Kemono Friends Mafia - Game Over

[DefaultBeep]

7 minutes ago, Mackc2 said:

Yeah you are right Beep you should have voted your opposing wagon unless that happened to mean lynching a scum buddy. Lets assume you are town for a second, you do not know Rex is town you see the lynch will be between you or Rex, you know you are town, You do not know if Rex is town so you should vote Rex because that way there is some chance the person being lynched isn't town. 

Alright, I went back to see when the big push for Rex happened in relation to when I started being busy. This:

On 10/27/2017 at 12:37 PM, DefaultBeep said:

Hey all, I'm here, but I may not be able to be active much in this last stretch, I've got family visiting soon. I'll do my best to be as active as I can, though.

Was the last thing I was able to post before the end of the day period. The whole "be as active as I can" thing clearly didn't work out well. But this was a bit before the final and strongest stretch against Rex started. It was also after he was supposed to be more active I think, but at the time I wasn't really able to do much because I was busy and in a rush.

Also, haven't multiple people been called scummy in this very thread for trying to push heat off of themselves when they're the biggest suspects? Again, too late to do anything about that now, and I didn't have much of a chance to do that at the time anyway, but that was the impression I gathered so far.

[Bluedoom]

Tbh it is possible that the entire scumteam just voted greencapps D2 and tried to get a lynch off of him lol.

Anyway DB as you might've seen already, your defence doesn't hold. You say that maybe voting Rex could've changed our minds in that scenario except it couldn't because a viable Rex wagon did not exist when you left. Which means had you voted Rex, it wouldn't have looked bad at all. The real problem is that you didn't ever mention Rex after D1 in a notable manner. Note that this isn't my only issue with you. In general it feels like you wait for other people to make cases before voting, I don't know if this is because of timezones but that has been a consistent pattern in your voting history.

[DefaultBeep]

2 minutes ago, Magnificence Incarnate said:

Anyway DB as you might've seen already, your defence doesn't hold. You say that maybe voting Rex could've changed our minds in that scenario except it couldn't because a viable Rex wagon did not exist when you left. Which means had you voted Rex, it wouldn't have looked bad at all. The real problem is that you didn't ever mention Rex after D1 in a notable manner. Note that this isn't my only issue with you. In general it feels like you wait for other people to make cases before voting, I don't know if this is because of timezones but that has been a consistent pattern in your voting history.

True, I didn't mention Rex in a notable manner in Day 2, largely because of his inactivity. I assumed he was still busy at first, and I had already addressed that during Day 1; then, later on, I was either too busy to make mention of him or others in detail, or I just forgot about him outright. And then when he was the main topic of discussion, I was the other big suspect, and I frankly didn't know what the best thing to do was in that situation, as I'm beginning to find out.

For what it's worth, regardless of if it changes anything or not, my timezone is PST, but I'm normally not online until after 12-1 PM, and then my activity from there pretty much depends on what's going on that day. Feel free to make whatever you want of that information.

[SB.]

I’d be down with a DB lynch because the way the d2 wagons went down was a bit ridiculous.

[Anime27Arts]

Hey! I'm here! Sorry guys!  Power went off at my house so I've been able to get online.  I'm out and about right now so that I can get service and what not.  I might not be on at the end of the phase, but I'm going to try to.  I'm going to read through everything I've missed and then I'll post a vote up.

[Anime27Arts]

On 10/29/2017 at 2:57 PM, SB. said:

Now that I have some more time I'll actually formalise this instead of prodding around.

##Vote: Michelaar

Their presence in this game has been pretty low overall and they only really engage with the people who are trying to murder them. Their contributions otherwise have been mostly sparse and insignificant, with votes that leave a lot to bee desired. His vote on Mackc2 during day 1 was for misinterpreting a joke, essentially. As a sidenote Anime had similar logic that I disliked, but her other contributions were stronger.

Speaking of Mich and Anime, I think his response to her vote on him was kind of awful. It basically says "yeah your vote is fine BUT I DIDN'T RESPOND EARLIER BECAUSE I WAS ASLEEP" when iirc nobody called him out on not responding quickly enough. This reads as really, really panicky. I also find it baffling that they Never Had An Opinion On Arcanite (capitalised because what the fuck) when they were the main wagon until the end of Day 1. There's no way that a townie actually does this.

Moving on to Day 2, they open with a short opinion post on every player but never really votes off of it. Greencapps and Mackc are his main opinions but they aren't really substantial, and he says he's not over his Mackc scumread but I don't think he ever addresses Mackc again. He seems to have a negative opinion on flipped scum!Rex, but avoids commiting to saying anything definite about him. Capps votes him for this post and Michelaar attempts to assert his dominance by voting back. Or something like that. It's kind of like what happened today, honestly.

