Sorcerers vs. Witches

[Roflolxp54]

The two tome-locked classes in the game -- which one do you prefer and why? The Witch class can be accessed (legally) as soon as next week via Anna's Gift 1 free DLC (assuming that you choose the Witch's Mark over the Sighting Lens)!

Sorcerer max stats:

LV.: 20

HP: 50

STR: 25

MAG: 35
SKL: 26
SPD: 29
LCK: 26

DEF: 29
RES: 33

MOV: 6 (8 via Boots)

Weapon Rank: Tomes/Scrolls (S)

Class skills: Heartseeker, Malefic Aura, Vengeance, Bowbreaker

Witch max stats:

LV.: 40

HP: 50

STR: 25

MAG: 36

SKL: 27

SPD: 34

LCK: 28

DEF: 26

RES: 29

MOV: 6 (8 via Boots)

Weapon Rank: Tomes/Scrolls (S)

Class skills: Shadowgift, Witch's Brew, Warp, Toxic Brew

Females-only class

Edited April 8, 2016 by Roflolxp54

[eclipse]

Do they have the same HP? Because if they do, then Witch has more total stats for whatever reason.

[Time the Crestfallen]

I like Sorcerer's better, but Witch's are the better class gameplay wise.

[Roflolxp54]

Do they have the same HP? Because if they do, then Witch has more total stats for whatever reason.

Forgot to put that in. Yes, Witch and Sorcerer classes both have same max HP caps.

[twice]

I voted for both because I like them so much!

[Mark the Tactician]

Ehh.... I dunno.

Something about the Sorcerer's skill set seems more practical to me...

[Roflolxp54]

Ehh.... I dunno.

Something about the Sorcerer's skill set seems more practical to me...

In terms of practicality, at least Sorcerer skills can be bought from the Unit Logbook or from other players' castle teams. Witch skills are DLC and therefore cannot be bought at all.

[RisinDevil]

I prefer Witch but it's sucks having to have Shadowgift take a slot when I want to use Nosferatu.

[Tsunami922]

Witches. They have higher Magic and Speed, and I like their design more.

[eclipse]

Heartseeker - usable on anything that's not using bows.

Malefic Aura - great for magical classes, useless on everything else

Vengeance - I guess if you're a Wary Fighter!General? Or if you think you'll survive long enough?

Bowbreaker - the ultimate taunt for fliers

VERSUS

Shadowgift - maybe if you want to run Nosferatu on an Onmyoji or something like that?

Witch's Brew - great in-game utility, kinda dicey elsewhere

Warp - I have PLANS for this move. PLANS that may involve Galeforce, Replicate, and general abuse.

Toxic Brew - goes decently well with a debuffer build I have in mind

Sorcerer skills are more battle-practical, while Witch's skills are more for shenanigans/setup. I guess it depends on what you want out of your unit!

[JSND Alter Dragon Boner]

I mean its a DLC class vs Generic class

Every DLC class is OP

Especially Lodestar

[Shadow Mir]

Vengeance - I guess if you're a Wary Fighter!General? Or if you think you'll survive long enough?

Two words: Hexing Rod. It's the ultimate middle finger to Vengeance.

As for the question, Witch.

Edited April 8, 2016 by Levant Mir Celestia

[lucisferre]

Witch! For reasons...

[FluffyWarlock]

Dunno. I know that I probably won't use either one due to the Yato, but, I'd say Sorcerer. Witch is squishy.

[Vyse]

Witch, mainly for aesthetic reasons.

Warp is cool too though

[デッド]

Witch, mostly for it's Warp ablity

[Sire]

Also throwing in the "hidden bonuses"

Sorcerer: Hit +5, Crt +10, CEv +5

Witch: Crt +10, Avo +10

* * * * *

As for the poll itself, I like both as they serve different purposes. Sorcerers are more of a mage tank, having more DEF/RES than Witches, but the Witch have more SPD which makes them a little more suitable for offense. Also, Witches are gender locked, so there is also that to take into consideration.

