*FE4 Spoilers* Why is Areone so stupid?

[GrySun]

Title. I simply don't understand why he couldn't call for peace between Thracia and Seliph's army. Trabant even told him as he went to die that he allows him to do whatever he wants, that he could peacefully end this if he wanted to. So he had the last kings approval and was king himself. Why lead the rest of his army into death? I don't really see the reason. He didn't strike me as stubborn or stupid, but rather as a calm intelligent man. Yet why does he do this? I could understand if he did it after Trabant died, but Trabant even told him that he can do whatever he thinks is the best.

Not to mention Areone knows himself that he would die if he fights them. He doesn't even listen to Altenna for some reason. Why???

For those confused, I'm talking about Chapter 9: For Whose Sake, which is quite the fitting title.

And by the way, is there anywhere a translation to what is said in the prologue cutscene, the one that appears if you don't press anything when the game starts up? That's untranslated in all trasnlations I've seen, but it features Eldigan and some other characters and other text, so I'm curious. Not to mention that you see part of the cutscene when shamans use the "Hel" book.

[Baldrick]

He said he would have if it wasn't for what Trabant said to him when he gave him the Gungnir. Possibly he felt he should follow in his father's footsteps. In any case, it shows he didn't know his father as well as he thought he did.

[Delphi Sage]

It's called "Pride". Fiction likes using it as a flaw for sympathetic antagonists.

Besides, the story was messy as-is when it said Trabant "represented the sole ally of Grandbell" when he's been directly antagonizing Freege's occupation of the Manster District. Having him give a Loputo Bishop a base of operations right on the capital's doorstep just makes things even more ridiculous.

And Trabant's goal was the unification and reparation of Manster and Thracia. He has no reason to involve himself as an ally to Grandbell. Blume's forces were the weakest faction in the penisula after Chapter 7, possessing only Conote and a skeleton crew at Manster, while Celice's faction had purged Isaac of all Grandbellian occupiers, routed the Loputos at Yied Shrine (their secondary base of operations), subjugated Darna's mercenary army and border guard, captured the border fortress of Melgen, and had their troops mobilized at both Lenster and Alster.

With that kind of strength at their doorstep, and with theirs and Thracia's military remaining untouched even after Conote's subjugation, Trabant should've called for an alliance with Celice and Leaf. Thracia has the entire continent's supply of Dragon Knights exclusively at their command, as well as two Holy Weapons. Celice had divine right as ruler of the continent and lineage to the Tyrfing. His army consisted of the heirs to Agustria, Isaac and Jungby, along with their respective Holy Weapons. Silesia's heir, Sety, was already in Manster, making that seven. And even if no one knew about it, Yuria made an eighth lineage, and even without, no one else on the continent could use the Narga tome. Sure, Trabant caused the Yied Massacre, but he still raised Altenna without any actual malicious intent.

There was no goddamn reason for Trabant and Coruta to stage a hostile takeover of a neutral Manster Castle and kill anyone in their way other than to contrive a reason to have to fight against Dragon Knights. At least Michalis had Dolhr at his doorstep, and their army possessed every single type of unit on the continent, along with exclusive access to the Manaketes.

[Acacia Sgt]

I wonder if there was also a factor of repercussion fear. Like, one should only take note on the abuse of warping the game does:

Manfroy kidnapping Dierdre, Blume and the mage trio fleeing from western Manster, Julius arriving to pick up Areone and leaving after the latter is defeated, Manfroy kidnapping Julia, Julius and Ishtar going to Miletos to attack the Liberation Army for what seems to be for fun and then retreating the same way, etc.

Perhaps Trabant knew better than to think allying with Seliph only to instead be paid a surprise visit and then killed or something for his "questioned loyalties".

Sure, it's just a theory... but to me it kinda makes sense.

[Sartek]

With that kind of strength at their doorstep, and with theirs and Thracia's military remaining untouched even after Conote's subjugation, Trabant should've called for an alliance with Celice and Leaf. Thracia has the entire continent's supply of Dragon Knights exclusively at their command, as well as two Holy Weapons. Celice had divine right as ruler of the continent and lineage to the Tyrfing. His army consisted of the heirs to Agustria, Isaac and Jungby, along with their respective Holy Weapons. Silesia's heir, Sety, was already in Manster, making that seven. And even if no one knew about it, Yuria made an eighth lineage, and even without, no one else on the continent could use the Narga tome. Sure, Trabant caused the Yied Massacre, but he still raised Altenna without any actual malicious intent.

