Metroid 2 remake/Federation Force

[Jedi]

It seems to me that you just are upset that your favorite franchises aren't what's getting attention.

What do you even know about my favorite franchises? If you knew me at all you'd realize I do appreciate that Kirby & FE have gotten stuff quite a bit recently.

All I see is someone trying to goad me on, you'd be wise not to.

[The DanMan]

Well in the Prime/Fusion era we also has Zero Mission, Prime 2 & 3, Prime Hunters, (Prime Pinball I guess too), but yeah we skipped a console and then suddenly Metroid was all over the place, but has been silenced thanks to the poor reception of Other M, Ninty's been afraid ever since then, and yes I get that Mario, Zelda & Pokemon are their big money makers, and Animal Crossing and somewhat FE these days, now. But they really need to get their heads out of their asses about the fact that other franchises exist too, or at least know the proper timing for bringing certain ones back (or making spinoffs), looking at you Starfox Zero (which I personally liked well enough, but putting it on a console with a small userbase doomed it right away). They effectively kill their own franchises now, because of their poor choices, I doubt we'll ever see a new Starfox game ever again.

I guess Xenoblade & Splatoon are good signs that they still know how to pull something original every now and again, (Although Xenoblade was 2nd party so yeah), but i'm not optimistic about the future. Despite the fact I've grown up with this company since I was little.

Well, with StarFox I must ask the question; even if they had made all the right choices, would a new game in the series done that well to begin with? The series itself feels pretty niche; there's a vocal few who are passionate about it, but by and large I'd say people have recognized Fox for Smash more than his own series.

I'd thought this since before Zero was announced; regardless of quality, I just don't think a new Star Fox game would do well. Kid Icarus Uprising was a Star Fox game in pre-development, but I think that it's own identity is half of what made it do as well as it did; strip out the characters and the wit and replace them with the droll, dated cheese of Star Fox characters and dialogue and the game probably wouldn't have done near as well.

I'd take some hope in the fact that Miyamoto seems to have been "kicked upstairs" into a management position rather than being in a more active developer position.

Nintendo has always prioritized certain franchises and neglected others; this just feels like a shift in that. I'm not "optimistic" or "pessimistic"; just curious on what the landscape will look like.

I don't think Metroid is dead or anything like that.

[ChibiToastExplosion]

As much as I hate to say this, sometimes it's just good to have a series step out on a high-note sometimes. Thinking about Mother, it's possible that they would have been able to top Mother 2/3, but what if they hadn't?

Other M is around the corner for just about every single series. Sometimes shorter is sweeter, because we appreciate what's there instead of grabbing for more cookies, which by this time have spoiled.

I love 2D metroid, so what's upsetting as a fan of that series is that people are universally crying for prime style - which had already killed Metroid for me long ago.

[The Draco Knight]

I love 2D metroid, so what's upsetting as a fan of that series is that people are universally crying for prime style - which had already killed Metroid for me long ago.

May I ask you why you think so?

I'm curious since Prime(the first one) is one of my favorite games of all time.

[ChibiToastExplosion]

May I ask you why you think so?

I'm curious since Prime(the first one) is one of my favorite games of all time.

I really dislike FPS. They just aren't fun to me in the best of cases, and they give me motion sickness in the worst of cases.

It's almost like the difference between top-down and 3d zeldas - I happen to like both styles in that instance, but it completely changes the kinds of puzzles that can be used and each style is distinct.

Super Metroid is one of the best games I have ever played. Metroid Prime is one of those games I wish I hadn't. I'm all for both styles existing, but Prime isn't for me and I hope 2D metroid never stops.

As for FF, it being FPS and even worse multiplayer with online randos really has me at a -10% change of playing it. I won't hate on it, but it is not the game for me.

