Serenes Forest's Teehee Thread

[Acacia Sgt]

1 minute ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Make Russia pay Ukraine's debts, then? I don't know how that's going to go down, especially if these mercenaries do end up taking over - and, y'know, gaining control over the nukes. Be that it could be so easy, but I don't know.

Like I said, the frozen assets. The stuff Russia doesn't have on its own soil.

1 minute ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I think it's rather naïve to expect superpowers like the US of A to just take millions' worth of military equipment to some country they couldn't point out on a map before this whole thing started and gift it all to them for free out of the goodness of their hearts. On the contrary, this was the perfect chance to move all that outdated stuff out of the warehouses and get some extra buck out of it, and looking good while at it. Then they reap the benefits when the time is right. Maybe when the war is over they'll start airing out some dirty laundry of Zelenski's to make the payment demands acceptable. And the ones who get screwed over are, as usual, the common folk who get an economic catastrophe added on top of everything else.

...Or, perhaps I'm being overly cynical here. With any luck, I'll be wrong. I just don't think it can possibly be so simple as "country gets invaded and everyone else rushes to their aid because they're very kind-hearted like that."

Yes, it's overly cynical.

Yes, Ukraine will be expected to pay back for all the help, but resorting to things like blackmailing is quite unlikely. Trump got his first impeachment for trying that. As Ukraine integrates more and more to the West, it is going to change how and how much they'll have to.

 

[Armagon]

15 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Make Russia pay Ukraine's debts, then? I don't know how that's going to go down, especially if these mercenaries do end up taking over - and, y'know, gaining control over the nukes. Be that it could be so easy, but I don't know.

The last time we made a bankrupt country pay off someone else's debts, they started WW2.

[Acacia Sgt]

2 minutes ago, Armagon said:

The last time we made a bankrupt country pay off someone else's debts, they started WW2.

Russia is not going to bankrupt, even after all this.

At the very least expect China to prop them up. Becoming the bigger partner of the anti-US faction is certainly one thing they wouldn't mind happening...

Edited June 24, 2023 by Acacia Sgt

[Codename Shrimp]

Soft power/expanding influence is nuch more important than some measly pocket change

[Armagon]

9 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Russia is not going to bankrupt, even after all this.

Yeah it's definitely in a better shape than Germany was after WW1 but I believe Russia's currency has hit rock bottom in terms of value? Last I heard of it at least. Repaying debts when your currency means jack shit is gonna be pretty difficult.

11 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

the very least expect China to prop them up. Becoming the bigger partner of the anti-US faction is certainly one thing they wouldn't mind happening

Surprised this hasn't happened already in some form.

Of course it also depends on how much conflict China wants I think. China wants Taiwan and is opposed to the US but they ain't stupid, they know just how much of their economy benefits from selling overseas. Even taking Taiwan would ultimately do more harm to them than any benefits.

[Saint Rubenio]

Just now, Acacia Sgt said:

Like I said, the frozen assets. The stuff Russia doesn't have on its own soil.

Yes, it's overly cynical.

Yes, Ukraine will be expected to pay back for all the help, but resorting to things like blackmailing is quite unlikely. Trump got his first impeachment for trying that. As Ukraine integrates more and more to the West, it is going to change how and how much they'll have to.

I can only hope you are correct. The Ukranian people don't need more shit flung at them.

Just now, Armagon said:

The last time we made a bankrupt country pay off someone else's debts, they started WW2.

This time nukes are a factor. War is a much more delicate prospect now, because war could bring human history to a close permanently. There's a reason aid has stopped at sending Ukraine things, and nobody has dared to really turn up the heat against Russia. They have nukes. The genocide of all living beings on Planet Earth is not something anyone wants.

1 minute ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Soft power/expanding influence is nuch more important than some measly pocket change

That is true. Getting Ukraine in NATO so they can put nasty stuff right at Russia's doorstep was always the ultimate goal here. The big problem is that, again, Russia has nukes. Ukraine used to have nukes too, once, but they were taken. None of this would've happened if that hadn't been the case.

[Capt. Fargus]

12 hours ago, Armagon said:

It's always fascinating to hear stories of the old school gaming. I didn't get seriously into gaming until the tail end of the Wii's lifespan (despite having it since launch year) so the jump in gaming power felt huge compared to when i looked at old consoles, from my point of view.

Back around 1980 or so my older brother got an Atari 2600 as a present. Couple years later he discovered girls, so I inherited the game. I about wore that console out becoming the baddest pacman player around 😎

Then along came one winter day in 1987 when the eastern US got rocked by one hellacious snow storm that closed schools for a couple days. I grabbed a shovel and went around banging on peoples’ doors asking if they wanted their walkways shoveled for $7 a pop. After about 12 hours of that I had the 75 bucks I bought my NES with, and my first few great adventures there were LoZ, Metroid, and Metal Gear

You’re a Zelda fan so you might appreciate this. 

