Chilean Musician Mafia [Game Over]

[Meeshed Potatoes]

Okay first off hey eclipse, welcome welcome. Earlier I was thinking of moving my vote to your slot but for now I'm backing off because of the sub-in. Also again, my notes aren't caught up so my memory is trying to serve me (very ineptly, I think) for a few pages of this game. I recall some comments about eclipse coming off scummy but as of this post I'm not too concerned about that. I'll look more later.

Secondly, and I've been headed this way for a while:

##Unvote: Shinori

##Vote: Helios

(me gusta the non-RTE, muchas gracias Kaoz like for reals)

Um um, I shall go back and dig up some quotes (I'll spoiler-tag them to keep this down in size), but the short version is that I've seen him do a lot of echoing other players and acting like it's all him giving great contribution. I also disagreed with his vote on Kay, though I didn't think he was overly scummy about that. Oh yeah, and another thing was the reasoning he's been giving for unvoting Prims. That is easier explained with the quotes.

First the echoing thing (and I believe there are more posts past where I last jotted page/post# down; I'll quote those later if it seems like a good idea):

The first time this really stuck out and bothered me was after Strider popped back in with thoughts.

BBM responded right away:

Rein, this early post of your's implied that you believed pushing for a survivor lynch to be slightly scummy, or at the very least, not inherently town. Yet your recent post implies that pushing for a survivor lynch is a good thing, or at the very least, not a bad thing. It seems rather contradictory to me.

Also, most of that post seemed like really obvious stuff to say. "Survivor claim was bad, doc claim was dumb" is a really generic response that wasn't really necessary to make.

5 posts later, Helios (snipped some for length; another section of this post will be quoted in a bit bc Prims unvote stuff):

>Says lynching survivor claim d1 is antitown since it allows mafia to not get lynched d1

>Now says lynching survivor is a town move

What's it gonna be Rein? You're also probably borrowing Paperblade's reasoning as to why my Kay vote is "terrible", which I already explained as much as I really can so meh. With regards to Mancer...have you ever played a game with him? This is how he has been since he started playing mafia. I don't think he's actually trolling, it was supposed to be a joke, but I'm not going to deem has obvscum just because he's doing what he normally does. I'm not going to dismiss it either, but at least I'll give him a bit to actually do something. Content will come in due time though if you know how I play; I always start posting more and more as the game continues once I start actually focusing more. Your vote in general seems a little opportunistic to me, and I'm gonna keep that in mind. Also it's kinda funny that you would try and grill me for a lack of content when I've posted more ~content~ than you have, technically. I get that you're a miller, but that doesn't just give you a free pass. Also like BBM said, the rest of your post is echoes and common sense. Dat young pseudocontribution son.

[...]

I really didn't like that. First it was like he paraphrased BBM and added attitude, and then I also disliked how he kind of is trying to make excuses for not posting much content right now (not that this is a huge issue; I'm the same way at times, but it's worth noting in this context). I don't get too much of an earnest feel to him saying Rein's vote was opportunistic; sounds more like "OMGUS" or trying to play it off to avoid looking too defensive. (And I have noted "My posts are bigger than yours" in the summary of what this post says, haha.)

At least at the end of the paragraph he acknowledges BBM said something first, so I'll subtract a fraction of a scumpoint off of this post for that.

Moving on, the Prims thing. When he first voted Prims he asked if Prims was scum trying to waste a day focusing on the claimed survivor to buy more time for Prims and his scumbuddies to do their stuff. This is his unvote post:

It's weird that I was the only person that thought Shinori was town based off his interactions with Mashed Potatoes. Being uncharacteristically aggressive that early is not Shinori's meta, and more importantly scum wouldn't do that so early in the game.

I'm neutral on Meesh right now since I'm not sure if her natural playstyle is the cause of her being a little unnecessarily defensive over Shinori's posts. Otherwise I don't remember her posting anything else other than defenses. Meesh, what's your current thoughts on what's been happening in the thread?

@Manix: All I can ask is why you caused this shitstorm, since you've done nothing but give yourself negative attention. Not smooth broseph.

##Unvote (Prims)

My question to him has become basically pointless now since Manix isn't actually a survivor. Would like to hear from him when he comes back from school or whatever about his current thoughts.

##Vote Kay

I think that your Shinori/Manix scumbuddy idea has no backing to it, your vote for Shinori in general was pretty weak, and discussing role speculation doesn't really seem protown to me. What do you have to say to this?

A lot of this post pinged, btw: "It's weird I was the only one who thought Shinori was town huh" = trying to get townie cred maybe.

And the Kay vote. I did see his explanations later but even so, that pinged a bit.

