What is it that you dislike about Fire Emblem?

[Sasori]

My biggest problem with Fire Emblem from a gameplay perspective is just how much better horses are in comparison to other classes. The cavalier line tends to have above avarage baes with no weakness that actually matters, better weapon triangle control in tier 1 and sometimes tier two as well, better movement and their caps are either very good or still good enough for them to stay at the top. I believe Fe10 is the only game I played where they weren't amazing and even then they where still good.

My solution would be an anti cavalier class like Hoplites or something.

Early game archers could also stand to get some extra bases. I know the theory behind it. Archers can safely chip so others can finish the enemy of without facing a counter, but it usually isn't all that important since enemies are either weak, the chip damage itself just isn't all that good or mages just do the things archers do, but better. The games either need to be harder like fe12 or archers need some better stats to compensate them not having an enemy phase.

[Espinosa]

Everything. Worst series ever.

Seriously though, I wish more games had the rescue feature and canto re-move and gave incentive to use foot units.

[Chloe Neo]

1) Weapon Durability

2) Emotionless Supports (FE13 is an example of this so is FE10)

3) Roy

4) Mini-Bosses

[PuffPuff]

-It's gone back to handheld only. We need some more games with better graphics. SMTx FE will change that!

-Huge maps (FE4)

-You can't double attack/crit (make it useable) with Rizaia/Nosferatu anymore which it has been the king of weaponry for a long time. (FE14)

-Luna got nerfed(FE8) which it was the best weapon in the game in FE7.

-Can't use Second Seals anymore(FE14). Makes it twice of a pain now to get access to some other classes further making getting some skill restricted without the skill shop.

-You can't rescue units in the older games. Before FE5.

-FE14 turned into a loveseat harem.

-The series took a dive for awhile and didn't get FE12. Which it was much better than 11.

-Shadow Dragon was the cure to dealing with perma death (The gaiden requirements), but it still scared alot of people which is why it sold like shit in Europe and has been a success in America and Japan.

-Lazed supports(FE10)

-To me...Casual and Phoenix. Because they really aren't a punishment at all which is why I almost always continue to play on classic. Casual only for the hardest difficulty though cuz I'm not that good. -.-

Edited September 19, 2015 by Oboro

[CrimeanRoyalKnight]

It's all mostly nitpicking, but:

- I dislike the support system in the GBA FEs, it's completely against getting a good rank.

- I dislike how archers are shit most of the time.

- I dislike how the series is never balanced enough. There are always some game breaking exploits somewhere. Is it impossible to get a good middle ground?

- I dislike how Axe Fighters can't promote in 3.

- I like Kaga, but I dislike how long it took him to like Axe Fighters.

- I dislike how Axes are shit most of the time.

- I dislike how Hard mode in RD removes the enemy range. It's dumb.

- I dislike how Ike/Elincia can never happen, not even a tragic ending or something.

- I dislike how Leen and Ares don't have an conversation in the Epilogue, but Nanna and Ares do. Incestuous fucks.

- I'm not fond of True Hit. I prefer the Hit Rates in the earlier games.

If I had to point out how many things I actually dislike in modern FE, I'd stray too much from the point of the thread, so I'll avoid that.

[sylveonzoroark]

The main thing I dislike is how Snipers are worthless most of the time.

Another thing is not much postgame.

[PuffPuff]

I can't believe that I made an account just to reply to like, two threads. Hahaha.

*I agree with everyone that said that the series became too much fanservice happy in recent games. It reminds me of my extreme Weaaboo days that I had until 2011-2012, and I would REALLY like to forget about that. (I'm probably going to unironically enjoy the skinship thing though. The thought of treating your human friends the same way you treat your supernatural pets from an alternative universe is just too funny.)

*Talking about fanservice, I really hope that making Original Character Do Not Steal of the three most popular characters from the previous game isn't going to be a thing. It just felt really lazy, you know?

*Please don't add the marriage system again (Unless it's a Genealogy remake). the marriage system in Fates actually sounds even lazier then the clone characters. How do you even manage to do that? Hahaha.

