Who is the worst unit in FE:A ?

[Czar_Yoshi]

When responding inside quotes, you should bold your responses so it's easier to see who wrote what.

It doesn't matter that Chrom's DSes aren't terribly strong, they're strong enough to snag a lot of KOes in Lunatic(+). Try getting Sumia to KO Cht.3's Knights without him.

Miriel has 6 chapters of availability on Tharja and 10 on Henry. There is absolutely no way those lategame chumps are better than her, especially since she has DM too if you want one. If Avatar leaves Tactician before Cht.5, who's going to be your Wyvern killer? Ricken? Too low of a Tome rank to wield Celica's/Rexcalibur, while Miriel can easily have that with investment. Miriel also has staff utility which is very nice lategame, especially on Lunatic+ with an Avatar-F.

[Azurelibra]

When responding inside quotes, you should bold your responses so it's easier to see who wrote what.

It doesn't matter that Chrom's DSes aren't terribly strong, they're strong enough to snag a lot of KOes in Lunatic(+). Try getting Sumia to KO Cht.3's Knights without him.

Miriel has 6 chapters of availability on Tharja and 10 on Henry. There is absolutely no way those lategame chumps are better than her, especially since she has DM too if you want one. If Avatar leaves Tactician before Cht.5, who's going to be your Wyvern killer? Ricken? Too low of a Tome rank to wield Celica's/Rexcalibur, while Miriel can easily have that with investment. Miriel also has staff utility which is very nice lategame, especially on Lunatic+ with an Avatar-F.

Point taken (Bolded for no real reason)

I personally found chrom didn't really get alot of KOes on stuff early game on most runs regardless of position in the pair However I'm going to try alot of what you said and suggested on a run of lunatic at some point and check how big a difference it makes (I'm almost certain the Nowi one is gonna break the game never even noticed that you could get a dragonstone + early since Whilst I did mess around with the buying parts I never encountered it but oh well )

(I'm not sure if I've just had bad luck in general with Miriel but she never seems to really turn out all that well no matter how much I reclass and when I promote her but meh I'll give her one last chance on Lunatic)

[Just call me AL]

Panne I do find it takes a while for her to catch up on the offensive side though

Which is why you want to give her a support partner such as Kellam at the earliest opportunity.

and I still find her to be outclassed by various other characters.

Postgame, that generally is the case. But for maingame? I kinda find that hard to believe, considering how solid she is once she gets her paws on a Second Seal.

Chrom the issue with is that his dual strikes don't exactly hit like a ton of bricks though in his defense he does have extra damage against ALOT of enemies with his Rapiers/Falchions though with his rather urksome growths he does suffer Even if you do farm levels on him it takes ALOT of investment in your time that could just as easily be put into more deserving candidates like" Timetravel hurts my brain/Yay forced recruitment".

I think you might be doing something wrong if Chrom's not performing how you would like him to. Like Czar_Yoshi said, he can help bolster Sumia's offense (though I do find Frederick better for that, personally), which is a plus. And that might very well be for starters.

Miriel doesn't really shine much to be honest and even when I did invest in her she usually didn't pay off much since the only tome user I find she outclassed was Ricken on runs where I DID invest alot into her I appear to have misplaced the area she belongs a little.

Ricken isn't exactly a hard unit to outclass to say the least.

Sumia I'd say The issue is that early game like many pegasus knights she suffers alot (although she is a godsend SHOULD you succeed in getting her off the ground or rather ON the ground (aka after you reclass her ) with a huge skill pool she can work well but suffers alot early game so does rather frequently need to be fed)

IMO, the best time to reclass Sumia, should you do that, would be after she's a LVL 15 Dark Flier. That way, she wouldn't have much trouble getting kills following her time outside of the Pegasus Knight family.

Maribelle- Straight to the point easilly killed,Outclassed By Lissa in most runs by the time you get her,With the previous levels invested in Lissa generally investing in Maribelle tends to be a waste of time in MOST occasions.

You typically don't go wrong with having more than one medic on the team. Including someone like Rarity Maribelle in this game.

