League of Legends

[CT075]

Ryze for an alternative ADC

please tell me i'm interpreting this wrong

[Elieson]

did I mean APC and I just got my terms mixed up?

@Psych, I tried Garen and Cho'Gath, but like I said, I just can't get comfortable with them. Probably need to try more than a handful of matches with them though; Garen carried one of my first matches, but then all the others I saw promptly ate bull testicles for the rest of their respective battles

Edited March 25, 2014 by Elieson

[Shahrivar]

Garen and Cho aren't the greatest top lanes imo, their late is too weak (and Cho sucks 1v1) - if you want something solid and not too hard, try Darius, Irelia or Riven. Their late and threat potential is greater aswell.

[Elieson]

Garen and Cho aren't the greatest top lanes imo

This is something I meant to ask about; what does it mean to Top v Bot anyway? How different are they?

[Raven]

Bot lane usually consists of an ad carry and a support.

Top lane usually consists of champions ranging from full tanks like Nasus, Shen, Malphite, to squishy melee autoattackers/casters like Tryndamere, Riven, and everything in between such as offtank (not full tank, but tanky with at least one damage item) like Garen, Renekton, and bruisers that build mostly offense with a couple of defensive items, like Jax, Aatrox... Of course you can mix it up depending on your champion, who your allies and enemies are, what they're building, etc.

For example, your jungler's going full tank. You're top as Renekton and can afford to build more damage than defense if your lane opponent allows for it, and Renekton really does perform better as a bruiser or offtank than full tank when you consider that a lot of his abilities scale pretty nicely off his AD, when only his ultimate benefits from tanky stats.

[Kiriane]

The last time I played Renekton, our jungle LS decided he was going full damage so I ended up the tank. It sucked. I hate playing tank Renekton.

[Shahrivar]

Tank Rene is kind of normal though, your scaling is mediocre and you're frontline anyway. You get enough indirect damage from Sunfire and SV (CDR) - in addition more than one damage item isn't needed anyway to be a threat for ap/adc.

[Eurykins]

Garen and Cho aren't the greatest top lanes imo, their late is too weak (and Cho sucks 1v1) - if you want something solid and not too hard, try Darius, Irelia or Riven. Their late and threat potential is greater aswell.

Garen and Cho are generally meant to stonewall or otherwise prevent the other top laner from laning effectively though- the point of them is to usually shut down the top laner so they're a weaker asset to team fights early-mid game. So it only makes sense that they can taper off late game if they allow it to go that far, imo. (Unless you go AP cho, in which case you can easily Q/W/Nom combo an ADC and insta-gib them- that's always fun.)

Darius is a good option, as Irelia can be. However, Riven would be slightly dangerous as a first pick imo; a lot of her damage now remains in her passive, so she's not exactly the most simplistic champ to first run with (especially when Elie's not overly familiar with the champ pool out there). Plus with the slight nerfs to her damage, it's now more important to utilize her passive/skill kit/outplaying capabilities, as she can't exactly just Q spam and hope to survive trades without a second thought; proved that point by murdering a fairly careless Riven top lane all laning phase with AD bruiser Leona top lane (won every single trade since level 1- silly Riven player). =P

If you (Elie) want to practice top lane ranged units, I'd wager Teemo or Heimerdinger or Vladimir. As for more melee options to start out with: Yorick, Shen, Volibear, Malphite, or Shyvana- aside from Yorick- all can transition well to either AD bruisers to full blown tanks for late game and still do well (and have more simplistic skill kits/playing style than say Riven, Lee, or Renekton).

[Shahrivar]

No offense, but Cho stonewalls hardly anything (well, imo at least >_>).

It's too easy to dodge Cho's Q which makes his laning presence mediocre and AP Cho bad - he's okay as jungle, but that's it. He has no gap closer and isn't tanky enough to go squishy ap (yeah the bonus hp from his ult is great, but that's not enough to make him work).

I see this point in Garen and won't disagree, but still I think that he's on the weak side overall. It's fine if you want to play him, but he won't make it on my recommendationlist (too onesided - easy to kite because of mediocre gapcloser, weak scaling for lategame)

You're probably right about Riven, but Irelia is harder to play aswell - she's a bit more than Jax-mode (right click = win 1v1). Actually Jax and Darius might be the best choice, they're quite simplistic, have strong lane presence and fine lategame. These two and Renekton are imo your best bet to learn toplane.

I wouldn't recommend Vlad anymore - he's okay, but nothing compared to s2 (and not as strong as the former stated champs). You have a hard time against many top lanes and there are a lot of counters (if I know a champ, then it's Vlad after my s2 obsession).

Teemo is a special case: He works against some toplanes, but he's strange in late (he doesn't have teamfight presence, you have to shroom up baron and secure him while splitpushing). Because his role is rather special, I wouldn't recommend him if you want to learn top.

No idea/opinion about Heimer, his rework didn't suit me.