*Also, Please please PLEASE don't put plot points and entire stories behind DLCs. There's no reason why Invisible Kingdom couldn't be an extra story after beating the main story of the version you choose and there's no reason why Invisible History couldn't be Gaiden chapters / Paralogues / Whatever they call it this time. Not everyone have a visa to buy them, you know.

*This is probably just me, but I really wish the Avatar was optional. I usually really like self inserts but in Fire Emblem they just feel really... forced, You know? All the characters agree with your Avatar's actions, they all love your Avatar (And probably fall in love with them) and if they don't love the Avatar they're probably evil. The Avatar also can't make bad decisions because they're supposed to be you and it's just.. like... no. I didn't read Fates spoilers in a long time but I think Black Kingdom and White Kingdom suffered the most from this. If Black Kingdom was about Xander, White Kingdom about Ryoma and only Invisible Kingdom being about the Avatar maybe it could've been better.

*The grinding in Gaiden is the only thing that stops me from unironically loving it. It's a good thing that grinding in later games that have world maps isn't as annoying. Hahaha.

Anyway, right now that's really about it. Sorry for writing too much. (Especially about the Avatar)

Thankfully, you can get it free with the trilogy pack.

No, the number of sales Awakening needed to 'save' the series was a number that almost every FE game did indeed pass.

Irrelevant. IS themselves stated that they would abandon the series if Awakening didn't make that sales number.

That statement sort of proves the series never really needed to be saved.

It was never in danger.

People just need to learn to know a good deal when they see it! I just don't want the series to go back to emulation/import only. Cuz, emulating sucks.

Best answer in the topic so far:


And my answer:

The sheer amount of whining I see about the games, especially those that haven't been released (whether it's "not released at all" or "not released locally" is another matter). Seriously, if a game is that bad/offensive, WHY POST ON A BOARD DEDICATED TO SAID GAME?

The other issue I have is how other fans are being treated. Most of you on SF are pretty good about treating the new guys right, so thanks for that. However, I think that badgering people for the following:

- starting with Awakening
- playing on Casual instead of Classic
- not playing on anything harder than the easiest mode
- grinding
- other trivial things that are literally personal preference regarding how the game is played

need to cut it out. All it does is make the FE fanbase look whiny and immature.

Only one that brings more fans into the series saving it!

Uh, forgive me here, but I can't seem to understand why anyone has a problem with marriage... It's been around since the series started, since Marth canonically married Caeda and stuff. And reasons like only because of a lack of same-sex pairings? Fates just gave you guys some. And I don't even think there are a lot of homosexual people in real life. I've certainly met only a few. So it's perfectly realistic for the majority of the characters to be heterosexual. Also, a same-sex marriage can present conflict if there's a second generation, particularly involving children that have to inherit something from a parent for plot-related reasons.

I agree with all this, and would like to add badgering for not playing the Japan-only games. I've been a victim of this because I don't want to emulate. It's not that I'm uninterested in them (except for FE6), I just want them to be localized in some way first.

The supreme court allows it!

So Nintendo shouldn't edit these out of Fates.

...And why that the series will be gone if it doesn't sell well again. Especially after bringing the overseas audience to the series.

Edited September 19, 2015 by Oboro

[solrocknroll]

Not really anything. I'm not whiny or picky like I could be. I love Kozaki's art for instance, and I think that the series is fine. I would like some voice acting back in the supports, since apparently Fates' has none? what even

[Sasori]

-It's gone back to handheld only. We need some more games with better graphics. SMTx FE will change that!

-Huge maps (FE4)

-You can't double attack/crit (make it useable) with Rizaia/Nosferatu anymore which it has been the king of weaponry for a long time. (FE14)

-Luna got nerfed(FE8) which it was the best weapon in the game in FE7.

-Can't use Second Seals anymore(FE14). Makes it twice of a pain now to get access to some other classes further making getting some skill restricted without the skill shop.

-You can't rescue units in the older games. Before FE5.

-FE14 turned into a loveseat harem.

-The series took a dive for awhile and didn't get FE12. Which it was much better than 11.

