Baldrick Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 It looks like the kind of submission where you need to work out the strategy through trial and error. Perhaps show the most interesting of the failed attempts, and then a successful run at the end? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyJoe1990 Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) @Numbers: I'm gonna keep it brief and say no. It's not. Fire Emblem is not a puzzle game, and it's not designed to be. Edited January 21, 2016 by MarkyJoe1990 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) puzzles are shit! SHIT! but seriously, i wouldn't give this hack a single award. Edited January 21, 2016 by HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyJoe1990 Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) Erm... Let's not be so harsh, a'ight? Remember that regardless of the quality of some of these submissions, people spent various amounts of time to make submissions for this contest, for free, basically. Here's the thing. I don't hate puzzles. I think puzzles can be fun. The problem is that Fire Emblem is not designed to be puzzle like. Whereas a puzzle usually has one solution, with all the pieces and elements laid out in front of you, Fire Emblem has things like RNG that add uncertainty to even the most logical moves, which makes it extremely frustrating when a submission is designed with one solution yet retains the RNG, and expects it to cooperate. Another thing is that Fire Emblem is deliberately designed to accommodate for things going horribly wrong such as losing units, failing to get important items, etc.. That's distinctly very un-puzzle like, and it's also something that makes FE enjoyable for me. You can still win if you don't play optimally, but you can also improve and become more efficient if you want as well. This allows the player to express themselves and develop their own play style rather than simply putting the pieces together on a pre-fabricated canvas. Edited January 21, 2016 by MarkyJoe1990 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomSwordmaster Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 oh....then you might not like my submission....though it is RNGless so I think that would make it easier and more bearable for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 oh....then you might not like my submission....though it is RNGless so I think that would make it easier and more bearable for you. i think i know which one is yours and i think it should be fine. meanwhile this hack throws out killer axes that you can't do much about until the first chest that has an iron rune, but you gotta fight at least one of these guys before that. also stepping on a random title that doesn't look different from the rest is awful no matter the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyJoe1990 Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) I won't defend the random tile triggering Legault to show up, since that is a design I legitimately dislike, but you can avoid the killer axe pirate by attacking him with javelins safely behind the prison door. After that, you can immediately get the iron rune, so the rest of the killer axe pirates aren't an issue. Edited January 21, 2016 by MarkyJoe1990 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avraxas Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Personally, I really liked the submission. It had clever twists with the budgeting for items (money is important), the javelin against the killer axe pirate, and saving your allies from their cells to fight the Money Man. I laughed out loud at the Game Over swords My only concerns, at least based on what you showed us from the first video, are that some of the ideas don't come intuitively or without a warning/clue. For example, I enjoy the idea of stepping on a certain tile to trigger an event, but I felt the idea would have been a better fit if it had been in the tile by the wall blocking your path to the armory. Naturally the player would be curious about the wall and the armory, as they are some of the few tiles that are unique to that room, so it is far more likely that the player would step there (and lo and behind, Marc did). My other concern, the lack of warnings/clues, seems to be an unfortunately common one in Ragefest submissions (I'm afraid I struggled with it myself, too). While the Game Over swords were funny in my opinion, that's also extremely punishing for a simple joke, unless you have a system like Savestates to use before it. The idea for it to cause a Game Over isn't innately bad, but the fact that there is no warning ahead of time so you can save is the main issue. That said, this submission seems really well thought out, though regrettably Marc doesn't like puzzles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyJoe1990 Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) Ehhh. I feel I should point out, the "Got a game over" chests as well as most of the other ideas in the submission have been done already by my RF3 submission, The Corruption Of Roy, and I doubt that's by accident. It's flattering, but I'm not sure it earns the creator cleverness points. But yeah, having the legault trigger event be right above the armory makes a lot more sense, especially since that's where Legault actually spawns when you break the wall. I think I also would have liked it if stepping close to Canas triggered a conversation between them planning to escape. It'd be a nice attention to detail, as well as a great opportunity for hints. Thinking about it, I think puzzles CAN work in FE, but the only submission so far that I feel does it right is SuperSonic1212's submission, Lyn's Revenge. I felt genuine satisfaction from beating that one, and I think part of it is due to the submission being a lot more intuitive. I was also able to figure it out entirely on my own, though, I DID get some cheerleading by SS1212. Now, that said... When I asked Pwntagonist for help, he said I needed to buy another door key. It seems obvious now that it's been mentioned, so maybe the problem is more that I'm commentating as I play, which makes it hard for me to play well... Edited January 21, 2016 by MarkyJoe1990 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyJoe1990 Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) Anyway, surprise. Here's a second Ragefest video. Here's 37 minutes of GhastStation and I chattin' it up in this submission. And here's his youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/GhastStation I recommend his FE plot summary videos. Edited January 21, 2016 by MarkyJoe1990 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrNight48 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 before i check out part 2, I meant to say I actually have been thinking about ways you can warn the player about possible traps without it being immersion breaking. One idea I had was using the fallen nils body with a message to the player if they chose to talk to it with "this body shows signs of being impaled". The player would then know to be on guard but could still be manipulated into the trap trying to avoid the obvious