Who do YOU think Chrom's one true Waifu is?

[shadowofchaos]

* Trips over rocks

I think the appropriate word would be "nothing".

[HeroMystic]

Let's recap:

AVATAR(F)

* Has a dark tragic backstory (without spoiling too much)

* Has a funky symbol on the back of her hand

* Can reclass to basically anything she wants

* Can marry basically anyone she wants

* Is constantly hyped in the storyline as a master Tactician

* Gets praised by Lissa after the first battle

* Is central to the plot the entire time no matter what she does

SUMIA

* Is already an established member of the Shepherds, and not really a standout (they seem to all respect each other fairly equally off the bat)

* Trips over rocks

* Has the same amount of reclass options as most other characters

* Can marry four different guys, in a game where even Panne can marry twelve

* Apparently isn't even really a trained Pegasus Knight, given that she acquires a mount right before the chapter and strains to remember what Phila said about arrows (yeah, it's for tutorial purposes, but whatever)

* Is kind-hearted and good with animals, or something

* Even when she's Lucina's mother, stops really being plot relevant after that

Tell me again who the Mary Sue is?

Throwing this out there right now: Neither character is a Mary Sue, but MU is pretty close.

In order for MU to be a Mary Sue, he/she has to be an over-centralization to the story, so much to the point where it degrades in quality. This does not happen for the first act of the game (Ganrel Arc) as MU is just a really damn good tactician and is establishing him/herself. You can make a good argument that FeMU would be a Mary Sue in Act II if she marries Chrom, but if you don't, she's just a Master Tactician that Chrom trusts. However this argument as a whole falls flat on the simple case that it's purely player choice.

The last five or so chapters thrusts MU into the Main Protagonist role instead of Chrom, and that plus the ending gives the best argument for being a Mary Sue. However, that's not even half of the game, and MU as well as the rest of the main characters are well-established at that point.

[Anacybele]

There's a reason Avatar is that close to being a Sue though. Because it's OUR character. We're supposed to decide many of his/her characteristics. And who he/she marries.

[HeroMystic]

That's exactly the point, there's nothing wrong with MU being a self-insert when that when that's the intent of the story (or game in this case). It's even better that the story holds up extremely well even after the fact.

[Loki Laufeyson]

Prefer FemMU but depending on how much i favor the other potential husbandos that may change. other than that any wife for chrom except sumia. i find her character to be annoying/mary sue-ish plus she sucks as a unit for me. chrom should have had tiamo/cordelia as the other option. i liker her personality+character design better and she's a great unit in my game.

Wtf did i just read?

I'm guessing that I'm the only here who doesn't think that anyone is a Mary Sue in this game.

Avatar is a Mary Sue because its our Self-Insert and is written as such. Since its an avatar character with no set personality aside from being determined and tactical choices, it makes sense and the story doesnt suffer because of it. (in fact, it makes it better because Avatar is supposed to be us. Its putting the player into the story. Much more than Mark from FE7 ever did.) The focus is still on Chrom as well.

[algae]

That's how I feel about "Mary Sues" as well.

I found every character in Awakening well-written enough to not be a "Mary Sue". I don't even know what this term means anymore...

I'm just starting to read it as "Character I don't like". If you look hard enough, you'll probably find a collection of Sue traits in any importantish character.

Of course, the real Sue is the Nameless Maiden, what with her coming out of nowhere and marrying Chrom like that

Edited February 14, 2013 by Alg

[metavision]

Lol whut.

I find it ironic people are saying "dont start ship wars" and i get a bazillion replies defending Sumia when all I said was I liked Chrom better with *anyone* else.

Ironic much?

Oh wait, guess I'm not allowed to dislike a character someone else likes.

Edit:

I'm just starting to read it as "Character I don't like". If you look hard enough, you'll probably find a collection of Sue traits in any importantish character.

True enough, but I call Sumia out for her Sue-ness because the game makes specific points for her that don't even have any revelance in the game at all. Like when there was a specific scene and CG made for her just to show huge good she is at taking care of animals. I mean really? Ok, but what significance does this have to the story or game? None. I would assume any mounted unit has some animal husbandry skill so why do I need a cut scene for only one character? Sumia's only major fault is that she is clumsy, which isn't really even a "fault".

In short, she is just another carbon copy of a shoujo manga heroine. Flat and uninteresting. She can stand right next to Leanne and Micahah previous games under the big mary sue sign.

For the record, MU is only as sue-ish as the character plays him/her. You could have nasty MU that gets the shepards more or less wiped out saved for a handful of units you aren't allowed to killed, but you just assume most people play a lawful good MU.

Edited February 14, 2013 by metavision

[HeroMystic]

I don't like Sumia, by the way.