-Shadow Dragon was the cure to dealing with perma death (The gaiden requirements), but it still scared alot of people which is why it sold like shit in Europe and has been a success in America and Japan.

-Lazed supports(FE10)

-To me...Casual and Phoenix. Because they really aren't a punishment at all which is why I almost always continue to play on classic. Casual only for the hardest difficulty though cuz I'm not that good. -.-

I have no doubt shadow dragon sold badly in Europe, but I think that Vgchartz picture still paints a picture that doesn't quite hold up. I've visited it a while ago for Fire emblem related sales and Europe figures where missing entire years of sales data. I believe it only counted two years and those did't include its release year.

[PuffPuff]

I have no doubt shadow dragon sold badly in Europe, but I think that Vgchartz picture still paints a picture that doesn't quite hold up. I've visited it a while ago for Fire emblem related sales and Europe figures where missing entire years of sales data. I believe it only counted two years and those did't include its release year.

Well...

It could be that they didn't look much into the European sales lately.

----

Only other thing I don't like is the amie that is open after every encounter/chapter completion which doesn't make what the series should be. It's irritating and annoying to do it all the time. -.-

Is why I only do this option rarely. It only benefits the avatar anyhow.

[YoshiYogurt]

Nothing I dislike to much about the franchise, it's pretty amazing so far...

Shadow Dragon would have been a perfect remake without those stupid gaiden chapters....also FE12 not being translated due to declining sales....

I do think there is a bigger split between awakening and fates, then between awakening and the rest of the games before it. Awakening isn't THAT fanservicey. Fates just has this touching shit i don't understand at all and forget about until some one brings it up again....

[Kuroki]

The section of the fandom that acts all superior because they're the "old fans" and hate anyone who has ever played awakening. Who also hate on anyone who plays on any form of easy mode, and who only care about the hardest modes, and bragging rights. who claim that awakening is the bane of the series.

I love fire emblem for the story, I like to play on the easiest setting due to that ( I think phoenix mode may be a bit too easy though for my personal tastes) , I actually enjoy the new air brought to the fandom. Honestly, I used to be terrified by most of the fandom and I felt like I was extremely unwelcome and that the other fans would hate me if I were to speak up. The DA Fe community were the less scary ones.

With awakening there seems to be a lot more people who enjoy the games for what they are, and enjoying them for the story and enjoy it just because it can be fun. They kind of people who all post funny, silly pictures of the series because the series can be too serious for its own good. I like to laugh and have fun after I play a game because they can be very beautiful yet depressing (in an amazing way) and the other fans know how to lighten the mood and have fun.

I ADORE that and it seems like other old fans like me are coming out now because there are actually friendly faces around.....I can't tell you how scared I was to join this site.

Yes, there's quite a bit of fan-service now, but I don't honestly care much at all. I don't think it takes away from anything because most of it is optional anyway.

Yeah, they're always going to be those weirdos in a fandom but I hardly ever really encounter them, maybe it's because I stick to Tumblr and adoptables sites, ( i don't go on DA often anymore) who knows. But...... I finally feel comfortable within the fandom and I'm terrified to talk to most fans still especially on more "core" sites like this.

The thing I hate the most is the fandom, the hating "older fan" side of it. I honestly get extremely anxious even when posting here still.

edit: I mean no offense to anyone but alot of you make it seem like people get waaaayyyyy too into the fanservice in a kind of creepy way, which yes I imagine some people would but whatever floats anyone's boat, I guess. Just don't go announcing it to the world, I personally am very "no public displays of affection" other than maybe a (short) hug (unless it's obvious comforting) or holding hands and what not. So I like to stay in the parts of the internet that are the same X"D unless it's like a ship or something but even then I keep it relatively innocent

Edited September 21, 2015 by Kuroki

[eclipse]

I'm not going to quote this, it's too long.

I can't ban people solely for disliking Casual/Easy/fanservice/waifus and husbandos/Awakening/Kamui's hair. However, I think it's completely unfair to lump everyone on SF as something to be feared. I think most of the people here are neutral (at worst) to a newcomer on SF. It's that person's actions that'll make a bigger impact - so someone who asks for help about a certain Awakening pairing is a lot more likely to get a friendly response than someone who tries to subtly insult a part of the fandom for liking one of Phoenix/Casual/Classic/Easy/Normal/Hard/Lunatic (I really wish I was joking about the latter, but it's happened before).