Miriel- Outclassed by both Dark mages in most runs as well as the Avatar and Morgan generally its a case of getting outclassed by so many other users of the same weapon kind (though the healing part of her generally CAN be useful She generally gets outclassed by the sheer damage/self sustainability of the other tome wielders.

Miriel CAN become a Dark Mage, though.

Brady-Usually the last child you will get should you use all units equally, NO access to galeforce rather few notable skills unlike Gerome and all in all outclassed by ALOT of units

Brady having no access to Galeforce just isn't true. Seeing as his mother does have the Pegasus Knight class. Couple that fact with his class set, and you'll kinda see why he's often considered to be one of the better child units in this game. Though I will mention that child units probably wouldn't get recruited with the exception of some like definitely Lucina and maybe Morgan or Laurent if you're playing through as fast as possible.

Olivia- Suffers from the issue levelling her as dancer is an issue and thats her main niche (though on lower difficulties she is possible to level with a bit of support but generally she never becomes an outstanding unit and classic just limits WHERE she can dance even more)

I have a hard time trying to understand how it's a negative, though.

[Shadow Mir]

Maribelle- Straight to the point easilly killed,Outclassed By Lissa in most runs by the time you get her,With the previous levels invested in Lissa generally investing in Maribelle tends to be a waste of time in MOST occasions.

I disagree with this, to be blunt. It's not like Lissa can be everywhere at once...

[Czar_Yoshi]

I personally found chrom didn't really get alot of KOes on stuff early game on most runs regardless of position in the pair However I'm going to try alot of what you said and suggested on a run of lunatic at some point and check how big a difference it makes (I'm almost certain the Nowi one is gonna break the game never even noticed that you could get a dragonstone + early since Whilst I did mess around with the buying parts I never encountered it but oh well )

(I'm not sure if I've just had bad luck in general with Miriel but she never seems to really turn out all that well no matter how much I reclass and when I promote her but meh I'll give her one last chance on Lunatic)

Chrom won't be getting much himself prior to Cht.7, just helping Sumia get hers. Once you're there, though, even base Chrom on a Mountain with a decently leveled S sumia support can dodgetank and KO Wyverns all day and catch up easily there. Getting the S takes a bit of care, especially if you're postponing the Paralogues (a good thing to do if you can get away with it): after their C from Cht.3, each support takes one map of combat plus either a Barracks event, Event Tile boost or Seed of Trust. You get one Seed for free, and doing Par.1 gives you another boost, but that means you have to get at least one well placed event tile for them (I usually go for the Cht.4 one).

Miriel is a real glass cannon and you will need to treat her carefully, but she can be one of your heaviest hitters as early as Cht.5, making her well worth it early on. Later on Laurent will take her job.

Brady having no access to Galeforce just isn't true. Seeing as his mother does have the Pegasus Knight class. Couple that fact with his class set, and you'll kinda see why he's often considered to be one of the better child units in this game. Though I will mention that child units probably wouldn't get recruited with the exception of some like definitely Lucina and maybe Morgan or Laurent if you're playing through as fast as possible.

Ingame, his Paralogue is the last to be unlocked (Cht.16) and he comes as a Priest, giving him no useful skills or weapon ranks. Males also have a pretty poor selection of magical classes, so his growths are out of place on him too. So yeah, he kind of is really bad.

Maribelle can get Demoiselle without a Second Seal. That alone is reason enough to use her, even if her child is lackluster. Of course, she really will do best if you use both her and Lissa: then Lissa can promote to start doing chip damage as a Sage soon after Maribelle starts getting the lion's share of the staff exp.

[Ownagepuffs]

Like Czar_Yoshi said, he can help bolster Sumia's offense (though I do find Frederick better for that, personally),

Bullshit. I love ya Al but this is wrong. You gotta realize the importance of speed in Lunatic. Sumia has a base of 13 Spd. As high as that is, she needs Chrom's +Spd pair up to double things.

