FE Warriors at TGS

[Arthur97]

7 minutes ago, ZeManaphy said:

Seems unusual they focus on Celica, and not Alm, since he's the King of Valentia, but I guess they wanted more female representation/Magic users. It would be nice to see a conversation between Marth, Alm, or Celica, can considering Echoes happens few years after Shadow Dragon.

That, and the producer likes Celica. They may also not have wanted to flip another characters moves since he's left handed and it looks like guests are relegated to clones.

[Truthblade]

5 hours ago, Gaia093 said:

Exactly. I'm not mad she's a clone, either - it's choosing swordplay as her main trait even though she could just be a magician's clone that disappoints me a lot. Magic was a far more pivotal part of Celica as a unit than the sword ever was.

 

By the way, who's Lyn a clone of? I have to admit that, other than several characters I like, I haven't been paying too much attention to gameplay.

Its the way her magic works that is a problem. Because magic is determined by weapon equipment, they would have to have Celica use a tome, and they though Celica would look weird using one. 

Lyn is most likely a clone of Navarre, who was leaked a while ago.

5 hours ago, Tenzen12 said:

Why she should have tome though? I mean all you need is make her clone of other magic users without book. 

Well, I dislike Celica so I don't give a damn how she fight, but for sake of argument I think it would be valid option. 

Weapon equipment. Magic is treated like an equipped weapon in this game. SoV's isn't. I guess they didn't like the idea of a book disappearing suddenly whenever it was given to Celica.

[Interdimensional Observer]

8 hours ago, Jedi said:

Dynasty Warriors 6 and 7 were mocked for clone movesets. Its a very sour topic for the Warriors community. 

9 is getting less flak for it because of how ambitious the game is but still, generally clone movesets in Warriors games are seen as super lazy.

And I think KT is taking the 7-8 approach again. Include everyone now to satisfy the masses, and make them unique later to please the true Musou fans when the fanbase has earned its next paycheck. 

DLC alternate weapons to fix some of the clone issues might not be a bad idea at this point. What to call them though?

I don't watch 95% of new video game trailers or videos, but Celica makes adds to the argument Camilla is directing FEW's development. Why? Because it feels like the developers are flying by the seat of their panties.

Do they have even have a direction? They had to at one point, but between Celica and Lyn, it seems like the fan backlash might have forced them to scramble some new things together.

 

The Weapon Triangle is overrated- it's a hindrance in the DS remakes, is nearly nonexistent in T776, and does not that much in FE4 or FE10 beyond affecting dodgetanking. SoV proves we don't need it, FE3 too, and so does Kaga's post-FE Sagas. I wouldn't mind in future FEs if it was a property of certain weapons in a type, but not all, like an actual inbuilt skill. We certainly don't need it in Warriors, FE has other ways of being strategic you know.

The logic that one should teach the triangle starting with Swords was bleh too, since what makes them ideal for training people? I can understand not starting with Axes, but Lances are the balanced in-between of Swords and Axes, neither fast but weak nor strong but slow. Rowan as a blonde Yukimura Sanada/Zhao Yun wouldn't have been for the worst, or they could've made him a Halberdier since nobody is going to get a moveset like one a Halberdier could bring.

[Anacybele]

48 minutes ago, Armagon said:

What i am understanding here is that you'd think it'd be unfair if Ike were DLC but Lyn and Celica weren't. Which is understandable. Unfortunately, this unfairness would've happened regardless. If Ike was in the base game (which he still very well may be) but Lyn was DLC, would you still complain? Or let's say both Ike and Lyn are in the base game but Roy is DLC. Would you still complain then?

Yeah. I've been saying before that if only one of Ike and Lyn were in the base game and the other was DLC, it'd be unfair to the fans of the latter because both won that CYL poll and both proved they're possibly the most popular FE character. It feels odd to just have one in the base game and not both.

Roy I can accept being DLC no matter what, because he was only a second place character and would be yet ANOTHER sword, plus Lyn already represents Elibe.

