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General Weapon Refinery discussion/speculation/creation thread

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-Roy
-Askr trio
-Maybe some of the people with only Distant Counter weapons, the somewhat weaker ones
-Corrin
-Sword Eirika
-Lloyd
-Leo

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The Askr trio need it the most. They have gotten nothing since the game's release and really need an upgrade. Other characters can at least get merges and IVs.

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Does this count only people with Unique weapons? Because otherwise,  I think Raven going from Brave Axe + to Basikillos opens the floodgates for a lot of mediocre statline people with normal weapons.

Similarily, does Hautecarte and Clarisses' Bow justfiy GHB and TT units getting Refine upgrades?

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Reality said:

Does this count only people with Unique weapons? Because otherwise,  I think Raven going from Brave Axe + to Basikillos opens the floodgates for a lot of mediocre statline people with normal weapons.

Similarily, does Hautecarte and Clarisses' Bow justfiy GHB and TT units getting Refine upgrades?

 

 

I would assume that it would justify the GHB characters considering that Zephiel also received one in the most recent update. As far my as list goes it would be Navarre, Sophia, Oboro, Shanna, Narcian, Lilina, Athena, and the Awakening/SD Christmas cavaliers. 

Edited by MisfitMiju

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The obvious have already been mentioned, but here's my list:

Askr trio - Weak as shit on varying levels, and hardly anybody uses them seriously, even outside of arena - unless they're masochistic and like doing GHB/BHB, etc. with the three and Fjorm (where Fjorm does 90% of the work), for theme's sake.

Eirika - Was the queen of buffs, but has since been overtaken in this role by so many buff kings and queens, such as Ephraim, Axura, and even Marth after his Falchion upgrade. She isn't even a good duelist in the first place.

Roy - Why does this young man not have built-in Distant Counter on his Binding Blade yet? Such a weapon upgrade would easily lift him out of his current tier. His mixed bulk is perfect for Distant Counter shenanigans.

Odin - Probably the most pathetic unit in the game. Not even Bladetome helps redeem him. I wasn't going to even mention him because he's so god damn shit.

Rebecca - Raven got Basilikos. It makes sense for Rebecca to get Rienfleche. Not Wil. Wil gets Brave Bow+. Give this weapon LaD3 like Basilikos has, and Rebecca will be A+/S-tier overnight.

Priscilla - Fortify staff. Heal all a lot of HP to all nearby allies (adjacent/within 2 spaces?).

Florina - The only FE7 lance user so far, so, Rex Hasta? Would prefer Oswin to have it, though. Should he even turn up.

Nino - She doesn't need buffs per se because she's a fantastic Bladetome user. But you can potentially drive her away from a life of constant hurt and Desperation by giving her an alternate choice with Excalibur. It may even make her weaker overall since Bladetome is so damn strong on her, but thematically it would be fucking great - and even better for arena scores.

Edited by Raven

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9 minutes ago, Hero_Lucina said:

Berkut

Berkut is actually a great mixed tank with Berkut's Lance+ [Def], which gives him 48/35/31 defenses, or Berkut's Lance+ [Res], which gives him 48/31/35. With Fortify Cavalry and 2 stacks of Ward Cavalry, he hits 48/49/45 or 48/45/49.

For comparison, Sheena has 50/36/37 with Slaying Axe+ [Res] and 50/48/49 with 3 stacks of Ward Armor.

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Oh yeah, if I had to list some characters currently with normal weapons, here's what I'd do.

Frederick: That Armored Axe found in Warriors data, or maybe something entirely new. I'd prefer to call it Guardian Axe myself as a nod to his gorgeous Warriors promotion. ^^ Freddy is already great, but I think axe cavs are a bit outclassed by green mage cavs now, so giving him a boost (and Titania as well) could encourage more people to use axe cavs as well as green mage cavs.

Oscar: What was that one SS ranked lance in RD called again? Ugh, it's on the tip of my tongue. Been too long since I last played it... Oh yeah! Wishblade! This could also work for Nephenee, though to be fair, she's already really really good.

Titania: Poleaxe, since that was actually her true favorite. Urvan could work too, since she loved Greil.

