The Lunatic Club

[Potato123]

Is there a strategy for chapter 3 on lunatic+? Because the guys at the top always spawn with pass. So if I deploy only the people I need, they walk through them and kill everyone, and if I deploy 23462392 people, the guys at the bottom kill everyone when I try to turtle. I know it's not my avatar because I got really lucky with his stats.

Avatar:

LVL 15 HP 33 STR 12 MAG 12 SKL 10 SPD 12 LCK 12 DEF 17 RES 7

[Interceptor]

The trick to dealing with Pass: deploy so many people that the enemies have no clear tiles to land on if they walk through. Fill their entire reachable range with bodies. You can use the corridors as chokes to make this possible.

Check guide in my sig, some more tips for Ch3 spelled out there.

[CT075]

i honestly had more success just opening the door ASAP and blitzing through the top (make sure that you cleared the lower part of whichever side you picked for best results); in my experience the northern enemies don't aggro unless you walk into their range so you can chokepoint the second groundfloor rush with fred

[Czar_Yoshi]

i honestly had more success just opening the door ASAP and blitzing through the top (make sure that you cleared the lower part of whichever side you picked for best results); in my experience the northern enemies don't aggro unless you walk into their range so you can chokepoint the second groundfloor rush with fred

Of that, note that the Knights guarding the doors aggro independently of the rest of the north enemies so you can kill one and not set off the rest of them.

Remember to not have your units pair up when hogging pass spots so you have more units to work with, only the front unit and the one directly behind them (if there are any 2-range units) should be in pairs.

On the topic of Pass in Lunatic+, I noticed that if you get two unequipped pairs to block the chokepoints in Cht.8 and 12 and then have the rest of your army stand the right distance back, Pass enemies will filter through the choke to attack your pairs from the rear, and then be in range of your main party next turn. With this, you can let your squishies fight around two units per turn who are guaranteed to have Pass- and thus one fewer dangerous skills, which is fabulous for training. Of course, you need some Rescues on hand to keep it safe, and clearing out the bottom left corner on Cht.12 is a pain... Once all the Pass enemies are gone, you can fire across the choke all day.

[eclipse]

Currently on: Lunatic Chapter 3.

Had to do some serious cheese strategies to get past the Prologue and Chapter 2 (neither of which I recommend for those with sanity/sense). Chrom's getting good levels. Avatar's levels are approximately awful (hello there base Speed).

[Potato123]

Yay, I beat chapter 3!

How many units should be used? I'm thinking of using 6 first gen units, with these classes:

Sumia Pegasus knight -> Pegasus knight -> Dark flier -> Falcon knight

Chrom Lord -> Cavailer -> Paladin -> Great Lord or Great Knight

Avatar Tactician -> Mercenary -> Hero -> ????

Miriel Mage -> Dark mage -> Sorecer -> Valkyrie

Cordelia Pegasus knight -> Mercenary -> Hero -> Dark flier(?)

Stahl Cavailer -> Myrmidon -> Swordsmaster -> Assassin

[Czar_Yoshi]

I consider four first gen combat units + as many healers as you can afford/protect + 2-4 children to be a good number. If you want to use Miriel, she might be better going Mage -> Troub -> Valk, or something else that doesn't hog your main exp source (enemies). Weapon ranks are the biggest problem with trying to put units through multiple classes in Lunatic(+), it takes some serious overleveling to overcome the handicap of Bronze stuff and early Arms Scrolls are very rare. You might want to ditch Stahl, as he's very hard to get going due to low weapon ranks and getting doubled by everything right off the bat, and Cordelia might be better off promoting to Falco to access Staves and keep her weapon exp. She's pretty good if you can get her going, though. Sumia and Chrom work out due to having enough Spd early on to double and get kills, but remember that if Chrom has two daughters then you can't have a double marriage between them and Avatar's children.

