Shrouded In Myth Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 (edited) Thank you to Microwaveit from reddit for the summary. Posted with permission from here: https://www.reddit.com/r/fireemblem/comments/3wu9x3/on_facerubbing_in_fates_interview_from_the/ All of the following is a summary of a portion of an interview with Maeda, Higuchi, and Kusakihara in which they discuss the whole “My Room” touching thing in Fates. I believe Maeda is the director, Higuchi the producer, and Kusakihara the art director of Fates. Maeda has been with the series since Blinding Blade, Higuchi since Genealogy, and Kusakihara since Awakening (or maybe earlier?). Anyway here we go, summary: The section starts off asking Higuchi about what he thinks about being able to touch units in Fates, since he was apparently against there being any kiss images in Awakening, and Higuchi is like, “Uhh…what’s the best place to start?” Apparently Maeda wanted to incorporate Live2D (a technology where 2D images move and appear somewhat 3D) when characters talk and have conversations. Higuchi himself thought that Live2D was an interesting technology, and held promise for the future, so he agreed, but not before warning, “don’t do anything weird!” According to Kusakihara, Yotaka from Nintendo was originally the one that suggested using the technology, and he wanted to use it for characters in images when they are standing. Kusakihara thought that while Live2D was really impressive, after an hour or more people would probably get used to it so it would lose its thrill. So then Maeda suggested using Live2D as a replacement for the confession scenes from Awakening. Maeda thought that he wanted to use Live2D to show scenes that would deepen the bonds and connectedness (*can also be read as “mutual touching,” but seeing as the others didn’t get this impression immediately, I’m not sure he meant it that way off the bat, haha) between characters. Higuchi thought this seemed like a good idea, and imagined being able to tap the screen to have a character look a certain way. However, he never imagined you’d be able to touch them! Kusakihara agreed with Higuchi, and thought that it would be something used between characters after marriage. Kusakihara originally thought of them just as confession scenes, thinking that after going through normal support conversations, it would be very climactic to suddenly have the character move and face you when delivering their confession. However, Maeda thought that it was a bit of a waste to use the technology so sparingly, and thought it would be better if they allowed players to touch characters regularly (this sounds way worse in English then it does in the interview, I promise). Maeda said he thought that it would be something people would really enjoy, and so rather than having to wait until marriage, it would be better if players could experience it from earlier on in the game. Then, he thought about the proper timing, which ended up being once per map. When they talked about it with Nintendo, Nintendo said they were over doing it, so they toned it down. Apparently, the version that Nintendo rejected was more extreme – you could touch a character anywhere, from their head to their stomach, and the touch icon was a hand. They thought the hand thing was kind of unpleasant, so they changed it to a touch pen (along with limiting the area players could touch). According to Maeda, there were two debugging teams that had totally different opinions on the matter. Team A found the whole thing kind of unpleasant, and were the ones that limited the touching area and switched the stylus from a hand. Team B was the opposite, and wanted to be able to touch the characters in more places and have the icon be a hand again. (In the end, I guess team A won out). Higuchi talks about how he periodically checked in to see how the Live2D situation was developing and was often surprised. Maeda took his dissatisfaction into account though, and the whole team reached a common ground. This is how Live2D skinship came to be as it is. Maeda adds that many people thought that the rating was higher due to all the My Room activity, but in reality one of the main reasons was Camilla’s entry cut scene. Notes: Remember, this is a summary, so I’m putting everything into my own words. Since the whole skinship thing is controversial, I thought it might be interesting to see what the developers had to say about it. What do you guys think? (Also if anyone has questions about what I wrote feel free to ask!) EDIT: I also want to mention that the interview is not as tense as my summary may make it sound. There is a lot of laughter going on. Edited December 19, 2015 by Shrouded In Myth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The DanMan Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 (edited) We already got a (more abbreviated) summary of this (that mentioned that higher ups at Nintendo vetoed Team A); I fear this thread will rapidly go down-hill for obvious reasons. Higuchi, your reverse psychology backfired. Bigtime. It would've been amazing if, instead of freaking face touching, we got the live2D assets used for support conversations. *sigh* Maybe next time... . Edited December 19, 2015 by The DanMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 I'm glad Team A won. The mode would be 10 times more awkward if they went with what Team B was gunning for. Full body groping, yikes. I think live2D could be good if it was used in the appropriate places such as S supported individuals (as far as implied touching goes). I do like seeing characters animated and up close, however. Also; inb4 things get nasty and a thread lock. We already got a (more abbreviated) summary of this (that mentioned that higher ups at Nintendo vetoed Team A); I fear this thread will rapidly go down-hill for obvious reasons. Higuchi, your