Alastor plays and ranks the whole series! Mission Complete! ...For now.

[Alastor15243]

16 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

It does have Recover... unless it's actually something you need to unlock.

Seems to be.

[Jotari]

10 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Good thinking, but I just checked, and that's not it either. Plenitude and Earth's Boon are both legible, just grayed out, for Saber, the one who learned them. Sounds like it is Ragnarok-Omega, and I guess it's promotion-gated or something.

 

10 hours ago, Acacia Sgt said:

No, what I and Jotari were getting at is it was a partially-learned skill, not one learnt already.

But yeah, Ragnarok Omega is gated to the promotion as it is.

Ragnarok Omega isn't gated by the promotion. I got it during the Mila's temple battle in my most recent playthrough. On retrpspect I think it's because you need to learn the prior skills before you can get Ragnarok (I think one of them is Subdue or Swap or something). I'm not sure how exactly the wexp formula works out, but I think if you learn the same skill from another weapon, then you can learn the advanced skills faster as you don't have to learn the lower level skills.

[Alastor15243]

Shadows of Valentia Day 26: Temple of Mila

Got a couple more random battles to get through before we have anything of “substance”.

The bow knight would have been annoying if I hadn't been able to take him out with a hunter's volley on turn one.

Oh yeah, forgot to mention: I gave the angel ring to Sonya to boost her crit rate, making Excalibur more reliable.

Huh, apparently Jesse and Saber have a support chain.

...It was getting good, but then it just abruptly ended. It was basically about Jesse talking about Saber's reputation at taverns all over the country, but then... yeah it just abruptly ends out of nowhere like a damned FE12 support.

Oh, and Genny and Sonya have their B support now.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

So Sonya was completely cool with Genny being intimidated by her, but when Genny says that Sonya reminds her of her mother, now Sonya flips out, taking that to be some kind of insinuation about her age. Though Genny quickly clarifies that it's been years since she's seen her mother.

Honestly, with most of these support chains, the entire 3-part conversation would probably only amount to a single support in some other games.

I fed a bunch of paladin reinforcements to Est while I made my way up there, and now I'm finally ready. She's level 9 now, only 3 more levels to get to falcon knight.

…Unfortunately the reinforcements seem to be coming too quickly to actually fight the Mila Temple without them. Well, it's just three paladins, how much damage can they do? Okay, I'll charge in.

So, Celica's finally realized that the Rigelian army was responsible for what happened to the Temple of Mila. But unlike what she told Alm, she doesn't even try to negotiate, she just orders everyone to infiltrate the temple immediately. I hope there's some manner of reflection upon realizing that Alm was right and negotiating with the Rigelian army wasn't an option.

Also, the Cantor outright says while clearly talking to Celica that he's going to summon gargoyles, but Celica's all “Take care, everyone. He's a cantor – he's likely to summon forth some manner of terrible beast”... like he didn't just explicitly say what “manner of terrible beast” that was.

So, the gargoyles are a colossal pain. I'll see what their stats are in a second, but keeping them dead basically requires a myrmidon or dread fighter with high attack and a blessed sword. Thankfully, I have one of those. The problem is how to get everyone else past that area safely when cliffs block every other means in. I think I may have to assassinate this guy with hunter's volley.

Est's got supports with Palla and Catria again, huh? Alright, let's see. I'm gonna have them fly over the cliff to fight the other enemies anyway.

Okay yeah, the Catria support is still funny, I just wish it were longer. While Catria's voice actress doesn't seem to be too good at giving Catria stronger emotions, she's amazing at deadpan snark.

The Palla-Est B support is too short and pointless to merit comment. I expect to forget what even happened in it by the time I re-read this part in proofreading.

Unfortunately using hunter's volley on the cantor is no longer an option, since he decided to retreat onto a heal tile when he wasn't even injured as soon as Leon came close. Damn it.

...These paladins apparently don't want to go for the heal tiles. Or is I that cavalry just flat-out can't reach over those spikes?

...Alas, I can't check, because the last paladin just died to a crit.

HAHAHAHAHA!

Genny's physicing people from the bottom of the cliff, and you can't even see the people she's healing due to the camera angle making the cliff in the way!

Atlas is getting tons of exp from holding off these gargoyles, and good thing he can without relying on crits, because those things would be a nightmare if we let them accumulate and swarm.

Weirdly, once we took out the snipers and started baiting in the sorcerers... the rest of them retreated into the central chamber...? I've never seen that behavior before. They weren't even wounded, they just grouped around the cantor! Well, guess Atlas will take them out then!

...Well, some of them. I'm thinking I can get Est to level 12 here if I give her the remaining enemies and the boss kill.

Okay, yes, seems those spike things keep cavalry out. Leon can't go inside.

I managed to fortunately get Est the kill. Hopefully she levels up from it...

YES! YES, JUST BARELY, AT EXACTLY 0 EXP INTO THE NEXT LEVEL! SHE CAN BECOME A FALCON KNIGHT AT THE MILA TEMPLE!

Oh, having three of these will be so useful in Act 4!

Alright, building visiting time.

I hope Est keeps up the defense levels, because the insane string of defense levels she got has just been rendered pointless by her promotion. Thankfully she gets a ton of bulk from it anyway, and in terms of physical strength, she's now the best of the three pegasisters due to her similarly-frequent attack level ups.

...Someone seems to really like honey. I've found two jars of it around the place so far, and nothing else except a cog.

Also, it seems Rigel has allowed civilians into the temple unmolested... and they never realized anything was wrong somehow? They just thought they weren't being let in to see Mila?

So apparently the enemy of Celica's Act 4 is gonna be a guy called Dolth? Barth, Grieth and Dolth? I'm noticing a pattern here.

So suddenly we get a flashback of what happened when we were told of what happened by Irma, who also heard it secondhand. It's really weird, usually when you get flashbacks like this, someone in the conversation saw it personally. But yeah, uh... Mila's pretty clearly unhinged here and not the sort of “Earth Mother” that one was probably picturing.

Honestly, I love the nickname of the Valentian Falchion: the Kingsfang.