[PKL]

I consider four first gen combat units + as many healers as you can afford/protect + 2-4 children to be a good number. If you want to use Miriel, she might be better going Mage -> Troub -> Valk, or something else that doesn't hog your main exp source (enemies). Weapon ranks are the biggest problem with trying to put units through multiple classes in Lunatic(+), it takes some serious overleveling to overcome the handicap of Bronze stuff and early Arms Scrolls are very rare. You might want to ditch Stahl, as he's very hard to get going due to low weapon ranks and getting doubled by everything right off the bat, and Cordelia might be better off promoting to Falco to access Staves and keep her weapon exp. She's pretty good if you can get her going, though. Sumia and Chrom work out due to having enough Spd early on to double and get kills, but remember that if Chrom has two daughters then you can't have a double marriage between them and Avatar's children.

What's with this belief that Stahl is hard to get going? Ive had him + Kellam not care about hits by Chapter 4 and get tinked (in regular Lunatic) by Chapter 6 and I play fast.

Edited March 16, 2014 by PKL

[Czar_Yoshi]

Until Stahl gets one more Spd, he's going to get doubled by everything except the Knights and Fighters (and maybe the Soldiers in Cht.2). He also comes with 8 Def (13 with Kellam, 10 with Sully). Soldiers have 23 atk against him if he has a Bronze Lance and 24 if he has a Bronze Sword, Mercs have 24 against Swords and 21 against Lances, and Archers have 22 against him either way. His weapon ranks are bad, so he can't use a Javelin to get exp. There are also only two axeguys in Cht.3 compared to 8 Lanceguys, so you're stuck with the Lance which has even less Wexp than the Sword.

If you can get him started, that's fine, but I don't consider it worth the trouble because Lunatic is already the hardest at the start, so going to more trouble there to make the end even easier doesn't make much sense. Unless you just like Stahl...

[eclipse]

Currently on: Chapter 6

Chapter 4 was a bit surprising, and the same stupid trick that I always use to recruit Donnel in Paralogue 1 works on this mode, too. Chapter 5 was. . .a pain in the ass. I had to turtle it hard, mostly because my Avatar is more worried about not being doubled than anything (and this is with Chrom backing him up). Thanks to a snafu, I wound up leaving a certain someone in range of a Wyvern that could OHKO/double. Somehow, that didn't happen. Ergo. . .

. . .I am training Ricken. Please tell me what a moron I am.

[PKL]

Until Stahl gets one more Spd, he's going to get doubled by everything except the Knights and Fighters (and maybe the Soldiers in Cht.2). He also comes with 8 Def (13 with Kellam, 10 with Sully). Soldiers have 23 atk against him if he has a Bronze Lance and 24 if he has a Bronze Sword, Mercs have 24 against Swords and 21 against Lances, and Archers have 22 against him either way. His weapon ranks are bad, so he can't use a Javelin to get exp. There are also only two axeguys in Cht.3 compared to 8 Lanceguys, so you're stuck with the Lance which has even less Wexp than the Sword.

If you can get him started, that's fine, but I don't consider it worth the trouble because Lunatic is already the hardest at the start, so going to more trouble there to make the end even easier doesn't make much sense. Unless you just like Stahl...

Based on this quote, you're using him so wrong though. He can get 2 levels even playing fast in Ch2. That's 7 spd average. In comes Kellam and you suddenly have a unit that isnt doubled and takes 8 damage out of 22 HP by some enemies. He reaches Killing Edge quickly. Isn't a pain to train thanks to high damage output from Kellam. Can be forged a rather cheap Bronze Lance if u want him to reach Javelins quickly for whatever reason and has a free early Paralogue with a lot of axers to train. With tonics, Kellam C and some levels, he quickly reaches a point where he's taking very little damage.

[Shamison]

On chapter 25 of of Lunatic. Ugh I need to make my avatar stronger because Chrom does fine but then my Avatar dies.

Edit: beat it

Edited March 18, 2014 by Shamison

[eclipse]

Congratulations, you above me~!