Base Chrom gives +3 Spd on pair up. Base Fred gives +1. The Archers have 11 Spd. The fighters have 10 Spd. The soldiers have 12. The C4 mages have 10 Spd as well.

Base Sumia w/Fred support has 14 Spd. With Base Chrom she has 16. If Chrom procs speed twice or they hit C support then that goes to 17 Speed which doubles everything except Myrmidons/Thieves and C4 Lucina until the C7 Barbarians who have 13 Speed which Sumia needs to proc speed only once in order to double (2 levels on average). The next non myrmidon enemies would be the C9 soldiers at 14 Spd which is a speed tonic away @ C support Chrom x Sumia and Sumia @ 14 Speed. I'm sandbagging the shit out of Sumia in this little analysis.

Saying that Frederick bolsters Sumia's offense more than Chrom does is incredibly wrong. Double attacking will always surpass the strength bonus from Fred. Double attack gives opportunities for dual strikes and another opportunity to attack in the case of a miss.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Ownagepuffs

[Irysa]

Chrom won't be getting much himself prior to Cht.7, just helping Sumia get hers. Once you're there, though, even base Chrom on a Mountain with a decently leveled S sumia support can dodgetank and KO Wyverns all day and catch up easily there. Getting the S takes a bit of care, especially if you're postponing the Paralogues (a good thing to do if you can get away with it): after their C from Cht.3, each support takes one map of combat plus either a Barracks event, Event Tile boost or Seed of Trust. You get one Seed for free, and doing Par.1 gives you another boost, but that means you have to get at least one well placed event tile for them (I usually go for the Cht.4 one).

I think honestly you neglect how capable Chrom is of tanking in Chapter 5 as well. He does need more levels to do it than BASE, sure, but he's a perfectly viable candidate to get on that fort and tank all the Wyvern reinforcements, and Sumia's res bonuses help with making it easy to pull the mages off them towards more alluring targets (such as Frederick).

[Ownagepuffs]

Oh yeah Czar I'm surprised you didn't mention C5 for Chrom. It is a bit harder to pull them but he can handle quite a bit. With 3 Spd procs and C Sumia support Chrom gets 16 spd and is in shape to double the Wyverns (and the 11 Spd Barbarians). Sumia also flies which allows for easier positioning. The +Spd and +Res from the pair up let's him handle the Dark Mages with no risk as well. (Edit: Base Chrom can double the dark mages with C Sumia lol. 8 base Spd + 4 from Sumia + 1 from C support = 13. 1 more than necessary).

Edited February 6, 2015 by Ownagepuffs

[Czar_Yoshi]

Chrom can do well in Cht.5 but I often find it a little more useful to get Sumia going solid before then. 3 Spd procs will take 4-5 levels with decent luck, and those are levels that could go to Sumia instead- someone who will otherwise have to wait to Cht.8 to get a good chance to get off the ground if not set up immediately, and unlike Cordelia I don't think she tanks Arcwind very well.

The other bit is that I was rushing Cht.5 on my most recent runthrough and often lacked either the time or safety to take a turn in which the Sumia x Chrom pair was able to afford not being flying. Additionally, Sumia with a C support on Avatar is a powerful way to go about the opening- especially if you lack both Boots and Rescue- leaving Chrom with just the Wyverns at the top. Finally, in Cht.7 the defensive terrain is clustered together and it's easy to cover your sides and keep Chrom safe- it's a lot harder in Cht.7 with large gaps in between defensive terrain that make taking forts hard and guarding them harder. Granted, I'm talking about Lunatic+ here and on vanilla he can train much more safely- Cht.5 is a very good option there.

But just for one more comparison... In Cht.5, Wyverns have 12 Skl, 10 Lck (23 base Hit) and Steel Axes (70 Hit). In Cht.7, they're actually the same (well 1 more Str). So Chrom isn't fighting any harder enemies there, though he will have a higher support with Sumia (better chances of doubling) and a pretty good chance to go up to +20 Avo from support up from just Sumia's +10 in Cht.5. Between an adjacent B support with Avatar and C with Lissa/Fred, of an A with Avatar and nothing with someone else, he can get his +20 Avo, making him a good deal tankier in Cht.7 should you wish to wait. Being able to spare units who are both bulky enough to discourage attacks, mobile enough to reach forts and have a high support with Chrom in Cht.5 is very difficult if you're pushing hard enough to take forts, so he won't get the same bonuses there.