reverse psychology backfired. Bigtime. It would've been amazing if, instead of freaking face touching, we got the live2D assets used for support conversations. *sigh* Maybe next time... . Personally, I find the 2D stuff can be a little distracting and over animated. Characters are constantly moving and looking at things so a conversation between two people would look strange in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 I'm glad Team A won. The mode would be 10 times more awkward if they went with what Team B was gunning for. Full body groping, yikes. I think live2D could be good if it was used in the appropriate places such as S supported individuals (as far as implied touching goes). I do like seeing characters animated and up close, however. Also; inb4 things get nasty and a thread lock. Personally, I find the 2D stuff can be a little distracting and over animated. Characters are constantly moving and looking at things so a conversation between two people would look strange in my opinion. Even i have to agree that Team A had a better idea here. Team B's goal was ummm...thats yeahhhhh. Higuchi's idea about it being a post-marriage thing was more what i was banking on when i originally heard the idea. I like the Live2D stuff because of the detail. Makes me hope that one day, we'll get a fully animated FE. (pipe-dream i know) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Live2D could be used for some really cool support stuff down the line it sounds like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Even i have to agree that Team A had a better idea here. Team B's goal was ummm...thats yeahhhhh. Higuchi's idea about it being a post-marriage thing was more what i was banking on when i originally heard the idea. I like the Live2D stuff because of the detail. Makes me hope that one day, we'll get a fully animated FE. (pipe-dream i know) I like the Accessory shop because you can look at the character models up close. I'm not sure about all the applications and capabilities of Live2D but I'd like it if they had an expanded feature to see the character models and animations. Maybe they could have a animation/sound room using the Live2D assets? Being more connected to the characters is a good thing, I just wish they'd make it appropriate for the characters (ie you don't get to touch people's faces just because you're the protagonist). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Laufeyson Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Live2D could be used for some really cool support stuff down the line it sounds like. Yeah like cuz the potential is totally there. I like the Accessory shop because you can look at the character models up close. I'm not sure about all the applications and capabilities of Live2D but I'd like it if they had an expanded feature to see the character models and animations. Maybe they could have a animation/sound room using the Live2D assets? Being more connected to the characters is a good thing, I just wish they'd make it appropriate for the characters (ie you don't get to touch people's faces just because you're the protagonist). Yeah the accessory shop model thing is helping cosplayers all over the world get a good look at the characters. A sound room would have been really cool. What does the sound room they have now look like? Like Awakening's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shrouded In Myth Posted December 19, 2015 Author Share Posted December 19, 2015 Even i have to agree that Team A had a better idea here. Team B's goal was ummm...thats yeahhhhh. On r/fireemblem #BlameTeamB is becoming a meme. Bad level-up? Blame Team B. Bad roster choice for Smash? Blame Team B. It's hilarious. Anyways I agree with most of you this should have been used for support conversations or maybe even normal dialogue. I don't like IS rationalization of why they didn't because apparently it will lose some of the thrill. They treat this technology as a novelty instead of another tool at their disposal. I feel sorry for Higuchi :( He told the team not to do anything weird then they proceeded to do everything weird. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsuky Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 (edited) So the thought about the potential usage of the Live2D technology pretty much went: character conversations -> confession scenes only -> spouse only -> every character (as your spouse, if you have one, looks on)... Wow, great job for moving away from the first and best idea. And I liked the Awakening confession scenes more anyway; the current ones just seem so tacky with the ugly bright blue and hot pink hearts flying in the background, and the characters fidgeting non-stop and blushing so much that they look like they are drunk XD Thank you, Nintendo and Team A, for toning it down from the original disturbing mess that we were gonna get Edited December 19, 2015 by Tsuky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 They seriously originally wanted players to be able to touch the characters ANYWHERE? Is IS made up of perverts or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Sage Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 The Live2D models aren't well animated anyway, the characters tend to either wobble around like they're drunk or they move like robots. It's really jarring. It's really sad that there are apparently enough sexually deviant creeps at IS that Higuchi actually felt the need to say "don't be weird." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solrocknroll Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Skinship is weird, but I'd rather it use the jarring Live2D models for an awful optional thing than for support conversations you have to see. I think they worked hard on the models, but it has a lot to go before being good for supports. I also prefer confessional stills but whatever. They already removed my wonderful voice clips during supports. Not having characters sigh and stuff makes Fates's supports seem... too silent. As strange as that sounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyainou Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Live2D models for supports would take away a lot of stylistic personality from FE. In the end, to me at least, all anime CGs and anything Live2D-esque look the same. Plus, what we've got going on now is a lot more visually attractive. The Live2D models are only good for skinship. And I agree, I hate the fact that they're used for confessions, too. There's going to be nothing satisfying nor interesting about getting every S-support without it. It took away personality and.. intimacy? I guess? I found it kind of satisfying and generally adorable to have CGs of characters cuddling up to you as they confess, or kissing your hand, etc. etc. Now they just kind of. bounce around? mk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SalShich10N Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) They seriously originally wanted players to be able to touch the characters ANYWHERE? Is IS made up of perverts or something? You can touch Pokemon anywhere in the Amie, my Lopunny particularly loves being touched on her inner thighs and all. Pokemon is marketed as a children's game. Edited December 21, 2015 by SalShich10N Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 You can touch Pokemon anywhere in the Amie, my Lopunny particularly loves being touched on her inner thighs and all. Pokemon is marketed as a children's game. Pokemon are animals. Pokemon are not people. Seriously, guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Pokemon are animals. Pokemon are not people. Seriously, guys. some people have trouble telling the difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter Nightblood Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Pokemon are animals. Pokemon are not people. Seriously, guys. And this makes it less morally questionable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maybe Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 And this makes it less morally questionable?yesthey designed this minigame for 700 something creatures, they can't individually make it so you can't rub the naughty parts of every pokemon that has something resembling naughty parts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 And this makes it less morally questionable? Pokemon are essentially pets. It's okay to pet pets. Unsolicited petting of people is wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) And this makes it less morally questionable? the next thing i expect to be posted is "is it less morally questionable to marry my dog then it is to marry my human girlfriend?" Pokemon are essentially pets. It's okay to pet pets. Unsolicited petting of people is wrong. as i said before, some people just can't tell the difference between a human and a animal, everything is piece of meat to them that only exists to satisfy them in their minds. Edited December 21, 2015 by HF Makalov Fanboy Kai Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Time the Crestfallen Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) as i said before, some people just can't tell the difference between a human and a animal, everything is piece of meat to them that only exists to satisfy them in their minds. I hate to be 'that werido', but I'm pretty sure that Rule 34 proves that he isn't entirely wrong. There is someone out there who is just as...'excited' at the thought of petting a Gardevoir/Lopunny as others would be at petting a Fates character. Search your feelings, you know it to be true... Edited December 21, 2015 by Phillius Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medeus Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 This is getting into territory that we probably should avoid, so lets go back to the interview and not touch that subject. Honestly, I'm glad Team A won, the mode is already awkward enough as is, I'd hate to have those features that Team B wanted present in the game as it would've made the mode more disturbing. They seriously originally wanted players to be able to touch the characters ANYWHERE? Is IS made up of perverts or something? A few developers make cow jokes with Camilla in the "Making of FE" Book, I honestly could believe that some of their staff is made up of perverts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SalShich10N Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 yes they designed this minigame for 700 something creatures, they can't individually make it so you can't rub the naughty parts of every pokemon that has something resembling naughty parts Well the MyRoom facerubbing is a minigame for around 50 cartoonish people in which they make it so you can't rub their naughty parts. Think what you will, Amie is about as lewd as face-rubbing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerosabers Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Well the MyRoom facerubbing is a minigame for around 50 cartoonish people in which they make it so you can't rub their naughty parts. Think what you will, Amie is about as lewd as face-rubbing Human's naughty bits are all near the same spot. Pokemon's are not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solrocknroll Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Yeah, IS seems to be made of creepy weirdos as of late. I'm just glad Team A won. I'm also glad to see these people can hopefully function in society but ah well. maybe that's why paper mario and advance wars are dead, no perversion factor. i love Pushmo so please help IS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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