I don't think their conversation with Rex is alignment indicative because it's mostly a clarification thing. What IS telling is their insistance on still killing Greencapps, trying to check if people think he's clear and then saying nothing on Rex despite apparently not liking them much in their start of day post. Again, he doesn't engage in the end of day wagons (only tunnels Green, ignoring DB and Rex) which is not a thing that townies do.

tl;dr Michelaar is not trying to actually figure out the mafia. They rarely do anything that isn't based around survival/being voted and somehow lack opinions on the major wagons of the day which is fucking ridiculous. This doesn't come from someone who's actually trying to scumhunt.

I really feel like SB has a point here.

##Vote Michelaar

Throughout the game Michelaar has only really showed his main opinion when it comes to Greencapps.  Originally he was against Mack for taking a joke seriously, and I'll be the first to admit that I did to, but as the game progressed, I moved on from Mack while Michelaar didn't change his vote at all and stayed with Mack until the end of the rounds based off of him taking a joke the wrong way.  The beginning of the next day he briefly mentions how he doesn't trust Mack but then jumps to the Green wagon and has not gotten off of that wagon sense.  It seems very weird that sense then you haven't truly had much of an opinion on anyone besides Green.  Even when all of these other thoughts and accusations go out, he is still focused on Green.  While I'm not 100% sure Green is town despite the SB fake daykill, I don't think he's suspicious enough to stay on that vote for so long unless there is something that I am missing about Green.  

 

On 10/29/2017 at 4:06 PM, Greencapps said:

Press X to doubt.

Even if you were one you're pretty shit and ends up just helping the scum by being an incredible scapegoat.

Okay while I agree on the Michelaar case this was a bit much.  There seems to be a lot of Vanilla Towns in this game from Bartozio and Boron are flipped Vanilla Town people and you claim to be one as well.  It's not that big of an unbelievable feat that you make it out to be.  I understand not believing his claim 100% but did it really warrant that kind of react because that seemed overboard.

 

Can someone explain the Shinori!Scum to me?  Not claiming quite yet, doesn't necessarily mean they are scum and I don't truly see an arguement against them?

 

As for Beep he seemed to give Rex too much credit for his absences, constantly assuming that he was busy, even when Glacies said he would be active.  I'm not sure if this Beep being super forgiving like he seems to be throughout the game, or covering for his scum buddy.  I'm really not sure which it is and I'm going to look more into Beep whenever I can

[Greencapps]

Ok so I think we need to be looking into consolidating votes.

It seems the consensus is Beep or Mich. I'm fine with both.

Though it seems Mich is the easier to kill without a large push, he has 3 to Beep's 1.

##Unvote

##Vote:Michelaar

Mich is now at L-2 keep that in mind folks!

10 minutes ago, Anime27Arts said:

There seems to be a lot of Vanilla Towns in this game from Bartozio and Boron are flipped Vanilla Town people and you claim to be one as well.  It's not that big of an unbelievable feat that you make it out to be.  I understand not believing his claim 100% but did it really warrant that kind of react because that seemed overboard.

I didn't say that because he claimed vanilla town I said that cause I don't believe him. Plus I'm 100% serious about him being a good scapegoat. If he is town he doesn't contribute much and just draws attention away from real mafians.

[Greencapps]

1 minute ago, Greencapps said:

Though it seems Mich is the easier to kill without a large push, he has 3 to Beep's 1.

Whoops I didn't see Mack's vote make that Beep's 2.

Though I guess retroactively it's valid after my vote switch.

[Refa]

Day 3.3 - Votals


Shinori (2) - Rapier, Arcanite
Michelaar (4) - SB, DefaultBeep, Anime27arts, Greencapps
DefaultBeep (1) - Mackc2
Greencapps (1) - Michelaar

Magnificence Incarnate (1)- Shinori

Not Voting (1): Magnificence Incarnate

You have a little over 3 hours and 30 minutes to decide on a lynch. With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Refa

[Arcanite]

I really don't want to vote Michelaar....

I know the round is ending though, and I'm not gonna be around for the end of it too 

So, I'm going to leave my vote on Shinori (since there is no point in not voting) and I don't want to vote out Mich quite yet.

[Greencapps]

3 minutes ago, Arcanite said:

since there is no point in not voting

Not consolidating is basically not voting.

Paging @Rapier @Magnificence Incarnate @Mackc2

Consolidate please my dudes.

[DefaultBeep]

I would laugh if the one time I actually vote for the main wagon, they end up not having enough votes to be lynched. What great irony that would be.

[Prims]

A little less than 2 hours left in the phase.

[Shinori]

Prodded, I'm here gonna check up on things.

But Arc wtf man what is that reasoning and vote posture?

That is terrible reasoning to leave your vote on me and a terrible idea that could possibly fuck over town.  Leaving your vote on me means if no one else really comes on, NO ONE GETS LYNCHED TODAY.