Anyway, so like BBM said (post 135), Helios' question to Prims didn't actually depend on Manix's alignment. [in post epiphany: OMG okay so I think I misunderstood Helios a bit, whoops, so the reasons he gave weren't ENTIRELY contradictory, if I'm finally understanding him correctly, but there were some things so I'm just gonna keep going because I've already typed all this out ugh.]

Well, I was gonna say, Manix not being survivor shouldn't have mattered to the question, which is still true, but I think I was just misunderstanding what Helios meant when he said it was a moot point.

Carrying on, he later says about his Prims unvote:

@BBM: I didn't unvote Prims because Manix wasn't a survivor, I unvoted because I didn't think he was gonna be around and parking my vote on him felt pointless. Not to mention my reasoning for voting him was mainly "why are you trying to lynch someone who isn't mafia right now when we should be trying to lynch mafia" and see if I can get some reactions off that. It wasn't happening, so I switched my vote to Kay because I didn't like some of her posts and I wanted to get some reactions off that (which I did from others) so it's been working out decently so far.

To me, this didn't really seem to fit with what he said earlier. Again, with kind of having a eureka moment, I'm not as solid on this as I was when I started typing, but yeah. At least your stated reason for unvoting Prims contradicts what you say here. Also I'm not entirely sure I buy you voting Prims for reactions based on the reasons you gave: because Shinori'd already said we should hunt scum instead of wasting time on Manix. Because things were kind of divided into a Manix camp and a Prims camp, so voting Prims wouldn't have seemed that odd, imo. Because right after you posed your question you gave a line dedicated to supporting the legitimacy of Manix trying to help town as survivor, so it makes it seem more reasonable to vote Prims.

Nokey dokey, I think that's long enough of a post on Helios, by this point I've probably missed 5 pages.

*catches up*

Wtf, okay, so now my vote on Helios is one of like...one? Two maybe? Fantabulous. Now you'll make me reread Elie, poopheads. Though the post BBM quoted when he voted for Elie doesn't actually stick out to me that much. As in, I didn't read it the same way as you.

Other thoughts then:

Bleh, I can quote posts that made me not like Boron but not right this second, not in this post. We'll see how the replacement does, I guess. That kind of made me lose my fire for a sec.

Although in all seriousness I'm really really tired and kind of irritable and I think I just don't have energy for long posts after this for a bit; I'm pooped.

Dunno about Prims. Personally I'm feeling him as town at the moment.

I don't like Rein, miller claim or no (speaking of the miller claim, no one ever answered my question, haha. But old habits die hard so miller claim doesn't actually mean much to me at all at this point, or if it does, it's more of the negative thing than a positive thing).

Want to hear more from Shinori, u okay?

Mancer is like...haha uber scummy. So full of pinginess that I'm pretty sure he either really just has a lot to learn, or else he's been coached to keep playing this scummy to A) keep votes off or B) serve as a sacrificial lamb of sorts. Yay for bussing, haha.

Don't remember, I think Kay's come back in and posted but I don't remember off the top of my head what she said.

[Meeshed Potatoes]

/Meesh shouldn't post on drugs (aka no sleep, I don't even know what I'm doing anymore, fml and I want to go jump off a relatively small cliff so as to be badly injured but not killed)

But really

I typed all that out and I realized "You're stupid, Meesha, shut up already" but I'd already spent all that effort and I didn't want it to go to waste....

I'm gonna go not need a brain for the rest of the night.

[Excellen Browning]

Summary up till now: manix claims independent survivor, prims votes him because that makes him a good lynch target. Reason isn't unfunded in my opinion, but it ignores the chance of the independent choosing town over mafia amongst several other things. Relatively neutral to this bit itself. Some people make a fuss over it and nothing really happens. Oh and Strider claims miller.

shinori thinks the argument over lynching third party is stupid, meesh makes a comment on it. Shinori in turn calls him defensive, which I do not find myself agreeing with at all. The intent of the post in case was very clearly intended to breed understanding. Kay posts some empty read. Helios tries to play a threatening game he should know will not give him what he wants. Shinori calls out Kay over empty reads.

shinori continues to call out meesh. blah blah blah. I have now read 2 and a half pages and Shinori stands out for his aggression. And I really can't find a reason to attack too many people for too little reason, other than him not being town.

also on a side note: hi dutch/flemish person meesh!

Meesh's self meta is odd, but right now I can't really palce it in town or anti town. Agree with brad on a survivor liar probably being scum. There's pretty much millers and assorted roles on town side that do not like getting investigated, and they would have to be post restricted from claiming. In this case we also have Rein's miller claim which makes this scenario less likely. Paperblade calls Manix out on his behaviour as claimed survivor, which doesn't really fit survivor. Manix gets in denial after being attacked. Shinori claims he'll claim if he gets one more vote.