Edited by Anacybele

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For needing a personal weapon to be better:

Athena, Azura, Camilla, Catria, Clair, Jakob, Karel, Ogma, Rebecca, Saber, Sheena, Niles, Soren, Oboro, Cain,  Mostly sword units need to get stronger because Arya set a new standard of being a powerful sword unit.

For Refinery:

Askr trio, mCorrin, Eirika, Halloween Nowi, Lloyd, Roy,  and Leo

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How about the three mages that got stuck with the generic tomes? Seems a bit unfair in my opinion that Soren, Sophia, and Lilina got shafted with no effect weapons at this point especially since Thoron+ has never made an appearance on the player side of things. 

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39 minutes ago, Raven said:

Florina - The only FE7 lance user so far, so, Rex Hasta? Would prefer Oswin to have it, though. Should he even turn up.

While we're at it, give Shanna Maltet.

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5 minutes ago, SoulWeaver said:

While we're at it, give Shanna Maltet.

*Has Brave Lyn shoot her out of the sky and pass it to Old Eliwood*

Though there is no reason why we can't give multiple characters the same legendary. Of course the legendary weapon effect on one character might not be suited for another, in which case, we make variants of the same legendary by tacking different adjectives in front.

And I'd rather give Farina the Rex Hasta, but that is just me.

 

21 minutes ago, DarkLordIvy said:

Seems a bit unfair in my opinion that Soren

Tornado!!!!!! The real A Rank Wind! We even have the RD ending movie for Part 2 to justify it.

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40 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

Berkut is actually a great mixed tank with Berkut's Lance+ [Def], which gives him 48/35/31 defenses, or Berkut's Lance+ [Res], which gives him 48/31/35. With Fortify Cavalry and 2 stacks of Ward Cavalry, he hits 48/49/45 or 48/45/49.

For comparison, Sheena has 50/36/37 with Slaying Axe+ [Res] and 50/48/49 with 3 stacks of Ward Armor.

This just serves as a reminder that Gwendolyn is the best mixed rank in the game with 54/41/39 with +Def, BL+res, and other no buffs :P Who needs attack when nothing can kill you and you can bonfire/ignis everything to death?

Anyway, what Berkut needs is really DC, the skill, not a weapon. With just QR, he can handle himself pretty well, and with DC he can take care of those pesky mages fantastically.

Most of the units have been said, but some of the way too evenly statted units, like Palla, could probably use some help. I'm sure there are others, but I can't think of them right now.

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Regular Ike (Don't know how they're gonna help him without helping Vike as well)

Ryoma. (F*ck Raven's Basilikos)

Xander & Camus (Bring them back to S Tier)

Eirika (Still no WR)

Hoshido/Nohr (they should get a bunch of different Naginata, Katana. Kukris and Club weapons to make them viable, but please don't put Divine Dew for everything IS) A good way to make common units more practical and unique.

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4 minutes ago, Ae†her said:

Ryoma. (F*ck Raven's Basilikos)

Just use Axebreaker.

 

4 minutes ago, Ae†her said:

but please don't put Divine Dew for everything IS

Divine Dew is used for anything in the refinery involving weapons that cannot be transferred through Skill Inheritance.

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2 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

Divine Dew is used for anything in the refinery involving weapons that cannot be transferred through Skill Inheritance.

I know. I wish they would stop requiring Divine Dew I wish they would half the cost of Divine Dew for newer personal weapons, it's a hassle to get all the way up to 200. You have to have units that can also use Refining Stones so as to not waste them on the same units.

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3 hours ago, DarkLordIvy said:

How about the three mages that got stuck with the generic tomes? Seems a bit unfair in my opinion that Soren, Sophia, and Lilina got shafted with no effect weapons at this point especially since Thoron+ has never made an appearance on the player side of things. 

Four actually, because Oliver also exists. Why he wasn’t given Nosferatu or a variant of it is beyond me.

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Gunther. Poor guy has lower stats in everything compared to Frederick except resistance (which is a crap 18)

Lloyd could use an upgrade to his Regal Blade too.

Corrin’s Yato was left in the dust when Seigbert’s weapon was introduced.

Leo. Brynhildr isn’t necessarily bad but he could use a boost.

I might be biased on this but I think we can all agree Niles could use a personal weapon. Maybe something like Shining Bow? His personal weapon in Fates can’t kill anything but I suppose they could take some liberties.