I also find it absolutely hilarious when Mila starts radiating windy dragon aura and not only do all the non-Rudolf Rigelian soldiers get blown away... but so do the priestesses cowering behind Mila for protection.

I wonder what that red ball is though, and why she seems to be channeling energy through it. Is that her dragonstone? But no, she shouldn't have one, because she's going crazy, which is only supposed to happen with dragons who refused to turn human.

...But she is clearly in human form. So what, did she choose to enter human form to be more palatable to the people she ruled as a goddess, but not do it in a way that would actually preserve her sanity in any way?

Now, Saber brings up that he's fulfilled his contract, but he phrases it in a way like Celica had already voiced her intentions to go further and he's objecting. But he says this right after the flashback.

Okay, so Celica's voicing her intentions to invade Rigel to get Mila back... with absolutely no self-awareness that everything she told Alm was reckless and unnecessary is now suddenly necessary to her.

Boey: Hold on just a moment. You're saying we INVADE Rigel? This isn' a motley band of pirates of thieves – it's an entire empire of them! We should all take a step back and consider our opti-

Celica: No amount of thinking will change the situation. Come, Boey. This isn't the first time we've faced hopeless odds. And when people told us to give up, did we run?

I find this a bit ridiculous to say. It wasn't outsiders telling her and her friends to give up. It was her friends telling her to give up.

But yeah, then Conrad shows up with the circlet, and Celica promotes, to much fanfare... and a single point of HP.

Gaiden promotions sure can be hilarious.

So yeah, Saber just kinda decides he's gonna fight for her now without the pretense of contract. I don't really mind that, given what they've been through together. Though maybe have him not say that line about “this is as far as I was paid to go”? And also... maybe show the slightest bit of surprise at her true identity, or maybe at least say “I knew it”, given he had his suspicions before?

Priestess: Someone at the castle said that when Lady Liprica first held you in her arms, she swore she would never let you stand before Mila. What do you suppose she might have meant by that?

Okay, first off... how the fuck is this not a line that Celica is vocally reacting to? This revelation is worthy of a whole damned cutscene, and yet it's an entirely optional conversation she has no reaction to at all.

Second of all... “what do you suppose she might have meant by that”? Maybe because Mila let the king waltz in to kidnap and rape her!?

Ah yes, and now we meet the crazy old man who was willing to let the entire country flood rather than do his job at the behest of anyone but the royal family of Zofia. But thankfully we managed to find the circlet and prove who Celica is to him, so his stupidity doesn't doom us all.

Also his acting is terrible. And judging by the similarly fake-gravely tone... I'm willing to bet good money this is the same guy who voiced Desaix and Hanneman. Man, this guy is atrocious at emoting, I'm sorry.

Alright, so the sluice gate is open. Time to open the other one on Alm's end.

I love how the guy at the western gate thinks it more likely that Anthiese is still alive than the idea that people just took the old man and beat him away from the controls, or forced him to open the gate if it takes knowledge only he has. God this is such a dumb plot point.

But Alm finally puts two and two together that Celica is Princess Anthiese.

So Jedah isn't remotely upset that they took the sluice despite swearing on his honor to Rudolf earlier that Tatarrah would stop them. So did he make Tatarrah throw the battle or something? This doesn't feel like a realistic reverse-psychology gambit... but then everything that happens in Rigel seems to involve somebody pulling a ridiculous, unconvincing “I wanted you to win” gambit.

...But at any rate, that's it for today. Tomorrow, we start Part 4, specifically Celica's half, so that we can get Alm his promotion while it can still get him some stat boosts hopefully. I remember Alm's being better than Celica's.

Stay safe, everyone!

[Acacia Sgt]

49 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

I wonder what that red ball is though, and why she seems to be channeling energy through it. Is that her dragonstone? But no, she shouldn't have one, because she's going crazy, which is only supposed to happen with dragons who refused to turn human.

...But she is clearly in human form. So what, did she choose to enter human form to be more palatable to the people she ruled as a goddess, but not do it in a way that would actually preserve her sanity in any way?

Because she and Duma actually don't know. They left Archanea during the Golden Age of Dragonkind, long before degeneration was a thing. Considering how restricted communication is between the two lands, then less of a reason for them to know. And conveniently the one trade route between the two is to a corner of Archanea that is isolated from the rest.

Admittedly, it could work better back when Valentia was a "remote island", but when it's a full fledged continent that doesn't look to be that far from Archanea, then why travel between the two isn't more common beats me. Since you'd think word of Manaketes and degenerated dragons would've reached Mila and Duma's ears eventually... but it didn't.

Edited June 29, 2021 by Acacia Sgt

[Eltosian Kadath]

On 6/28/2021 at 8:33 AM, Alastor15243 said:

 

A coral ring, a cog, and the revival shrine. So, a coral ring, for my purposes. Though I guess this means if I lose someone today I can just head back and not have to re-do this massive dungeon.

I kinda like how that revival shrine is placed. If someone died in the desert it isn't that big of a deal, as there is a revival shrine right after.

 

7 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Atlas is getting tons of exp from holding off these gargoyles, and good thing he can without relying on crits, because those things would be a nightmare if we let them accumulate and swarm.

If Genny already has Expel, that can help deal with them swarming (although it is rather random).

 

7 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

 

Second of all... “what do you suppose she might have meant by that”? Maybe because Mila let the king waltz in to kidnap and rape her!?

I kinda took it as Liprica figuring out the same thing Jedah did (but for Mila instead of Duma) that in Mila's insane state she might be in the mood for a Branded sandwich.

 

I did also get further on my ironman over the weekend, with Celica marching all the way to the sage. Her army is a well oiled machine, start with either Dread Fighter Saber assassinating all the bowmen, or Baron Valabar drawing them in to be jumped on, then the flyers and mages move in to slaughter what is left, so no real problems or deaths. Also promoted Alm and did the easy task of doing the map where half the enemies turn into green units thanks to Zeke being free to do as he pleases, so his army is back up to 8.