Currently on: Chapter 9. I have way too many units I'm training, but I've been getting insanely lucky with their levels (even Ricken, who pulled off a clutch Defense level in the middle of Chapter 7 to survive a Wyvern. . .really. . .he's going into Endgame, no matter what). Chapter 7 was done in one take. . .Chapter 8, not so much (kept dying to stupid things). Chapter 9 looks interesting, and it feels doable. I think I'll be burning a Second Seal on Chrom, to turn him into a Cavalier, and eventually Avatar for Dark Mage/Mercenary (leaning the latter due to lame Speed). Lissa will get a Master Seal to turn her into a Sage, for further staffbotting. Chapter 16 can't come soon enough!

[PKL]

Congratulations, you above me~!

Currently on: Chapter 9. I have way too many units I'm training, but I've been getting insanely lucky with their levels (even Ricken, who pulled off a clutch Defense level in the middle of Chapter 7 to survive a Wyvern. . .really. . .he's going into Endgame, no matter what). Chapter 7 was done in one take. . .Chapter 8, not so much (kept dying to stupid things). Chapter 9 looks interesting, and it feels doable. I think I'll be burning a Second Seal on Chrom, to turn him into a Cavalier, and eventually Avatar for Dark Mage/Mercenary (leaning the latter due to lame Speed). Lissa will get a Master Seal to turn her into a Sage, for further staffbotting. Chapter 16 can't come soon enough!

I'm curious, Eclipse. What units are you using besides Ricken?

Edited March 17, 2014 by PKL

[Potato123]

Yay, I beat chapter four! It was really hard because you need two strong units, one to cover each side. But I had only trained Avatar and Miriel, so it took me like 10,000,000 resets. Also I just found out about soft resetting. -_-

Here are my stats. Am I going to fail? :(

Avatar: LVL 18.63 HP 35 STR 13 MAG 12 SKL 12 SPD 13 LCK 14 DEF 19 RES 8

Chrom: LVL 3.64 HP 22 STR 7 MAG 1 SKL 9 SPD 9 LCK 6 DEF 8 RES 1

lissa: LVL 10.19 STR 2 MAG 11 SKL 7 SPD 11 LCK 16 DEF 3 RES 8

Miriel: LVL 7.40 HP 22 STR 3 MAG 9+2 SKL 9 SPD 10 LCK 8 DEF 4 RES 7

Since I'm having trouble training these units I'm going to not use Cordelia and Stahl. Thanks czar_yoshi for the advice.

[Shamison]

Yikes lunatic+ lvl 2 is rather ridiculous with the chance of a Luna+ hawk eye hammer

[eclipse]

I'm curious, Eclipse. What units are you using besides Ricken?

Too many. But here's what I'm sticking with.

Chrom/Sully (so Sully's there mostly to make Chrom look good - reclassed Chrom to Cavalier, and forgot why)

Frederick/Sumia (reclassed Frederick to Griffon Rider, and am enjoying the benefits immensely)

Ricken/Panne (don't ask)

Avatar/Lissa (DON'T ASK)

. . .and if I feel like it, Nowi/Gregor. Nowi's to the point where she's able to do decent chip, and a promoted Gregor helps her Speed. Currently on Chapter 12, and am debating how to handle the massive rush. I think I'm going to end up abusing the everliving daylights out of my staffbots as soon as I can get unlimited Rescues.

[PKL]

Too many. But here's what I'm sticking with.

Chrom/Sully (so Sully's there mostly to make Chrom look good - reclassed Chrom to Cavalier, and forgot why)

Frederick/Sumia (reclassed Frederick to Griffon Rider, and am enjoying the benefits immensely)

Ricken/Panne (don't ask)

Avatar/Lissa (DON'T ASK)

. . .and if I feel like it, Nowi/Gregor. Nowi's to the point where she's able to do decent chip, and a promoted Gregor helps her Speed. Currently on Chapter 12, and am debating how to handle the massive rush. I think I'm going to end up abusing the everliving daylights out of my staffbots as soon as I can get unlimited Rescues.