Ryze is another viable option.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Assurhaddon

[Eurykins]

I agree that Cho's a hell of a lot easier to manage/play against nowdays, especially with the change to him a while back that super highlights his Q location, and that he's probably much stronger in the jungle than in top or mid. That, and once you start losing ulti stacks/dying late game, unless you can re-acquire said stacks, it just gets easier and easier to kill him, which always sucks. ;/

And that is true with Irelia- especially with her situational stun/slow, as well as managing her Q last hitting and use of W. However, even Jax (though much more AA reliant than Irelia) can be a bit sticky, in terms of landing/timing the leap/stun, and learning the most appropriate timings in which to get off the most damage in terms of using Empower. Renekton also, imo, is like Riven, who relies on skill combo for powerful trading/harass. Though his skill itself is much more simplistic than Riven's (and doesn't rely on passive AA's in between), Renekton's ability to dash in, stun, Q, and dash back out if/when he doesn't want to stick around to trade with someone else for long is what makes him very strong in top lane; idling in the combo or doing it at the wrong times can easily get someone killed (either tanking too much minion damage, or otherwise remaining around for the other person to retaliate with a stronger sustained damage).

Vlad is a heck of a lot weaker, I suppose (sustain doesn't really come into play until he has at least 2-3 levels into Q imo), and yeah, lots of counters. However, he does have a fairly powerful team fight potential with his ulti, but I agree that even that is fairly situational (requires a decent AoE or CC comp to utilize his ulti to the fullest, more or less landing it on multiple people).

Mmmmm... I just figured that Teemo's skill kit in itself is easy enough to work with- passive on poison/AA's, blind, and MS skill. And the shrooms are always something fun to learn/utilize, and so overall would be interesting to learn. (And in this case, it'd help in terms of map awareness/management in terms of learning key locations to shroom up or otherwise keep vision of that can help influence fights and/or wall off the other team.) Heimer was just for lolz, but all in all, he's actually been pretty good against most bruisers at top lane, and can also be used mid, and is decent with both poke/push as well as playing more defensively under turret.

Ryze is, but since he's already played him some, it'd probably be better to try out more champs as he goes along to get more exposure/knowledge of other top lane champs to see/understand what each can do for when he faces them himself (makes it easier on him in team fights/laning phase, imo).

[Shahrivar]

Heh, they should buff the ultimate to give 2 stacks once it reaches level 3 - if you lose a mid/late teamfight, you'll hardly get full stacks ever again. I really liked him and want to play him, but he's way too frustrating.

While Jax's gap closer is more tricky (Irelia's is ALMOST perfect because of the great animation - it's way harder to interrupt hers than Jax's), his 1v1 capability is incredible. You beat stuff like Irelia just by right clicking because his dps is that insane. Of course there is more to him and someone starting lol won't master him in a few games - but you get good results easier than.. dunno, Orianna. Something with higher skillcap for decent results.

No champion is failproof, I tend to exaggerate. IMO he's just easier than many top lanes (which isn't a bad thing, I play him a lot when I have to go top). He even got hardcounters like Quinn who totally wrecks him, but overall he's solid.

Vlad's late is still great, no sense in denying. But I feel like it's hard to get into him - you feel so helpless when a Jax or Irelia jumps into your face and rapes you. With a solid CC like Ruthless Predator, you have a hard disengage at least.

My perception might be wrong of course, but I feel like "hard" abilities and nonskillshots make learning easier (Renekton is more tanky than Riven by default, Riven requires more effort with E timing while Renekton just heals with Q - it's easier to disengage with a Sionstun then LB E or Cassio Q/W).

While Vlad W is surely great and he got his role, his lack of offensive CC and soft disengage make him fairly difficult.

Teemo isn't a bad idea at all, I just think that he's too special of a champion. Stuff like Irelia's attack animation canceling improves your mechanics for other top lanes aswell. Not to forget, only evildoer play Teemo and enjoy it.

I "can" imagine that Heimer does well vs Bruiser. No idea though, haven't played top in a while. He was way cooler with 6 turrets.

Trying different things and getting a feel for them is great, but that's for advanced players imo. He wants to get into top lane if I remember correctly >_>

They're just a good start to get into it(Jax for more offensive Bruiser, Darius/Renekton for tankish one, Ryze for mage).

While extremely situational, Quinn is a good top champ aswell.

If he wants a full tank (or ap tank), Malphite might be an interesting option aswell.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Assurhaddon

[Eurykins]

Agreed on the Cho thing- at times, you literally just don't have the time/CD in order to regain your stacks with how frequent fights can happen mid/late game. Poor Cho cho just gets smaller and smaller once he dies. :(

*Likewise agreeing with Jax and Vlad. In addition, with his skills running of HP, misusing them (ESPECIALLY his pool) during laning phase is going to kick you in the face sometimes harder than the person you're laning against, and that in itself can get you killed/make you near useless early/mid game.