[Jotari]

 

8 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

 

Priestess: Someone at the castle said that when Lady Liprica first held you in her arms, she swore she would never let you stand before Mila. What do you suppose she might have meant by that?

Okay, first off... how the fuck is this not a line that Celica is vocally reacting to? This revelation is worthy of a whole damned cutscene, and yet it's an entirely optional conversation she has no reaction to at all.

Second of all... “what do you suppose she might have meant by that”? Maybe because Mila let the king waltz in to kidnap and rape her!?

 

I always thought it was more because of the brand. That she was afraid that if Mila had the brand bearer in front of her, then she might kill Celica to prevent the whole prophecy predicting the death of the gods.

57 minutes ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

I kinda took it as Liprica figuring out the same thing Jedah did (but for Mila instead of Duma) that in Mila's insane state she might be in the mood for a Branded sandwich.

Ah, so I'm not the only one who read it that way.

[Alastor15243]

1 minute ago, Jotari said:

I always thought it was more because of the brand. That she was afraid that if Mila had the brand bearer in front of her, then she might kill Celica to prevent the whole prophecy predicting the death of the gods.

That is almost assuredly the answer upon reflection, but I still find it ridiculous that this priestess sees no reason why Liprica would resent Mila given what happened to her.

[Alastor15243]

Hey guys, sorry, today's not a good day for an update. I was pretty busy traveling and moving stuff around during the time I usually do this stuff, and also I'm having some issues with wifi on my laptop and I'm not sure when exactly today they'll be solved. I'll have to pick this up again tomorrow.

[Venger_06]

On 6/1/2021 at 12:57 AM, Interdimensional Observer said:

I know this is almost a week old, I haven't been following this topic that closely the past few days, but I'd say Archer Kilff is his second or third-worst option, worst being Knight ofc.

I know this is almost a month old, I haven't been following this topic that closely the past few days, but I'd say Archer Kilff is his best or second-best option, second-best being Mercenary ofc.

On 6/1/2021 at 12:57 AM, Interdimensional Observer said:

8 Res and range are relevant how exactly? Are you having him go and enemy-phase the Arcanists for maximum killing efficiency?

Yes. Having a ranged attacker with decent RES helps tremendously in maps in maps like Arcanist Woods, Sluice Gate and Nuibaba's Abode, where killing the enemies as fast as possible is the best course of action.

On 6/1/2021 at 12:57 AM, Interdimensional Observer said:

As for me ranking Archer Kliff so low, he is the last of the three Ram Farm Boys I'd send Archer. The Archer line isn't fast, the Archer line doesn't use spells (which Kilff has a good set of), most Bows are have semi-shaky accuracy. And lastly, if you're gunning for a Killer Bow, then Spd is entirely irrelevant for Bow users, and Def surely is too, because why are your range 1-5 guys getting hit very often if at all? Hunter's Volley is a guaranteed double. 

Yes, you're right, SPD is useless when you get a Killer Bow. But before you get a Killer Bow you still need SPD to double. And here's the best part: you don't have to use Python anymore, as Archer Kliff has higher SKL (55% vs 35%) and SPD growth (55% vs 50%,), so it's easier to use him (unless you're Alastor).

On 6/1/2021 at 12:57 AM, Interdimensional Observer said:

Otherwise, I'd send Kliff Mage to make his best spell list of the Sons of South Zofia. -Although Kliff won't be doubling a whole lot there, since the Wt of some spells, and Kliff's horrendous Spd base not being assisted by Mage/Sage's class Spd base, completely undermine his great Spd growth.

I haven't tried Cavalier!Kliff, but maybe it'd work out well, but maybe it wouldn't.

Cavalier Kliff works in the early game, but falls off fast after Clive and Mathilda join. Mage Kliff is the worst mage, as Kliff's speed growth only starts mattering after mages fall off. In spite of his high-speed growth, he'll struggle to double enemy Cavaliers. It's also the case that the opportunity cost is highest since Mercenary and Archer are such strong classes for Kliff.

Speaking of opportunity cost, the reason he shouldn't go Cavalier, Mage or even Mercenary is because there are other characters that make better use of these classes. Gray will become useless in any other class except Mercenary after Act 1, at least until you get a Killer Bow. Tobin has a better early spell list, and he can fall back as a support once he learns Physic. It's better to invest in either Clive or Mathilda as a Cavalier, and even if you don't, you get 4 cavaliers in Alm's route. Why would you need a fifth?

In the end, Archer Kliff is simply more efficient in a no/low grind run. And if you're grinding, the Dread Fighter loop is the obvious choice, and then any class is viable.

Kliff best Echoes character. Fight me.

Also, I got the Blitzkrieg award. AMA.

Edited July 1, 2021 by Maof06

[Alastor15243]

Yeah, given how effective my generally below-average Kliff wound up being as an archer, I have to agree it's a great choice for him.

And @Maof06 congrats!

Edited July 1, 2021 by Alastor15243

[Eltosian Kadath]

1 hour ago, Maof06 said:

 

Also, I got the Blitzkrieg award. AMA.

Congrats! I guess I have three questions. First who were the units that shined the most on your Blitzkrieg run? Second, what difficulty were you playing for the Blitzkrieg run? And Finally did you keep track of your turn count, or have some kind of rule of thumb to keep track of it more abstractly?

Personally I greatly regretted not tracking my turn count in any way when I got that achievement, as it added a lot of extra stress to the run as I didn't know how much leeway I really had...

[Venger_06]

11 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

First who were the units that shined the most on your Blitzkrieg run?

Clive in Alm's route (at least until Act 4) and Pegasus!Mae for Celica's. Honorary mentions to Clair and Est: I thought would be useless, but they're were actually worth it.

11 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

Second, what difficulty were you playing for the Blitzkrieg run?

Normal. I was just playing for fun. Thinking back to it though, getting the award on hard would be just as easy, since...

11 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

And Finally did you keep track of your turn count, or have some kind of rule of thumb to keep track of it more abstractly?