Edited September 3, 2016 by ChibiToastExplosion

[kingddd]

Well, with StarFox I must ask the question; even if they had made all the right choices, would a new game in the series done that well to begin with? The series itself feels pretty niche; there's a vocal few who are passionate about it, but by and large I'd say people have recognized Fox for Smash more than his own series.

I'd thought this since before Zero was announced; regardless of quality, I just don't think a new Star Fox game would do well. Kid Icarus Uprising was a Star Fox game in pre-development, but I think that it's own identity is half of what made it do as well as it did; strip out the characters and the wit and replace them with the droll, dated cheese of Star Fox characters and dialogue and the game probably wouldn't have done near as well.

I'd take some hope in the fact that Miyamoto seems to have been "kicked upstairs" into a management position rather than being in a more active developer position.

It would have done well if they hadn't been constantly experimenting with the gameplay style of the franchise so much. Majority of the fanbase you hear from veterans or players of the Star Fox fanbase want the on-rail style shooter and maybe a tiny proportion of all ranged battle style of Star Fox. This is where majority of the positive receptions of the star fox games shine. Most people will tell you that their favourite Star Fox missions are in the air shooting missions, the branching paths you can take and consistent level designs that keep you engaged in the actions and battles and a challenging scoring system that keeps you replaying it. The issue with the games beyond since 64 are, constant experimentation, inconsistent gameplay, third person style shooting and that just don't work.

Star Fox Zero's despite going back to the SNES, 64 style of gameplay was still experimenting with tons of things that got people still annoyed that they aren't listening to the feedback that fans have been telling them. People want a new Star Fox that is a continuation sequel with similar consistent on-rail shooting style gameplay with new levels just like the foundation that Super Mario Bros gets where it has consistent platforming and level design changes but still feels like a Mario game. As someone who has played all Star Fox games, Star Fox Zero is my 2nd favourite game in the series and I admit the biggest problem really is the extra levels suck, they reek of experimentation than actual expanding on the actual game's levels. However I still replay Star Fox Zero consistently because I love the main levels so much and they are way more fun to replay imo than majority of the kid icarus missions.

[Zera]

If only Metroid and Star Fox would stop experimenting and take every single page from the Sin & Punishment book, they could be great again.

[NinjaMonkey]

I really dislike FPS. They just aren't fun to me in the best of cases, and they give me motion sickness in the worst of cases.

It's almost like the difference between top-down and 3d zeldas - I happen to like both styles in that instance, but it completely changes the kinds of puzzles that can be used and each style is distinct.

Super Metroid is one of the best games I have ever played. Metroid Prime is one of those games I wish I hadn't. I'm all for both styles existing, but Prime isn't for me and I hope 2D metroid never stops.

As for FF, it being FPS and even worse multiplayer with online randos really has me at a -10% change of playing it. I won't hate on it, but it is not the game for me.

Metroid Prime is not an FPS, it's a First Person Action-Adventure game. The shooting aspect is a secondary one, just like it is in the 2D titles. In fact if you talk to anyone in the FPS fanbase, they'll say it doesn't count as one due to the Prime games putting the focus on exploration and puzzle-solving elements.

Edited September 3, 2016 by NinjaMonkey

[ChibiToastExplosion]

Metroid Prime is not an FPS, it's a First Person Action-Adventure game. The shooting aspect is a secondary one, just like it is in the 2D titles. In fact if you talk to anyone in the FPS fanbase, they'll say it doesn't count as one due to the Prime games putting the focus on exploration and puzzle-solving elements.

Okay, so it's not a strict FPS. Okay.

Still first person.

Still bobbing up and down.

Still disorienting.

Should I go on? Just because it's not CoD style of game play doesn't change what it is. It's the orange to the grapefruit - yes it's different enough, but it's still citrus.

I happen to love grapefruits irl, but I dislike prime. It's first person whatever word that won't get ya triggered and I don't like it.

[Zera]

The only people that seem to dislike the Prime games are the ones that get motion sickness. Coincidence?