I can have fun while being serious (see: drafts), and I know I'm not the only one like this. Don't ask me to draw, because I can't get the proportions of stick figures right.

[Tamanoir]

Nomad being so much better than Archers is stupid. And then it's even worse on Promotion...

Not counting than the units in these class are generally better.

-Shadow Dragon was the cure to dealing with perma death (The gaiden requirements), but it still scared alot of people which is why it sold like shit in Europe and has been a success in America and Japan.

It sold like shit also because there wasn't enough copy available...

I wanted to buy it, but they hadn't any copy available.

And then I lost interrest towards it...

I'm not selling it wouldn't have sold badly otherwise, but it's not entirely the fault of EU fans...

[Sentacotus]

Only a few nitpicks

-Support system in GBA games puts you in unecessarily bad positions and you can never tell your progress in them.

-Not getting FE12 overseas

-Almost nonexistant support convos in FE10

-Archers seem to struggle in the series as a whole except maybe FE13 Lunatic where you practically need them

[Jedi]

The main thing I dislike is how Snipers are worthless most of the time.

Snipers are actually good most of the time.

It's archers that are usually worthless.

Like seriously the only prepromote Sniper I can think of that can even be called "bad" would be Jeorge in Shadow Dragon, but he still has a good rank.

Edited September 21, 2015 by Jedi

[The DanMan]

Shadow Dragon would have been a perfect remake without those stupid gaiden chapters....also FE12 not being translated due to declining sales....

Objection.

Shadow Dragon has sold better than both PoR and RD combined, running off of the figure from above.

PoR and RD both sold around 180,000; they were borderline commercial failures, and likely are what caused IS to play it safe and make the Archanea remakes to cash in on homeland nostalgia.

The main reason NME didn't get localized is pretty obvious; its release date. A niche series getting a release in the last months of the DS's life stood little chance of getting localized.

[BrightBow]

Not only was FE12 a niche game released at a bad time but as an RPG it would also been very costly to localize. Either way, NoA didn't seem to be too happy to localize RPGs at the time. After all, around the same time as FE12, Xenoblade was also released and NoA didn't localize that one either, or the other RPGs covered by Project Rainfall for that matter. Sure, they eventually made their way, but only after the well known noise by Project Rainfall.

Edited September 21, 2015 by BrightBow

[Jave]

For the love of Naga, people, stop using VGChartz. THE NUMBERS ARE ALL MADE UP.

[SSbardock84]

I feel like the gaps of the release dates for the games are too long and it always takes a while for the U.S release to come out after the Japanese. In the games I wish that you could save your characters and weapons like in Awakening and Sacred Stones. Also wish all of the games had bonus maps too. There aren't too many things I dislike about Fire Emblem games tbh. But one more thing is obvious and everyone probably agrees is having no feet in Awakening.

[Jave]

Since I was one of the first to bring up the fanbase, I think I should explain my position on this.

First, let me make clear that despite everything I may mention in this post, I think SF is a great site filled with awesome people. It's definitely one of the best places to talk about FE, and whenever there's good discussion, it's REALLY good. I'm definitely grateful for this community and the best people here do represent the best part of it.

Of course, every fandom has its bad apples, and in FE, there's always been people who look down on newer members. Years ago on GameFAQs, there was a very vocal group of people who considered everything after FE7 to not be "true" FE games, and anyone who played and liked those was not a true FE fan. I never noticed that here on SF (thankfully), and I'm glad it never carried over.

However, SOMETHING happened when FE13 came along, something that really changed the fandom in a drastic way. It's like a lot of that behavior at GameFAQs started to creep into other places in the fanbase, even here, and a of of things changed for the worst. Among the changes I've noticed, well...

New Players feeling unwelcome: This one I don't feel is too bad as others in the thread have commented, specially on SF, but it's definitely something that exists, mostly on sites like GameFAQs and Reddit. I'm not exactly sure what triggers this behavior on veteran members, but it's probably connected to my next bullet points.

