Othin Plays FE13!

[LeaderR Elliot]

I got 1 question too

Lets say Donny is in double with Krom, krom is the main character and donny on the back,

now donny has weapon saver and his 100% Luck.

Say donny triggers dual attack! does weapon saver activates or not because it should have a 100% activation rate or weapon saver cannot activate in dual attacks?

[Shun One]

Better question: How do any of those modes compare to Lunatic?

Answer: They don't.

...It still astounds me to read these comparisons. Lunatic is really that hard?

[Remnant Sage]

Just a quick question about skills.

Is it possible for more than one to proc at the same time? By which I mean, would it theoretically be possible for Sol and, say, Magnificent Flame to simulataneously activate on the same attack?

And following on from that question, if it isn't possible, is there any point to having more than one % activation ability like that? Other than weapon saver I mean, which I assume is universally useful and doesn't interfere with other abilities.

I haven't had more than one %-based skill trigger at the same time in the past 10+ in-game hours, so I don't think it's possible. If you mean something like Vantage + Sol, then it should be possible. I think I saw an enemy pull that off once...

Weapon Saver doesn't interfere with anything, which is reasonable and pretty much the point. Having multiple %-based skills might be a waste of slots, but it does sort of help "increase" the chance of activating something whenever the unit attacks. Stack the right skills with high enough stats... It's pretty fun running around with Vengeance/Sol/Magnificent Flame/Weapon Saver/Luna at SKL40+bonuses. Almost every attack had a skill attached to it~

I got 1 question too

Lets say Donny is in double with Krom, krom is the main character and donny on the back,

now donny has weapon saver and his 100% Luck.

Say donny triggers dual attack! does weapon saver activates or not because it should have a 100% activation rate or weapon saver cannot activate in dual attacks?

It can activate while in Double too, so Donny does have a chance of not expending a use.

[Only My Unit]

Would a Shield skill be able to trigger alongside an attack skill then (provided the enemy could still attack)?

Edited June 13, 2012 by Only My Unit

[Remnant Sage]

I don't use the Shield skills, but do encounter them frequently against SpotPass teams (mostly because I blindly summon them). The Shield skill seems to have a chance of activating per attack against them. It's come up multiple times whenever someone triggered Astra, halving 2~3 attacks at times.

[Othin]

Can you retreat from skirmishes like in FE8, or do you need to finish the map?

You can't simply delete skirmishes that way, no. On the preparation screen for any map, including story maps, you can return to the world map, but any skirmishes are unaffected. Once you start, you need to either finish the map or reset.

Just a quick question about skills.

Is it possible for more than one to proc at the same time? By which I mean, would it theoretically be possible for Sol and, say, Magnificent Flame to simulataneously activate on the same attack?

And following on from that question, if it isn't possible, is there any point to having more than one % activation ability like that? Other than weapon saver I mean, which I assume is universally useful and doesn't interfere with other abilities.

The following skills seem to not stack from what I've found:

Lethality

Aether

Astra

Sol

Luna

Magnificent Flame

Vengeance

This is the order the game sorts them in ingame if a character has learned multiple of them and removes them. The fact that they activate in different ways from the other skills and are grouped together by the game's internal order seems to verify that these are the only ones that can't stack. I believe this is the order that the game checks them for the purposes of activations: if you have Lethality, it rolls an RN to see if you get that, then if not it checks Aether, etc. I suspect it's no coincidence that it goes from the strongest and least frequent skill to the weakest and most frequent, although Magnificent Flame tends to be much more effective than Luna.

The purpose of having multiple is really to stack your chances. Lucina makes particularly good use of this: with Aether, Astra, Royal Weapon, and 40+ Skl, she has over a 50% chance to activate one of the two skills, which ensure a kill against most things. She's the only character capable of having those three skills together, and can add even more skills to further increase her odds.

...It still astounds me to read these comparisons. Lunatic is really that hard?

Yeah. I can't really speak about H5, having not played it much, but I don't think FE5 and HHM are anything special in difficulty. Lunatic, on the other hand, has enemies on every map that are stronger than most of your team, and the AI is set to be extremely aggressive. You can't use conventional offensive strategies; you'll get steamrolled. From what I understand, the only thing close is FE12 Lunatic, but looking at the sorts of strategies that seem to work there, you really can't get away with them here, and you have a lot more to worry about like using Double carefully. Of course, I'm also excluding certain strategies I'd call game-breaking from FE13, so it may not be a fair comparison.

