SSB4: SSB for Wii U and 3DS, maybe the NX and also your toaster!

[Anacybele]

Yeah, but he's given Ike a lot of buffs compared to some other characters here. And I DID say "to some extent." lol

Ike can do short hop Fair with no landing lag

Lovely. ^^ Opens up some possibilities for me!

Edited November 18, 2014 by Anacybele

[Jotari]

Any changes to my man Ganondorf? I'd love to be able to cancel out of Up Tilt.

[Elieson]

Ganon is now the only character who can 'cide successully. Bowsercide, kirbycide and DDDcide all kill themselves first, but #GanonIsCanon

[DodgeDusk]

Any changes to my man Ganondorf? I'd love to be able to cancel out of Up Tilt.

All I've seen is that his n-air has lower lag; however I can't remember if it affects the move's starting, ending, or landing lag

Edited November 18, 2014 by DodgeDusk

[Tsunami922]

Any changes to Palutena?

[Jave]

Ness' Down throw does 7% instead of 9% now, but you can still combo into it.

[Anacybele]

Ganon is now the only character who can 'cide successully. Bowsercide, kirbycide and DDDcide all kill themselves first, but #GanonIsCanon

Good, I always found those suicides annoying. >.>

[Jave]

For the record, that doesn't mean suiciding is gone. It means that if you want to win by suiciding, you have to be at least two stock when your opponenet is on its last.

[Ein]

*Ike maining intensifies*

[Anacybele]

For the record, that doesn't mean suiciding is gone. It means that if you want to win by suiciding, you have to be at least two stock when your opponenet is on its last.

That's true. It's still really cheap and annoying though.

[Ragnell]

Another Ike change: In his A+A+A combo, the second hit (the kick) seems to have less knockback to ensure better that the third hit (the sword) connects.

If this is all true, holy crap, Sakurai made this patch specifically for me! My two mains, Ike and Shulk, are the two people apparently buffed most noticeably. Ike's jab not connecting was the saddest nerf to him from Brawl.

That said, I'm trying to remain objective about the patch contents; a lot of placebo went around during the last patch.

[BrightBow]

At the risk of falling for a placebo, Ike's Fair seems to be his new Bair now.

Edited November 18, 2014 by BrightBow

[Jotari]

Have the fixed Robin's weird footstool mechanics?

[Nova]

For the record, that doesn't mean suiciding is gone. It means that if you want to win by suiciding, you have to be at least two stock when your opponenet is on its last.

I also like to suicide when I've got much more percent than the enemy. Even if it doesn't win me the match, it still gives me an advantage.

That's true. It's still really cheap and annoying though.

Remember that it takes skill to successfully suicide. It also takes skill to avoid being suicided by the enemy. A good player knows how to deal with techniques like this and will be able to avoid them. So it's far from being cheap.

I still shy away from doing it when I'm playing online, 'cause it really can anger people. I'm good enough with Kirby anyway.

My friends are an exception. They can deal with me being an asshole. :3

[Jedi]

Does anyone have a general list of changes?

[Anacybele]

Remember that it takes skill to successfully suicide. It also takes skill to avoid being suicided by the enemy. A good player knows how to deal with techniques like this and will be able to avoid them. So it's far from being cheap.

I still shy away from doing it when I'm playing online, 'cause it really can anger people. I'm good enough with Kirby anyway.

My friends are an exception. They can deal with me being an asshole. :3

...How does it take skill to simply inhale someone and fall off the edge of the stage?

Edited November 18, 2014 by Anacybele

[Jave]

From Smashboards: (SOME OF THESE NEED TO BE 100% CONFIRMED)

Ike:

+ SH Fair now autocancels. Startup is also much faster.
+ Bair does 1% more damage, slight increase in knockback(?)
+ Nair has reduced knockback allowing for more opportunities for followups.
+ Dtilt trajectory is upwards now, less recovery, does 1% more damage.
+ Ftilt recovers slightly faster.
+ Dsmash trajectory is slightly more horizontal.
+ Jab now works as intended, including comboing properly on Greninja. Does not combo properly on Yoshi still. :/

Shulk:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAQwL310Gk4
+ Most of Shulk's moves gained a +1% increase or more to his base damages
+ MArts's damages are increased as well
+ Jab deals ~2% more damage
+ U-smash deals ~1% more
+ D-smash deals ~1% more
+ D-tilt deals about 1% more
+ F-tilt deals about 1% more
+ F-smash deals about 1% more
+ U-air deals like 2 to 3% more

+1%
D-air
B-air
Air Slash
N-air
U-tilt
Dash Attack
F-throw
B-throw
U-throw
D-throw

Zero Suit Samus:

+ Side-b now connects properly (first hit always launches into second hit if you're close, though you still get some weird rogue hits on the outer part of the whip). Total animation time is reduced heavily, making it safer.

