What staff and skills should Legendary Elincia have?

[Jotari]

8 minutes ago, Vicious Sal said:

I never stated they couldn't both be Staff Fliers, I just stated my personal preferences based upon how the unit felt to me gameplay and story wise.

You felt like Elincia, a character consistently mounted on a pegasus was an armoured unit? You know she can attack most enemies four times and then canto away, right? Or, more permanently, she can heal someone and then canto to safety. She has 9 movement. Miaciah is way more of a drag around unit than she is.

Edited April 10, 2020 by Jotari

[Vicious Sal]

19 minutes ago, Jotari said:

You felt like Elincia, a character consistently mounted on a pegasus was an armoured unit? You know she can attack most enemies four times and then canto away, right? Or, more permanently, she can heal someone and then canto to safety. She has 9 movement. Miaciah is way more of a drag around unit than she is.

I'd advise you to read my first post again.  My reasoning is for a great deal based upon how I perceived the unit in the entire game. I clearly specified I was also talking about how in both games it felt like I had to drag her along the entire story. Aside from the first encounter and the escape toward Gallia, Elincia does not feel like a driving force behind the story, be a reactionary one.

And you are clearly hyping up Amiti. In PoR Elincia has no place being on the battlefield, since Clash is one of the hardest maps in PoR (assuming  JP Maniac mode/Western Hard). It's one of the few maps that can actually pose a challenge since the space is very open, reinforcements keep coming in and there are quite a few (long)bow paladins. This means Elincia is in need of constant protection and isn't going anywhere faster than a snails pace. 

In RD, we can skip 2-1 since Amiti, which makes Elincia good, if replaced witha slim sword, and she is laughably weak.

2-E Is either turtling, so you're not going to make use of that 9 move a lot, though canto is useful for going up and down the ledges. Or if you're LTC/Speedrunning the game, you just fly in with Haar and she doesn't even get of the seize point.

Part three we see her shining with her 9 move, where she tends to run face first towards a platoon of bow paladins. Real nice. First playthrough I hated that map, though now I just rush faster than the CRK and block her from suiciding. 

Part four she's finally able to be the healer you spoke of, being able to fly and canto to her hearts content.  And yeah, maybe she can become useful in the tower if you wait 25 turns and feed her all the cats. Otheriwise, she's just stuck healing at the backline, like every other healer.

 

So yeah, she might have those abilities, but the game does not really give her situations to actually use them until part 4.  So yes, to me, dragging her along does feel more like I'm using an armour knight than a pegasus knight, story and gameplay wise. For someone that has such great movement, she gets pretty much no opportunity to use it effectively until the end of the game.

 

EDIT: And yes, Micaiah faces similar situations, like 3-6, where no one can go off the island pretty much except a blessed Jill. She isn't exempt from critique, but I do not have the same amount of frustration in dragging Micaiah around since the game has more maps that are designed in a way that allow for her to contribute, like removing an armour knight from a choke point so that you can rush through. Those challenges on the map might be solved differently, but you can clearly see the intent of the map design, and that gives Micaiah, on most maps at least, an objective and lets her move forward. Elincia however, just as in the story, requires constant protection from retainers and guards. 

Edited April 10, 2020 by Vicious Sal

[Jotari]

13 minutes ago, Vicious Sal said:

I'd advise you to read my first post again.  My reasoning is for a great deal based upon how I perceived the unit in the entire game. I clearly specified I was also talking about how in both games it felt like I had to drag her along the entire story. Aside from the first encounter and the escape toward Gallia, Elincia does not feel like a driving force behind the story, be a reactionary one.

And you are clearly hyping up Amiti. In PoR Elincia has no place being on the battlefield, since Clash is one of the hardest maps in PoR (assuming  JP Maniac mode/Western Hard). It's one of the few maps that can actually pose a challenge since the space is very open, reinforcements keep coming in and there are quite a few (long)bow paladins. This means Elincia is in need of constant protection and isn't going anywhere faster than a snails pace. 