I must have about 200 turns left. I wasn't counting every battle, but I realized that I finished the first two acts in less than 80 turns. I doubt I got past 200 turns when I finished Act 3. From then on, I knew I would get the award. Playing normal meant that while enemies had slightly lower stats and many had no items, enemy formations were different and battles didn't give as much experience. This just made the run more grind-y. Playing on Hard would mean that Leon would be God instead of the Pegasus Knights.

Ha ha ha Killer Bow go brr

[Acacia Sgt]

As I said before, I doubt I'll get it myself on my playthrough, haha. As I'm sure turns in DLC maps count, and therefore...

[Venger_06]

2 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

As I said before, I doubt I'll get it myself on my playthrough, haha. As I'm sure turns in DLC maps count, and therefore...

They count, but it's only 8 turns max for the Gold map for example. I did it a lot and I still got it. Follow your dreams!

[Acacia Sgt]

1 minute ago, Maof06 said:

They count, but it's only 8 turns max for the Gold map for example. I did it a lot and I still got it. Follow your dreams!

Even with that... no, seriously, I doubt I'll get the Award in my current playthrough. I'm still in Act 3 and I already clocked like over 120 hours, for that matter.

I don't suppose an overall turn count is displayed upon ending the game. Still, I'm sure it'll be over 500 by the end of it.

[Alastor15243]

Shadows of Valentia Day 27: Into Rigel

Okay, so apparently Alm decided to treat for peace after reclaiming his country, sending messages to Rigel after taking back the sluice. Good, that's when you're supposed to do it, when you have leverage, and not when it mostly would amount to begging to be given your country back. Although I have to wonder, how is the Deliverance certain they've actually driven the Rigelian army out of Zofia? There's an entire third or so of the country they haven't touched. Are they really just assuming based on the fact that the sluice was opened that somebody's taken care of the rest of the east for them?

But of course, Rudolf does not reply. And this is where I think this gets pretty dumb. Just because Rigel refuses to treat for peace... they're going to invade? Like they barely even give this much discussion, they say it like it's the natural conclusion to Rigel refusing to end hostilities. You've retaken both sides of the massive fortress that is the sluice gate. Why not just stay here and defend yourselves from the home field advantage rather than attempt to rout an entire fucking country's army when that country is notoriously better at war than you are? Would invading instead of defending yourself until they give up really have less of a loss of life?

In fairness, maybe there are good reasons for this.

But they don't discuss a single one of them.

They don't even acknowledge holding this position as an option. Clive says they have to move forward because:

Clive: Our men are approaching their limit. And Rigel's climate is far colder than what they knew in Zofia. Further delaying here will only sap their strength and morale.

Excuse me, but is this not a fucking sluice? A place designed for the regulation and control of water that is above fucking freezing? Water that has not been able to flow properly because the gates have been closed until now, and thus would be frozen now if the weather were cold enough to do that to a still body of water? The coldest this place can be is, like, autumn temperatures, and most of these soldiers are wearing thick uncomfortable armor. Wouldn't the chilly weather be a relief? As would finally reclaiming their country and getting to stay put in a big fancy fortified building? How can holding position be worse for their morale than charging into a snowy wasteland and into territory where the enemy has the home field advantage?

And now they're doing more ridiculous foreshadowing of Alm being Rigelian royalty where Alm says the cold weather feels familiar, and honestly, it feels like this shit was all dramatic irony, like they didn't even care about making it a surprise for the people actually playing for the first time. Like this game was intended to be experienced like Oedipus Rex, where the audience already knows all the spoilers and the writers are taking the piss out of the fact that the characters don't.

So, I gave the sluice worker some bonewalker oil and he gave me... 10 silver marks. Um... isn't that the trade-in price of bonewalker oil normally?

...YES! YES IT IS! I JUST CHECKED AGAIN! The fuck is the point of this quest!?

Anyway, I talked to Delthea, and it sounds like they decided to ditch the whole “Delthea sealed her powers after the war” thing. She clearly seems to still enjoy having her magic after the events of her sole character arc in the story, judging by this conversation Alm has with her, and nothing after this happens that could change that.

And Tobin has this talk about accepting how he isn't the main character and that he needs to accept that Alm is better than him and his role is to be “a part of [Alm's] strength”, and maybe I'd tolerate this more if this were a game where I earned this amount of ridiculous worship through gameplay, but given how easy this game is... yeah no this is annoying.

Yeah, that's the main issue I have with these two heroes. They seem to have given Alm nothing but positive points while Celica got all of the flaws, and yet they frequently act like the writers don't realize that's what they've done.

But enough of that. Time to have Celica move forward into her latest gimmick: the swamp.

I guess this half of Rigel isn't high-altitude or something? It seems to have a totally different, warmer climate. In fact, Saber's complaining about the humidity. How the fuck high up in the air is this sluice that the climate changed this drastically? I wish the world map actually had depth for things like this so I could tell.

But yeah, here it comes.

The beginning of the agonizing slow assassination of what remains of Celica's character. Jedah calls out to her. But... that's all. For now at least.

Now to wade across map damage swamps while three goddamned cantors spam shit at us.

Lovely.

At least the music is nice. “The Sacrifice and the Saint”. It's the “victory is near” theme of Celica's route from Gaiden, a feature that they got rid of in the remake, except made much darker, with very visible cues from A Dark Fall from Fire Emblem Fates.

Palla and Catria have a support (I forget which rank this is) where they muse about their homeland. It's funny how they say they miss “Archanea” and not “Macedonia”, since the stuff they talk about clearly implies they're thinking about the latter.

But then it seems that Palla knows about Catria's unrequited crush on Marth.

Kamui and Leon have a talk and...

...Okay, this is odd. I got the impression from the rest of Kamui's talk with Leon that Kamui's not gay, but when Leon talks about a hypothetical quest to find the perfect man if Valbar weren't around, and says that sounds like fun, Kamui agrees. They follow it up like Leon read that as gayer than Kamui meant, but... the fuck did Kamui mean by agreeing that hunting for the perfect man across the country would be fun?

Atlas and Celica have a talk too. Not much of interest happens sadly.

Ah yes, Mae and Boey's A support, with the famous exchange:

Boey: You're headed back to the island, right?