+ Fsmash is now faster to recover and thus safer on block. By how much I'm not sure.
+ Close range down smash is better on block. By how much I'm not sure, though in testing it seems I can jab before the opponent can drop shield (like brawl).
+ Air dodge lag increased to 22f from 15f
+/- Paralyzer Shot's small shot range reduced, however you can now release the attack before it finishes charging.
- Down throw launch angle changed slightly; the opponent is now launched less horizontally and at lower percents a little bit lower.
- Same change for down tilt; the opponent is now launched less horizontally and at lower percents a little bit lower.

Less sure about:
+ Up b seems to connect better in the air. (now with more "probably for real this time™")
+/- Fsmash's angle of KB seems different, more horizontal instead of a corner KO angle.
- Zair ledge tether range reduced
+ Up-b's KB doesn't seem to be staling at all.

Custome Moves:
Paralyzer -
+ Blast Shot can now be fired before it is fully charged, but incurs normal landing lag (was way lower before )
+ Spreading Shot now deals 10% damage (up from 6%) and lasts long enough for ZSS to get a follow-up (wore off before ZSS could even move before, weird)

Boost Kick:
+ Impact Kick now properly absorbs the target so that the final hit connects properly
+ Lateral Kick now allows ZSS full aerial movement during special fall

Plasma Whip:
+ Whip Lash got the same buff as normal side-b: less animation time, so safer on block and more follow-ups.

Flip Jump:
+ Low Flip travels faster across the field (?)

Kirby

+ Feet-based attacks have a longer range
+ U-Smash is significantly faster, has a sour-spot that allows the move to reach farther
+ U-Air is much faster, has reduced landing lag, hitbox extended to hit BEHIND Kirby now.
+ Dash speed is increased

- Increased landing lag on N-Air, F-Air
- D-Air -> sourspotted U-Tilt no longer a combo (normal U-Tilt still is)
- Kirbycide KOs Kirby first now
* Hup Cancel is still in

So it seems some of Kirby's problems have been addressed.

Meta Knight

+ N-Air has been buffed from 7% to 10% and now KOs ~45% earlier.
+ Dimensional Cape sends the target in a more horizontal angle and now KOs ~15% earlier.
+ Forward Throw has been changed, it has two hitboxes that total 9% on all characters. It previously did 3% on some character and 9% on others, so it's more of a fix than anything else.
+ Back Throw has received slightly increased knockback and KOs ~5% earlier.
+ Back-Air's knockback has been increased a lot and now KOs a whopping ~30% earlier.
- Forward-Air can no longer spike.
- Range and visual effects remain the same.

Edited November 18, 2014 by Jave

[kingddd]

...How does it take skill to simply inhale someone and fall off the edge of the stage?

Bowser's suicide can be controlled by the opponent to offset them from suicide kill and swallow/inhale still has a huge build up to initiate. Timing is everything for those moves.

[Jedi]

Glad to hear about all those buffs. Well except Zero Suit didn't really need any

[Jotari]

...How does it take skill to simply inhale someone and fall off the edge of the stage?

It takes skill because you have to time it right to actually make it effective. Inhale really doesn't last that long so it can only be easily done when standing near the edge of the stage. In which case you have to manage to inhale when your opponent knows exactly what you plan to do and can take advantage of it. Even then it might not work when you have them in your grasp. Inhaling is among the easier suicide options but it's not very reliable.

I love Ganondorf's suicide. It's very situational to pull off since you can't do it to the ground but it's effectiveness makes it very difficult for a savy player to chase Ganondorf off the edge, and in the newest game, even edge guarding him is very risky since it gives him enough time to pull back.

Edited November 18, 2014 by Jotari

[Elieson]

...How does it take skill to simply inhale someone and fall off the edge of the stage?

Plus think, you need to set yourself up sidestage, and prepare to be immobile for what amounts to about 2 seconds (and about .4 seconds to get your inhale to actually occur after pressing B). One poke and that's out of the picture; it's pretty hard to inhale an aggressive player, and a defensive/passive player often won't even be that close to you without trying to get out of the way 'somehow'.

[Anacybele]

Glad to hear about all those buffs. Well except Zero Suit didn't really need any

This. Why the hell are they buffing an already top tier character?

As for the suiciding thing, I see now. I guess some people just made it look really easy.

[Nova]

...How does it take skill to simply inhale someone and fall off the edge of the stage?

Have you ever tried it yourself? Please do so before judging it. I would explain how much skill it takes, but there's really nothing more I can add to what Jotari and kingddd said.

edit: God, I'm slow. I'm glad that you understand.

Edited November 18, 2014 by Nova

[Jedi]

You know with these buffs to Metaknight I may be able to actually KO with the guy now.

Dude had no way, I understand he was godly in Brawl (thus why I didn't use him despite being my 3rd most wanted newcomer) I wanted a fair Metaknight, looks like I may have finally gotten it somewhat.

[Vajra]

Those are really considerable buffs for Ike. This could secure Ike a place in the mid tiers. ^-^