Chrom is best as Cavalier. Though he's outclassed in this by Lucina, since she can get Aether and he wont as a cavalier. Fred Sumia is a staple. Interesting reclass on Frederick. How is that working out? Ricken Panne might not be that bad if she's not gonna be doing maincombat. She does give him spd. And uh Avatar/Lissa...fine I won't ask. Good luck :)

Oh and chapter 12...hmm, abuse that Beastkiller as much as you can. Don't stall too much or you'll soon be rushed by too many enemies. Ive always just destroyed the enemies with my flier army in that map, usually consisting of Cordelia paired with Stahl, Sumia paired with Fred, Cherche paired with Gaius/Lon'qu hammering things and Panne Wyvern being...well, Panne Wyvern. Healers never hurt.

Edited March 18, 2014 by PKL

[eclipse]

Frederick has speed to double, and as long as I'm not up against something with Axebreaker/stupid avoid, his hit rates are reasonable. Sumia's now a Dark Flier, to boost his mobility. Thanks to his time as a Great Knight, he has some durability to his name. What I eventually want is Deliverer on crack, with Galeforce helping to move those two along. Ricken/Lissa will probably be staffbotting, and if I ever get around to it, Avatar will be the cheesiest Nosfertank ever (with Lissa to give him more magic as a Sage).

I should probably drop one of the pairs, but NIEN. Ricken does a scary amount of damage to stuff that doesn't like magic, and Panne helps him to get where he needs to be (as she flies and all).

[Czar_Yoshi]

. . .and if I feel like it, Nowi/Gregor. Nowi's to the point where she's able to do decent chip, and a promoted Gregor helps her Speed. Currently on Chapter 12, and am debating how to handle the massive rush. I think I'm going to end up abusing the everliving daylights out of my staffbots as soon as I can get unlimited Rescues.

Keep in mind that Nah's paralogue sells Second Seals and is easily cheesed with Mire, so you can get them several chapters early (and in time to immediately reclass the other children).

For Cht.12, if you have two pairs with decent defenses there's a 2 wide choke immediately in front of where you start that can be held all day, though you need a third pair capable of handling the squad on the left corner...

Yikes lunatic+ lvl 2 is rather ridiculous with the chance of a Luna+ hawk eye hammer

Fort+Bronze Sword and don't use Fred up front if you can help it. Avatar and Fred can reach a fort on turn 1, just stay there with the Sword out until everything with 1 range is dead, then switch to Thunder. Unless you didn't train Avatar in the prologue, in which you'll either need to restart or get lucky...

[eclipse]

Finished Chapter 12 by shoving a few DLC levels into Panne and Nowi so they could take a couple of hits. I'm interested in finishing the game, methods be damned. Did the usual one-turn clears of Chapters 13 and 14. Chapter 15 was done with relative ease, because Panne had Hammer access and an axe to grind (literally). Chrom is a Great Knight, and I just promoted Sully to Paladin. Lucina at base is better than Avatar at level 20.

EDIT: Avatar is near-hopeless. Here's what I remember of his stats:

Name   Class      Level  HP  Str  Mag  Skl  Spd  Lck  Def  Res
MU     Tactician  20.00  33  13   14   15   13   13   18    9

Yeah, that's not surviving much of anything - hence, he became Lissa's pocket buddy with benefits.

EDIT 2: Found a way to one-turn Chapter 16. It's not pretty/elegant, and I'll need to do a wee bit of DLC stuff (on Vaike), but assuming everything aligns, I can one-shot Cervantes.

Edited March 19, 2014 by eclipse

[Shamison]

@Czar I trained him as much as I could.( I would soften up enemies with Fred at least until he died[casual]). And bronze sword avatar or Fredrick?

And what would the best child character be after Morgan? Or does it depend on parents?

[Interceptor]

@Czar I trained him as much as I could.( I would soften up enemies with Fred at least until he died[casual]). And bronze sword avatar or Fredrick?

Same rule applies to Lunatic+ as it does to Lunatic: don't over-use Frederick. He doesn't have a future in this mode as a primary combatant, so focus on growth units like Avatar.

And what would the best child character be after Morgan? Or does it depend on parents?

More like it depends on what you need. I consider Lucina (with Avatar as the mother) to be the best child after Morgan, because she can get Veteran and have a wide selection of classes to pick from. After that, it's a crap-shoot. I have a soft spot in my heart for Laurent, personally, based on what he did for me in my playlog.