looking one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avraxas Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 -Marc and Ghast talking about buffing archer class with extra range + base stats- Or you can make them drop a lot of single-digit crits. Marc's Precious is definitely getting something for its sadism, but I'm not sure what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrNight48 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Well it's definitely pissing marc off. I know it's cheap but it's still pretty funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyJoe1990 Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 Trust me, if I can get the audio syncing to work on the next part, the rage is even more glorious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondworld Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) So what's up with that thief? Spawns in an area surrounded by enemies where it's only safe to not move anywhere, and then surprise reinforcements that punish the player for keeping the thief safe? I assume the submission expects you to rush down there in time once you get inside, but there isn't any reason to assume that the thief is actually in danger until suddenly bolting sage. Oh yeah and wow the enemy greens. Also kinda bullshit, but at least that was amusing. Edited January 21, 2016 by DavidSW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
47948201 Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) It's still not the most polished game ever, but the more of it I see, the more I like. It has an unhealthy dose of unfair pegasus dung, plus an actual nice amount of legitimate design. The back-and-forth structure to some of the encounters is a little tedious on the "forth" phase, but like... EDIT: finally a tl;dr version of my rambling [10:31:05 午後] (｡･ ω<)ゞ☆: I get uneasy when I see marc raging because it feels like it means he doesn't like it [10:31:11 午後] (｡･ ω<)ゞ☆: but I think this game is doing a good job Edited January 21, 2016 by 47948201 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Mister Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) I haven't finished watching it yet, but oh my god I bursted out laughing at Horace's "green pen" suggestion. That's now my current favourite RFIV submission joke. EDIT: So you're saying you want thieves to be like PoR's Sothe. Edited January 21, 2016 by Mr. Mister Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyJoe1990 Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 @Mr. Mister: Sothe joins too late and he's too hard to train. =( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 WELL THIS IS CAUSING RAGE ALRIGHT. but is it the good kind? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyJoe1990 Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) Well. Yes. People are laughing, Except for me, but I'll finish the submission, forget my anger, rewatch the video, and join everyone in their laughter. ... In the mean time, ASDFGHJKL!!!!!!!!!!!! Edited January 21, 2016 by MarkyJoe1990 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMoniker Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 This is pretty funny to watch, though I can see your criticisms. A three-way battle seems like an interesting concept, but the way this hack did it is the way where you pretty much have to fight both sides regardless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pwntagonist Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 The part where the supposed "NPCs" attacked Marc... I was laughing for a solid 10 minutes at his reaction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nintales Posted January 22, 2016 Share Posted January 22, 2016 (edited) Hmm... Regarding puzzle submissions, I think they should be allowed only with "precise" hints. The main issue of Money Man's Last Stand being it to be a try and die. Sure, the prison is small, but it's just weird to have to try every spot with not a single hit whatsoever. Though, the thing about the critical axes can be trivialized if I'm correct. Kill the pirate with Javelins, while Legault stays on the armory and buys door keys. Then you recruit Dart. After that, kill the Pirate in front of Canas' cell with him and recruit Canas by carrying him over with Dart. And then you should just try to kill the money man with Canas. But I'm not sure this is the solution. Imo you're not supposed to fight the Money Man and just have to get Dart to check all the chests and get Nellie. Don't forget the Status said there's no reason to kill Money Man. (unless he's required to get the chest, but it doesn't seem like that) As for Marc's Precious... I just don't know what to say. On the one hand, it's really funny. Bunny's introduction, the Comm Knight's death quote, the glasses, Horace, the surprise passages... But is it really ragey? There's no real trap. With better strategy, I think you can just outsmart the hack. At least that's what it seems to me. The only "get wrecked surprise part" was the village. I find it a little bit... Maybe lacking of cutscenes. I don't know, some passages seem too much gameplay based -and a little bit boring due to bait and switch aspect-. I don't know, there could have been cutscenes for the Town Folk's introduction, etcetera. I might be too harsh though. But overall it's a good submission. Edited January 22, 2016 by Nintales Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyJoe1990 Posted January 22, 2016 Author Share Posted January 22, 2016 My main problem with some of these submissions is that they just take too long to complete. Marc's Precious felt like it should have been beatable within a single day, but now I've done, like, four recording sessions because it's such a time sink. That might also be due to the difficulty. I've noticed a pattern with myself. I don't want to stop playing a submission until it's done, but then the rage accumulates and I play worse. Then I decide to take a break, but then I feel unsatisfied because I'm making it take longer for me to get videos up... Lately, people have been telling me I'm absurdly hard on myself, and... I agree, but those feelings just don't go away in a single night either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyJoe1990 Posted January 22, 2016 Author Share Posted January 22, 2016 (edited) Heeeey, guess what I spent a couple hours doing? Syncing up the bloody audio for 12 minutes of footage! Seriously, the next two files of footage I recorded for Marc's precious got desynced beyond imagination because I had bad settings when I recorded it with VirtualDub. I wanted to scrap it. But oh man... this footage... I feel like I'm holding in my two hands some amazing glowy substance uncovered from caverns far below earth, and the camera is looking at my illuminated, amazed face right now. 7 more minutes worth of footage left to fix, and then I can finally edit and unleash this upon the world. Though, I worry if the rage will be too much for some people to handle. Only time will tell... Edited January 22, 2016 by MarkyJoe1990 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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