Bitterness: There definitely seems to be an overall more bitter tone from certain people when discussing the newer games. FE13 pretty much put FE on the map, and now the general perception of the series is that its main focus is the whole "Waifu" stuff and "Otaku pandering" (I hate all of these terms, by the way, specially because a lot of people use them as insults), and because of that, we may never get a more traditional FE again.

Guilt Tripping: This is what I feel has changed for the worst. Comments like "How can you like this waifu crap" or "How can you pair these two characters? It's pedophilia!" have increased ten-fold, and it's very uncomfortable to read them being a person who simply likes pairing characters to complete the Support Library. Yes, we all have pairings we don't like or are badly written, but I feel a lot of the stuff people say in regards to this is completely uncalled for. I remember how Tharja fans had it rough for the longest time, since a lot of discussions involving her eventually delved into "How can you like her? She abuses her daughter!" territory. Eventually the topic died down, but it sucked that legit Tharja fans had to cope with that stuff. It really didn't feel fair.

Can anyone please think of the children: I really, REALLY don't know how this fandom became so prudish. I'm sorry if that word offends anyone, but it's true. I don't think I ever saw this prior to FE13 (not even on GameFAQs) but it's become such a hot topic now to the point of ridiculousness. Back in the day I know people felt uncomfortable with stuff like the incest and mass children murdering in the Jugdral games. That was understandable and I can accept it, since not everyone has the same level of tolerance. But what do we have now? People who actively want the game CENSORED (actual words) for Western release, with whole convos, whole cutscenes and whole features taken out from the game, for no real reason other than "I don't like this so please take it out so no one can look at it". Is this something that even happens in other fandoms? I mean, this is the kind of stuff I'd expect from Tumblr/Twitter SJWs, not from the fanbase itself.

There's one more point, but I won't bring it up here because it might open a huge can of worms and really derail the thread, so I'll save it for the case that topic ever gets its own thread.

And one last thing. Please don't ask me for proof or numbers or whatever. This is not a matter of stats, but a matter of perception. I have literally ZERO reason to make this stuff up, and if I mention it is because there's a behavior that exists that I've happened to notice. Apologies if this offended anyone, but it's simply how I feel about the whole subject.

TL;DR

No Taguels or Manaketes were harmed during the making of this post.

[Kiseki]

You know, I was just going to say something about how it's because of the series veterans that the now-big majority of the fanbase doesn't even go onto dedicated FE forums and other places on the Internet, but that pretty much sums it up.

[CrimeanRoyalKnight]

I would like to see these asshole veterans everyone talks about.

If FE fans hated casual discussion so much we would have so many casual threads ("What's your favorite XYZ" and such).

EDIT: Also shouldn't this sort of discussion about the fandom get its own thread? It's not like it's the games' fault people act in certain ways.

Edited September 22, 2015 by CrimeanRoyalKnight

[shadowofchaos]

Awakening was my first game

I know that I may not be a true Fire Emblem fan

Stop.

Right there. That's what grinds my gears.

Right there is what I hate about Fire Emblem. Moreso the fanbase's tendencies.

I agree that the fanservice and the direction FE is taking is different, but a "true" Fire Emblem fan is nothing more than loving the game or the series.

Saying any different in that regard is just an attempt to say "your tastes are crap" in a less offensive fashion.

Otaku pandering or not, love Awakening and If more than the older games, love the older games more than Awakening and If, love the older SNES/NES renditions more than the GBA, 3DS, or Tellius...

You are a true Fire Emblem fan.

[The Geek]

I would like to see these asshole veterans everyone talks about.

If FE fans hated casual discussion so much we would have so many casual threads ("What's your favorite XYZ" and such).

EDIT: Also shouldn't this sort of discussion about the fandom get its own thread? It's not like it's the games' fault people act in certain ways.

I had a lovely discussion yesterday with a fan artist who didn't believe I myself was a series veteran simply because I liked Awakening. Of course, her perception of the older games seemed to have a pretty damn heavy veil of nostalgia around them.