As for skills, Warp seems to be the best one out of them all. Otherwise, the Sorcerer has a better set of overall skills than the Witch.

Shadowgift is, currently, a bit pointless on the Witch. If you want a mage tank, go Sorcerer. Alternatively, you can also carry over Shadowgift to another class

Witch's Brew is a proc based item finder, which does little for combat.

Warp, as already stated, is amazing. Offense, Defense, Azura, it matters not.

Toxic Brew has its uses, provided the Witch doesn't just outright kills her target.)

Heartseeker may be underrated, but dropping an adjacent enemy's Avoid by 20 is pretty good (especially when dealing with enemies on Forts or Throne tiles). Even if the Sorcerer (or Dark Mage) is too weak, the effect still applies so that another unit can finish them off.

Malefic Aura is another underrated skill, why add +2 MAG when you can drop enemies within 2 range with "- 2 Resistance"?

Vengeance still has its uses for risky builds, and its an offensive proc skill to boot.

Bow Breaker depends on the situation and is best used on a different class, but it can work on Sorcerers as well.

Again, both have their uses, so I like both. Their designs are also aesthetically pleasing as well.

[Ngtunganh]

Well,they are mage ,not tank so I prefer witch for higher offesive stat

[joshcja]

Postgame:

Certain blow +40, forge +20, passive hit +5 Keeping 100% hitrates through lucky 7 tomebreaker WTD: priceless. Sorc bases, +3 base def, +4 tome def, +6 rallied def. Surviving mele 2range and bows by litteraly 1 hp on Elise!Ophelia, priceless.

Vs

1 fucking Mag/4 speed, man, one more damage to ohko the same things sorc ohko's, and 4 more speed to still not double wary fighters.

Stick with sorc.

In game:

lolsorcdomination#Dlcworsethanthebaseclass

Witch is good for warp and aesthetics. The class itself is pretty ass.

Edit: (Ok witch nina is pretty damn good)

Edited April 8, 2016 by joshcja

[Emblem Blade]

Funny how it is debating on two magical glass cannons. Both are completely viable, no class beats the rest if you use the right set-up. If you like risks, just ram a very tanky unit with both Counter and Magic Counter equipped right into either the Sorcerer or Witch and they die possibly with that action if your tanks survives (the tank doesn't even need their attack to connect as the enemy will essentially OHKO themselves back with 200% recoil damage). If you want to take safer measures against either, run Tomebreaker. Silence basically shuts down both of those classes in one-shot once it hits them as they can't do anything but possibly 'Warp' to safety. Stat-wise, both are balanced and are equally potent. Skill-wise, you can be unpredictable or just as predictable as before. Unless you give your magical glass cannon a lot of defense tanks to statues and rallies or even Pavise to help screw up melee attackers, a full round things such as Astra-Crit (all the hits don't even need to be a critical-hits) or Aether-Crit will kill them both.

[joshcja]

Funny how it is debating on two magical glass cannons. Both are completely viable, no class beats the rest if you use the right set-up. If you like risks, just ram a very tanky unit with both Counter and Magic Counter equipped right into either the Sorcerer or Witch and they die possibly with that action if your tanks survives (the tank doesn't even need their attack to connect as the enemy will essentially OHKO themselves back with 200% recoil damage). If you want to take safer measures against either, run Tomebreaker. Silence basically shuts down both of those classes in one-shot once it hits them as they can't do anything but possibly 'Warp' to safety. Stat-wise, both are balanced and are equally potent. Skill-wise, you can be unpredictable or just as predictable as before. Unless you give your magical glass cannon a lot of defense tanks to statues and rallies or even Pavise to help screw up melee attackers, a full round things such as Astra-Crit (all the hits don't even need to be a critical-hits) or Aether-Crit will kill them both.

Counter only works at 1-1 range. Tomes work at 1-2 range. You are not surviving a warp dual strike at highforge. (Lol paired units in postgame, the fuck is this, awakening?)