[Tolvir]

So after getting some sleep since I was up for almost a full 24 hours, I took a second look at Celica.

At this point, I think all I can say is that I am just happy she is in. Im hoping that maybe her status means all the Amiibo characters will make it, and maybe the Amiibo will have some kind of different effect than expected. The only thing I am personally confused about as far as Celica goes, is the choice behind her being a clone. Not that her being a clone is bad, but who they chose to clone with her. She is the first mage sword user. A very similar style to Robin. Why wasnt she a clone of Robin? I think if she was a clone of him, then it may have gone over a bit better.

Either way, cant really change that. And, especially after looking back over, I definitely think Celica and Lyn were late additions. If that is true, then I think a lot of this complaining and whining about too many swords becomes null and void. Why? Well, they are only clones and added in after the fact. They likely didnt effect development of other characters, as their development probably borrowed a lot from said characters. It was obvious with Celica, but yet to be seen with Lyn.

So at this point I am just waiting patiently for tonight and tomorrow. While I would of loved to see a confirmation of Navarre, Azura, Draug, or someone unexpected so we can blow the 25 theory out of the water, at least we got Celica out of the way and are leaving some of the more interesting non sword users left to look at.

Edited September 21, 2017 by Tolvir

[The DanMan]

So, direct feed footage of her should be coming soon.

[TheSS]

29 minutes ago, Tolvir said:

So after getting some sleep since I was up for almost a full 24 hours, I took a second look at Celica.

At this point, I think all I can say is that I am just happy she is in. Im hoping that maybe her status means all the Amiibo characters will make it, and maybe the Amiibo will have some kind of different effect than expected. The only thing I am personally confused about as far as Celica goes, is the choice behind her being a clone. Not that her being a clone is bad, but who they chose to clone with her. She is the first mage sword user. A very similar style to Robin. Why wasnt she a clone of Robin? I think if she was a clone of him, then it may have gone over a bit better.

Either way, cant really change that. And, especially after looking back over, I definitely think Celica and Lyn were late additions. If that is true, then I think a lot of this complaining and whining about too many swords becomes null and void. Why? Well, they are only clones and added in after the fact. They likely didnt effect development of other characters, as their development probably borrowed a lot from said characters. It was obvious with Celica, but yet to be seen with Lyn.

So at this point I am just waiting patiently for tonight and tomorrow. While I would of loved to see a confirmation of Navarre, Azura, Draug, or someone unexpected so we can blow the 25 theory out of the water, at least we got Celica out of the way and are leaving some of the more interesting non sword users left to look at.

I'm personally of the opinion that all of the clones were planned from the very beginning. Clones are such a big part of the game's design, I wouldn't be surprised if the decision was stuff along the lines of "Include Hinoka, Cordelia, and Caeda and give them all the same moveset", not "Hey, we have Hinoka in, let's throw Cordelia and Caeda in last minute".

[Arthur97]

7 minutes ago, TheSS said:

I'm personally of the opinion that all of the clones were planned from the very beginning. Clones are such a big part of the game's design, I wouldn't be surprised if the decision was stuff along the lines of "Include Hinoka, Cordelia, and Caeda and give them all the same moveset", not "Hey, we have Hinoka in, let's throw Cordelia and Caeda in last minute".

As for how long clones were planned, we really have to know when Nintendo put their foot down on Lucina since she set the precedent. If that was early, then maybe, but if it was later, then, well...

[The DanMan]

8 minutes ago, TheSS said:

I'm personally of the opinion that all of the clones were planned from the very beginning. Clones are such a big part of the game's design, I wouldn't be surprised if the decision was stuff along the lines of "Include Hinoka, Cordelia, and Caeda and give them all the same moveset", not "Hey, we have Hinoka in, let's throw Cordelia and Caeda in last minute".

The PKs and the twins I both think were planned clones from the start. Lucina, Elise/Sakura, Lyn, and Celica seem like they were added later. We know for a fact they didn't want to include Lucina at first, for one. The little sisters were widely considered the most "expendable" of the royals and very well could've originally been NPCs. I'm thinking Lyn was probably some time shortly after the CYL poll, and Celica (due to her model looking rough in places) was likely added even later.

