Why does everyone likes Ike?

[Slumber]

9 hours ago, Ryuke said:

Ahem. Alm. Of course not many people played that game. Though Alm do becomes a King. Meanwhile Ike needs Soren and Soren doesnt want to go back to his nobility root. *Radiant Dawn spoiler*

 

As for best unit. All lord are good in FE. The weakest growth happens to be everyone first game Eliwood... even then he isnt bad considering his growth is like a Paladin only to occur late game. Roy has amazing growth with late promotion. Robin and Corrin is pretty broken when you put him next to Ike.

A.)

Alm is the blood heir. He's the son of the king of Rigel. He falls into the same deal as everyone having special blood. He's not just somebody who becomes king.

B.) FE5 Leif, FE6 Roy, FE7 Eliwood and Lyn, FE8 Eirika, FE9 Elincia, FE10 Elincia and Micaiah, FE11 Marth... There are a LOT of shitty lord units(Granted, some of those I mentioned become *decent* when they get a special weapon). And even then, lords like Chrom, Ephraim, FE3/12 Marth, and even Hector, should he get RNG screwed, which is fairly plausible, aren't definitive contenders for the best units in their games. Ike(Both PoR and RD to a slightly lesser extent) is really the only Lord since the SNES era where you can say "Yeah, this dude is one of the best units in the game. And then he gets an amazing skill and a super powerful weapon."

It's really just Alm, Sigurd, and Seliph who stand with Ike as the best units in their respective games. Seliph and Sigurd are slightly above, due to being pretty much unarguably the best units in FE4, but Ike is around that tier.

Edited February 17, 2017 by Slumber

[Ryuke]

@Slumber Marth/Eliwood/Lyn/Eirika/Roy ... are decent lord. Yes... they have a higher chance getting STR screwed via RNG.

Ephraim and Hector are definitely contender for the best unit in the game ... espeicially Ephraim. Hector well. there's Athos and we cannot complain.

 

However for PoR/RD there's Caineghis (however you spell it or the royal laguz but Caineghis is definitely there)

[Magical Glace]

Athos comes too late to be considered the most useful unit in FE7.  He's useful when you have him, but "when you have him" is all of two maps, one of which is just the one used for the final boss.

Also FE1 Marth is considered among the best units in that game, it's FE11 Marth who's bad.  Mechanics changes hit him hard.  At least this was considered to be the case last I checked.

All lords have a use somewhere though.  Not all of them will shatter the game or anything, but they can all do at least something.

Regarding Alm:

Spoiler

It wasn't like he actually knew he was Rudolph's son.  For all intents and purposes, Alm, and almost everyone who lived in the village, thought he was just Mycen's grandkid.  The only person who actually knew the truth was Mycen himself.  

 

[Slumber]

13 minutes ago, Ryuke said:

@Slumber Marth/Eliwood/Lyn/Eirika/Roy ... are decent lord. Yes... they have a higher chance getting STR screwed via RNG.

Ephraim and Hector are definitely contender for the best unit in the game ... espeicially Ephraim. Hector well. there's Athos and we cannot complain.

 

However for PoR/RD there's Caineghis (however you spell it or the royal laguz but Caineghis is definitely there)

It's been a while since I played Sacred Stones, so I might be remembering Ephraim a little wrong, if he is generally considered one of the best, then I'll concede him. But Hector has the potential to be AMAZING or just alright. His growth rates are all over the place, and if things fall into place, he's a tank who can blast enemies away and can avoid being doubled by mages. If things don't go his way, he's a physical sponge who will get ruined by mages and frequently gets surrounded and can't one-round anything. He also only has 5 move, which isn't super great.

Yes, PoR has the royal Laguz, but if you're making it through that final chapter at a reasonable pace, you might get to use them for literally less than 10 turns. Same deal with Athos in FE7, but you both get Athos for a bit longer, and Ike is almost always going to be able to rival the Royals when it comes to damaging Ashnard, while Hector needs a lot of luck to rival Athos when it comes to taking out the Black Fang Morphs and Nergal.