Mae: ...Yeah.

Boey: Then that's where I'm going as well.

Mae: Huh? Wait, what's that mean?

Boey: Are you really such a dope that you can't figure it out?

Mae: WAAAAAAT!?

So, crossing the swamp is a bit of a pain, but I've got enough healing to mostly be fine, especially with Genny's aura. And of course I have my flier trio taking on the gargoyles up north.

Palla: I will discharge my duty!

...Listen, writers. There are already some pretty childish jokes people make about the word “duty”... do you think maybe adding the word “discharge” in there is tempting fate a little bit?

Anyway, Est unlocked her A support with Palla (the Palla-Catria one was an A support too, I checked their displayed rank when highlighted).

...Oh shit, I forgot Palla also has an unrequited crush on a boy with the same hair color as her. Only this time instead of an out-of-her-league prince... it's Abel, her little sister's boyfriend. But Est doesn't realize this, I think, and instead Palla took her question the wrong way with her initial pained reaction before she started talking about being a wing-girl for Palla if she wanted to date one of the cute boys in the army. Either that or she does know and is trying to help her out by hooking her up with someone else. Either way, Palla uses this as an excuse to change the subject by saying that a war is a terrible time for dating.

...Is that a dig at the previous games?

But yeah, not to mention, dating someone from a country you're planning on leaving soon is... a recipe for heartbreak if things don't go well.

I've cleared the southern area. Thankfully both Atlas and Saber hit 20 speed and thus could double the dread fighter, and after that and a fortunate series of dodges and crits after a mis-placed Leon, all that remains is the north the pegasisters were harrying.

Enemy summons are really weak. I mean, they'd be absolutely ridiculous if they weren't, but it kinda highlights that this is a terrible idea in this combat system, where the only options are unfairness and pointlessness.

And the battle's over, more talk with Saber, then...

...Yep, Jedah calls out to her again. And this time she runs after where she thinks the voice is coming from in confusion. And... she finds the source. Somehow. Despite the voice being magically transmitted.

And... yeah. Jedah says he'll trade Mila for... Celica's soul.

...So, Jedah knows about dragon degeneration and “the madness shared by all dragonkind”. So did Mila and Duma leave the mainland once degeneration became obvious, but before the dragonstone solution was found? And they never went back to check if they figured anything out? And they had no plans in place for what would happen to their people after they went insane?

The fuck is wrong with these two?

...Do they ever explain what the brand is? Where it came from or why it doesn't appear on the hand of every royal? Because that brand apparently affords Celica's soul qualities that make it a fine meal for Duma, but... that's literally the only property of the brand that we're ever informed of, other than the fact that the people who have it are important to destiny.

Also, Jedah says that this soul deal would also allow Alm to stop fighting, and... does that logically follow? We're never given an explicit reason to my knowledge for what Duma's madness is doing to Rigel in order to drive it to wage war, other than giving his priests crazy orders. And if Jedah's really suggesting that “Alm won't have to fight because Duma will stop ordering me to make Rigel fight him”... bleeeeh? Whah? Fuh?

And Celica... is amazingly quick to accept the idea of giving up her soul, if not the idea of trusting Jedah. Like, no angst or conflict whatsoever, she's like “Yeah, your offer to do all this in exchange for making me a soulless husk is really generous, and that makes it really suspicious”.

Also, I notice that Jedah's making no effort to hide his creepy, mustache-twirling villain attitude. He's even still doing his creepy evil chuckle as he leaves! How the fuck does Celica decide to trust this guy eventually?

And of course now we're getting necrodragon reinforcements. Which means we have to keep moving forward or this will quickly get ridiculous. Thankfully I'm pretty sure if you go into battle, enemies don't move afterward, so I don't have to fear an ambush if I move to the encounter right next to it.

...Fuck it, sure, let's do one more battle today.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Oh I'm so glad you get more than one opportunity to hear Boey scream like a little girl at the sight of necrodragons. And this one doesn't require missed party members either!

But yeah, this isn't gonna be that much of a pain. I've got plenty of units capable of fighting necrodragons, including three who can fly.

Let's do this real quick, see if there are any complications. I think doing the next big battle too would be a bit much for the day, but we can definitely at least do this and whatever dumb story moment comes after it.

...Nope, no dumb story moments! And by that I mean no story moments at all, because basically everything in Celica's act 4 is dumb.

So yeah, that's it for today. Tomorrow I'll storm this damned necrodragon fortress with my pegasus knights and dread fighters, and then see how much more of Celica's slow and painful descent into madness and stupidity I can stand.

Stay safe, everyone.

[Jotari]

12 hours ago, Eltosian Kadath said:

And Finally did you keep track of your turn count, or have some kind of rule of thumb to keep track of it more abstractly?

You know this would be a nice feature for the series in general. An active total turn counter you can check as you play the game. Particularly nice if they ever bring back something like the Blitzkrieg reward, but just in general being able to check it before finishing the game would be appreciated.

[Jotari]

3 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

They don't even acknowledge holding this position as an option. Clive says they have to move forward because:

 

Clive: Our men are approaching their limit. And Rigel's climate is far colder than what they knew in Zofia. Further delaying here will only sap their strength and morale.

Excuse me, but is this not a fucking sluice? A place designed for the regulation and control of water that is above fucking freezing? Water that has not been able to flow properly because the gates have been closed until now, and thus would be frozen now if the weather were cold enough to do that to a still body of water? The coldest this place can be is, like, autumn temperatures, and most of these soldiers are wearing thick uncomfortable armor. Wouldn't the chilly weather be a relief? As would finally reclaiming their country and getting to stay put in a big fancy fortified building? How can holding position be worse for their morale than charging into a snowy wasteland and into territory where the enemy has the home field advantage?

And now they're doing more ridiculous foreshadowing of Alm being Rigelian royalty where Alm says the cold weather feels familiar, and honestly, it feels like this shit was all dramatic irony, like they didn't even care about making it a surprise for the people actually playing for the first time. Like this game was intended to be experienced like Oedipus Rex, where the audience already knows all the spoilers and the writers are taking the piss out of the fact that the characters don't.