Edited September 21, 2017 by The DanMan

[Corbin]

It's very likely not Caeda. Her personal weapon is the Wing Spear, which, as shown in her SD art, has a ring at the end, not a diamond. Also, something I'd like to point out from the recent trailer: in the scene where Rowan and Lianna are lining up with characters from the other games, Lianna has one less than her younger brother on her side. Given that the space after Robin is inexplicably empty, I'm guessing that that they may have edited out whoever is potentially the eighth major character in Story Mode, who is likely Azura or Caeda. Overall, it would be rather shocking if they excluded Azura not only because she's a major character, but also some cutscenes seem to imply that the Fates cast is going to journey to Valla during their segment of the plot and, well, she's the one who leads everyone there. 

Edited September 21, 2017 by Corbin

[Tuvy]

oh fun... another place to be let down at...

[Tolvir]

5 minutes ago, Tuvy said:

oh fun... another place to be let down at...

We have 2 more days of reveals. Today they are going over History mode. They say there are no hero reveals today, or at least didn't mention any, but you never know with conventions. Then tomorrow will be a recap of all characters and new announcements.

[Interdimensional Observer]

4 minutes ago, Corbin said:

Overall, it would be rather shocking if they excluded Azura not only because she's a major character, but also some cutscenes seem to imply that the Fates cast is going to journey to Valla during their segment of the plot and, well, she's the one who leads everyone there.

Well if they go to Vall- *liquidified* then I hope its the nice bright outdoors ruins side of Valla- not the bleak forest or bad indoor parts. HW did have a wonderful choice of venues with distinct and contrasting aesthetics (but I wish HWL had added Clock Town). FE might not be quite as fantastical as LoZ, but they should aim for battlefield variety.

[Tolvir]

1 minute ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

Well if they go to Vall- *liquidified* then I hope its the nice bright outdoors ruins side of Valla- not the bleak forest or bad indoor parts. HW did have a wonderful choice of venues with distinct and contrasting aesthetics (but I wish HWL had added Clock Town). FE might not be quite as fantastical as LoZ, but they should aim for battlefield variety.

I think the indoor map with moving platforms could be cool. It would need to be heavily changed, but keeping the concept of an indoor area with a semi puzzle like design with moving platforms could be fun.

[Lau]

So what time is day 2's stream? I have to go to college tomorrow, but I'm hoping that it's early enough that I can catch it.

[Gaia093]

1 hour ago, Truthblade said:

Lyn is most likely a clone of Navarre, who was leaked a while ago.

Ehhh, there's absolutely zero basis for that. Navarre gameplay hasn't even been shown yet - it's not even a sure thing that he's playable in the base game.

I'd rather wait for footage before jumping to conclusions. Thanks for replying, though.

[Azz]

12 minutes ago, Lau said:

So what time is day 2's stream? I have to go to college tomorrow, but I'm hoping that it's early enough that I can catch it.

It's on 1 p.m. JST, so whatever that correlates as in your timezone.

[HK Motendra]

for those running on EST, that'd be 12 AM

 

[Denomon]

I'm as disappointed that Celica is a clone as anyone else, but the overwhelming negativity has gone to an uncalled for extent. Why would you cancel a pre-order because of one disappointing announcement? I understand that people are free to express their own opinions, but some of them are extreme.

[Azz]

Here's a timetable for all major U.S times I found on Tumblr.

For GMT:

Show 2 is at 4:00 a.m.

Show 3 is at 3:30 a.m.

Show 4 is at 7:00 a.m.

Keep in mind, pretty sure UK is GMT +1 like Ireland so Show 2 is 5:00 a.m, 3 is 4:30 a.m and 4 is 8:00 a.m.

For you Aussies out there, you guys are an hour ahead of Japan so Show 2 is 2:00 p.m, 3 is 1:30 p.m and 5:00 p.m.