In RD, we can skip 2-1 since Amiti, which makes Elincia good, if replaced witha slim sword, and she is laughably weak.

2-E Is either turtling, so you're not going to make use of that 9 move a lot, though canto is useful for going up and down the ledges. Or if you're LTC/Speedrunning the game, you just fly in with Haar and she doesn't even get of the seize point.

Part three we see her shining with her 9 move, where she tends to run face first towards a platoon of bow paladins. Real nice. First playthrough I hated that map, though now I just rush faster than the CRK and block her from suiciding. 

Part four she's finally able to be the healer you spoke of, being able to fly and canto to her hearts content.  And yeah, maybe she can become useful in the tower if you wait 25 turns and feed her all the cats. Otheriwise, she's just stuck healing at the backline, like every other healer.

 

So yeah, she might have those abilities, but the game does not really give her situations to actually use them until part 4.  So yes, to me, dragging her along does feel more like I'm using an armour knight than a pegasus knight, story and gameplay wise. For someone that has such great movement, she gets pretty much no opportunity to use it effectively until the end of the game.

 

EDIT: And yes, Micaiah faces similar situations, like 3-6, where no one can go off the island pretty much except a blessed Jill. She isn't exempt from critique, but I do not have the same amount of frustration in dragging Micaiah around since the game has more maps that are designed in a way that allow for her to contribute, like removing an armour knight from a choke point so that you can rush through. Those challenges on the map might be solved differently, but you can clearly see the intent of the map design, and that gives Micaiah, on most maps at least, an objective and lets her move forward. Elincia however, just as in the story, requires constant protection from retainers and guards. 

Ah dragging her along the story. I thought you meant you had to drag her along in gameplay. You're wrong about gameplay. You yourself have listed several instances where she's quite useful. It doesn't hurt that she joins the route with the most available exp in Part 4.

Edited April 10, 2020 by Jotari

[Vicious Sal]

16 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Ah dragging her along the story. I thought you meant you had to drag her along in gameplay. You're wrong about gameplay. You yourself have listed several instances where she's quite useful. It doesn't hurt that she joins the route with the most available exp in Part 4.

You're again not reading it. I just explained it's Story AND gameplay.

My post just now explained why in almost all of her maps, she feels like deadweight, does not contribute anything meaningful or is an active hindrance since she isn't even under your control.  The only maps where she shines along two entire games are part 4's two maps. And that is if you take your time dawdling and soaking up exp. I'm not one for grinding in games, so no, the way i play Elincia feels like dead weight in pretty much every chapter and does not contribute anything meaningful. So you saying my previously stated feelings regarding Elincia being "wrong" is just absurd. Since I don't know how you could know my feelings and gameplay experience better than me.

 

 

[Jotari]

1 hour ago, Vicious Sal said:

You're again not reading it. I just explained it's Story AND gameplay.

My post just now explained why in almost all of her maps, she feels like deadweight, does not contribute anything meaningful or is an active hindrance since she isn't even under your control.  The only maps where she shines along two entire games are part 4's two maps. And that is if you take your time dawdling and soaking up exp. I'm not one for grinding in games, so no, the way i play Elincia feels like dead weight in pretty much every chapter and does not contribute anything meaningful. So you saying my previously stated feelings regarding Elincia being "wrong" is just absurd. Since I don't know how you could know my feelings and gameplay experience better than me.