[DeadGame]

Ricken is the biggest dweeb in the history of Fire Emblem.. also a bad unit.

[Irysa]

But just for one more comparison... In Cht.5, Wyverns have 12 Skl, 10 Lck (23 base Hit) and Steel Axes (70 Hit). In Cht.7, they're actually the same (well 1 more Str). So Chrom isn't fighting any harder enemies there, though he will have a higher support with Sumia (better chances of doubling) and a pretty good chance to go up to +20 Avo from support up from just Sumia's +10 in Cht.5. Between an adjacent B support with Avatar and C with Lissa/Fred, of an A with Avatar and nothing with someone else, he can get his +20 Avo, making him a good deal tankier in Cht.7 should you wish to wait. Being able to spare units who are both bulky enough to discourage attacks, mobile enough to reach forts and have a high support with Chrom in Cht.5 is very difficult if you're pushing hard enough to take forts, so he won't get the same bonuses there.

Hmm, I dunno. If you're still talking about Lunatic+ then I can't speak from any experience, but on Lunatic it felt quite easy to get Chrom onto the central fort in 2 turns safely if he was trained. I had Virion chip the Barb to the center, then Fred hit him again. Then Ricken/Maribelle chip the Myrmidon and Sumia flies Chrom in so he can land the killing blow on the Myrm. Rescue Ricken. Then on EP the chipped Barb should suicide on Chrom, and Virion ends up luring the Dark Mage off the fort so that Chrom can go sit on it, and then kill the Mage. Fred/Virion basically just lure Mages away, and any stray Wyverns that come down the hills can be dealt with by Miriel/Avatar/Ricken Elwind use.

I think probably the greater problem is whether or not you can successfully power through the enemies to the left, since there I was relying on str tonic Killing Edge Avatar paired with Lon'qu to deal with most of the initial crunch.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Irysa

[Czar_Yoshi]

Yeah, I'm going Lunatic+ and doing Cht.5 before Par.1 to make Avatar's reclass points happen in better spots (namely, keeping Tomes for Cht.5) and to let Maribelle in on a fairly lucrative training chapter, so I don't have Rescue, have considerably weaker units and have to contend with Hawkeye and Counter wrecking my dodgetanking and Luna+ OHKOing at base. There are also tons of dudes who come to the middle fort right away- it's the hottest spot in the map and Chrom is not suited for EP frontlining with so many dangerous skills that can maul him.

[Chloe Neo]

Another bad unit would be donnel as he's worthless when you first get him and the only thing that makes him redeemable is his aptitude skill even then he doesn't have many class pools and that really sucks.

[astrophys]

Despite Donnel's many weaknesses I'd argue that he beats out several of the Spotpass paralogue units.

After all, not only does he have far better availability than them, but he actually gets a standard range of supports, instead of having offensive capabilities that crippled (loss of +40% dual strike rate access) with anyone except the Avatar due to inabilities to support.

[Ownagepuffs]

IIRC Emm plays the role of drop in staff bot and her map is kill boss so yeah she's more useful than Donny.

Gangrel is shit. Why they would replicate the Katarina recruitment while making it harder is beyond me.

Aversa is incredibly powerful at base with an easy to abuse paralogue so she beats Donny.

Walhart Priam and Yen'fay are all tough as nails to recruit and don't contribute much so yeah maybe Donny beats them.

[eclipse]

Of the Spotpass paralogues. . .

Gangrel - He's Gaius' replacement as back-end pair-up, and I have him hit Res. Of them, he's technically the worst for having the most painful recruitment, but he's also the biggest ass, so I think it fits.

Walhart - He has Conquerer and his own shiny weapon. Pair him with Gangrel/Yen'fay for giggles.