I was hung up on Adventure of Link for the longest time. Beat the Maze Island palace and couldn’t figure out what to do next. I skipped out on a fire drill one day in school so I could sneak a peek at somebody’s Nintendo Power magazine and take some notes. 😁

Got yelled at but it solved the game problem Lol

[Acacia Sgt]

8 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Yeah it's definitely in a better shape than Germany was after WW1 but I believe Russia's currency has hit rock bottom in terms of value? Last I heard of it at least. Repaying debts when your currency means jack shit is gonna be pretty difficult.

No, it just went back to pre-war levels, from what I recall. Or rather, it's not rock bottom yet.

Russia is still making a profit, or only losing a paltry difference at the moment. They still have ways of making profit, but right now they're not a lot sustainable during the war. Which is part of the West's strategy with all the sanctions and stuff.

8 minutes ago, Armagon said:

Surprised this hasn't happened already in some form.

Of course it also depends on how much conflict China wants I think. China wants Taiwan and is opposed to the US but they ain't stupid, they know just how much of their economy benefits from selling overseas. Even taking Taiwan would ultimately do more harm to them than any benefits.

Well, China has seen they can't count on Russia being a good distraction to make their move. Best case scenario any issues over Taiwan have been delayed.

7 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

That is true. Getting Ukraine in NATO so they can put nasty stuff right at Russia's doorstep was always the ultimate goal here. The big problem is that, again, Russia has nukes. Ukraine used to have nukes too, once, but they were taken. None of this would've happened if that hadn't been the case.

That hasn't happened even when Poland and the Baltics joined. This isn't the 1960's with nukes being put in places like Turkey and Cuba.

The whole threat-from-NATO has always been an excuse. Russia wants irredentism for their old Empire, which the former parts of it definitely do not want. Hence wanting to join NATO to begin with. Just look at Finland and Sweden. Decades of neutrality shattered because of Russia's warmongering, and now you have Ukraine wanting to join too. There's a reason Putin has been memed as being NATO's best recruiter.

Edited June 24, 2023 by Acacia Sgt

[Acacia Sgt]

Ultimately, a big lesson to be learned here is that the era of buffer and/or neutral states is long dead, and a more heavy emphasis on MAD doctrine. Countries like Belarus, Ukraine, and Kazakhstan gave up on their nuke stockpiles for safety guarantees. And look where are they know. Belarus one step away from full vassalage (or is it? Word is that Lukashenko's plane is in Turkiye), Ukraine invaded, and Kazakhstan forming closer ties with China.

Edited June 24, 2023 by Acacia Sgt

[Codename Shrimp]

18 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Getting Ukraine in NATO so they can put nasty stuff right at Russia's doorstep was always the ultimate goal here. T

Not really. Without the war Ukraine would've never been accepted into NATO

Putin is like the best thing NATO, and especially the US, could've asked for

Edited June 24, 2023 by Shrimpy -Limited Edition-

[Sidereal Wraith]

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Wraith, that's... literally what they're saying, that it doesn't matter where you're born, but rather who you want to be going forward.

You can't just quote a passage and then proceed to whine about something that doesn't even apply to it, dude. You should know that, you're the reader extraordinaire among us!

Everyone is gunning for my ass today.

1 hour ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

or so he claims

https://www.goodreads.com/user/show/108291642-sidereal-wraith

Edited June 24, 2023 by Sidereal Wraith

[Saint Rubenio]

2 minutes ago, Capt. Fargus said:

Back around 1980 or so my older brother got an Atari 2600 as a present. Couple years later he discovered girls, so I inherited the game. I about wore that console out becoming the baddest pacman player around 😎

Weakling, he should've found himself a G A M E R   G R I L L so he didn't have to sacrifice either

3 minutes ago, Capt. Fargus said:

Then along came one winter day in 1987 when the eastern US got rocked by one hellacious snow storm that closed schools for a couple days. I grabbed a shovel and went around banging on peoples’ doors asking if they wanted their walkways shoveled for $7 a pop. After about 12 hours of that I had the 75 bucks I bought my NES with, and my first few great adventures there were LoZ, Metroid, and Metal Gear

Sounds like one hell of an adventure of its own to get those adventures lol. My story was a lot simpler, my parents didn't want to buy me consoles so my mom just set me up with fangames, emulators and ROMs. In fact, Mario fangames are some of my earliest gaming memories.

Just now, Acacia Sgt said:

That hasn't happened even when Poland and the Baltics joined. This isn't the 1960's with nukes being put in places like Turkey and Cuba.

The whole threat-from-NATO has always been an excuse. Russia wants irredentism for their old Empire, which the former parts of it definitely do not want. Hence wanting to join NATO to begin with. Just look at Finland and Sweden. Decades of neutrality shattered because of Russia's warmongering. There's a reason Putin has been memed as being NATO's best recruiter.