[ChibiToastExplosion]

The only people that seem to dislike the Prime games are the ones that get motion sickness. Coincidence?

Is that to say that these games are flawless, and free of criticism? Because somehow I don't think so.

I'll admit that I'm unable to give it as fair a shake as it deserves, but I do know that I dislike FP games in general, and yes, it does make me fairly sea-sick.

I'm glad you like it. My personal fave was Super, and I enjoy all of the other 2D metroids. A LOT. Like a lot a lot. But I do not like the 3D ones... sorry????

[Elieson]

It seems to me that you just are upset that your favorite franchises aren't what's getting attention

I think a lot of peopel are upset that one of the founding fathers of an entire genre, and a downright monumental franchise, raking in hundreds of thousands of dollars in charity among other things, isn't getting the attention it deserves from its owners.

Though, it's more disappointment than anger, I'm sure.

The only people that seem to dislike the Prime games are the ones that get motion sickness. Coincidence?

I personally think Prime 2 is a pretty "ok at best" prime game.

Edited September 4, 2016 by Elieson

[Zera]

Zera's Condensed Prime 2 Review

Metroid Prime 2 is an AWESOME game!

The light/dark world mechanic adds even more world and atmosphere (literally) to Metroid, along with some neat puzzles.

The light/dark beams and the way you control ammo adds some depth to combat and makes destructibles a bit more important.

The fact that Dark Aether's atmosphere damages you and you can heal in light bubbles makes exploration even more interesting.

The game is more challenging than Prime 1, a nice change of pace.

The scannable things and the extra lore are really nice like in Prime 1.

Oh, and there's a multiplayer thing. I didn't try it.

Flaws: The loading screens are too long, the Alpha Blogg is a mediocre boss, and there's a bit of backtracking near the end.

Prime 2 is a fantastic game. Definitely a worthy sequel to Prime 1.

9/10

[Tryhard]

o boy

kinda see why jedi is disappointed, though. if i was a big metroid fan I would be fairly annoyed by this point, and their decision to take down am2r is incredibly stupid.

Edited September 4, 2016 by Tryhard

[Florete]

I just played through AM2R switching the Metroid count to display the total instead of just in the area like it was in the original Metroid 2, and I found one very minor thing that I actually do prefer about the original. Gonna put it in the spoiler since it's about the last segment of the game.

In the original Metroid 2, the Metroid count doesn't include the Metroids at the final area of the game. The count goes down to 1, then when you see the Metroid egg, the count rises to 8(?), signaling the new arrival of more Metroids. AM2R doesn't have this, it just counts all of them. Again, it's really minor, just wanted to mention it.

Oddly, AM2R also doesn't count the queen. I'm pretty sure the original did, but I might be remembering wrong.

Metroid Prime is not an FPS, it's a First Person Action-Adventure game.

This is a dumb technicality that only results from people not wanting to categorize Metroid Prime with stuff like Call of Duty. The game is played in first person and the primary method of advancing in the game is done by shooting. Sure, there's a lot more to it, but to say it's "not an FPS" is kind of a stretch. If people can consider Portal an FPS, Metroid Prime is an FPS.

[Jedi]

If anyone cares I'm doing a run of AM2R, its nothing special, my commentary is kinda meh in this first part but hey whatcha gonna do, I wanted to just introduce stuff haha http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=65331&p=4528348 and get the word out there on it more than it is.

I just played through AM2R switching the Metroid count to display the total instead of just in the area like it was in the original Metroid 2, and I found one very minor thing that I actually do prefer about the original. Gonna put it in the spoiler since it's about the last segment of the game.

In the original Metroid 2, the Metroid count doesn't include the Metroids at the final area of the game. The count goes down to 1, then when you see the Metroid egg, the count rises to 8(?), signaling the new arrival of more Metroids. AM2R doesn't have this, it just counts all of them. Again, it's really minor, just wanted to mention it.

Oddly, AM2R also doesn't count the queen. I'm pretty sure the original did, but I might be remembering wrong.

