So whats with everyone calling the people from Tellius Mary/Gary sue?

[Gold Vanguard]

First it was Micahiah, then it was Ike and now Laguz?!?! Whats with people over using the word now? Its lost all meaning.

[Jedi]

Tellius is somehow the most controversial game set in the whole series.. That's why.

Any day now we'll have "SO & SO IS ALSO A SUE" , I'm sick of it. It's ruining my enjoyment of path of radiance and my lesser but still somewhat enjoyment of RD

[Gold Vanguard]

I mean sure not ever one from Tellius is perfect. Ike isn't perfect, infact when

Greil died

Shinon and Gatrie left becasue they felt he wasn't ready/didn't like him. Micahiah may be praised by many people in Tellius, hell Soren gave her a compliment but that because she free and entire country. Name a one FE characters that free a country........scrath that but she make mistakes in her plan and almost got Sothe killed. The Laguz.... I can't see how. For both games they are hated, even when free from slavery. They are hated by nearly all the people of Tellius(Mostly the Begnion Sentors).

[shadowofchaos]

Micaiah may be praised by many people in Tellius, hell Soren gave her a compliment but that because she free and entire country.

I don't see how that's a flaw. I'd even consider calling her the "Mary Tzu" type.

Even in a game with people who has hair colors that covers all the colors of the rainbow, she has "Silver Hair" that makes her stand out and the glorious ability of "Sacrifice".

Even before she freed Daein, she was, quoting Jarod, "the jewel that shines and attracts people". The prince was nothing more than a figurehead compared to her.

Soren praises her as the revered "Maiden of Dawn" with her tactical prowess. Her very presence invigorates Daein soldiers to point of not minding perishing for the sake of their beloved maiden.

We have Ike, who has had flaws shown in FE9... that MIGHT scrape by as an excuse for his Gary Stu-likeness, as I've heard from people. Micaiah, on the other hand, seems to have had a chosen destiny for her from the beginning... considering how she was a freaking vessel for a goddess.

So I don't see your point here.

Edited August 10, 2012 by shadowofchaos

[Momo]

These two games clearly try the most to tell a grand story. While I applaud their efforts, the final product is very flawed and since it tried so much, the flaws stand out more. It's like for instance, if people called Marth a sue. Nobody would care because the game he's in that most people played (11) doesn't try to tell much of a story.

[Anouleth]

I don't see how that's a flaw. I'd even consider calling her the "Mary Tzu" type.

Even in a game with people who has hair colors that covers all the colors of the rainbow, she has "Silver Hair" that makes her stand out and the glorious ability of "Sacrifice".

Sacrifice isn't that glorious. It's rarely mentioned, after all.

Even before she freed Daein, she was, quoting Jarod, "the jewel that shines and attracts people". The prince was nothing more than a figurehead compared to her.

The same could be said for Ike and Elincia.

Soren praises her as the revered "Maiden of Dawn" with her tactical prowess.

Actually, Soren rather dislikes Micaiah:

"Soren: Do not presume to understand me, you ridiculous girl. You have no idea who I am and what I can do. None at all. Daein has no business in this war. I will defeat you swiftly and send you and your army back to Daein."

[Gold Vanguard]

I don't see how that's a flaw. I'd even consider calling her the "Mary Tzu" type.

Even in a game with people who has hair colors that covers all the colors of the rainbow, she has "Silver Hair" that makes her stand out and the glorious ability of "Sacrifice".

Even before she freed Daein, she was, quoting Jarod, "the jewel that shines and attracts people". The prince was nothing more than a figurehead compared to her.

Soren praises her as the revered "Maiden of Dawn" with her tactical prowess. Her very presence invigorates Daein soldiers to point of not minding perishing for the sake of their beloved maiden.

We have Ike, who has had flaws shown in FE9... that MIGHT scrape by as an excuse for his Gary Stu-likeness, as I've heard from people. Micaiah, on the other hand, seems to have had a chosen destiny for her from the beginning... considering how she was a freaking vessel for a goddess.

So I don't see your point here.

My point here is that Michaiah is not perfect and dosen't fit the Mary Sue as people say she is. A mary Sue most of the time is someone who can do anything without problem. Micaiah alone could not save Daein. Plus she's weak both gameplay wise and story. She always has someone protecting her.

[Chiki]

FE9 wasn't as filled with lame plot devices and bland characters as FE10 was.

[Gold Vanguard]

FE9 wasn't as filled with lame plot devices and bland characters as FE10 was.