Emm - She's a competent emergency staffbot.

Yen'fay - Reseal him into Swordmaster, and have fun with someone that gives a ridiculous amount of Speed to his pair-up partner.

Aversa - Flying Mire is bad in what dimension?

Priam - The only guy I've never, EVER used. I should fix that. But those procs look funny (or they were when I made a Kjelle who inherited them).

At least some of them come with cool stuff, and won't kill themselves on early Risen maps (non-Lunatic)?

[Shadow Mir]

Gangrel is shit. Why they would replicate the Katarina recruitment while making it harder is beyond me.

Not sure why you're complaining of them replicating the Katarina recruitment when that's not even the worst recruitment in the series [*cough*SHINON*cough*]... *

...Okay, so Shinon's re-recruitment isn't the worst in the series, but it's pretty damn close.

[PuffPuff]

Not sure why you're complaining of them replicating the Katarina recruitment when that's not even the worst recruitment in the series [*cough*SHINON*cough*]... *

...Okay, so Shinon's re-recruitment isn't the worst in the series, but it's pretty damn close.

Only recruitment harder than Katarina's is Xavier's(FE5).

[Ownagepuffs]

It's still really a really bad recruitment. Katarina's chapter was small so it was easy to recruit her by like turn 3 or something.

Gangrel? Allllll the way on the other side of the map with over 9000 promoted enemies ready to swarm you. Shinon recruitment is pretty lol but Stefan recruit is just wtf. As least Shinon recruitment is somewhat intuitive. Stefan pulled the same shenanigans for 2 games straight.

[eclipse]

With Katarina, it was possible to recruit her in a single turn. Gangrel? You need two, at minimum.

[Czar_Yoshi]

I'm pretty sure with a large enough Rescue chain, dancing and Galeforce partners (you can still switch after talking) it should be possible to recruit Gangrel on turn 1.

[Irysa]

With Katarina, it was possible to recruit her in a single turn. Gangrel? You need two, at minimum.

Blowing Again charges on recruiting Katarina is pretty <_< though. I mean seriously the map is simple enough to 2 turn as it is.

[Shadow Mir]

It's still really a really bad recruitment. Katarina's chapter was small so it was easy to recruit her by like turn 3 or something.

Gangrel? Allllll the way on the other side of the map with over 9000 promoted enemies ready to swarm you. Shinon recruitment is pretty lol but Stefan recruit is just wtf. As least Shinon recruitment is somewhat intuitive. Stefan pulled the same shenanigans for 2 games straight.

In what way? It's never hinted at in PoR - meaning that you'd either have to have played RD, which DOES tell you there's a connection between Rolf and Shinon, or used a guide to find out that Rolf needed to talk to Shinon first to figure it out (and this is all discounting the fact that Rolf is the worst character in the game, and thus unlikely to have been seeing use, which means I have to drag his worthless ass along. Great.). At least PoR DOES hint at Stefan in a base conversation, even if it doesn't out and tell you how to recruit him...

Only recruitment harder than Katarina's is Xavier's(FE5).

Errr, I was talking about how irritating it was to recruit, not how hard it was to do so - and as I haven't played Thracia (and likely never will).... At any rate, as far as annoying recruitments go, Shinon's definitely near the top.

Edited February 17, 2015 by Levant Caprice

[Ownagepuffs]

Like, maybe someone could hazard a guess that you have to talk to him with Rolf or some shit. I meant intuitive relative to Stefan. It still blows.

You've gotta park one of two specific units on a specific tile for Stefan. That's just too much.

[Shadow Mir]

Like, maybe someone could hazard a guess that you have to talk to him with Rolf or some shit. I meant intuitive relative to Stefan. It still blows.

You've gotta park one of two specific units on a specific tile for Stefan. That's just too much.

How so? Because Rolf isn't the only unit that could talk with Shinon (there are at least 5 other units that can talk to him)... And there's the part where Ike has to defeat him afterwards.

Edited February 17, 2015 by Levant Caprice