+70/65 > -50

Pavise is bows/tomes, Aegis is mele. (Edit: this is backwards as fuck, mistakes were made)

How the fuck are you silencing a warpkiller, or forcing to to chose a target, at all. Their effective range is "the map, all of it"

You have hit a new record for "most things wrong in one post"

Edited April 8, 2016 by joshcja

[Based Goomy]

I like Witch more aesthetically but Sorcerers are more for me gameplay wise due to gender neutrality. I'd still use a witch given I'd get a Witch's Mark. But more likely I'd get the Sighting Lens to give MU the Ballista class.

[Emblem Blade]

Counter only works at 1-1 range. Tomes work at 1-2 range. You are not surviving a warp dual strike at highforge. (Lol paired units in postgame, the fuck is this, awakening?)

+70/65 > -50

Pavise is bows/tomes, Aegis is mele.

How the fuck are you silencing a warpkiller, or forcing to to chose a target, at all. Their effective range is "the map, all of it"

You have hit a new record for "most things wrong in one post"

*'Suicide rush' into the target as in you are adjacent to the enemy where most melee weapons aka swords, clubs and lances have their effective fighting range. You must think that I meant fight the opponent 2-3 spaces away from the enemy which is not what I was talking about.

You're not going to Dual Strike with a warped unit unless you have ended one of your Warp users turns before using a second Warp unit right next to them or already have a unit next to the enemy. Lol: Miracle, Miraculous Save, Dragon Ward, all of those can save users from Dual Strikes and +7 weapons, it's possible to survive as long as you have the right skills equipped and have enough HP and defensive power to tank.

Pavise is anything not named magic, bow or dragonstone, Aegis is the opposite.

On your turn you can send in a Falcon Knight paired up with someone who can use staves/rods have some Rescue Staves on them and start chain Rescuing until you are within reasonable range. Then once you are close, have your own Stave/Rod user with Warp equipped warp right next to you and Silence those two Tome/Scroll only users. It's that simple. Unless you're taking things far too on the extreme end with only having it your own way then have it so. Counter Magic works against adjacent and non-adjacent enemies who hit the user with a magical attack. When stacked with Counter on a unit who can easily tank a powerful magical attack, that unit can rush into that Witch/Sorcerer at 1-1 range and possibly OHKO the enemy with 200% recoil damage (100% damage sent back due to Counter and another 100% damage sent back due to Counter Magic).

Edited April 8, 2016 by Emblem Blade

[joshcja]

*'Suicide rush' into the target as in you are adjacent to the enemy where most melee weapons aka swords, clubs and lances have their effective fighting range. You must think that I meant fight the opponent 2-3 spaces away from the enemy which is not what I was talking about.

Countermagic When the enemy triggers the battle and inflicts magical damage, the enemy receives the same damage

Counter When an adjacent enemy triggers the battle and inflicts damage, the enemy receives the same damage

Are you literally ending phase by a robe, and not clicking that unforged brave weapon to flat orko? Are you actualy burning 2-3 skill slots, a deplotment slot, and most of that units HP, to remove one (badly built unforged) mage on a coinflip?

(oh, aegis is mag here, huh,win some you lose some, apologies for that bit)

As for the silence tactics posted, what, no, why, how, send help, you are putting your entire army in a tight cluster at +11 gale lead range to silence one thing.

Edited April 8, 2016 by joshcja

[Roflolxp54]

From what I'm seeing here, it sounds like somebody didn't pick up on Counter being nerfed in Fates (kamikaze tactics no longer work as effectively as in Awakening since Counter, and similarly Countermagic, only work during the phase opposite of the unit using Counter(magic)).

Fun tidbit:

Nyx!Forrest!Kana (+MAG and -DEF, -STR, -SPD, or -SKL) = +10 MAG mod

Nyx!Rhajat!Kana (+MAG and -DEF, -STR, -SPD, or -SKL) = +9 MAG mod

They can have the exact same Magic stat if male Kana goes Sorcerer and female Kana goes Witch.