I wonder what season it's meant to be. Because this sounds like winter is approaching. Unless summer has just started and Rigel is still super freaking cold, the weather actually gives more incentive to stay put and even if one want's to invade, waiting for a more opportune season to do so.

Side note, this silliness in the plot could have actually worked much better if they just acknowledged it by having someone suggesting they don't invade and Alm insisting they do for their future national security. You could make Alm have a sensible point, but still narratively lead into him killing Rudolf as something he chose to do by continuing the war.

3 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

So, I gave the sluice worker some bonewalker oil and he gave me... 10 silver marks. Um... isn't that the trade-in price of bonewalker oil normally?

...YES! YES IT IS! I JUST CHECKED AGAIN! The fuck is the point of this quest!?

 

I think the reward is random and repeatable. I have some vague memories of this being the fourth place you can get the Dragonskin for making your own Draco Shield.

3 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

I guess this half of Rigel isn't high-altitude or something? It seems to have a totally different, warmer climate. In fact, Saber's complaining about the humidity. How the fuck high up in the air is this sluice that the climate changed this drastically? I wish the world map actually had depth for things like this so I could tell.

On retrospect making Rigel a cold nation was a really weird choice. I don't think it's something that's ever mentioned or suggested in Gaiden or any of the pre Shadows of Valentia material. I can kind of see why they did it, as aside from North=Cold (rip any Fire Emblem countinent that could be set in the southern hemisphere), making it literally cold works well thematically with the whole "Rigel became cold hearted and forgot their compassion". Still though, swamps and volcanoes are what they had to work with in Gaiden, and neither really screams cold (yeah, yeah a volcano can appear anywhere even in a cold region, but like if that was the case you'd kind of expect it to be some sort of central hub for hotsprings and stuff if it were really that cold).

Oh and for points counting how Shadows of Valentia cared for Awakening's lore just as much as Awakening cared for Gaiden's, the whole Rigel being cold isn't mentioned at all in Awakening. In fact Awakening put a big jungle looking tree in the middle of the land providing even less reason to interpret it as a cold region in the remake. I guess overuse of tomes has slowly lead towards global warming by the time of Awakening.

3 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

...Yep, Jedah calls out to her again. And this time she runs after where she thinks the voice is coming from in confusion. And... she finds the source. Somehow. Despite the voice being magically transmitted.

Well presumably Jedah did want to be found. And presumably he also just wanted to split her up from her friends. So the source naturally be wherever Celica looked that was a decent distance away from everyone else. It was engineered that way.

3 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

 

And... yeah. Jedah says he'll trade Mila for... Celica's soul.

...So, Jedah knows about dragon degeneration and “the madness shared by all dragonkind”. So did Mila and Duma leave the mainland once degeneration became obvious, but before the dragonstone solution was found? And they never went back to check if they figured anything out? And they had no plans in place for what would happen to their people after they went insane?

The fuck is wrong with these two?

...Do they ever explain what the brand is? Where it came from or why it doesn't appear on the hand of every royal? Because that brand apparently affords Celica's soul qualities that make it a fine meal for Duma, but... that's literally the only property of the brand that we're ever informed of, other than the fact that the people who have it are important to destiny.

 

It is highlighted in Scendscale and Ragnarok Omega. So presumably it can give one the power to create lasers and giant fire balls too.

3 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

And of course now we're getting necrodragon reinforcements. Which means we have to keep moving forward or this will quickly get ridiculous. Thankfully I'm pretty sure if you go into battle, enemies don't move afterward, so I don't have to fear an ambush if I move to the encounter right next to it.

I'm not so sure that's true. I have vague memories of being forced into a battle immediately after finishing a previous battle. Maybe I'm wrong though.

[Acacia Sgt]

11 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

Okay, so apparently Alm decided to treat for peace after reclaiming his country, sending messages to Rigel after taking back the sluice. Good, that's when you're supposed to do it, when you have leverage, and not when it mostly would amount to begging to be given your country back. Although I have to wonder, how is the Deliverance certain they've actually driven the Rigelian army out of Zofia? There's an entire third or so of the country they haven't touched. Are they really just assuming based on the fact that the sluice was opened that somebody's taken care of the rest of the east for them?

But of course, Rudolf does not reply. And this is where I think this gets pretty dumb. Just because Rigel refuses to treat for peace... they're going to invade? Like they barely even give this much discussion, they say it like it's the natural conclusion to Rigel refusing to end hostilities. You've retaken both sides of the massive fortress that is the sluice gate. Why not just stay here and defend yourselves from the home field advantage rather than attempt to rout an entire fucking country's army when that country is notoriously better at war than you are? Would invading instead of defending yourself until they give up really have less of a loss of life?

In fairness, maybe there are good reasons for this.

But they don't discuss a single one of them.

They don't even acknowledge holding this position as an option. Clive says they have to move forward because:

Clive: Our men are approaching their limit. And Rigel's climate is far colder than what they knew in Zofia. Further delaying here will only sap their strength and morale.

Excuse me, but is this not a fucking sluice? A place designed for the regulation and control of water that is above fucking freezing? Water that has not been able to flow properly because the gates have been closed until now, and thus would be frozen now if the weather were cold enough to do that to a still body of water? The coldest this place can be is, like, autumn temperatures, and most of these soldiers are wearing thick uncomfortable armor. Wouldn't the chilly weather be a relief? As would finally reclaiming their country and getting to stay put in a big fancy fortified building? How can holding position be worse for their morale than charging into a snowy wasteland and into territory where the enemy has the home field advantage?

It's more fun when you consider that not only can they bunker down on the Sluice, but keep the gates open, thus deprive Rigel of water. So basically invert the plan. Instead of flooding Zofia, it's now drying up Rigel. Sooner or later that will force them to the negotiation table, so long they're able to hold the Sluice. But no, this is a video game. We must solve this through gameplay battling.

13 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

So, I gave the sluice worker some bonewalker oil and he gave me... 10 silver marks. Um... isn't that the trade-in price of bonewalker oil normally?