And lol- but Teemo shrooms are so fun! Though the lowering of the AP ratio to 0.5 made me a bit sad (even as someone who only rarely plays him nowdays). Q_Q

Heimer- goddamn. You upgrade his turret now, and it's like, "HA. Your hp? You have none left. ;D" and can completely mess up any bruiser. Saw a Heimer top in a ranked game get 3 man-ganked by a Shyv jungle, Ahri mid, and Trynd top; shat on all 3 and killed them before he himself died. It was insane. xD

I suppose that's true- though I'm not sure where he wants to main. For now, I just told Elie to try out champs and to find some that he really liked before going all out to learning the lane/specific roles that champ runs. 'Cause if you're not having fun with the champ(s), then you're not going to have fun with the game- is how I see it.

[Shahrivar]

Yeah, it's one of the reasons why Cho is hardly played. Noone wants to be a sissy Cho'gath - and Q requires teamsupport to be great (well or confusing teamfights). He got a small niche though, more than Sion has.

I'm glad we were able to find an agreement =P

Teemo's appeal is griefplay, of course you have to be evil :3 Watching ads helplessly autoattacking you while blinded, making ganks impossible with shrooms and harassing them with laughspam.

I enjoyed playing him some time ago - but I dislike the ward changes (Trinkets, no oracles etc). Even though it was for his benefit, I almost stopped playing Teemo. Removal of Oracles was dumb and made the AP nerf necessary (which means less fun for both parties overall - less shroom damage sucks and no oracles vs shrooms sucks aswell).

Don't remind me, I hate R->Q. That turret does so much damage, it's disgusting to deal with - I'd pick Nunu just to harass him and to be able to destroy it.

I can't deny that, of course fun is the most important thing. But there are so many champions now (when I started, there were 40 - nowadays almost 120), I'd feel overwhelmed and thankful for a starting point.

[Eurykins]

I knooooooow. I also get sad when I use Jurassic Cho (in the rare times I do play him) and anytime I die, I watch him explode into so many pieces. Sad times... ;_;

Lol, ikr?

Hahaha, yeah. Man, I remember a game that, as AP Teemo, I bought a Mejais last 'cause I could, and for some reason (I honestly don't know why), the enemy team insisted on only pushing mid lane. So I shroomed up the entirety of it. I get killed, watch Ez roam with half HP, and proceeds to run into one shroom and dying, lol. Two more die directly due to shroom damage, and the rest I get assists on. PIcking up Mejai stacks while dead and nearly one-shotting ADC's with a single shroom = priceless. :3

Hahaha, yeah. Nowdays junglers are like, 'alsdjfl;asdjff efff your turret!' and will generally attempt to smite it in order to kill the large turret faster, lol. 'Cause man, especially right now, that R'd turret hurts like hell.

Indeed~ I started around the time when... Leona was released? (so by the end of S1, since I also ended up getting the Judgement Kayle skin), but I always found it interesting to run with newer champs and find out what I liked. Granted, I had to adapt faster since I kept getting pulled into games with my friends who got me into league (at least one was level 30; the rest were mid-high 20s), so normal games with them were pretty chaotic for me. xD

[Shahrivar]

I got Battlecast Prime Cho'gath, you can't imagine how sad I am >_> Appropriately enough I played him yesterday; Dominion but still - never got more than 3 passive stacks.

Sadly Riot is known for neglecting certain champions for a long time while glutting others with balance changes.

See? Only evildoers like him. His whole kit is about griefplay, annoying people by running with lightning speed, blind autoattack champs and spamming laug while they try to hit you.

Too bad that shrooms will rarely one/twoshot anyone anymore.

Heimer's turrets before were laughable, but the ultimate one's HP are waay too high. ~ 1500 would be enough imo.

I didn't bother trying much early, I went for Nasus first because I love egyptian stuff, got disappointed after few games and moved on to Nidalee for 20 games and Katarina after - mained her directly for 3 months.

While 5-10 games with every champion are great to get a grasp on different mechanics, I prefer to main something most of the time.

Edited March 30, 2014 by Assurhaddon

[Elieson]

Saving up IP for Irelia, almost there. Had some good matches as Ryze last night. Tried Xerath, that was an absolute nightmare.

[Raven]

who is irelia

[Shahrivar]

The one champ who doesn't have to face upness even once (although everyone cries "better nerf Irelia" all the time ~~ her W will always make her viable).

[Eail]

You should all stay away from Wukong, if any more people pick him up after the LCS started using him Riot might actually decide to nerf the monkey madness.

I don't want to lose my ability to go full Beyblade mode.

[Zanarkin]

Saving up IP for Irelia, almost there. Had some good matches as Ryze last night. Tried Xerath, that was an absolute nightmare.

Xerath is an awesome champ. Snipe everything! Then get all your mana back and snipe everything again :D dat passive.

[BK-201]

who is irelia

I think it's Wickd.

[Eail]

http://vote.na.lolesports.com/en/player-voting/

Remember kids, vote for The Pie

The Pie believes in you, you should believe in The Pie

ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ﾉ

Edited March 30, 2014 by Eail

[BK-201]

Doublelift, Bjergsen, Meteos if you want NA to look decent.

[Fateborn]

lol

I voted Meteos, Bjen, and Quas

Edited March 31, 2014 by Fateborn

[Xander]

Can anyone help me take an account from level 27 to 30 in exchange for a skin?