 

Just now, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

Not really. Without the war Ukraine would've never been accepted into NATO

I seemed to recall they were looking likely to enter NATO before the war began. Looking back, they were actually fairly unlikely precisely because Ukraine in NATO would force certain commitments when the inevitable conflict began. My apologies, I had the order of events wrong.

Just now, Acacia Sgt said:

Ultimately, a big lesson to be learned here is that the era of buffer and/or neutral states is long dead, and a more heavy emphasis on MAD doctrine. Countries like Belarus, Ukraine, and Kazakhstan gave up on their nuke stockpiles for safety guarantees. And look where are they know. Belarus one step away from full vassalage (or is it? Word is that Lukashenko's plane is in Turkiye), Ukraine invaded, and Kazakhstan forming closer ties with China.

Pretty much. If Ukraine hadn't given up their nukes, this wouldn't have happened. The nasty truth is that everyone needs nukes now, because anyone who doesn't finds themselves in the position where it's better to let them burn than risk nuclear armaggedon with the bigger guy that does have nukes.

[Codename Shrimp]

3 minutes ago, Sidereal Wraith said:

Everyone gunning for my ass today

You are Putin confirmed?

[Codename Shrimp]

Just now, Saint Rubenio said:

seemed to recall they were looking likely to enter NATO before the war began.

They might've wanted it, but many NATO countries were against the idea

And you need every NATO member to agree to join

[Acacia Sgt]

Just now, Saint Rubenio said:

I seemed to recall they were looking likely to enter NATO before the war began. Looking back, they were actually fairly unlikely precisely because Ukraine in NATO would force certain commitments when the inevitable conflict began. My apologies, I had the order of events wrong.

Mostly because of the issue with the separatist republics.

This was part of Putin's strategy. It's the reason you have the likes of Transnistria, South Ossetia, Abskhazia, etc. Georgia was heading into a pro-EU and pro-NATO too... then Russia invaded in 2008 to stop that.

Just now, Saint Rubenio said:

Pretty much. If Ukraine hadn't given up their nukes, this wouldn't have happened. The nasty truth is that everyone needs nukes now, because anyone who doesn't finds themselves in the position where it's better to let them burn than risk nuclear armaggedon with the bigger guy that does have nukes.

Either that or quickly get under the protection of someone who does. But yeah, the former is becoming more desirable as it gives you more freedom of choice.

[Acacia Sgt]

For that matter, it's also the reason the Euromaidan happened.

Ukraine was already looking towards the West... then Yanukovitch got elected, and began to regress the process. Then when he got ousted, it's when Russian began to make noise on Crimea and the Donbass.

Edited June 24, 2023 by Acacia Sgt

[Saint Rubenio]

2 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

You are Putin confirmed?

Oh Jesus, c'mon I know Wraith can have his idiosyncrasies, but he's not that bad lol

1 minute ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Either that or quickly get under the protection of someone who does. But yeah, the former is becoming more desirable as it gives you more freedom of choice.

...It's a really fucking depressing thing, isn't it. The ability to destroy the planet shouldn't be a mandatory cautionary meassure. Alas, it's what we have come to as a species.

[Codename Shrimp]

6 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

The ability to destroy the planet shouldn't be a mandatory cautionary meassure.

It's the only way we can have peace

[Saint Rubenio]

1 minute ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

It's the only way we can have peace

No yeah, I know. It shouldn't have gotten to this point, is what I'm saying, but well... It has, so we do what we gotta do.

[Saint Rubenio]

 

[Acacia Sgt]

Goomba with the Rest strategy from Jigglypuff.

[Codename Shrimp]

So

was it all a prank or something

[Acacia Sgt]

2 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

So

was it all a prank or something

The Russia thing?

It may be a bit early to tell. Since we don't know what exactly was negotiated, if there was a deal reached.

[Acacia Sgt]

It is overall odd, however. Feint or not, Prigozhin basically showed Putin was weak, as he could march too close to Moscow, downed a few helicopters, and apparently it was Lukashenko who negotiated with him, not Putin, who may or may have not fled to St. Petersburg. Even if he can still oust Shoigu from head of MoD, he may have to start to watch his back...

[Saint Rubenio]

4 minutes ago, Shrimpy -Limited Edition- said:

So

was it all a prank or something

Epic prank on my boss (GONE WRONG) (GONE SEXUAL) (GONE BANANAS) (SUBSCRIBE!!) @xXPROgozhinXx

 

2 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

It is overall odd, however. Feint or not, Prigozhin basically showed Putin was weak, as he could march too close to Moscow, downed a few helicopters, and apparently it was Lukashenko who negotiated with him, not Putin, who may or may have not fled to St. Petersburg. Even if he can still oust Shoigu from head of MoD, he may have to start to watch his back...

It would certainly make him look rather feeble if he panicked and ran for the hills over the shortest civil war in the history of mankind.