Tobin is in a weird place. He’s one of them slow sword users but he doesn’t have a personal weapon like Chrom, Seliph, and Alfonse. He has a lower attack than the 3 mentioned + Hinata and Laslow. Lower defense than Hinata. And can’t benefit from IV’s so Tobin could use an upgrade to stand out.

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The Fuujin Yumi upgrade was pretty meh overall. Brave Bow is still just better. But I suppose we should focus on units who haven't got anything yet.

Giving Soren the green equivalent of Dire Thunder would be sure to mix things up for him!I think we should make the Brave effect on tomes more accessible, although that might lead to breaking the game. Which is why they are probably holding off on that.

Making Ivaldi better would do all kinds of awesome things for L'Arachel. She deserves to be a top unit in this game!

Also, my girl Oboro needs to get herself a netter spear!

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I really liked that they turned Felicia into a monster and, while I know not EVERY kind of trash unit can get such a treatment, I'd like if they would keep doing that

So units like Fir, Odin...actually most of the dagger units...but most importantly Gunter & Jagen.
They had unique penalties because they were "Veterans", to simulate their roles in their games as being, uhhhh....Jagens. High starting base stats, but weaker than others by the end. I think the way the stat system worked means they don't get hit as hard as horse mages but it's still a couple BST difference. 

But still, those penalties are kind of useless and in this day & age you can't just arbitrarily release units like that. I mean even post-power creep Aran would still be arbitrarily weaker than other melee cavalry, you know? So these 2 will probably always be the only 2 in that stat line and they should get a new weapon & refinement each to help out. Not sure what weapons in particular Jagen could get (maybe an original creation since the only big important Archanea lance I can think of is the Gradvius) but Gunter could get the Aurgelmir.

Also I like Gunter...he was the glue for my horse team until I got Titania and I still bring him out on other horse teams from time to time. 

As for characters who don't NECESSARILY need it, but would probably like it, how can I not mention Lilina getting something like Forblaze 

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Camilla, because Sakura and Elise aside she is the only Fate noble who has not an exklusiv weapon.

Of course Leo needs an upgrade to his book. Because it's still worse than a Gravity staff.

Tobin with Levin sword would be an idea too.

 

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33 minutes ago, Nanima said:

The Fuujin Yumi upgrade was pretty meh overall. Brave Bow is still just better. But I suppose we should focus on units who haven't got anything yet.

Giving Soren the green equivalent of Dire Thunder would be sure to mix things up for him!I think we should make the Brave effect on tomes more accessible, although that might lead to breaking the game. Which is why they are probably holding off on that.

Making Ivaldi better would do all kinds of awesome things for L'Arachel. She deserves to be a top unit in this game!

Also, my girl Oboro needs to get herself a netter spear!

Maybe the could give Oboro the Waterwheel?

Similarly, they could give Arthur Aurgelmir.

Edited by Ildanach

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23 minutes ago, Nanima said:

Making Ivaldi better would do all kinds of awesome things for L'Arachel. She deserves to be a top unit in this game!

L’Arachel doesn’t need an Ivaldi upgrade though. At neutral, she can reach 54/41 offense with Ivaldi active, swift sparrow, and a spd 3 seal. That’ll go to 60/47 with a hone cavalry. And depending on her IV’s and if goads/spurs are used it will be even higher. Ursula and Olwen will struggle just trying to get close to that.

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4 hours ago, Ae†her said:

Regular Ike (Don't know how they're gonna help him without helping Vike as well)

Ryoma. (F*ck Raven's Basilikos)

Xander & Camus (Bring them back to S Tier)

Eirika (Still no WR)

Hoshido/Nohr (they should get a bunch of different Naginata, Katana. Kukris and Club weapons to make them viable, but please don't put Divine Dew for everything IS) A good way to make common units more practical and unique.

If you don't mind me asking why do you think Ike needs a refine he's more solid than most of the sword characters currently present in red

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Jakob, since Felicia got an upgrade he should get one too, plus I like him better:p

regular Roy, he was my first 5* and made my early game go well I wish I could have a reason to use him again.

The Askr trio need an upgrade since they are all pretty weak they should get a big weapon boost

Odin, one if not the worst unit in Heroes he needs some type of upgrade so that he can be used if needed/wanted

That is just off the top of my head, but I know there are some others I would like to see boosted as well.

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