...YES! YES IT IS! I JUST CHECKED AGAIN! The fuck is the point of this quest!?

It's only 10 silver marks the first time. You get other stuff the more oil you give him. Including a Fruit of Life and Dragon Scale.

14 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

Anyway, I talked to Delthea, and it sounds like they decided to ditch the whole “Delthea sealed her powers after the war” thing. She clearly seems to still enjoy having her magic after the events of her sole character arc in the story, judging by this conversation Alm has with her, and nothing after this happens that could change that.

Oh no, she still seals her magic away.

And honestly... it makes perfect sense. She was basically mind raped and came close to losing her soul because of her magic. And she's only 13! If this wasn't a video game forcing her to be a playable character, she should be all up in PTSD over the ordeal. Thus driving her to get rid of her magic. But well, that be that.

15 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

...So, Jedah knows about dragon degeneration and “the madness shared by all dragonkind”. So did Mila and Duma leave the mainland once degeneration became obvious, but before the dragonstone solution was found? And they never went back to check if they figured anything out? And they had no plans in place for what would happen to their people after they went insane?

The fuck is wrong with these two?

...Do they ever explain what the brand is? Where it came from or why it doesn't appear on the hand of every royal? Because that brand apparently affords Celica's soul qualities that make it a fine meal for Duma, but... that's literally the only property of the brand that we're ever informed of, other than the fact that the people who have it are important to destiny.

Also, Jedah says that this soul deal would also allow Alm to stop fighting, and... does that logically follow? We're never given an explicit reason to my knowledge for what Duma's madness is doing to Rigel in order to drive it to wage war, other than giving his priests crazy orders. And if Jedah's really suggesting that “Alm won't have to fight because Duma will stop ordering me to make Rigel fight him”... bleeeeh? Whah? Fuh?

And Celica... is amazingly quick to accept the idea of giving up her soul, if not the idea of trusting Jedah. Like, no angst or conflict whatsoever, she's like “Yeah, your offer to do all this in exchange for making me a soulless husk is really generous, and that makes it really suspicious”.

Also, I notice that Jedah's making no effort to hide his creepy, mustache-twirling villain attitude. He's even still doing his creepy evil chuckle as he leaves! How the fuck does Celica decide to trust this guy eventually?

Like I said before, they don't know. Mila and Duma left Archanea before degeneration was a thing. So they don't know. Naga also seemingly never tried to find them to warn them either. Or they never bothered to check back home. Duma may be in exile, but Mila technically isn't, so she could've flown back and learned that dragon kind was... in the twilight of their era. As far they were aware, everything was still fine.

Jedah doesn't know either. He only knows Duma and Mila are going mad, but not as to why. Otherwise he or Halcyon or any of their predecessors would be telling Duma to turn into a Manakete, instead of going into this convulated plan of convincing Celica to give up her soul. Which, again, goes back to the fact both continents don't have much communication between them. Otherwise this whole thing would've been avoided. After all, by the time people like the Whitewings would hear about it, it's too late to anything about it.

Brands are basically like the markings of Major Holy Blood wielders from Jugdral, or from Awakening. Since it's the same world, they're trying to tie it up all together. As such, assume it gives the same sort of benefits. We can see it. It's why Alm can wield Falchion, not unlike the Jugdrali Holy Weapons needing someone with the mark to wield them.

There's logic to the plan, since Duma likely wouldn't have wanted for the Divine Accord to be broken if he was sane. And do remember that it was him being insane when he ordered Rudolf to conquer Zofia. So yes, it's likely that a sane Duma wouldn't have done it. It's a rare case where a bad guy doesn't have to lie or make too much up in order to convince someone. Of course, Jedah still has his own agenda, but well, that is that.

[Alastor15243]

3 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

It's more fun when you consider that not only can they bunker down on the Sluice, but keep the gates open, thus deprive Rigel of water. So basically invert the plan. Instead of flooding Zofia, it's now drying up Rigel. Sooner or later that will force them to the negotiation table, so long they're able to hold the Sluice. But no, this is a video game. We must solve this through gameplay battling.

Christ, that's an awesome point too.

 

4 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Oh no, she still seals her magic away.

And honestly... it makes perfect sense. She was basically mind raped and came close to losing her soul because of her magic. And she's only 13! If this wasn't a video game forcing her to be a playable character, she should be all up in PTSD over the ordeal. Thus driving her to get rid of her magic. But well, that be that.

But her base talk right after it is about how much she loves being special and hates having to hide. She doesn't see the merit of hiding her power at the cost of her ego even after being captured and used against her will.

6 minutes ago, Acacia Sgt said:

Jedah doesn't know either

Oh yes he does. See what I quoted? Jedah explicitly brings up, in his own words, "the madness shared by all dragonkind". He knows about degeneration.

[Acacia Sgt]

6 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

But her base talk right after it is about how much she loves being special and hates having to hide. She doesn't see the merit of hiding her power at the cost of her ego even after being captured and used against her will.

Oh yes he does. See what I quoted? Jedah explicitly brings up, in his own words, "the madness shared by all dragonkind". He knows about degeneration.

Like I said, if the game wasn't set on making her playable... also, not wanting to show weakness can be a symptom of the problem. Delthea could be hurting inside but being who she is, she might not want to show it. Point is, she still got rid of her magic. The ending doesn't say why, but honestly, I feel the whole incident with Tatarrah would be a good reason as to why.

That doesn't preclude him not knowing when it happened. Maybe if he had known back then (well, hard to say when their sanities started to slip, it was only noticed within the last hundred years after all)... but it again boils down this likely wasn't known when it happened. Unless Duma and Mila were feeling their minds slipping but kept mum about it until it was too late. Still, I'll give Jedah props for wanting to reverse the irreversible. Since to date, dragon degeneration is considered irreversible, and no one has bothered to try... until Jedah, that is.

Edited July 1, 2021 by Acacia Sgt

[Shanty Pete's 1st Mate]

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

Also, I notice that Jedah's making no effort to hide his creepy, mustache-twirling villain attitude. He's even still doing his creepy evil chuckle as he leaves! How the fuck does Celica decide to trust this guy eventually?