In short, she is just another carbon copy of a shoujo manga heroine. Flat and uninteresting. She can stand right next to Leanne and Micahah previous games under the big mary sue sign.

I agree with Sumia being flat and uninteresting. But... that's not what Mary Sue means. The term gets thrown around so much that it's misused more often than not.

[metavision]

I don't like Sumia, by the way.

I agree with Sumia being flat and uninteresting. But... that's not what Mary Sue means. The term gets thrown around so much that it's misused more often than not.

Not really. Mary Sue is just a very broad term/generalization now that people are more familiar with it.

But for the record : Mary Sue

And the sub category Sumia is under is "Mary Sue as Idealized Character". She also has a lot of Sue traits (as do several other characters; MU may or may not be included).

I get what you and some other people are saying though, just I disagree with it. "Mary Sue" term has since evolved from it's original meaning.

[CheatEnabled]

hooked him up with olivia at first but sumia seems more fit for him impo

[Sunwoo]

In short, she is just another carbon copy of a shoujo manga heroine. Flat and uninteresting. She can stand right next to Leanne and Micahah previous games under the big mary sue sign.

For the record, MU is only as sue-ish as the character plays him/her. You could have nasty MU that gets the shepards more or less wiped out saved for a handful of units you aren't allowed to killed, but you just assume most people play a lawful good MU.

As the people above me have said, that is not what a Mary Sue is. If I am remembering correctly, the term "Mary Sue" is supposed to refer to a character, usually a woman, who is like the "universe's pet". Micaiah, I can actually buy a case for her being a Mary Sue. Leanne? No way in hell. She isn't even that plot relevant. Sumia may be "flat and uninteresting", but that's not what makes a Mary Sue.

Despite MU being customizable, his/her personality and supports are pretty much locked. You can't customize your MU to act differently on different playthroughs. I'm not going to go into details because big spoiler alert, but MU has a lot of TRAITS that scream Mary Sue. More so than Sumia does. But does that actually make the self-insert a Mary Sue? People will disagree on that.

I really couldn't care less whether people want their MU with Chrom or not. But bashing Sumia for being "less worthy" of your "pwecious Chwomy-poo" and calling her more of a Mary Sue than the self insert just makes me facepalm. I can understand disliking Sumia for not being interesting and not wanting her paired with Chrom because you don't find their romance interesting. The bashing is unnecessary.

[Anacybele]

I agree. I don't like Sumia either, but only because I find her annoying and uninteresting. I don't really think she's Sueish. I don't think anyone in the game is, actually. And Chrom would only be my second choice for female Avatar's husband anyway. Anyone here probably knows by now who my first choice is.

[shadowofchaos]

I agree. I don't like Sumia either, but only because I find her annoying and uninteresting. I don't really think she's Sueish. I don't think anyone in the game is, actually. And Chrom would only be my second choice for female Avatar's husband anyway. Anyone here probably knows by now who my first choice is.

It's obviously Stahl.

[Anacybele]

It's obviously Stahl.

Okay, this is getting old. Every time I say something about a preference or some such, you go and make a sarcastic remark. Please stop already.

[Terrador]

Panne x Krom OTP

[Sunwoo]

Okay, this is getting old. Every time I say something about a preference or some such, you go and make a sarcastic remark. Please stop already.

If you didn't repeatedly mention how much you love your "Freddy bear" in like every other post, people wouldn't be so included to tease.

[Anacybele]

If you didn't repeatedly mention how much you love your "Freddy bear" in like every other post, people wouldn't be so included to tease.

I don't mention him THAT much. Maybe a bit more than I should, but I certainly don't bring it up in every single post. And even if I did, it's no excuse for anyone to go bothering me.

Edited February 14, 2013 by Anacybele

[Slyfox]

I like Sumia...

[Mighty Kamina]

I was never expecting Sumia to be a fan favorite character, but man I never expected this much hate for her.

Glad shes winning the poll though.

[shadowofchaos]

I don't mention him THAT much. Maybe a bit more than I should, but I certainly don't bring it up in every single post. And even if I did, it's no excuse for anyone to go bothering me.

Besides where it's relevant to a topic... do you see me mentioning "Olivia" in something like say... the FE13 help topic?

You mention how much you love your Freddy Bear in a topic about Chrom. You should expect a shot as much as people take shots as me for moe Japanese Olivia.

I doubt any sensible mod will warn me for simply responding to you once, but since I'm derailing this topic with this post, I should contribute something OTHER than my response to you.

I was never expecting Sumia to be a fan favorite character, but man I never expected this much hate for her.

I didn't expect that either... but I guess since females have the "self-insert" character option... as well as the trend from Japan's popularity poll for who their favorite male is when Chrom took the number 1 spot on the official FE Background site popularity contest... I'd expect the numbers for the girls after Chrom's "Falchion" is pretty high.