[Roivann]

And what would the best child character be after Morgan? Or does it depend on parents?

It would really depend on their availability. A solid Lucina would probably be the second best, as she joins at about the same time that everyone is promoting/reclassing. Then, children who have easier paralogues on the first continent in the game, like Kjelle, Nah, and Laurent. Most of the children are unusable in-game, with the exception of Lucina, most first-gen Morgans, and the Avatar's children who are available immediately from chapter 13 (Laurent, Nah, Kjelle, Noire, Inigo (after Morgan's paralogue is completed), Severa, and Yarne, but Inigo, Severa, and Yarne have difficult paralogues for that early in the game).

[XeKr]

Finished Chapter 12 by shoving a few DLC levels into Panne and Nowi so they could take a couple of hits. I'm interested in finishing the game, methods be damned. Did the usual one-turn clears of Chapters 13 and 14. Chapter 15 was done with relative ease, because Panne had Hammer access and an axe to grind (literally). Chrom is a Great Knight, and I just promoted Sully to Paladin. Lucina at base is better than Avatar at level 20.

EDIT: Avatar is near-hopeless. Here's what I remember of his stats:

Name   Class      Level  HP  Str  Mag  Skl  Spd  Lck  Def  Res
MU     Tactician  20.00  33  13   14   15   13   13   18    9

Yeah, that's not surviving much of anything - hence, he became Lissa's pocket buddy with benefits.

EDIT 2: Found a way to one-turn Chapter 16. It's not pretty/elegant, and I'll need to do a wee bit of DLC stuff (on Vaike), but assuming everything aligns, I can one-shot Cervantes.

It’s perhaps worth noting that Lunatic gets exponentially harder as you 1 turn (relatively) easy chapters like C13/C14. Such that the other enemy stat bumps around Chapter 17 and Chapter 23 might require more grinding or restrictive play.

The exp curve is far more reasonable (particularly for larger teams of non-Veteran/children units) if you near-rout every chapter and go to as many Paralogues as possible for the exp.

(Yeah, I realize you mentioned your own preference to beating it, but this is more of a general commentary. I know others have complained about the exp curve in no grind runs, especially when they get to the Valm arc)

It would really depend on their availability. A solid Lucina would probably be the second best, as she joins at about the same time that everyone is promoting/reclassing. Then, children who have easier paralogues on the first continent in the game, like Kjelle, Nah, and Laurent. Most of the children are unusable in-game, with the exception of Lucina, most first-gen Morgans, and the Avatar's children who are available immediately from chapter 13 (Laurent, Nah, Kjelle, Noire, Inigo (after Morgan's paralogue is completed), Severa, and Yarne, but Inigo, Severa, and Yarne have difficult paralogues for that early in the game).

Hmmm, I wouldn’t really say I agree with some of that (Lucina is indeed probably best or second best though). All the children have such good bases/skills (if parents were actually trained) and level so relatively fast that they’re all easily usable if you want. Stuff like Rally Spectrum does help a lot in training them, and you can use their parents as Pair Up.

Anecdotally, iirc I recruited Sevara soon after Morgan/Kjelle’s Paralogue when they opened (in a No Second Seals run). I could have recruited Gerome, who has arguably the hardest paralogue, just as his chapter opened around C16 when Cherche/Gregor finally married. Though I would have had to let Lucina do most of it. But that’s kinda my point. In just a few chapters, Sully!Lucina went from base to way stronger than my whole team, including Avatar (gimped by no reclass, but still he was nearly 20/20). Sevara and Gerome, who you could say were delayed in recruitment, ended up being my 2 strongest fighters by Chapter 18 or so (for Gerome, that was like a chapter or two of training) and carried the team lategame.

Also, I don’t think Nah has one of the easier Paralogues (admittedly I haven’t tried a Mire strat since I typically don’t use Spotpass stuff). Statwise, it’s mostly promoted enemies with forges and Hit+10, so near C17 or later in difficulty, plus there’s the random door factor. My general rule is still to go by the Mother’s recruitment order, where earlier is easier.

Edited March 19, 2014 by XeKr