This is a dumb technicality that only results from people not wanting to categorize Metroid Prime with stuff like Call of Duty. The game is played in first person and the primary method of advancing in the game is done by shooting. Sure, there's a lot more to it, but to say it's "not an FPS" is kind of a stretch. If people can consider Portal an FPS, Metroid Prime is an FPS.

Sadly I can't tell you, but maybe I'll ask my Mom, she'd actually probably remember if the Queen counted or not.

Yeah and I agree, Prime can be categorized as an FPS

Edited September 4, 2016 by Jedi

[Elieson]

I just started playing it and I'm loving the controls more than anything else. Metroid battle music ks kinda getting on my nerves but this game pushes you to WallKick/BombJump everywhere until it basically accepts that you're a good player and just hands you the space jump early a.f.

Iloveeveryminuteofthis

Edited September 4, 2016 by Elieson

[Jedi]

I just started playing it and I'm loving the controls more than anything else. Metroid battle music ks kinda getting on my nerves but this game pushes you to WallKick/BombJump everywhere until it basically accepts that you're a good player and just hands you the space jump early a.f.

Iloveeveryminuteofthis

I love how much it feels like Zero Mission, and heck I'd even say possibly better. But I'd have to gauge it properly with a comparison when I play Zero Mission again.

[Zera]

This is a dumb technicality that only results from people not wanting to categorize Metroid Prime with stuff like Call of Duty. The game is played in first person and the primary method of advancing in the game is done by shooting. Sure, there's a lot more to it, but to say it's "not an FPS" is kind of a stretch. If people can consider Portal an FPS, Metroid Prime is an FPS.

The only people who call Portal a first-person shooter are the people who are so used to all FP games being shooters that they can't tell the difference.

COD is a first-person shooter game.

Portal is a first-person puzzle game.

Metroid Prime is a first-person action-adventure game.

Aside from the camera perspective and the sheer existence of projectiles, these games have almost nothing in common and do not feel the same.

[Florete]

The only people who call Portal a first-person shooter are the people who are so used to all FP games being shooters that they can't tell the difference.

COD is a first-person shooter game.

Portal is a first-person puzzle game.

Metroid Prime is a first-person action-adventure game.

Aside from the camera perspective and the sheer existence of projectiles, these games have almost nothing in common and do not feel the same.

Portal, sure, but Metroid Prime's gameplay doesn't feel that much different from other FPSs such that one should never call it an FPS.

[Refa]

How does AM2R compare to the other 2D Metroid games? People are quick to note the similarities to Zero Mission but tend to shy away from direct comparisons for whatever reason.

Portal, sure, but Metroid Prime's gameplay doesn't feel that much different from other FPSs such that one should never call it an FPS.

For me, it's just as different to say, CoD, as Super Metroid is to Contra.

[Florete]

How does AM2R compare to the other 2D Metroid games? People are quick to note the similarities to Zero Mission but tend to shy away from direct comparisons for whatever reason.

I think it stands a good shot at being the best 2D Metroid game, and I've played and finished them all aside from the original Metroid. It controls better than any of them and while it's a bit more linear than Super/Zero Mission, it still has that Metroidvania feel with exploration, good boss fights, and lore that you can take in at your leisure.

For me, it's just as different to say, CoD, as Super Metroid is to Contra.

Games of the same genre can still feel very different. Metroid and Zelda can both be considered action-adventure, but they certainly attract different audiences.

Games can also incorporate multiple genres. Metroid Prime can be both FPS and action-adventure.

Edited September 4, 2016 by Red Fox of Fire

[Elieson]

The controls are tight and make improvements in the most subtle ways, such as a dedicated MorphBall transformation button, and Up/Down angle buttons unique for eachother.

Space Jump also functions way easier

[Jedi]

How does AM2R compare to the other 2D Metroid games? People are quick to note the similarities to Zero Mission but tend to shy away from direct comparisons for whatever reason.

