Florete Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 Yeah, I couldn't remember if he did or not. In fact, it may even be a variable of enemy stats whether he does or not. I feel like I've both seen him have it and seen him not have it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentacotus Posted March 24, 2015 Author Share Posted March 24, 2015 I think I speak for everyone here when I say this but 1-2% crits for the enemy are bullshit. Like seriously whenever you have it you never get it but they have it hide ya wife hide ya kids cuz you bout to get wrecked! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chococoke Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 I believe the monk does have displayed crit on Nino. I also seem to remember that Nino can tank a crit from the bastard at full health. Plus she starts with an elixer so that's chill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionordeQuester Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 Alright then, here's Chapters 11-20! Interlude 1: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22181 Interlude 2: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22182 Chapter 11: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22183 Chapter 12: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22184 Chapter 13: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22185 Chapter 13x: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22186 Chapter 14: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22187 Chapter 15: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22188 Chapter 16: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22189 Chapter 17: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22190 Chapter 17x: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22191 Chapter 18: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22192 Chapter 19: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22193 Chapter 19x: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22194 Chapter 19xx: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22195 Chapter 20: http://lpix.org/sslptest/index.php?id=22196 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I believe the monk does have displayed crit on Nino. I also seem to remember that Nino can tank a crit from the bastard at full health. Plus she starts with an elixer so that's chill yeah she can take on the monk as long as he doesn't crit and if nino's at full health. otherwise she will die to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paper Jam Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I seem to remember Nino taking very little damage from the monk. I know she has WTA against him, in any case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I seem to remember Nino taking very little damage from the monk. I know she has WTA against him, in any case. so i won't repeat myself, watch the OP's video, or skip around it until he gets to nino vs the monk, it'll show ya the exact HHM stuff for that encounter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jotari Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Huh. I didn't no Ursula moves. I got her to break Bolting on my units so when she moves she has to get right up close to attack, hence me not noticing she'd done so. Even though I sent a Pegasus down there to kill her in my victorious run. I had to retreat when I suddenly got overwhelmed by an unexpected amount of units. She must have been just outside of range when the chapter ended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feplus Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 Thanks to Quester for those LP links, it's an entertaining read for sure. Despite the monk displaying a crit chance, Nino will never die if a player is prepared: 1. Even with a critical hit, the monk cannot do 19 damage. 2. Nino does not counter-attack. 3. Base Pent can reach Nino with physic by turn two. So that's not an issue. Jaffar is certainly an issue, though. Has anyone ever calculated the odds of him dying in, say, 2-3 turns? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 (edited) 2. Nino does not counter-attack.Yes, she does, and how does this even matter? Oh, wait, you mean she doesn't attack on other phase. Edited April 1, 2015 by Red Fox of Fire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feplus Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Oh wow, I just watched the linked video in the opening post. I had assumed it was a fun bit of rage at how tough BBD can be on HHM, but the author genuinely believes saving Zephiel and Nino is up to luck (not to mention how much he underestimates Jaffar's survival odds). There are even people in the comments wondering if they should pass on Fire Emblem 7 because they fear this "luck-based" map. This is my biggest pet peeve when it comes to strategy games: blockheads like whoisthisgit spreading misinformation about map design because they aren't smart enough to come up with reliable approaches. I've seen this sort of toxic mentality in regards to Advance Wars, Fire Emblem, Tactics Ogre, Valkyria Chronicles, and even the newly released STEAM. Don't blame the game because you're bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexMH3 Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 FionordeQuester, I really liked reading that LP you linked to. TBH, I saved them as pdfs and loaded them onto my kindle. It's a great way to re-experience FE after all these years. Could you link to the rest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Oh wow, I just watched the linked video in the opening post. I had assumed it was a fun bit of rage at how tough BBD can be on HHM, but the author genuinely believes saving Zephiel and Nino is up to luck (not to mention how much he underestimates Jaffar's survival odds). There are even people in the comments wondering if they should pass on Fire Emblem 7 because they fear this "luck-based" map. This is my biggest pet peeve when it comes to strategy games: blockheads like whoisthisgit spreading misinformation about map design because they aren't smart enough to come up with reliable approaches. I've seen this sort of toxic mentality in regards to Advance Wars, Fire Emblem, Tactics Ogre, Valkyria Chronicles, and even the newly released STEAM. Don't blame the game because you're bad. we live in an era of DSP mentally people unfortunately. "wooooooooow i was pushing buttons and nothing happened, bugged game mechanics" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Raven Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 (edited) Oh wow, I just watched the linked video in the opening post. I had assumed it was a fun bit of rage at how tough BBD can be on HHM, but the author genuinely believes saving Zephiel and Nino is up to luck (not to mention how much he underestimates Jaffar's survival odds). There are even people in the comments wondering if they should pass on Fire Emblem 7 because they fear this "luck-based" map. This is my biggest pet peeve when it comes to strategy games: blockheads like whoisthisgit spreading misinformation about map design because they aren't smart enough to come up with reliable approaches. I've seen this sort of toxic mentality in regards to Advance Wars, Fire Emblem, Tactics Ogre, Valkyria Chronicles, and even the newly released STEAM. Don't blame the game because you're bad. I mean the thing people complain about is the fact that Jaffar, under the right circumstances, will do