 

 

Yes. Elincia is not good in end game if you don't bother to train her. Like everyone. But they do give her the route with the most training potential and obviously we should be judging characters on the potential of you training them and not ignoring them. You've only pointed to one map where she's actually a dead weight, Part 2 prologue, where she's not really because even without Amiti you only have three units to use in the entire map. So if you're not using her then you're just not bothering to make use of the resources of the chapter. You mention part 3, but she's not playable for part 3. I'm not sure what Bow knights you even mean because the one part 3 chapter she's even on the field for she's an NPC unit that is hard coded to retreat and surround herself with her her own army instead of charging anything. She's literally unarmed so she can't attack anything. I am reading your post, it's just you're contradicting yourself more than you're reinforcing your point. You can say an armoured knight if you want, and for the plot I can see why, but she's clearly not designed to be one in terms of gameplay by any stretch. Her most obvious advantage is her mobility (and compared to other fliers, staves). She's designed to be a hard hitter that can move around without taking too much damage herself. It's like the opposite of an armoured knight. Micaiah on the other hand is slow af and designed to take enemies out in one hit, so she has way more armoured knight traits than Elincia does, but even that's stretching it as armoured knights are meant to be tanky (which neither unit is).

Edited April 10, 2020 by Jotari

[Vicious Sal]

38 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Yes. Elincia is not good in end game if you don't bother to train her. Like everyone. But they do give her the route with the most training potential and obviously we should be judging characters on the potential of you training them and not ignoring them. You've only pointed to one map where she's actually a dead weight, Part 2 prologue, where she's not really because even without Amiti you only have three units to use in the entire map. So if you're not using her then you're just not bothering to make use of the resources of the chapter. You mention part 3, but she's not playable for part 3. I'm not sure what Bow knights you even mean because the one part 3 chapter she's even on the field for she's an NPC unit that is hard coded to retreat and surround herself with her her own army instead of charging anything. She's literally unarmed so she can't attack anything. I am reading your post, it's just you're contradicting yourself more than you're reinforcing your point. You can say an armoured knight if you want, and for the plot I can see why, but she's clearly not designed to be one in terms of gameplay by any stretch. She's designed to be a hard hitter that can move around without taking too much damage herself. It's like the opposite of an armoured knight. Micaiah on the other hand is slow af and designed to take enemies out in one hit, so she has way more armoured knight traits than Elincia does, but even that's stretching it as armoured knights are meant to be tanky (which neither unit is).

I am judging Elincia by what the game offers her. And as i explained before. The maps she's in don't allow her strengths to shine. They incapacitate her most valuable assets and highlight her weaknesses. That's why she's a dead weight to me. he bases aren't anything special either for being third tier. I am not going to judge a character on their potential. It's the same logic as sayingNino is better than Pent because she has better stats at 20/20.  

Elincia is stuck at being third tier with decent bases during part two, which become incredibly mediocre come part 4. To list her contributions, which, as I said, I will take from my own gameplay, since my opinion about her inclusion in fates is based upon my experiences playing through the game:

PoR: Nothing of note. a detriment in Clash, and an occasional heal in endgame.

2-P: A mend here and there, she's not going to see combat. She won't be getting a level up here. Her movement is a non issue here since she just heals every now and then. Haar and Nealuchi can rout the map in 4 turns so the map does nothing to make her assets as a unti stand out.

2-E The map is easily cleared by Haar on Turn 2 or 3. Elincia contributes nothing. She gains maybe 1 or 2 mends worth of exp. I am not waiting the full 12 turns, because I said, i am not going to grind exp and funnel resources into one unit, since by that metric, anyone can solo maps. Her movement and amiti are wasted here since she contributes nothing of worth to the objective, defeating the boss.

3-10: She's actually not hardcoded to flee. She's hardcoded to stay in between your army and the enemies army as much as possible, highlighting her sentiment of wanting to end the fighting. So from turn 1 to turn 3 - 5, depending on how fast you play, she's pretty much hardcoded to go right, into the enemy. And the boss and his troops consist of many bow paladins. So yeah, she's a hindrance here.  

Part four I already mentioned she can finally use her move and canto, but by now her stats are falling behind and she won't see much combat. So yeah, the first map she actually, as i mentioned before, is able to do what she was intended to do. Have great range and healing. Shame it's at the very end of the game. End game she can be asked to join, but why bother when she is still at most 3 levels above base level. There are far better performing units to take into the tower. So even with regular use, Elincia just does not get enough healing or combat in to grow into a respectable unit. In most LTC's you won't see her used that much because the game gives you tools to clear the map that hardly require Elincia and thus she won't gain enough Exp to warrant a spot in the tower. 