EDIT: I will add to Ephraim, however, is that his availability will almost always put him behind at least PoR Ike in my mind. Depending on the route, you might only get him for what, like, 8 chapters? Ike, however is ALWAYS there, and always kicking ass.

Edited February 16, 2017 by Slumber

[Zapp Branniglenn]

...hunh? What's with all the apologies for Anna? She doesn't even exist in Tellius beyond the most comical tutorial ever in 9. Also @Ryuke @Slumber please be mindful of Echoes spoiler. I want to talk about Him too when the subject of lords come up, but you've got to be tight lipped when remakes are announced. Also

1 hour ago, Ryuke said:

Ephraim and Hector are definitely contender for the best unit in the game ... espeicially Ephraim. 

 

Ephraim's the best lord of GBA era, but he's in a game where the entire roster is amazing, so it's hard to say whether he's really soaring above the rest of the characters. Lancelock is way better than sword lock, but it's still a lock, and there's four horseback units plus amelia that don't need to carry axereavers. Con of 8 is really bad, worse than even Amelia as a cavalier. Even the +2 from promotion isn't enough for him to wield javelins effectively. However, a Speed cap of 24 makes it barely possible to double the final boss without a body ring using siegmund, even on hard mode. He only hits high tier with the aid of Reginleif and Siegmund. Weapons that prove the designers understood how Con works and why ultimate weapons shouldn't be 16 WT when only two body rings exist in the game.

Two other lords that absolutely dwarf Sigurd, Seliph, and Ike would be Robin and Corrin. Robin is indeed a lord when him dying results in a game over. Having all classes available with only gender restriction gives him a serious edge over the most (potentially) overpowered Fire Emblem cast to date. Corrin as well, because you only need to reach A support with characters to attain their class options. While other units in fates can only A+ and S once to get new classes. The Yato may not get the delicious 1-2 range, but the final version of each game is still a great weapon, and the stat boosts it provides are in effect even when equipping other weapons. Plus Dragon Corrin is a great utility for tanking and getting other units kills. And the Hoshido/Nohr Noble skills are all great. Robin and Corrin are only barely outclassed by their kids under the right circumstances.

Edited February 16, 2017 by Gustavos

[Busterman64]

Despite everyone pretty much what I would say, I'll try to be short(emphasis on try).

Ike stands out for being just a normal guy rising his way to BE a Lord(he EARNED that right! It wasn't some Birthright )! Minus Ragnell, he had no special thing to him. He was a normal guy living a normal life(in ye' old Medieval times) who pretty much chose the path he took. He could've not chosen to help Elincia and just live peacefully(*Cough*) in Gallia like his father wanted, but he chose to fight for her despite have pretty much no reason to do so.

His "no crap given" attitude(and being a bit of a hothead) is interesting, but it's also a flaw, especially seeing how if Sanaki wasn't as good as she was, that would've gotten him killed AND Crimea doomed! Everything up to that point would've been all for nothing!

Also, and I didn't see this mentioned much, but Ike doesn't really care for who or what you are. If he see's that you're a good person, that's all he mainly needs. He accepts you for who you REALLY are deep down. I know it might not seem so special, but considering the rasicim going on with the Laguz and Branded(not to mention the line between Nobility and Commoners), that has a bit more significant here.

And to comment on what someone said, while Ike had Soren and Titania by his side, he kinda needs them. Ike is a Warrior more then anything else. Soren is much more better in Tactics and Startergy, some Ike lacks a bit. Titania was more experience handling a mercenary group then him too(and just experience in-general). Ike NEEDED them to pretty much make up what he lacked!

As for his revenge, I liked it. Mainly because, while he doesn't interact with the BK much, you see Ike kinda super idotic and hothead the first time he tries "fighting" him. However, you see later on that he learns to keep his cool and not to run off towards the BK at the first sight of him! 