some stupid shit and move into a bunch of enemies and die. There are Swordreavers and Swordslayers on that map, you know, and a non trivial amount of them. Edited May 3, 2015 by Lord Raven Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arvilino Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 Personally I found Living Legend more of a pain on HHM because Pent can end up dying to the Wyvern Riders by turn 2(perhaps turn 1 if you're unlucky I think three Wyvern Riders are in range of him). If I recall the Wyverns have 22-23 attack with Steel Lances and Pent has 33 HP and 11 Defense, it's unlikely to happen but it's a bit annoying when it does, the stats are set exactly for Pent to have a chance of death before the player can intervene(one point of defnese for Pent or 1-2 less attack for the Wyvern's would have made all the difference). On one ranked playthrough I had a situation where he kept geting hit once on turn 1(so he doesn't use the Elixer) then twice on turn 2(due to the reinforcements). In BBD the another scenario is that as well as Jaffar being able to be beaten quickly if you're unlucky, alternatively if Jaffar doesn't get hit enough to retreat with the elixer he can end up charging into the bottom of the map where all the reinforcements appear. In that video where he dies due to getting hit by two Swordreaver Fighters and then the Mage, if he evades enough attacks to remain above 50% HP he'll go after the Archer and end up facing all the reinforcements for the rest of the chapter, it's ingrained in my mind because I had a string of attempts where he kept doing that. What I think they should have done was put them in situations where even the worst case scenario can't result in them dying until a turn or two after a player could reach them at 8 squares per turn(pehaps less for pent). They shouldn't be able to randomly die before you reach them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feplus Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 (edited) @Lord Raven: Sure, but a) the odds of Jaffar dying are really low with proper planning, b) this only applies to HHM anyway, and c) the map itself doesn't require luck, only an optional goal. The linked video is super misleading. (edit 2: apparently the optional goal doesn't require (much) luck either) @arvilino: The simpler solution would be to get rid of fixed RNG. That way, prepared players would only have to restart once out of every 500 attempts, or whatever the odds are of Pent / Jaffar dying. edit - Actually, can't the player technically reach Pent by turn 2? If that's the case then there isn't any RNG involved anyway. Edited May 8, 2015 by feplus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arvilino Posted May 4, 2015 Share Posted May 4, 2015 edit - Actually, can't the player technically reach Pent by turn 2? If that's the case then there isn't any RNG involved anyway. Nope Pent is too far away in HHM and typically moves even further away during his turns. He's in a different spot and you could reach in on turn 2 in Eliwood mode but he isn't in danger of dying in two turns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feplus Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Looking at this map to refresh my memory, it appears Pent can be reached from his starting location with a promoted flier plus Ninian by turn two. If Pent gets hit once and goes north (which is IIRC the only situation where he can die), you can intercept one of the southern wyverns and keep Pent alive. Granted, this requires advanced preparation and a well-trained flier to be reliable, but it can certainly be done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Raven Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 @Lord Raven: Sure, but a) the odds of Jaffar dying are really low with proper planning, b) this only applies to HHM anyway, and c) the map itself doesn't require good fortune, only an optional goal. The linked video is super misleading.Getting all of the chapters is a pretty common goal, but it's not "really low", and it's still a pain because he does do weird things. It's not like the person is wrong at all, it's a non-trivial percent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feplus Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Suppose it depends on how we define "non-trivial." Is 1% non-trivial? Half a percent? Quarter of a percent? I'm surprised no one's calculated these odds already. Wouldn't be too hard to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Raven Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Swordreaver gives +30 to hit against Jaffar's swords which gives each Swordreaver fighter a 95 base hit, not accounting for skill (with skill it would be more like 115-120 or so). Jaffar's base evade is around 60, so if he gets hit by two Swordreavers or maybe even an Archer or Mage or two (bunch of 30% displayed hit rates) then I can easily see the rate at which he does stupid shit get to be around 20-25% at least, but I only did rough mental calcs (sort of rounding off 30% displayed hit to zero and 60% displayed hit to 50). He only needs to be hit with one Swordreaver and dodge a bunch of 30% displayed hits (all of which is quite likely to happen) to hop into a pool of enemies and get his ass killed, can't be lower than a 15% chance, but I didn't do the actual calculations because I don't remember offhand exactly which enemies are there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jotari Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 So one in six times you play the match your going to fail without being able to influence it? Hmm. I get the feeling it's lower than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chococoke Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 I'd argue that's a decent rough estimate. The odds of Jaffar dodging only 1 out of the 2 swordreavers are pretty good given the ~60 displayed hit for each (he's usually facing two in one EP if I'm recalling correctly) If he dodges the rest of the attacks (he can probably still tank one mage or archer) he'll be above healing HP and dive headlong into a crowd of enemies without healing. The two Swordreavers are what do the most damage to Jaffar on the initial EP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dondon151 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 jaffar most often dies because he dives into a mob of 2-range enemies when his HP is reduced but above the healing threshold. a single swordreaver hit brings him down to 22 HP, and then he jumps in and gets killed from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feplus Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 He only needs to be hit with one Swordreaver and dodge a bunch of 30% displayed hits (all of which is quite likely to happen) to hop into a pool of enemies and get his ass killed, can't be lower than a 15% chance, but I didn't do the actual calculations because I don't remember offhand exactly which enemies are there. Interesting guess. According to this analysis, Jaffar does actually have a 15% chance of dying, but only if you try to save him in four turns. If you try to save him in three turns, his odds of dying are .03%. That's a lot, lot lower than I was expecting. Has anyone else run the numbers to confirm these odds? The game's been out for twelve years, I'm sure someone somewhere has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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