What I've heard about H5 is that it's hard for a while, especially in terms of fighting the bosses, but then gets easier. I've played the first couple maps of H5 before, but I decided to try the first chapter again to refresh my memory. When I saw the enemy stats and how they matched up against my own characters, I laughed. Granted, when I was getting chased back to the starting point by the last of the first group of enemies, I wasn't laughing quite so much. I did lose that attempt, but I'm not impressed with the difficulty level even at the earliest point. Honestly, it seems to me that the only difficulty is that your only healing comes from forts until you get Wrys, so you're really limited in your options and have to play a rather straightforward way to get rid of the enemies without any character running out of HP. In comparison to FE13 Lunatic, this is nothing.

Edited June 13, 2012 by Othin

[cheetah7071]

Speaking only for myself, I find early FE12 and early FE13 lunatics to be about equally difficult (barring the random hammer enemy in chapter 1). However, FE12 evens out around chapter 6 when you promote your first unit in a way FE13 never really does (barring nosferatu shenanigans).

[Othin]

Ah, I see. So in terms of raw enemy-to-player strength comparisons, FE13 still reigns supreme. That's important, I think, as the things you have to restrict to ensure that FE13 stays difficult really don't cut into what I'd call regular FE gameplay.

Anyway, I did Ch13 the easy way and rushed the boss with MU and Frederick while using everyone else to fight off the enemies approaching from the bottom. Had to sell a Dragonstone to afford to buy a Master Seal for Lucina afterwards. Prices are a bit worrying with that in mind, but then, I'm not going for children characters, so the Master Seal drops from the upcoming two bosses should be more than I'll need for the remainder of the game: the only character left who's unpromoted and might potentially promote during the main story is Tiamo. The lack of children characters is really resulting in some limited teams, though. While going just for the story chapters is interesting, I don't think I'm going to repeat it on later playthroughs; there aren't enough options.

Ch14 steps up the enemy weapons again. Before, enemies were using all Silver weapons for basic physical weapons, but they were kind enough to limit themselves to Short thrown weapons and Arc spells in the case of magic. Now, they're only half as kind, as Spears and Tomahawks are everywhere. Fortunately, they haven't brought out the Thoron and Bolganone tomes yet. Unfortunately, the promoted enemies are staying one step ahead and using forged Silvers and forged Tomahawks. And there are 11 Pegasus Knights around the map ready to fly in and destroy everything, and I can't possibly wall them off. I think I'll try to rush the lower ship and rout the small number of enemies there so I can block off all the ground-based enemies through a single-square chokepoint and focus on the fliers. Having four fliers of my own also helps; too bad two of them can't fight.

Edited June 13, 2012 by Othin

[Saethori]

f you have Lethality, it rolls an RN to see if you get that, then if not it checks Aether, etc.

So, in other words, if the character has, say, the top five skills of that list (Lethality, Aether, Astra, Sol, and Luna), and... we'll say, 36 Skill, then the battle check would be like this?

9% chance to trigger Lethality (Skill/4% chance).

16.4% chance to trigger Aether (Skill/2% of the remaining 91%, rounded up).

13.5% chance to trigger Astra (Skill/2% of the remaining 74.6%, rounded up).

22.0% chance to trigger Sol (Skill% of the remaining 61.1%, rounded up).

14.1% chance to trigger Luna (Skill% of the remaining 39.1%, rounded up).

25.0% chance to trigger nothing and perform a normal attack.

More or less? (All values rounded up to the nearest tenth of a percent.)

(Also, with this in consideration, is Royal Weapon's +10% activation an absolute value, or compared to the original value? Would it make Lethality 19% or 9.9%?)

[Othin]

Precisely. And yes, it's an absolute +10. Lethality goes to 19%, Aether goes to 28%, etc.

Dammit, the Pegasus Knights reach my team too fast, and the enemies on the bottom boat take too long to kill...

[Shun One]

I can certainly understand Sol and Luna not stacking considering it'd make Aether attainable by anyone who can get both of those skills. A bit of a shame that Luna/Sol affects can't trigger during Astra. I can see the reason for it though.

I'm glad to know that in the even you do have multiples of the non-stacking skills that it checks for Lethality first.

[Raven the Obsidian]

Ah, I see. So in terms of raw enemy-to-player strength comparisons, FE13 still reigns supreme. That's important, I think, as the things you have to restrict to ensure that FE13 stays difficult really don't cut into what I'd call regular FE gameplay.

Anyway, I did Ch13 the easy way and rushed the boss with MU and Frederick while using everyone else to fight off the enemies approaching from the bottom. Had to sell a Dragonstone to afford to buy a Master Seal for Lucina afterwards. Prices are a bit worrying with that in mind, but then, I'm not going for children characters, so the Master Seal drops from the upcoming two bosses should be more than I'll need for the remainder of the game: the only character left who's unpromoted and might potentially promote during the main story is Tiamo. The lack of children characters is really resulting in some limited teams, though. While going just for the story chapters is interesting, I don't think I'm going to repeat it on later playthroughs; there aren't enough options.