Let's be fair - she never trusts Jedah. She just views his proposition as her only chance. Better a longshot than no shot at all.

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

But yeah, not to mention, dating someone from a country you're planning on leaving soon is... a recipe for heartbreak if things don't go well.

Camusiriel_IRL

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

...Okay, this is odd. I got the impression from the rest of Kamui's talk with Leon that Kamui's not gay, but when Leon talks about a hypothetical quest to find the perfect man if Valbar weren't around, and says that sounds like fun, Kamui agrees. They follow it up like Leon read that as gayer than Kamui meant, but... the fuck did Kamui mean by agreeing that hunting for the perfect man across the country would be fun?

My interpretation is, Kamui likes the idea if being Leon's "wingman". Helping to set him up with "the perfect man".

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

Clive: Our men are approaching their limit. And Rigel's climate is far colder than what they knew in Zofia. Further delaying here will only sap their strength and morale.

Broke: hunkering down inside to deal with the cold weather.

Woke: leaving this comfort to face even colder weather, against enemies who are accustomed to it.

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

But of course, Rudolf does not reply. And this is where I think this gets pretty dumb. Just because Rigel refuses to treat for peace... they're going to invade? Like they barely even give this much discussion, they say it like it's the natural conclusion to Rigel refusing to end hostilities. You've retaken both sides of the massive fortress that is the sluice gate. Why not just stay here and defend yourselves from the home field advantage rather than attempt to rout an entire fucking country's army when that country is notoriously better at war than you are? Would invading instead of defending yourself until they give up really have less of a loss of life?

Not the first time this happens. Why does Chrom travel to Valm, an unfamiliar continent where he's surrounded by enemies at all times, rather than shore up (heh) Ylisse's own naval defenses? Why does Ephraim travel to Grado (facing the continent's mightiest army amidst a hostile populace) before redeeming Renais (which is much closer, less firmly defended, and has people who would welcome and join his cause)? Why does Claude invade the Empire, when the stability of the Alliance itself is not even assured? Basically, we've always got to invade the "bad guys", whether or not it makes narrative or military sense.

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

Okay, so apparently Alm decided to treat for peace after reclaiming his country, sending messages to Rigel after taking back the sluice. Good, that's when you're supposed to do it, when you have leverage, and not when it mostly would amount to begging to be given your country back. Although I have to wonder, how is the Deliverance certain they've actually driven the Rigelian army out of Zofia? There's an entire third or so of the country they haven't touched. Are they really just assuming based on the fact that the sluice was opened that somebody's taken care of the rest of the east for them?

SMH at this sheer recklessness. Celica was right: Alm has gone mad with power, content only to destroy Rigel until - oh.

1 hour ago, Acacia Sgt said:

It's more fun when you consider that not only can they bunker down on the Sluice, but keep the gates open, thus deprive Rigel of water. So basically invert the plan. Instead of flooding Zofia, it's now drying up Rigel. Sooner or later that will force them to the negotiation table, so long they're able to hold the Sluice. But no, this is a video game. We must solve this through gameplay battling.

Is that how the sluice works? I thought it was just full of seawater (i.e. Rigel will continue to have access to its internal freshwater resources). Is that not what's going on?

[Acacia Sgt]

1 minute ago, Shanty Pete's 1st Mate said:

Is that how the sluice works? I thought it was just full of seawater (i.e. Rigel will continue to have access to its internal freshwater resources). Is that not what's going on?

The Valentian Accordion points the sluice was built as an agricultural project meant to benefit both countries. How that works exactly when both gates are connected to the ocean and one seemingly lets the water in... beats me. But that's what it does.

[Samz707]

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

 

So, I gave the sluice worker some bonewalker oil and he gave me... 10 silver marks. Um... isn't that the trade-in price of bonewalker oil normally?

...YES! YES IT IS! I JUST CHECKED AGAIN! The fuck is the point of this quest!?

 

The beginning of the agonizing slow assassination of what remains of Celica's character. Jedah calls out to her. But... that's all. For now at least.

Now to wade across map damage swamps while three goddamned cantors spam shit at us.

Kamui and Leon have a talk and...

...Okay, this is odd. I got the impression from the rest of Kamui's talk with Leon that Kamui's not gay, but when Leon talks about a hypothetical quest to find the perfect man if Valbar weren't around, and says that sounds like fun, Kamui agrees. They follow it up like Leon read that as gayer than Kamui meant, but... the fuck did Kamui mean by agreeing that hunting for the perfect man across the country would be fun?

 

You can get other non-silver mark rewards.

Brain damage from constantly huffing swamp fumes.

Real Men be Wingmen, even for their gay friends. ThatorLeonPayshimtoputonaValbarwig

 

 

[Jotari]

1 hour ago, Alastor15243 said:

Christ, that's an awesome point too.

 

But her base talk right after it is about how much she loves being special and hates having to hide. She doesn't see the merit of hiding her power at the cost of her ego even after being captured and used against her will.

Oh yes he does. See what I quoted? Jedah explicitly brings up, in his own words, "the madness shared by all dragonkind". He knows about degeneration.

It is possible Duma and Mila know about the degeneration but don't know how to stop it. We actually don't know they're not manaketes. Nothing is said on the topic one way or another, but Mila does curiously hold something that could possibly be a dragon stone, even though it doesn't look like previously seen divine stones. It's also possible Duma started his soul eating ways as a method to maintain sanity (if soul eating even has any effect on degeneration, the game is quite wishwashy on that point). It's more than possible that Mila and Duma were informed of the degeneration and did become manaketes, but that it still wasn't enough to stop their degeneration. Fire and Mage manaketes seem to be safe from degeneration, but of all the divine dragons we know of, only Tiki ever actually kept their dragon stone. And even then two thousand years later she had to seal a portion of her power away until needed. Xane and Gotoh willingly throw away their dragon stones, I don't think we ever get an explanation why, but presumably they have good reason to do so, and that reason being that they're so powerful degeneration will hit them even if they're manaketes is a pretty decent one.