 

So, to once again make my point abundantly clear. Elincia might have the movement and canto, but the game hardly ever lets her use it effectively. She's very similar to Fiona, a cavalier that gets a -2 move penalty in her only part 1 maps, then can't leave the starting area in 3-6 and is then stuck on ledge duty in the later part three maps. The game never allows her strengths to shine, and actively hampers her as a unit. Elincia is in the same vein, a unit that might have high move, but ultimately gets stuck in the same space the entire time because the maps don't play to her strengths. Thus, for me she feels like an armour unit, stuck in one place the entire time.

 

[Jotari]

2 hours ago, Vicious Sal said:

I am judging Elincia by what the game offers her. And as i explained before. The maps she's in don't allow her strengths to shine. They incapacitate her most valuable assets and highlight her weaknesses. That's why she's a dead weight to me. he bases aren't anything special either for being third tier. I am not going to judge a character on their potential. It's the same logic as sayingNino is better than Pent because she has better stats at 20/20.  

Elincia is stuck at being third tier with decent bases during part two, which become incredibly mediocre come part 4. To list her contributions, which, as I said, I will take from my own gameplay, since my opinion about her inclusion in fates is based upon my experiences playing through the game:

PoR: Nothing of note. a detriment in Clash, and an occasional heal in endgame.

2-P: A mend here and there, she's not going to see combat. She won't be getting a level up here. Her movement is a non issue here since she just heals every now and then. Haar and Nealuchi can rout the map in 4 turns so the map does nothing to make her assets as a unti stand out.

2-E The map is easily cleared by Haar on Turn 2 or 3. Elincia contributes nothing. She gains maybe 1 or 2 mends worth of exp. I am not waiting the full 12 turns, because I said, i am not going to grind exp and funnel resources into one unit, since by that metric, anyone can solo maps. Her movement and amiti are wasted here since she contributes nothing of worth to the objective, defeating the boss.

3-10: She's actually not hardcoded to flee. She's hardcoded to stay in between your army and the enemies army as much as possible, highlighting her sentiment of wanting to end the fighting. So from turn 1 to turn 3 - 5, depending on how fast you play, she's pretty much hardcoded to go right, into the enemy. And the boss and his troops consist of many bow paladins. So yeah, she's a hindrance here.  

Part four I already mentioned she can finally use her move and canto, but by now her stats are falling behind and she won't see much combat. So yeah, the first map she actually, as i mentioned before, is able to do what she was intended to do. Have great range and healing. Shame it's at the very end of the game. End game she can be asked to join, but why bother when she is still at most 3 levels above base level. There are far better performing units to take into the tower. So even with regular use, Elincia just does not get enough healing or combat in to grow into a respectable unit. In most LTC's you won't see her used that much because the game gives you tools to clear the map that hardly require Elincia and thus she won't gain enough Exp to warrant a spot in the tower. 

 

So, to once again make my point abundantly clear. Elincia might have the movement and canto, but the game hardly ever lets her use it effectively. She's very similar to Fiona, a cavalier that gets a -2 move penalty in her only part 1 maps, then can't leave the starting area in 3-6 and is then stuck on ledge duty in the later part three maps. The game never allows her strengths to shine, and actively hampers her as a unit. Elincia is in the same vein, a unit that might have high move, but ultimately gets stuck in the same space the entire time because the maps don't play to her strengths. Thus, for me she feels like an armour unit, stuck in one place the entire time.