Ch14 steps up the enemy weapons again. Before, enemies were using all Silver weapons for basic physical weapons, but they were kind enough to limit themselves to Short thrown weapons and Arc spells in the case of magic. Now, they're only half as kind, as Spears and Tomahawks are everywhere. Fortunately, they haven't brought out the Thoron and Bolganone tomes yet. Unfortunately, the promoted enemies are staying one step ahead and using forged Silvers and forged Tomahawks. And there are 11 Pegasus Knights around the map ready to fly in and destroy everything, and I can't possibly wall them off. I think I'll try to rush the lower ship and rout the small number of enemies there so I can block off all the ground-based enemies through a single-square chokepoint and focus on the fliers. Having four fliers of my own also helps; too bad two of them can't fight.

Oh wow, that sounds like absolute madness. Good luck with that D: Got my first preview of how aggressive Lunatic can be with that Nosferatu video that Endgame so persistently posts on on GFAQs and I was shocked. I mean, that map in particular looks incredibly hard as is, but with enemies as tough as they are on Lunatic swarming you relentlessly? Wow. I also see just how broken Nosferatu is... I'll definitely steer clear of that on serious runs.

[Othin]

And the new SpotPass set is out. Got Renha's map, and it seems the new SpotPass team is... FE5. Damn, they really don't want to release teams for the worldwide released games, huh?

I still have my NM and HM files, and they're the ones I use for stuff like this, so I'll use them to see what I can find here.

[Psych]

Who's in FE5?

Nanna, Leaf, I'd presume Fin and Othin...

[Andreyas]

I forget.... what does Renha look like?

[Othin]

Who's in FE5?

Nanna, Leaf, I'd presume Fin and Othin...

I have Leaf so far. Others are listed here: http://serenesforest.net/fe13/recruit_spotpass.html

Othin's absence is odd because he has a weapon named for him in the game: all the others with named weapons appear as SpotPass, except Chris who has a named item. I suspect the two of them will show up in the two remaining monster DLCs as bonuses, like Eltshan did in IDW.

Renha shows up as an NPC in another Corpse Soldier map; haven't tried it yet to figure out his recruitment method. The boss is a Swordmaster who equips and drops the Sol Katti; interesting that it shows up this way. It's also quite powerful; on HM, it has capped Str, Skl, and Spd - unusual for even HM enemies to reach caps.

[NeonZ]

Is the Swordmaster an actual character or just a corpse soldier? Also, there's no way to get the Ragnel yet outside of the Legendary Weapons DLC yet, right?

[Remnant Sage]

Hm. Got Fin. Normal mode stats:

Lv 12 Paladin

HP 56

STR 28

MAG 3

SKL 36

SPD 32

LCK 29

DEF 26

RES 14

Sword C, Lance A

Discipline, Outdoor Battle, Defender, Miracle

Equipped with Brave Lance, Fin's Guardlance

Sairi can recruit Renha during the chapter.

[Othin]

Is the Swordmaster an actual character or just a corpse soldier? Also, there's no way to get the Ragnel yet outside of the Legendary Weapons DLC yet, right?

The Swordmaster is a generic Corpse General boss.

And yes. The following weapons are not yet available outside of IDW:

Excalibur

Mistletainn

Gaebolg

Thorhammer

Holsety

Holy Tome Naga

Armads

Nidhogg

Rangell

Double Bow

We've seen four released for SpotPass download, and we'll probably see another seven more. Not clear how we'll get the remaining three.

Hauteclere is only available without DLC as a price for Basilio's Dual Tag, so it's likely that for whatever weapons they don't release in this way, they'll show up as other Dual Tag prizes. It's possible that one or more of the items listed is already a Dual Tag prize; I can't check myself and I don't know of any site that lists the prizes for all the downloaded Dual Tag teams.

[Exiledwolf]

For Renha, if you haven't recruited him yet, have you tried talking with Sairi, her sister? Otherwise, I would assume you still need Krom only to recruit

[Andreyas]

Can Renha pair with MU?

[Remnant Sage]

For Renha, if you haven't recruited him yet, have you tried talking with Sairi, her sister? Otherwise, I would assume you still need Krom only to recruit

Krom doesn't talk to him at all.

[Only My Unit]

Every opposite gendered chara can pair with MU, and MU can support everyone anyway.

[Miscellany]

Can Renha pair with MU?

Yes. Curses, beaten to it.

Edited June 14, 2012 by Miscellany

[Andreyas]

Found a picture of him!