Taking that into account, IS shoving Chrom x Sumia in their faces probably gets in the way of their OTP with themselves.

Edited February 14, 2013 by shadowofchaos

[GoD]

I may be new here, but enough is enough. This topic was made to state your own opinion about who Chrom's true waifu is. This is not supposed to be canon first of all, no woman in FE: Awakening is better than the other.

If you like Sumia, everyone should respect that. If you like the Avatar, then we can respect that as well. And goddamn it, if you like yaoi pairings, then give a fuck yeah!!!

This is not a topic made for disrespect for the characters nor to start a pointless argument about Mary Sues. You guys may raise interesting points regarding Sumia's forced relationship, the Sue-ness relevant in the Avatar but this topic is not equipped to handle these sorts of discussions

If you would like to discuss other non-related topics, then please create a new topic where you guys can argue, in a civil manner. I'd like to ask if you could refrain this Sue-talk now, please.

Back on topic, I'm not too sure who I want my Chrom to pair up.

From what I can gather Sumia likes pies and there is a lot of nudity with the Avatar and Chrom.

Regardless when I saw an S- Rank Support I kinda went D'aaaawww at the cuteness in it all. So fucking cute!!!

[Prax]

Sumia is obviously the canon choice as it's her in the intro holding his kid, having special cutscenes with Chrom and her peggy, and being in the marriage cutscene as the "shadowy wife figure" at the end of Chapter 11. lol

I think I would have liked Sumia and Chrom together more were it less about making pies and asking if it was "her boots again". :l Lame chemistry. She herself is quirky and kind of entertaining, if not a little weak playing the role of a klutzy so scattered but kawaii girl. Chrom's a lot less entertaining though. Wonder why he's so bland as a lord. lol Maybe that's why he needs a quirky girl to punch unblandness into him.. >__>

But in the end I liked Chrom and Sully together the most. Childhood buddies that grew into romance! YEAH! And Sully is woman enough to propose to Chrom instead of the other way around! xD

I read convos for Chrom with everyone else, and I felt they didn't really compare to his and Sully's (well, Chrom and Maribelle seemed good to me too lol She has an air of nobility and good-heartedness to her, and also toughness that you wouldn't expect. Makes it easy to see why a bubbly girl like Lissa and her are best friends).

Edited February 14, 2013 by Prax

[PuffPuff]

Plus having Lucina and Morgan carrying the blood of both Grima and Naga is badass.

But Chrom should too. Both him and Lucina have the same eyes which is why Lucina broke out in tears when she met Chrom shortly after some of the second half of the game.

Are you guys who voted for nameless maiden serious? If I didn't pair my character with Chrom, I'd pair Chrom with Maribelle.

Maribelle's canon pairing is actually Ricken. Since they've known each other longer than anyone else.

Now, now Rey just because NoA changed Olivia to be not as moe with MU as she is with everyone else, doesn't mean you have to be jealous.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mw_ZFOkthsU

That's why he's probably glad to have the Japanese copy. xP

Having said all that, I paired up Chrom with Maribelle because I found the idea of the cowardly delinquent Brady inheriting the kingdom unbelievably hilarious. That and I figure Chrom passes down some neat growth rates and skills, and the conversations between him and Brady would be interesting given both of their natures.

Him owning Maribelle's Seduced Lady skill is rather odd, but I won't complain. He is Maribelle's son from the future after all. ^^

IS does shove Sumia/Chrom down your throat, but I say his one true waifu is Male Avatar.

Because they are perfect for each other.

SUMIA

* Is kind-hearted and good with animals, or something

Tell me again who the Mary Sue is?

Again, that's why they are perfect for each other.

I think the appropriate word would be "nothing".

She more like has two left feet. Trips over her own feet.

I really couldn't care less whether people want their MU with Chrom or not. But bashing Sumia for being "less worthy" of your "pwecious Chwomy-poo" and calling her more of a Mary Sue than the self insert just makes me facepalm. I can understand disliking Sumia for not being interesting and not wanting her paired with Chrom because you don't find their romance interesting. The bashing is unnecessary.

I actually paired them in my first run on accident as the game switched over to a scene seeing Lucina born and that the game forced to have them paired.

Glad shes winning the poll though.

Sames.

She deserves it!

Edited February 14, 2013 by Katarina

[TheGhosteon]

Canon, what's that? Olivia for me!

[bookofholsety]

I wouldn't say I have a particularly strong opinion either way. I'm inclined to say Sumia, if mostly because I really like what the English version seems to have done with her voicing from what I've heard, but on my first playthrough I'm planning to do Chrom/Olivia for reasons I don't quite remember. I think I'll probably try all possibilities at some point, but Chrom/Sumia will probably be my fallback when I don't particularly care.

also holy shit this whole mary sue debacle is hilarious