 

It's not about how shitty a unit you subjectively think she is. It's about what kind of unit she is actually designed to be. The logic your using is "I don't bother to train her and perfer to use other units, therefore she's an armoured unit." Despite the fact that her most noteworthy trait, high movement, is the opposite to what armours are known for. Even take all of your criticisms as legitimate (which I don't, especially for 2-E) none of them even equal armoured unit. Because armored unit isn't a synonym for crappy unit. Even if Elincia had zero offensive capabilities and was hard coded to die in a single hit, she still wouldn't be played like an armoued unit by the simple fact that she has high movement and the ability to canto.

Edited April 10, 2020 by Jotari

[Lightcosmo]

14 hours ago, Anacybele said:

We all agree that legendary Elincia should be a flying healer, I believe. It's a pretty rare unit type and we don't need yet another sword legendary, that's for sure. Elincia doesn't have a staff that's really associated with her, so the question of which one she'd have is a valid one. Make your pick in the poll! 🙂

I could be wrong, but aren't there equal bow legendary's to swords? Lucina, Alm, Chrom, Leif, and Lyn, compared to Eirika, Eliwood, Ike, Lif, And Marth? Saying there are "too many" is silly. And that's if you count Lif as a "Legendary" unit.

On topic: I personally don't like Elincia as a character, but if she gets in, i'm happy for her fans. Actually, in PoR she's alright, since she kinda grows into a stonger character, but then RD makes her this weak ruler again. Like, they went backwards on her character development with that one, in my opinion.

Edited April 10, 2020 by lightcosmo

[Vicious Sal]

45 minutes ago, Jotari said:

It's not about how shitty a unit you subjectively think she is. It's about what kind of unit she is actually designed to be. The logic your using is "I don't bother to train her and perfer to use other units, therefore she's an armoured unit." Despite the fact that her most noteworthy trait, high movement, is the opposite to what armours are known for. Even take all of your criticisms as legitimate (which I don't, especially for 2-E) none of them even equal armoured unit. Because armored unit isn't a synonym for crappy unit. Even if Elincia had zero offensive capabilities and was hard coded to die in a single hit, she still wouldn't be played like an armoued unit by the simple fact that she has high movement and the ability to canto.

The entire premise of why I would prefer her to be an armoured unit is based on subjective opinion, since, it's, you know, my opinion. 

My logic also isn't that I do not bother to train her, therefore she's an armoured unit. My logic is: "The game gives me te tools to play the maps in such a way that Elincia does not see much use and her possible movement therefore is wasted on me. She may as well be an armour unit since she doesn't need to go anywhere anyway for me to beat the maps in an efficient manner." 

Elincia could have 99 move for all I care, if all I need is Haar and Leanne and a Hammer to quickly beat the map, she may as well have no movement at all. Being an armour unit does not immediately make you a crappy unit, that's true. but the reverse also holds true. A high move flier isn't immediately a good unit. My way of playing through the game is fast paced, and every single map where Elincia features before part 4 does not provide her an effective role within that play style. And when part 4 rolls around, she's a backline healer and lacks the stats to get into the tower. So for me, since we are still discussing if I should find my own reasoning for preferring Elincia as an armour staff in feh based upon my own play style, Elincia tends to just sit in a corner and occasionally heal. And that makes her feel as an armour unit type in feh, since they also never get around anywhere. 

So you go ahead and keep saying I'm not preferring Elincia to be an armour unit in Feh, but the fact remains that the way I play, she never goes anywhere, and based on those feelings, combined with the fact that she gets dragged along everywhere in the story instead of being a driving force for the narrative herself, makes me feel as if she performs similar to an Armour move type unit in feh, and that is why i personally, in my own opinion, that is based upon my own play style, which I have continually stated, wll continue to prefer armour staff Elincia in feh. 

I'm not saying Elincia plays like an Armour knight for everyone in Radiant Dawn and PoR. I am saying that based upon my play style she does, and that that is why I would rather see as an Armour unit in a different game. 

 

 

EDIT: It's fine to have a different preference based upon your own opinion, but right now you are arguing that MY preferences, based upon MY experiences and opinions regarding PoR and RD, are wrong because you have a different opinion. 