I'm gonna be slightly blunt here and I do apologize ahead of time but:

Get your head out of your ass and stop solely tunneling me.  If I am scum name reasons for why I'm scum outside of inactivity. I still wanna hear how I'm scum if Rex got lynched and was scum on day 2 when I would have had to kill him there.

What you are doing right now is selfish and bad play just because you think I'm town cause I'm not posting much and you are refusing to help your fellow town members.

Also this just occured to me, We had Arc get jailed, what's the chances that he was actually sent to do the kill and the jailing stopped the kill, as I don't see any reason for scum to actually kill him.

[Shinori]

Day 1 arc is scummy - claims cop.

Night 1 Arc inspects rapier - Guilty inspection

Day 2 Arc tunnels me until the end, last person to vote Rex at the end of the day phase.

Night 2 Arc get's jailed, Arc doesn't get an inspection off, No kill happens.  This either means that Arc was the target of the scum kill, which is partially questionable since he's a potentially insane cop, or he's scum and he was being sent to do the kill, ESPECIALLY since no one was should have been roleblocking him since he was our supposed cop.  Frankly that Arc jail was iffy in the first place BUT no matter what it got us some form of information.

On one side, why would scum shoot arc? To deny us information from the potentially insane cop?  The only reason I see this being the case is if Rapier is scum.  IF rapier is scum then they don't want Arc getting more inspections off since that was Arc's first investigation.  Outside of that there is zero reason for scum to shoot Arc.

On the other side, if he's scum it would explain his poor play, his lack of cases on people(He can't see them as scum because he knows their town), and it would explain why there was no kill last night.  I'm honestly feeling that this might be the best idea for a lynch, especially since he doesn't seem to give a fuck on if town gets a lynch today.

[Shinori]

Will vote mich though since it doesn't seem like we really have people on and I don't see a wagon swap happening at all today.

[Greencapps]

4 minutes ago, Shinori said:

Will vote mich though since it doesn't seem like we really have people on and I don't see a wagon swap happening at all today.

Then do the swap!

[Shinori]

##Unvote:

##Vote: Mich

Was kind of wanting to see if anyone else would be around to talk.

[Shinori]

I actually really think a Rapier or an Arc lynch tomorrow might be smart, I feel that one of them is scum because otherwise last night's actions don't make much sense imo.

[Mackc2]

I see what you are saying shinori there certainly is a chance that arc is scum And I caught them mid kill bit I only jailed them because I thought they would Be the most likely kill target since if arcanite is cop then they have guaranteed the stop of the flow of information and would be taking them out before town is likely to sink resources into them/ trust them 

That said I will finish the Mich lynch but not yet in case someone wants to talk 

[Shinori]

The only issue with Arc being cop is that he is 'potentially' insane. He doesn't know if he is and we don't know if he is.  This means that all the information that comes from him can't be trusted at all until we lynch one of his targets, or he get's multiple inspections all saying the same thing, enough to the point that we could guess whether he is insane or not.  I can see both sides of the argument, I just feel it was a weird time to attempt to kill him considering the situation.

[Mackc2]

Maybe they just wanted him out of the way, I mean some information can still be provided to town from an insane cop even if it is less than a regular cop would and less concrete too it is still more helpful for finding scum during night phrase than any other roll might be.

[DefaultBeep]

If I understand Shinori's points right, it's not a case of whether scum would want to kill off a town Insane/Sane Cop, but when they would want to kill them off. The chances of town Arcanite finding scum during night 2 isn't great, and even then, there's no solid proof for their sanity or insanity until one of the inspected members are lynched. It would get riskier every night for the scum to keep them alive, but Arcanite's ability isn't necessarily an immediate threat early on in the game.

[Mackc2]

I'm definitely not saying that in an arcanite is clear way I still think we should be wary of them however I don't necessarily think they are scum.

So is everyone cool if I end the phrase now?

[Mackc2]

1 minute ago, DefaultBeep said:

If I understand Shinori's points right, it's not a case of whether scum would want to kill off a town Insane/Sane Cop, but when they would want to kill them off. The chances of town Arcanite finding scum during night 2 isn't great, and even then, there's no solid proof for their sanity or insanity until one of the inspected members are lynched. It would get riskier every night for the scum to keep them alive, but Arcanite's ability isn't necessarily an immediate threat early on in the game.

The thing is though town would be less willing to sink resources into our supposed cop early on when they aren't trusted because they might be protecting scum, I only used my role because it was a double edged sword that would also RB whoever i visited making arc useless for the night if they where scum. Thus the doctor is more likely to be somewhere else as with other town protective so it could also be advantageous to tackle the cop before they can prove themselves. So it could tilt either way depending on which way scum thought patterns fall.