If you didn't find it too interesting, won't blame you(revenge is revenge, its something that's in a lot games. They can't all be winners).

However, this more sticks to PoR Ike. RD Ike...is fine, but like mentioned already, he steals the spotlight from Micaiah. Someone who, lets be honest, got thrown to the back in terms of importance. Yune takes her place most of the time in part 4, which should've been Micaiah's truest moment to shine!  I didn't mind him having importance, but Micaiah should've stayed one of the most important!

 

As a whole, he's may not be the most interesting guy in RPG's in general, but for Fire Emblem, I think he earns a lot of his praise. If you don't like, I won't try to force my opinion on ya(because I'm sure you have your reasons for liking another Lord much more)! 

 

Oh, and in terms of a unit, he's pretty beastly. And, while I don't care much for them, his growths speak for themselves(but like I said, I don't care to much for that stuff. On multiple playthroughs, I see that he's a great unit [and main Lord]...as many others before, with, and after him)!

EDIT:Lastly...he kinda ties with Lyn for me as a really good Lord and personal favorite(do I have bad tastes? Maybe, but I think they left more of a lasting impression on me more so then some of the others(who are still pretty good)! But hey, that's just me. 

Edited February 16, 2017 by Busterman64

[NekoKnight]

14 hours ago, Thane said:

That being said, he's got a lot of things going for him, from the unusual humble beginnings (which are shared by Lyn but hey) to his confidence to some pretty damn funny character interactions. It's refreshing to see someone as blunt as him in the series.

Speaking of Lyn, I want to know why she's popular, too.

Lyn is the granddaughter of a Marquis so she's as much a lord as Eliwood is, although she spends the greater part of her life in a different culture.

As for why people like Lyn, I would say:
-Original lord
-Solid character design
-Cool sword
-Honest and proud personality
-Endearing personal quest
-Boobs

The biggest difference between the 3DS era games and the games before it is that the 3DS put a much greater emphasis on putting YOU in the game, specifically with the appeal of romancing your character of choice. People will waifu characters even without a game mechanic but that's at least contained to fanfiction and not actively encouraged by the game.

Fiora was the original waifu anyway.
 

[Slumber]

3 hours ago, Gustavos said:

...hunh? What's with all the apologies for Anna? She doesn't even exist in Tellius beyond the most comical tutorial ever in 9. Also @Ryuke @Slumber please be mindful of Echoes spoiler. I want to talk about Him too when the subject of lords come up, but you've got to be tight lipped when remakes are announced. Also

Ephraim's the best lord of GBA era, but he's in a game where the entire roster is amazing, so it's hard to say whether he's really soaring above the rest of the characters. Lancelock is way better than sword lock, but it's still a lock, and there's four horseback units plus amelia that don't need to carry axereavers. Con of 8 is really bad, worse than even Amelia as a cavalier. Even the +2 from promotion isn't enough for him to wield javelins effectively. However, a Speed cap of 24 makes it barely possible to double the final boss without a body ring using siegmund, even on hard mode. He only hits high tier with the aid of Reginleif and Siegmund. Weapons that prove the designers understood how Con works and why ultimate weapons shouldn't be 16 WT when only two body rings exist in the game.

Two other lords that absolutely dwarf Sigurd, Seliph, and Ike would be Robin and Corrin. Robin is indeed a lord when him dying results in a game over. Having all classes available with only gender restriction gives him a serious edge over the most (potentially) overpowered Fire Emblem cast to date. Corrin as well, because you only need to reach A support with characters to attain their class options. While other units in fates can only A+ and S once to get new classes. The Yato may not get the delicious 1-2 range, but the final version of each game is still a great weapon, and the stat boosts it provides are in effect even when equipping other weapons. Plus Dragon Corrin is a great utility for tanking and getting other units kills. And the Hoshido/Nohr Noble skills are all great. Robin and Corrin are only barely outclassed by their kids under the right circumstances.