If I said I'd prefer an Elincia alt with green and blue colour scheme because I had a Tv that only had those colours and i found her art pretty in that colour scheme, you'd be saying i was wrong for liking that because she canonically has write and gold colour scheme. Yes, canonically she does, but does that mean I am wrong in preferring Blue/Green outfit because that's how she looked when I played the game? 

Besides, if people want to throw around the term "canonically" in Feh, Elincia could be literally anything. As has been shown with examples earlier in the topic. 

 

So, I'd kindly ask you to quit telling me my preferences based upon my own experiences are wrong, since you know, to each their own?

Edited April 10, 2020 by Vicious Sal

[Anacybele]

7 hours ago, Vicious Sal said:

I don't really care about if Micaiah gets Matrona or not in an alt, but just wanted to show a comparison of the in game model. It's Matrona she's wielding in the cutscene.

I still can't tell if I compare this image, sorry. Maybe it's my eyesight, since it isn't actually the best.

7 hours ago, Vicious Sal said:

Regarding Elincia; I Don't think Elincia should be up for contention for a Legendary Alt. The entire game of PoR she pretty much gets dragged along and does rather little.

She's still the main female of the game and is also considered a lead by IS as well. And Ryoma, Tiki, and Julia all got to be legendaries, and they're not main characters of their games, as they weren't even part of the leads banner. Elincia was, so why would she not be up for contention?

Micaiah should not be a flying legendary because by the time she is queen of Daein, she is no longer Yune's vessel and it was Yune that allowed her to fly. Also, she'd be far too similar to Elincia if both are flying healers.

Edited April 10, 2020 by Anacybele

[Vicious Sal]

43 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I still can't tell if I compare this image, sorry. Maybe it's my eyesight, since it isn't actually the best.

She's still the main female of the game and is also considered a lead by IS as well. And Ryoma, Tiki, and Julia all got to be legendaries, and they're not main characters of their games, as they weren't even part of the leads banner. Elincia was, so why would she not be up for contention?

Micaiah should not be a flying legendary because by the time she is queen of Daein, she is no longer Yune's vessel and it was Yune that allowed her to fly. Also, she'd be far too similar to Elincia if both are flying healers.

She’s holding it with the top cross at the lowest point. 

 

Regarding Ryoma, yeah, not exactly would consider his feats legendary either. 

Julia is debatable, though the lack of Seliph or Sigurd makes it weirder. 

Tiki would be better suited as a Mythic, just as Nagi. 

 

 

And being too similar is why I stated my preference earlier in the topic.

[Anacybele]

Just now, Vicious Sal said:

She’s holding it with the top cross at the lowest point. 

I know how she's holding it, that isn't the problem. I can't see all the details on it clearly enough.

1 minute ago, Vicious Sal said:

Regarding Ryoma, yeah, not exactly would consider his feats legendary either. 

Julia is debatable, though the lack of Seliph or Sigurd makes it weirder. 

Tiki would be better suited as a Mythic, just as Nagi. 

 

 

And being too similar is why I stated my preference earlier in the topic.

Not to mention Ryoma and Azura without Corrin now is also weird. But the point is that these legendaries exist, so there's no reason they would and legendary Elincia shouldn't imo. I'm not sure I'd have thought Lincy was up for contention if not for those three, honestly.

Sorry about that, I didn't read through the whole topic yet, there are a lot of posts.

[Othin]

1 hour ago, Anacybele said:

I still can't tell if I compare this image, sorry. Maybe it's my eyesight, since it isn't actually the best.

She's still the main female of the game and is also considered a lead by IS as well. And Ryoma, Tiki, and Julia all got to be legendaries, and they're not main characters of their games, as they weren't even part of the leads banner. Elincia was, so why would she not be up for contention?

Micaiah should not be a flying legendary because by the time she is queen of Daein, she is no longer Yune's vessel and it was Yune that allowed her to fly. Also, she'd be far too similar to Elincia if both are flying healers.