Based on the first three pages, I'm neutral on everyone except for Meeshed (town feel, trying to reach understanding. Definitely not trying to scum hunt though), shinori (over agressive behaviour, WTF claim shenanigans, anti town would lynch) and Manix (stupid survivor claim, then retracts like a wimp after he gets attacked and feels like he might get lynched over it. I don't see this working even as a "I'll get reactions LOL" kind of thing)

continuing: nothing of note happens on p4 in my opinion. Mancer starts p5 with a not-so-sublte threat at Shinori (the doctor claim, mind you). Feud between manix and shinori carries on a little longer. Manix gets aggravated over a post from Paperblade. Interestingly, by now Boron has dropped a few posts, which contained all fluff. BBM attacks Mancer. I do agree the threat does not exactly make him look good(as a person) but I've not yet decided it's scummy, but other than that I really don't think the attack has enough weight behind it. Then again I do think his attacks on Boron are more justified.

Opinions at the end of page 6

shinori: behaviour and claim are wtf. Not really comfortable with the idea of lynching a doc claim but I consider him to be one of the better lynch options ATM

manix: WTF behaviour all throughout, another person I would not mind lynching based on these 6 pages

Meesh: While I would not call your posts defensive (and certainly not overly defensive) I do notice an oddly high defense to content ratio

Mancer: Waffling throughout first worthwhile post. Threat is WTF behaviour, but not sure how to interpret it.

BBM: posts so far seem to be pretty town oriented.

EVERYONE ELSE: either post more or neutral/town read.

Calling it quits for the night.

[BBM]

Meesh: While I would not call your posts defensive (and certainly not overly defensive) I do notice an oddly high defense to content ratio

So is she defensive or not?

[Sober Emo Girl]

before i skim through this last page i wanted to ask you a little favor oh please forumites

1. can you post a list of which user is which? there's people called excewhatever and boron and what's-their-face and who the fuck are these people again

2. please be more concise if possible, i couldn't give less than zero fucks for how great your poetry class in high school was but it makes scumhunting fucking difficult.

it's not a fucking essay ;)

do all this and ill gladly start typing like a nerd instead of showing off my infinite lowercase swag

im about to make a post but warning: i skimmed and took a few notes of what grabbed my attention (not much), deal w/ it

[Prims]

Don't quote me on this but Excellen is probably the guy with Excellen in his name.

Boron is Ryuji-kun, Blitz is Cap'n Flint, Rein is Strider and everybody else has a proper username. Everybody else is obvious.

[Paperblade]

you forgot BBM is Thomas Raith

Llen, do you think Shinori's Doctor claim makes him less scummy or would you still lynch him?

[Sunwoo]

Don't quote me on this but Excellen is probably the guy with Excellen in his name.

Boron is Ryuji-kun, Blitz is Cap'n Flint, Rein is Strider and everybody else has a proper username. Everybody else is obvious.

Not in this game anymore!

It's Taewoo now. Just changed my name.

Not in this game anymore!

[Grace]

excellen did you actually miss my friendly townie claim in that very same post I retracted

gotta ask

[Grace]

and then concurrently; why the fuck are you tunneling on me when I can prove myself and then if not you get to lynch me anyway >_>

[Prims]

everybody else has a proper username. Everybody else is obvious.

WHOOPS I GUESS I SHOULD READ WHAT I TYPE

okay BBM I'm mainly not interested in explaining my townreads indepth when not relevant because it's a waste of words. Directing questions toward them is not a waste of words.

Helios and Kay stances weren't waffly so much as prioritizing. I found them scummy but wanted more to work with before I considered voting them over Elie or Boron. Right now I wouldn't exactly cry if he was lynched but I'm not scumreading him.

Boron's sub-out is sighworthy by the way even if it's justified, Excellen's post just reads like typical catching up to me so I still prefer Elie. Dying to see SEG grace us with her presence after she ignored the game for a day and basically told us she barely read anything. Gurgh, I'm still tired of every SF game (except Trainwreck for some reason) requiring like 50 subs. Arguably Rapier did sub out but whatever.

ddddddddddd

[Sober Emo Girl]

ty touhou boy ♥

another little favor: please, nobody say something like "as you can see in post 76" because fuck you, link to it or ill ignore it

also meta, stop using it pussies

shit i wrote down and i feel might be good to bring up:

- shinori is fucking stupid but everyone knows this, not going to waste time on this slot. unfortunately most of my notes were about this asshat.