There was no goddamn reason for Trabant and Coruta to stage a hostile takeover of a neutral Manster Castle and kill anyone in their way other than to contrive a reason to have to fight against Dragon Knights. At least Michalis had Dolhr at his doorstep, and their army possessed every single type of unit on the continent, along with exclusive access to the Manaketes.

You need to factor the fact that if it wasn't for Julia, Seliph's revolt was lost at the moment it started. You can have every crusaders on the same side, without Naga's power it's hopeless to even try to take on Julius and therefore, the empire. In fact he has no reason to ally with Seliph since, should he fail (and for what was known at the time, he was sure to do), all his allies would face retaliation.

Edited March 15, 2015 by Sartek

[Katie]

Hey, at least Areone can be talked into joining your side(unfortunately not as playable though). He's got nothing on Eldigan's stupidity.

[Mekkah]

I think Julia is irrelevant to this conversation, as nobody seems to acknowledge her existence or lineage until later in the story, when Levin magically finds out (as he does throughout gen 2).

The key to Areone's rationale is in here, I think:

Trabant:
“I’ve had enough, Areone. It’s me they’re after anyway. Do as you see fit after I’m gone, okay?”

Areone:
“Are you suggesting I call for a truce!? You know I could never do that!”

Trabant:
“Like I said, do as you see fit. I only ask that you see an end to the people’s suffering. Farewell, Areone!”

Apparently Areone does not think he can stop the people's suffering if he sides with Celice. Somewhat understandable if you think about the terror caused by the Lopt sect. I wish they had been clearer about this, though.

[Sartek]

I think Julia is irrelevant to this conversation, as nobody seems to acknowledge her existence or lineage until later in the story, when Levin magically finds out (as he does throughout gen 2).

Not that irrelevant.

My point was that Trabant can't side with Seliph because the latter has no chance against the empire without the power of Narga (which means Julia), and like you said no one knew he had it before the very end.

[RJWalker]

Julia isn't absolutely necessary. The game never says that is impossible to defeat Julius without Naga. Julius only says that he doesn't fear Seliph because he only has Baldur's blood. Seems more like it was pointing out his arrogance than anything.

[Delphi Sage]

The key to Areone's rationale is in here, I think:

*snip*

Apparently Areone does not think he can stop the people's suffering if he sides with Celice. Somewhat understandable if you think about the terror caused by the Lopt sect. I wish they had been clearer about this, though.

I'd doubt that. By the time this conversation has taken place, Celice and co. have already killed Coruta's squadrons, slain Thracia's entire border guard, and were deployed at Mease. Corpul was already kidnapped from Hannibal as coercion for Kapathogia to fight; Disler was having the northern villages sacked; Judah was in Grutia awaiting Musar's reinforcements; and Altenna's squadron was just killed off, along with her Thracian sympathies. The opportunity for civility was long gone by then.

I wonder if there was also a factor of repercussion fear. Like, one should only take note on the abuse of warping the game does:

Manfroy kidnapping Dierdre, Blume and the mage trio fleeing from western Manster, Julius arriving to pick up Areone and leaving after the latter is defeated, Manfroy kidnapping Julia, Julius and Ishtar going to Miletos to attack the Liberation Army for what seems to be for fun and then retreating the same way, etc.

Perhaps Trabant knew better than to think allying with Seliph only to instead be paid a surprise visit and then killed or something for his "questioned loyalties".

Sure, it's just a theory... but to me it kinda makes sense.

If that was possible, Ishtar and Blume would've warped into Mease or Thracia and had Trabant killed long ago.

[Acacia Sgt]

If that was possible, Ishtar and Blume would've warped into Mease or Thracia and had Trabant killed long ago.