You're right about Ryoma and Tiki, but Julia is actually on the leads banner. 

[Anacybele]

3 minutes ago, Othin said:

You're right about Ryoma and Tiki, but Julia is actually on the leads banner. 

Oh yeah, she was, that's right. But my point does still stand about Ryoma and Tiki, yes.

[Othin]

1 minute ago, Anacybele said:

Oh yeah, she was, that's right. But my point does still stand about Ryoma and Tiki, yes.

Indeed. I think there are some units on the lead banner that would have less reason to be legendary than those two (such as Nanna, Caeda, and Lilina) but Elincia isn't one of them. 

[Florete]

I'm the first "Other" vote. Interesting.

While it has been the case for some, most legendaries don't have their alt weapon. I think Micaiah has a good chance of being a staff legendary since her brave variant wasn't and there's no special tome for her in RD other than Thani, but I think legendary Elincia will come with a special version of Amiti. As for what it will do, well, these days that's anyone's guess.

[Anacybele]

2 hours ago, Florete said:

I think legendary Elincia will come with a special version of Amiti.

Ugh, please NO. Not when 1. we have so many sword legendaries already, and 2. we still don't have any form of a healer Elincia when staves are her second thing. Sorry, but I just really don't want another Amiti Elincia yet. >_<

Edited April 10, 2020 by Anacybele

[Icelerate]

7 hours ago, lightcosmo said:

On topic: I personally don't like Elincia as a character, but if she gets in, i'm happy for her fans. Actually, in PoR she's alright, since she kinda grows into a stonger character, but then RD makes her this weak ruler again. Like, they went backwards on her character development with that one, in my opinion.

Elincia is a strong ruler so I don't know where you came to that conclusion but okay. She's definitely a stronger leader than in PoR where she really doesn't show much leadership capability. 

[Anacybele]

23 minutes ago, Icelerate said:

Elincia is a strong ruler so I don't know where you came to that conclusion but okay. She's definitely a stronger leader than in PoR where she really doesn't show much leadership capability. 

Elincia is a weak and inexperienced ruler at first, even in RD. This is noted how her mistakes cost Lucia her hair and almost her life. But she toughens up as a person and a leader afterward.

And I mean, she wasn't raised in court or ever taught much about politics and junk. She isn't just going to suddenly be a good queen when she gets crowned. It's unrealistic.

The way I see it, PoR Elincia grows as a character and warrior. RD Lincy grows as a leader.

Edited April 10, 2020 by Anacybele

[Lightcosmo]

2 hours ago, Icelerate said:

Elincia is a strong ruler so I don't know where you came to that conclusion but okay. She's definitely a stronger leader than in PoR where she really doesn't show much leadership capability. 

In PoR, she actually learns something and grows with Ike, in RD, what does she all accomplish that helps her character?

[Diovani Bressan]

1. I thing the pool should have the "I don't want Legendary Elincia to be a Staff unit" option. I am not saying that I would pick it, but...

2. Ana's idea of a skillset could have an option in case she is a Pair Up Hero, since C Duel Flying wouldn't be that good in this case.

Anyway, I am one of the people who thinks she shouldn't be a Legendary Hero... She is not that Legendary for me, but you could also say it about Ryoma and all Nifl family. Seasonal Flying Healer? I am fine with that.

[Anacybele]

1 hour ago, lightcosmo said:

In PoR, she actually learns something and grows with Ike, in RD, what does she all accomplish that helps her character?

She stood up to Ludveck as best as she could because she didn't believe Crimea would be in good hands with him on the throne. She literally disarmed herself to get Zelgius to stand down, and successfully (until Valtome made him attack anyway, but Elincia could never have foreseen this, she was focused on Zelgius who WAS trying to avoid a fight since he said he would not harm an unarmed woman. She had no idea Valtome was there). And though I'm not 100% certain that Elincia actually fully made the choice rather than being completely indecisive until it was too late, she was going to let Lucia die so she could remain on the throne and protect Crimea and its people instead of sacrificing it to Ludveck save her best friend and stepsister. To stand there and let that happen, to watch it happen, even if Lincy wasn't completely decided on it, took real guts and courage. She wasn't expecting Ike and his group to show up, after all.