- elie bothered me from the very first time they talked. said the survivor discussion was "nothing to go on" despite the fact two pages had just been spent discussing the fucking claim, and they weren't bad posts or filler posts. so much discussion couldn't possibly be "nothing" bby. ♥

- manix's crumb was so stupid, it seems too well-planned. like it's just there in case he'd go under fire and needed some fast insurance. worst crumb ever, who the fuck would even read that code.

- thomas was giving me strong scum vibes in his earlier posts. it kinda died down but not entirely. he started off by being basically a news reporter, i.e. retelling events which does nobody no good. also he likes the word waffle a lot. he also felt mancer was maf apparently but would rather act like teacher to him because umm he's new? basically thomas really likes pointing out contradictions (or supposed contradictions) and then sitting on his ass watching others actually discuss them, what a pussy. also he fosses helios for what is obv newbie lack of confidence. speaking of ganging up on new players...

- taewoo annoys me to no end as well, who the fuck is this anyway. his attacks on mancer were awful (like how he was pretty much pushing mancer to vote even though mancer wasnt sure about his thoughts, what kind of obvious attempt at peer pressuring a newbie is this?). it seems to me taewoo was making vague posts so he can make assumptions out of them which is like weakweakweak.

- helios is so defensive, lol. not sure if newbie or scum but leaning towards newbie for now.

- kay defended her crazy scumbuddies theories by saying it was a reaction test, which is like the worst excuse ever after "im sick srry"

- cap'n flint had like a million scum reads but instead voted me which was retarded as fuck because clearly i wasnt lurking but rather hadnt been able to make it here. what did you even expect to get by voting me? i would be able to mindread your comment and feel the urgency of posting? no fuck you

##vote: taewoo

i feel like thomas made better posts as time went on but you just suck ♥

[Grace]

- manix's crumb was so stupid, it seems too well-planned. like it's just there in case he'd go under fire and needed some fast insurance. worst crumb ever, who the fuck would even read that code.

well I did kinda plan this idea well in advance way before the game

I was just going to adapt it based on what I rolled

the reason I crumbed as such was that when it got to the later stages of the game (like LYLO), I could string maf along by making them out and then pointing toward my crumb and basically as a big "screw you maf".

but no apparently I can't do that so whatever

[Sober Emo Girl]

Dying to see SEG grace us with her presence after she ignored the game for a day and basically told us she barely read anything.

in my defense, i was in a conference and i tried accessing the place from the library and the ip was inexplicably banned lol

also 15 fucking pages of content in like one day what drugs do you people even take

[Grace]

also for the record: friendly townie is a shit fakeclaim for maf because it's literally impossible to prove

[Sober Emo Girl]

well I did kinda plan this idea well in advance way before the game

I was just going to adapt it based on what I rolled

the reason I crumbed as such was that when it got to the later stages of the game (like LYLO), I could string maf along by making them out and then pointing toward my crumb and basically as a big "screw you maf".

but no apparently I can't do that so whatever

so did you plan to stretch this idea to like forever until you could fuck mafia up?

thats odd, i thought you said it was a way to get discussion going and a reaction test.

i mean you were barely under fire when you said it was a fakeclaim, it looks to me more like a nervous mafia than a townie who had this great idea cooked up and let it go under the first sign of pressure

[Grace]

either or

it served a purpose

and you know, people wanted to lynch me/have me vigged

that ain't helpful for town

[Grace]

also for the record: friendly townie is a shit fakeclaim for maf because it's literally impossible to prove

also SEG, did you also miss my friendly townie claim

[Sober Emo Girl]

so you were playing a game against prims whose favorite move is apparently to hate third parties and you just expected the idea of getting vigged never to get brought up?

survivors are backstabbing tools, if town wont waste the day lynch on you then you were getting vigged

for something you planned ahead of time way before the game began, you clearly didnt think it through ♥

[Grace]

yeah I noticed

oh well, shit happens

[Sober Emo Girl]

i am just now realizing you were seriously claiming friendly neighbor

its just a shitclaim, kind of like survivor

both are shitclaims

saying "mafia wouldnt claim this shitclaim" is a horribad defense

[Paperblade]

tbh even though what Manix did was super dumb I think lynching him is a waste of time until his action starts mysteriously being redirected to the same person or failing or "oops I targeted a dead guy lol!" and then like only one person can corroborate it after 3 days.

[Sober Emo Girl]

"shit happens" is also a bad defense you doofus

[Grace]

yet it's provable, unlike vivor

I smell opportunistic scum around

[Grace]

also; I get one chance (unsure what happens if I get blocked), and I get a OC message back and forth with my target

also if my target flips as non-town I die immediately