That mostly counts for the Dawn Brigande since they have nearly no background and theres no support Converstaion to explain anything. Pretty much everyone else was returning characters from FE9.

[shadowofchaos]

My point here is that Michaiah is not perfect and dosen't fit the Mary Sue as people say she is. A mary Sue most of the time is someone who can do anything without problem. Micaiah alone could not save Daein. Plus she's weak both gameplay wise and story. She always has someone protecting her.

I don't see how "gameplay" weakness when it comes to getting killed works with "Mary Sue" when that is discussing the character.

From the way you're describing it, you don't see her character as a Mary Sue because "she couldn't snap a finger and fix everything". That's a TYPE of Sue.

Her character makes everyone flock to her. As in she herself is projecting an image of perfection, not necessarily dependent on her accomplishments.

She always has someone protecting her.

And what EXACTLY makes them protect her?

Sothe - He's in love with her. Okay.

Black Knight - Protecting her because Daein won't successfully win independence without her.

Without her, Daein would forever die under Begnion. Jarod and the BK have said this. These are Sue-like qualities.

Sacrifice isn't that glorious. It's rarely mentioned, after all.

Well yes. But the civilians do mentioned it in Part 1, immediately setting her apart... even though staves are there.

The same could be said for Ike and Elincia.

True. I mean it was mentioned in Part 2 that Pelleas and Micaiah were compared to Ike and Elincia.

Actually, Soren rather dislikes Micaiah:

"Soren: Do not presume to understand me, you ridiculous girl. You have no idea who I am and what I can do. None at all. Daein has no business in this war. I will defeat you swiftly and send you and your army back to Daein."

Yes. He dislikes her. But even he acknowledged how dangerous she was when factoring in the Daein Army morale.

I'm not saying she is a Mary Sue... all I'm saying is when you say "I don't see any arguments for it and I don't understand how they can have this idea." to consider that people here have had a few heated debates about this.

Edited August 10, 2012 by shadowofchaos

[Gold Vanguard]

I don't see how "gameplay" weakness when it comes to getting killed works with "Mary Sue" when that is discussing the character.

From the way you're describing it, you don't see her character as a Mary Sue because "she couldn't snap a finger and fix everything". That's a TYPE of Sue.

Her character makes everyone flock to her. As in she herself is projecting an image of perfection, not necessarily dependent on her accomplishments.

And what EXACTLY makes them protect her?

Sothe - He's in love with her. Okay.

Black Knight - Protecting her because Daein won't successfully win independence without her.

Without her, Daein would forever die under Begnion. Jarod and the BK have said this. These are Sue-like qualities.

Well yes. But the civilians do mentioned it in Part 1, immediately setting her apart... even though staves are there.

True. I mean it was mentioned in Part 2 that Pelleas and Micaiah were compared to Ike and Elincia.

Yes. He dislikes her. But even he acknowledged how dangerous she was when factoring in the Daein Army morale.

I'm not saying she is a Mary Sue... all I'm saying is when you say "I don't see any arguments for it and I don't understand how they can have this idea." to consider that people here have had a few heated debates about this.

I think you explain Micaiah for me but what about the Laguz? Now it seems even they are sues as well. I don't understand there hated alot even after POR. People still call them 'Sub-Humans" which is the equivalent of the N word of today.

[Momo]

Because despite what some people say, every single Laguz character we've seen is supposed to be a "Good guy". We never see the bad side of the laguz, since they apparently do not exist.

[Chiki]

That mostly counts for the Dawn Brigande since they have nearly no background and theres no support Converstaion to explain anything. Pretty much everyone else was returning characters from FE9.

Ike became Mr. One-Dimensional, and Kilvas and Goldoa both gained perfectly valid explanations for their actions.

[Jedi]

Because despite what some people say, every single Laguz character we've seen is supposed to be a "Good guy". We never see the bad side of the laguz, since they apparently do not exist.

Naesala was a greedy prick in FE9, Lethe was xenophoic, the laguz bandits in RD's Ch 1-4 show some more bad side, Skrimir's pride and brutality nearly got the Laguz alliance destroyed

Tibarn is quick to anger and there was his whole vengeance against humans deal before the whole thing in Ch 17 in PoR.. This trait of being quick to anger was passed to Reyson due to his spending time with Tibarn gave him a very unheron like personality and he is very very vengeful

Lehran and his whole plot come to mind. As well

Edited August 11, 2012 by Jedi

[Momo]

All those people are good guys, though.