Edited April 11, 2020 by Anacybele

[Jotari]

12 hours ago, Vicious Sal said:

The entire premise of why I would prefer her to be an armoured unit is based on subjective opinion, since, it's, you know, my opinion. 

My logic also isn't that I do not bother to train her, therefore she's an armoured unit. My logic is: "The game gives me te tools to play the maps in such a way that Elincia does not see much use and her possible movement therefore is wasted on me. She may as well be an armour unit since she doesn't need to go anywhere anyway for me to beat the maps in an efficient manner." 

Elincia could have 99 move for all I care, if all I need is Haar and Leanne and a Hammer to quickly beat the map, she may as well have no movement at all. Being an armour unit does not immediately make you a crappy unit, that's true. but the reverse also holds true. A high move flier isn't immediately a good unit. My way of playing through the game is fast paced, and every single map where Elincia features before part 4 does not provide her an effective role within that play style. And when part 4 rolls around, she's a backline healer and lacks the stats to get into the tower. So for me, since we are still discussing if I should find my own reasoning for preferring Elincia as an armour staff in feh based upon my own play style, Elincia tends to just sit in a corner and occasionally heal. And that makes her feel as an armour unit type in feh, since they also never get around anywhere. 

So you go ahead and keep saying I'm not preferring Elincia to be an armour unit in Feh, but the fact remains that the way I play, she never goes anywhere, and based on those feelings, combined with the fact that she gets dragged along everywhere in the story instead of being a driving force for the narrative herself, makes me feel as if she performs similar to an Armour move type unit in feh, and that is why i personally, in my own opinion, that is based upon my own play style, which I have continually stated, wll continue to prefer armour staff Elincia in feh. 

I'm not saying Elincia plays like an Armour knight for everyone in Radiant Dawn and PoR. I am saying that based upon my play style she does, and that that is why I would rather see as an Armour unit in a different game. 

 

 

EDIT: It's fine to have a different preference based upon your own opinion, but right now you are arguing that MY preferences, based upon MY experiences and opinions regarding PoR and RD, are wrong because you have a different opinion. 

If I said I'd prefer an Elincia alt with green and blue colour scheme because I had a Tv that only had those colours and i found her art pretty in that colour scheme, you'd be saying i was wrong for liking that because she canonically has write and gold colour scheme. Yes, canonically she does, but does that mean I am wrong in preferring Blue/Green outfit because that's how she looked when I played the game? 

Besides, if people want to throw around the term "canonically" in Feh, Elincia could be literally anything. As has been shown with examples earlier in the topic. 

 

So, I'd kindly ask you to quit telling me my preferences based upon my own experiences are wrong, since you know, to each their own?

I'm not saying you can't have a subjective opinion. I'm just challenging your logic which absolutely is "Shitty unit = armoured unit." I'm not even trying to argue that "High Move Flier = Good unit." I'm trying to argue that "High Move Flier != Armoured Unit", which I think should be alarmingly obvious. Your fine to hold an opinion, it just doesn't make sense.

[Roflolxp54]

I voted in the New Staff group -- they could very well create a brand new Prf staff. 

That said, it's hard to see what they could do to make Elincia stand out aside from being a Pair-Up Legendary unit (which by itself would be a great thing for her since Allegiance Battles would be much more bearable if there's a powerful healer to use assuming she is a Legendary healer unit). IS has generally been pretty cautious with healers after the Weapon Refinery update in 2017 since that's when healers became really strong (Razzle Dazzle) and right now, only Veronica, Fjorm, and Camilla have Prf staves.

[SSbardock84]

A new staff imo. But I think I'd prefer her with Amiti.