FE6, maybe if it just used FE5's mechanics instead this would've never happened...

We have specialized swords/lances/axes/bows already. I don't see why we can't have magic with specialized spells.

The problem with turning all melee weapons into one group is that it doesn't make sense. I would like separate anima/dark/light, but in Archanea that may not be the case. That doesn't mean magic can't be diverse. As for the magic triangle, well, how often has that really come into play?

[Nanami Touko]

All the special specific ones like in the good system. It kills the diversity likes turning Axes/Swords/Lances into a single "Melee" rank would, we couldn't have our diverse weapon triangle then and this is the same!

> Thinks having all magic as the same type is bad.

> wants all armors to have the same movement as infantry.

Seems legit.

Edited March 15, 2012 by seph1212

[CrashGordon94]

I can understand how the magic triangle wouldn't work if magic was all under the same type, but usually there aren't enough enemy mages for the magic triangle to matter. I find it perfectly acceptable for magic(at least anima) to have one rank and to just differentiate between the different tomes by how effective each are against certain enemies.

That's stupid! It's an abysmal way to do it!

And merging Anima makes as little sense as merging Melee, and being in Akaneia is completely irrelevant! Akaneia didn't have Rescue either, remember?

[TheEnd]

Akaneia didn't have Rescue either, remember?

Alright, I think this is getting a bit too ridiculous.

[CrashGordon94]

> Thinks having all magic as the same type is bad.

> wants all armors to have the same movement as infantry.

Seems legit.

Those aren't even related or similar.

[Emblem Lugh]

Maybe we should just ignore the tantrum and move on? >.>

Anything else anyone wants to talk about?

[arvilino]

That's stupid! It's an abysmal way to do it!

And merging Anima makes as little sense as merging Melee, and being in Akaneia is completely irrelevant! Akaneia didn't have Rescue either, remember?

Should Hammers and Halberds be in their own weapon ranks aswell though? I mean because they aren't actually axes are they? But yeah the Anima Books that are all generally written in the same magic text explained in games should all have separate ranks because...

[Nanami Touko]

Maybe we should just ignore the tantrum and move on? >.>

Anything else anyone wants to talk about?

Yes, ignoring Crash normally is the best course of action. Egging him on can be fun, though :3c

Yes, I want to comment on how they finally got wyverns right! No front legs, wee~

[arvilino]

Yes, ignoring Crash normally is the best course of action. Egging him on can be fun, though :3c

Yes, I want to comment on how they finally got wyverns right! No front legs, wee~

Though it sounds a bit odd I find their defeated animation a bit funny in a way. Since the Rider falls off backwards and the Wyvern falls on it's back as well.

[Rewjeo]

That's stupid! It's an abysmal way to do it!

And merging Anima makes as little sense as merging Melee, and being in Akaneia is completely irrelevant! Akaneia didn't have Rescue either, remember?

Care to explain why?

That's different. Rescue was a mechanic that didn't exist in the originals, but clearly in that world one person could protect another/carry them on their mount. Magic being one type matters because it says that using different spells is fundamentally the same. Unless people have discovered entirely new ways of casting spells (possible) then that would still be the case.

Those aren't even related or similar.

You're saying magic should be different types for variety but you also think armors and regular infantry should have the same movement, reducing variety and also not making sense logically.

[CrashGordon94]

Should Hammers and Halberds be in their own weapon ranks aswell though? I mean because they aren't actually axes are they? But yeah the Anima Books that are all generally written in the same magic text explained in games should all have separate ranks because...

No kidding, I had thought of that with Hammers.

And the lore is irrelevant, this is a gameplay mechanics issue, only gameplay mechanics are relevant.

[Emblem Lugh]

Yes, I want to comment on how they finally got wyverns right! No front legs, wee~

Is that how it was before FE6 (other than Wyvern Knight)? I honestly never took the time to notice.

[SilentSentinel]

I know in FE4 the Dragon Knights have front limbs. They are kinda short though, like T-rex arms, so I don't think they could really be called legs. I like the changes to the Wyvern design overall.

[Nanami Touko]

Is that how it was before FE6 (other than Wyvern Knight)? I honestly never took the time to notice.

No, it's just that in the GBA games they called dragons wyverns. Wyverns have no front legs and are normally smaller. Dragons have forelegs and are larger. So labeling them as wyverns for three games was a tad annoying to me, since I knew the mythology behind the creature.