Edited September 21, 2017 by Azz

[Lau]

2 minutes ago, Azz said:

Here's a timetable for all major U.S times I found on Tumblr.

For GMT:

Show 2 is at 4:00 a.m.

Show 3 is at 3:30 a.m.

Show 4 is at 7:00 a.m.

(Keep in mind, pretty sure UK is GMT +1 like Ireland so Show 2 is 5:00 a.m, 3 is 4:30 a.m, and 4 is 8:00 a.m.

I don't mind missing show 2, but show 3 is gonna be a killer...ah well, it's a Saturday. Early morning hours, let's go!

Thank you :)

[Truthblade]

43 minutes ago, Gaia093 said:

Ehhh, there's absolutely zero basis for that. Navarre gameplay hasn't even been shown yet - it's not even a sure thing that he's playable in the base game.

I'd rather wait for footage before jumping to conclusions. Thanks for replying, though.

It has not been confirmed, but all the evidence points to that direction.. To quote  @Folt (since I would otherwise just be echoing him...no pun intended).

 

1. "Navarre appears in the story. Lyn has had no scenes shown of her contributing or appearing in the story. (To add to this, Navarre is seen standing with other members of the playable cast. The idea that he is just an npc doesn't stack with this fact)
2. Lyn's clones only appear in her Musou Attack. We got to see some of Lyn's regular moveset as an opponent (and some snippets in some of the videos), and it focuses way too much on dual-swords (which is something Navarre has been associated with before Lyn).
3. Celica's showcase and her moveset indirectly implies that characters who weren't part of the focus games were likely late additions as extras to the roster thanks to her moveset being cloned from Marth (except for the specials) and similiarly not being shown appearing in any capacity in the game's story.
4. History Mode: Navarre is a character who comes from one of the focus games: Shadow Dragon, which is confirmed to have their own portion in History Mode so Navarre will likely have a not-so-little role there as well. Shadow Dragon having it's own portion in History Mode already implies that there's more characters from Shadow Dragon than just Marth, so it's highly likely that he's been planned as one of the SD reps in the roster since early/mid development as one of the Shadow Dragon reps."

[Tolvir]

50 minutes ago, Azz said:

Here's a timetable for all major U.S times I found on Tumblr.

For GMT:

Show 2 is at 4:00 a.m.

Show 3 is at 3:30 a.m.

Show 4 is at 7:00 a.m.

Keep in mind, pretty sure UK is GMT +1 like Ireland so Show 2 is 5:00 a.m, 3 is 4:30 a.m and 4 is 8:00 a.m.

For you Aussies out there, you guys are an hour ahead of Japan so Show 2 is 2:00 p.m, 3 is 1:30 p.m and 5:00 p.m.

Going to have to miss show 4. That is way too early in the morning for me. All the others aren't too bad though.

[The DanMan]

15 minutes ago, Tolvir said:

Going to have to miss show 4. That is way too early in the morning for me. All the others aren't too bad though.

I stayed up for 1, but since 2 is just showing off History Mode and no new characters I'm not tuning in. Thankfully show 3 is at an almost reasonable time for me-- but yeah, Show 4's a no-go (especially since I have classes in the morning that day).

[Baron the Shining Blade]

2 hours ago, Azz said:

Here's a timetable for all major U.S times I found on Tumblr.

For GMT:

Show 2 is at 4:00 a.m.

Show 3 is at 3:30 a.m.

Show 4 is at 7:00 a.m.

Keep in mind, pretty sure UK is GMT +1 like Ireland so Show 2 is 5:00 a.m, 3 is 4:30 a.m and 4 is 8:00 a.m.

For you Aussies out there, you guys are an hour ahead of Japan so Show 2 is 2:00 p.m, 3 is 1:30 p.m and 5:00 p.m.

Man, where was this timetable last night? Would've been very useful. Know what, I'm gonna save it and keep it on hand for myself.

4 shows? I thought FEW only had 3. What's show 4 gonna focus on? I can't stay up past midnight.