In terms of actual control, I think AM2R has it beat, but I think Zero Mission is still very appealing to those who love to go REALLY FAST, because AM2R is kind of like a mixture of Fusion & Zero Mission in a sense, where you have linear progression, but its up to you to find most of the ways through & the items, they don't really give you a streamlined "go here for x".

It's quite possible to miss a number of things fairly easily if you're just running through, so exploration is still heavy for those who enjoy it.

Super Metroid is still probably the biggest 2D Metroid though. So its kind of a "pick your fine cheese or wine" out of all the excellent 2D Metroids as per usual, (Although 1&2 have aged poorly, I still find some odd appeal in them, but I watched my Mom play 1 when that was like one of the only ones so maybe thats part of it, but I still turn on Metroid 1 and go Justin Bailey for lols).

[Original Alear]

Zera's Condensed Prime 2 Review

Metroid Prime 2 is an AWESOME game!

The light/dark world mechanic adds even more world and atmosphere (literally) to Metroid, along with some neat puzzles.

The light/dark beams and the way you control ammo adds some depth to combat and makes destructibles a bit more important.

The fact that Dark Aether's atmosphere damages you and you can heal in light bubbles makes exploration even more interesting.

The game is more challenging than Prime 1, a nice change of pace.

The scannable things and the extra lore are really nice like in Prime 1.

Oh, and there's a multiplayer thing. I didn't try it.

Flaws: The loading screens are too long, the Alpha Blogg is a mediocre boss, and there's a bit of backtracking near the end.

Prime 2 is a fantastic game. Definitely a worthy sequel to Prime 1.

9/10

Despite generally disagreeing with most of what you say, I think you're pretty much completely correct here. My only real disagreement is that the light/dark beams don't really function very differently from the plasma/cold beams, so I don't feel they added all that much depth. The ammo system usually isn't a big issue.

My other two complaints about the game, independent from what you said, are:

-I wish there were a few more "substantial" Ing normal enemies. The Ing hunters and Ing Warriors are just about the only "full ing" (non-possessed enemies) that end up being fairly strong. I get that the ing possessing enemies was a major thing in prime 2, but it would've been cool to have a couple more "rank and file."

-Fights with Dark Pirate Elite Units (whatever those guys are called) tend to take too long, and yet they aren't very dangerous offensively.

I think some people don't like the environments in prime 2 as much as prime 1, but I actually like the prime 2 environments a lot. Mostly not quite as much as prime 1's, but I really love the cyber/electronic area.

Super Metroid is still probably the biggest 2D Metroid though. So its kind of a "pick your fine cheese or wine" out of all the excellent 2D Metroids as per usual, (Although 1&2 have aged poorly, I still find some odd appeal in them, but I watched my Mom play 1 when that was like one of the only ones so maybe thats part of it, but I still turn on Metroid 1 and go Justin Bailey for lols).

I really like playing 1, but I'm rather awful at it. 1 was one of the first games I played (NES was my first system and my guess is metroid was something like the 5th or 6th game). I've never killed Kraid. But it's been a very long time since I last played it.

Generally I find metroids cute/awesome/interesting but I find the larval metroids in metroid 1 terrifying.

Last thing I'll say is that while I like Super Metroid, it's not my fave 2d metroid. Not only do I like AM2R more, but I like zero mission more, too.

EDIT-Re metroid Prime being FPS or something else - I consider it an FPS. But actually think one of the biggest things that makes metroid prime different, beyond things like the morph ball, is how freaking beefy samus gets once she gets a few energy tanks and a better armor suit. Even on hard, fights typically feel like a slugfest where you can take a fair share of really powerful hits and stay afloat. This is only after you've gotten ok health of course - metroid prime's "broken machine that summosn war flies" boss will off you in a few hits, I believe (esp if you go in the acid).

Edited September 5, 2016 by HELP