Trying to find an explanation other than "storytelling practice where the antagonists don't use the means to simply win because then they'd be little to no story", if I were to follow on the Warp factor, I'd say that it is a political matter. Killing the leader of the only country they didn't had to military annex would not be a good idea. And it's also the matter of when. Before the rise of the Liberation Army? Very bad PR move and then having to deal with an angry Thraccia. After? Now they'd be totally convinced to join the LA.

But apart on that, I don't think they even had a reason or need to kill Trabant in the first place. Could be wrong, though. But again, not a good idea.

[BrightBow]

Julia isn't absolutely necessary. The game never says that is impossible to defeat Julius without Naga. Julius only says that he doesn't fear Seliph because he only has Baldur's blood. Seems more like it was pointing out his arrogance than anything.

At least Levin thinks that they definitely need her.

Levin: “Yet Loputousu’s clan wields the most diabolic power of the entire tribe. King Narga passed his own blood onto the leader of the liberation army, Bishop Heim. That was Narga’s only hope to rival the Loputian power."

Celice: “Couldn’t any of the other tribesmen take on Loputousu?"

Levin: “Doesn’t seem likely. Even with all their power combined, they’d still need Narga’s.

...

...

Levin: “This explains her disappearance now, doesn’t it… But, we’ve got to find her. Because we don’t stand a chance against Yurius without her!”

Edited March 15, 2015 by BrightBow

[MartyTheDemonSlayer]

Hel > Narga

[Jotari]

Definitely pride. It's easy for us as outside observers to look on and say they should have allied, but from their perspective it was an impossibility. Not only out of universe but in universe they were the villains. Despised by everyone for their mercenary like ways and responsible for the death of Leif's parents. Trabant hoped he could pile the hatred onto him but Areone wouldn't have wanted that. It was Trabants desire to see Thracia prosper that caused him to act so villainous, I imagine that is something Areone stands by and wouldn't want to see his father shamed solely. If he fights then it's a conflict between two nations. If he brokers peace then his father goes down in history as a trouble brewing monster. I also get the impression that Areone was somewhat suicidal at this point. He told Altenna to leave but he clearly didn't want her to go. From his perspective, he leaving and joining an invading army would have been proof she never loved him and given how obsessed he is with her I think it would be in character for him to simply say feck it. I'm done with this life but Thracia won't kneel to its enemies. When he does end up joining he has put away his stubbornness and fought not as a mercenary for Seliph but as one who loves Altenna.

[Rapier]

With that kind of strength at their doorstep, and with theirs and Thracia's military remaining untouched even after Conote's subjugation, Trabant should've called for an alliance with Celice and Leaf.

No, because Lenster would be given to Leif instead of Thracia's rightful ruler (Trabant or Areone), which was Trabant's objective all along.

I suppose Areone just wished to continue his father's fight. Conquering Lenster was all that mattered.

[Sartek]

Julia isn't absolutely necessary. The game never says that is impossible to defeat Julius without Naga. Julius only says that he doesn't fear Seliph because he only has Baldur's blood. Seems more like it was pointing out his arrogance than anything.

Azmur:

“The day you brought her in to the Royal Palace to announce your wedding intentions, I tell you… I could have swore my eyes were playing tricks on me! I don’t know. Call it a family’s intuition, but somehow I knew. And sure enough under her circlet were the markings of Narga. Lord Alvis, you understand what this all means, don’t you? According to the Book of Narga only descendants of Heim, like myself, can give off that kind of vibration. And Narga’s power is the only one capable of standing up to the Dark Lord Loputousu.”

[GrySun]

Interesting responses, but you all forget that Areone knew he can't win and he would die if he fought them. He also wasn't terribly sad about his fathers death so he shouldn't have given his life for nothing. Trabant even told him to do as he please, which was the best way for him to say "I want you to try with your own methods as I don't believe in my own ones anymore". So, he basically knew he'd lose the war and he still went to die. Being scared of the empire isn't a thing either, as he'll die even sooner against Seliph. There simply is no good justification for his actions. Maybe he wanted to commit sudoku? Either way I'm very disappointed in him.

[Zasplach]

Eh, but if you play through to the end, he does change course when given the chance. He would have had to know that Lord Julius has been rescuing those with holy weapons willing to fight against Celice, everyone must have heard about Ishtar. And if you let Altenna talk to him in the end, he will become neutral to you.