Glad they finally designed them right ~( ' 3')~

[Ether]

As an example, what if Magic was all put into a single 'Tomes' weapon rank, and the weapons available were as follows:

E rank:

Wind: 3 Mt, 90 Hit, 0 Crit(Weight not specified, as we don't know the weight system yet)

Thunder: 4 Mt, 70 Hit, 5 Crit

Fire: 5 Mt, 80 hit, 0 Crit

D rank:

Elwind: 5 Mt, 85 Hit, 0 Crit

Elthunder: 6 Mt, 65 Hit, 10 Crit

Elfire: 7 Mt, 75 Hit, 0 Crit

C rank:

Divine: 7 Mt, 85 Hit, 15 Crit

Flux: 12 Mt, 60 Hit, 0 Crit

Purge: 8 Mt, 70 Hit, 10 Crit, 3-10 Range

Swarm: 13 Mt, 50 Hit, 0 Crit, 3-10 Range

Luna: 0 Mt, 60 Hit, 20 Crit, Nulls Res

Aura: 5 Mt, 80 Hit, 0 Crit, Effective Vs. Undead(or whatever you wanna call these guys)

Fimbulvetr: 5 Mt, 70 Hit, 0 Crit, Effective Vs. Flying units

Lightning: 6 Mt, 60 Hit, 10 Crit, Effective Vs Mounted Units

B rank:

ArcWind: 7 Mt, 100 Hit, 0 Crit

ArcThunder: 8 Mt, 75 Hit, 15 Crit

ArcFire: 9 Mt, 85 Hit, 0 Crit

Blizzard: 8 Mt, 80 Hit, 0 Crit, 3-10 Range

Bolting: 9 Mt, 60 Hit, 15 Crit, 3-10 Range

Meteor: 10 Mt, 70 Hit, 0 Crit, 3-10 Range

A Rank:

Nosferatu: 9 Mt, 65 Hit, 0 Crit, Drains HP

Shine: 8 Mt, 90 Hit, 20 Crit

Tornado: 9 Mt, 85 Hit, 0 Crit

Thoron: 10 Mt, 60 Hit, 30 Crit

Volcannon: 11 Mt, 70 Hit, 0 Crit

This establishes a hierarchy of magicks, with Wind being used to ensure a hit, Fire being used for power, and Thunder being used for Critical hits. Light and Dark provide Niche roles, and could perhaps gain a bonus vs Fire, Wind, and Thunder. This allows your mage to take on plenty of different roles and be a Jack-of-all-Trades so to speak. Obviously S Rank weapons weren't included since we don't know how they will work yet.

I don't see why this isn't preferable to having the exact same thing, just split between multiple weapon types, and having you wish your mage could do something aside from the single thing it's archetype calls for. Wish your Thunder mage had more Hit against those High Evd enemies? Too bad.

Obviously numbers given are arbitrary, and can be changed as necessary.

Edited March 16, 2012 by Ether

[Emblem Lugh]

As an example, what if Magic was all put into a single 'Tomes' weapon rank, and the weapons available were as follows:

...

Obviously numbers given are arbitrary, and can be changed as necessary.

Looking at this, I honestly don't care if ranks even differentiate between anima/light/dark anymore...

Edited March 16, 2012 by Cammy

[Othin]

All the special specific ones like in the good system. It kills the diversity likes turning Axes/Swords/Lances into a single "Melee" rank would, we couldn't have our diverse weapon triangle then and this is the same!

Is "example" not in your vocabulary? Name me some spells, peon.

The point was that within Archanea's history, magic has been varied but used fundamentally the same way. If that continues to be the case, then there really isn't a reason to break up the magic if within that world it's all similar to use. Having one group of magic doesn't mean thunder magic can't be effective against armored units.

And within Archanea's history, battle-capable beings were just humans and Manakete. And spears didn't perform any better than usual against swords. And ballistas were designed as short-range weapons. And magic was only available to dedicated spellcasters. And suits of armor didn't have jetpacks. And pegasi turned into dragons. And you could decide to forget how to use one weapon and instantly become competent with another. And you couldn't connect to Ancient Jugdral through portals.

Yes, and if you make thunder magic effective against armored units and then give all mages equal access to it, armored units will be even more trivial than they always were because all mages will just keep a Thunder spell with them whenever there's a clanking foe on the map. On the other hand, if only a couple of playable mages could use that spell, it'd be a different story. As I already explained: Condensing magic does not remove the possibility for varied spell effects, but it removed the possibility of having different mages specialize in different effects, which can be fantastic for a game in many ways. You cannot get that with a condensed system, at least not without making personal weapons for each specialty.

For this reason, Ether's system would be a shitty replacement, and have a high likelihood of ruining the game. It's a good thing the people who really make the games know not to throw around effective bonuses so wildly. And his other methods of differentiating the weapon types are quite pitiful.

Edited March 16, 2012 by Othin

[Ether]

Above was just an example, as said. You could remove effectiveness from Generic magicks and add specific spells for effectiveness if that makes people happy. The way I had it set up was to have mages as more of a Utility unit than an offensive unit, packing utility counters to certain types of units, and having the ability to deal with those easily.