[Gold Vanguard]

Naesala was a greedy prick in FE9, Lethe was xenophoic, the laguz bandits in RD's Ch 1-4 show some more bad side, Skrimir's pride and brutality nearly got the Laguz alliance destroyed

Tibarn is quick to anger and there was his whole vengeance against humans deal before the whole thing in Ch 17 in PoR.. This trait of being quick to anger was passed to Reyson due to his spending time with Tibarn gave him a very unheron like personality and he is very very vengeful

Lehran and his whole plot come to mind. As well

-Nasesala did most of it for his land.

-Lethe got over it in RD.

-There about as evil as any other bandit from Fire Emblem.

-Skrimir learns from his mistake.

-Well Tibarn is the Chuck Norris of the sky. You don't FUCKED WITH TIBARN.

Edited August 11, 2012 by Silver Mercenary

[Rapier]

I don't see how that's a flaw. I'd even consider calling her the "Mary Tzu" type.

Even in a game with people who has hair colors that covers all the colors of the rainbow, she has "Silver Hair" that makes her stand out and the glorious ability of "Sacrifice".

Even before she freed Daein, she was, quoting Jarod, "the jewel that shines and attracts people". The prince was nothing more than a figurehead compared to her.

She stands out because she is widely known as the Silver Haired Maiden from the Dawn Brigade. So it is really easy to make the connection.

[Lord Raven]

I don't think FE10 was concerned with characters as much as it was with plot, explaining the whole "Mr. One-Dimensional" thing. Ike didn't need development or nuance; he already had it in FE9. His character arc is over and he doesn't have much growing left to do.

[TheGhosteon]

I never called Ike a Gary-Stu. I don't consider him one. It's just that he had about as much personality as a box of hair (In FE10), like most other characters in RD. My opinion on Micaiah has softened a little, but not by much. I still think of her as a Mary-Sue, to an extent.

Edited August 11, 2012 by TheGhosteon

[Florete]

It really is overdone and I hope I never have to hear about it again in regards to FE (I won't be so lucky). They probably all have a number of Sue qualities, but it never bothered me.

[Loki Laufeyson]

Soren praises her as the revered "Maiden of Dawn" with her tactical prowess. Her very presence invigorates Daein soldiers to point of not minding perishing for the sake of their beloved maiden.

Not...exactly. He says something like "The People of Daein believe yada yada and she did liberate the nation." But then someone asks him "Miracles? really?" and Soren is all "lol i doubt it." and goes on to say her followers are deluded and as such, she makes a formidable adversary. In other words, he think shes full of crap but because people blindly follow her...yeah.

When you have them fight in 3-7, he basically says "shut the fuck up."

Im...willing to bet hes the only character in the game that outright mislikes her entirely. Yeah...thats one guy. Just. One. (And also one of the reasons i love Soren so much.)

What sucks is that Micaiah is very very borderline Sue. So borderline....

[HeroMystic]

@Jon Snow: People dislike Soren for that reason, but that's actually one of the main reasons why I like Soren. He just doesn't accept anyone's bullshit.

First it was Micahiah, then it was Ike and now Laguz?!?! Whats with people over using the word now? Its lost all meaning.

People mistake poorly written characters for mary-sueness. It's why I stick strictly to the definition these days. Micaiah lacks growth, Ike is overpowered, and the laguz are kinda retarded, but that doesn't make them mary sues.

Edited August 11, 2012 by HeroMystic

[Vicious Sal]

People mistake poorly written characters for mary-sueness. It's why I stick strictly to the definition these days. Micaiah lacks growth, Ike is overpowered, and the laguz are kinda retarded, but that doesn't make them mary sues.

Oh god even though I don't exactly agree with you I just couldn't hold back my laughing at the Laguz part. xD

Maybe if you combine them all you get a Mary Sue?

No, you just get: MicahIkeraguz.

[Loki Laufeyson]

@Jon Snow: People dislike Soren for that reason, but that's actually one of the main reasons why I like Soren. He just doesn't accept anyone's bullshit.

Exactly. Calling someone out on their crap does not make one a dick. Especially when everyone else around him is all "ERMAHGERD! MICAIAH ISH SO AHSUM!" Seems to me Soren is the only Sane Man in Tellius.

Badly written character =/= Sue. Its when everything ever revolves around Sue and every character gushes about Sue and the people who dont like Sue, are just jealous of Sue.