I mean, sorry about spoilers and all, but Echoes IS a remake of a 25 year old game. I guess I should be more mindful, as there are plenty of people who have never played FE2 who will be playing Echoes relatively soon. Again, sorry. I'll definitely try to limit myself outside of the NES/SNES board when it comes to spoilers.

But back on topic, I have a hard time lumping in Robin and Corrin as traditional lords, as theoretically, there are no limits to those characters, given what Awakening and Fates. Plus, in regards to Awakening, pretty much all of the children will pass up Robin(Especially his/her kids) with relative ease. Corrin is in a game where kids aren't quite so broken, so he/she stays on top pretty much through the whole game, really only getting passed up by Kana or whoever else their kids might be, and purely depending on how good the father is. But again, Corrin is so deliberately overpowered that it's tough to talk about them like this.

Edited February 17, 2017 by Slumber

[Extrasolar]

I'd say that people like Ike partially because he was such a different point of FE as opposed to other FE lords. Instead of the main focus being country-governing, the rightful heir to a throne, and international politics, you had this ragtag group of mercenaries from the countryside, just looking to be able to pay for their next meal, getting embroiled in a conflict far larger than themselves.

Given a natural progression of things, Ike would have become some obscure mercenary leader in backwoods Crimea, but as fate would have it, he rose to make his own legend. He's not given the privilege of a grand name behind him like Marth, descendant of Anri, Seliph descendant of Baldr and Sigurd, or anything, since Gawain had renounced his title years previous. He was his own man, without baggage or a past, and became his own hero. That's what I find interesting or different about him, personally.

Aaaaaand it doesn't help that he's one of the best lords in the series stat-wise as well.

Edited February 18, 2017 by Extrasolar

[Acacia Sgt]

Hmm, dwelling on it a little, I think that for those saying that Ike appeals to originality... well, they're not wrong, per se, but also not quite right. In my opinion, you see, at the end of the day Ike is not really an original experience. He's a fresh experience.

Ike is basically the Ogma archetype of PoR. Same way Ogma is to Marth, Dieck to Roy, Gerick to the Renais twins, Ike fulfills that same role to Elincia. The early merc with a band (granted, Ike doesn't become the leader of his until a little bit later) (or not incluiding the band, and people like Saber and Raven also fit the bill) that joins the Lord early in its quest. Had PoR been any other FE game, we'd have started with Elincia, and then meet Ike.

There's also the character of Ike himself. Among his fellow Ogmas, the one he's most similar to is Raven. Think about it. Ike's vendetta with the Black Knight for killing his father? Raven once saught revenge on the ones he thought responsible for the death of his parents. Soren is similar to Lucius. Lucius came in the service of Raven's parents since young and with no one else to be with, and became friends with him. Same how Soren ended with the mercs and befriended Ike. Though faint, there is a small similarity with their younger sisters too, Mist and Priscilla. If only gameplay wise, since they're both healers with mounts (though Mist only gains it after promotion, and wields swords instead of magic).

So there's nothing really new with Ike himself. Other than being an Ogma with protagonism. But even that is not fully original. Having a game with the perspective of someone other than the Lord has been done before. Before Ike with Elincia, we had Hector with Eliwood, and Leif with Seliph (to a lesser, since instead of a full game, it was only the last chapters of Leif's adventure overlapping with a small segment of Seliph's). With Ike, the only thing unique is that we only have his perspective. Elincia doesn't get one. She's not even being playable until the last chapters, and can't even damage Ashnard. But well, you can't deny that is different form the norm.

But well, that's how I see it. Ike certainly earns the praise he gets. But well, it's all due to perspective, presentation, and proportion. Otherwise, he'd be just one more Ogma. And Raven with a different coat of paint. Not that it's an unpopular thing to be. But nothing really new, either.

I suppose that also explains in detail why I think he's "just... there", to me.

Edited February 17, 2017 by Acacia Sgt