Chapter 1 beaten without Marcus

[Harvey]

So I argued with someone that beating chapter 1 without marcus would be practically impossible. Well turns out that he did do it without Marcus. You know? That very first chapter where you have tough enemies that even Allen and Lance won't kill easy at first?

Well, here's the vid..

 

All I can say is that the RNG was in his favor otherwise, he would have lost Allen at the last part.

 

[whase]

Is this considered a hard thing to do? I always do a Roy solo first chapter since I don't enjoy the other characters given here.

That said, I do always use Marcus to get to the village while Roy is avoiding bandits on a forest.

[Harvey]

Wait..is this actually simple to do without Marcus?

 

[BergelomeuSantos]

Wait, beating the first map is hard without Marcus?

Sure, I can see it taking more turns but...yeah. I never played vanilla hard mode but my custom rom for it was quite neutral in terms of dificulty at this map. (And take my word that my custom rom is not easy) 

[Hello72207]

I mean: I did it on hard mode with just Bors and Roy because that is what I got in the FE6 pmu.

So yeah, I would say it is possible without marcus

[sailtheshipacrossthesea]

This map is pretty easy without Marcus. I'd like to see someone try chapter 4 without him, though. That would be interesting.

[Hello72207]

1 hour ago, Rejoinable said:

This map is pretty easy without Marcus. I'd like to see someone try chapter 4 without him, though. That would be interesting.

I also did chapter 4 without him. It was hard. I could only use Roy, Bors, Elen, Rutger, Lugh, and Thany. That was not fun.

[Whisky]

On 4/24/2020 at 6:24 PM, Rejoinable said:

This map is pretty easy without Marcus. I'd like to see someone try chapter 4 without him, though. That would be interesting.

Easy? The guy in the video (Diogo) completely ran out of Vulneraries and barely beat the boss only by getting a Crit. How is it easy? Your non-Marcus inits

literally get killed in 2 hits and need to use Vulneraries every turn to survive, which you will run out of eventually.

I agree that Chapter 4 would be much harder though.

[AnonymousSpeed]

It's doable without Marcus but it's much more tedious, there is literally no reason not to use Marcus for the first seven or so chapters of the game.

[Whisky]

3 minutes ago, AnonymousSpeed said:

It's doable without Marcus but it's much more tedious, there is literally no reason not to use Marcus for the first seven or so chapters of the game.

I think he’s still very helpful from Chapters 9-11 as well. Basically half the game.

[Koops]

Chapter 12 isn't even that hard anyway so you could argue he's good there too despite the fact that this is pretty much the point where your units become self-sufficient. Chapter 13 is definitely not tho, I think that chapter is the point where some enemies become super powerful.

[Whisky]

2 minutes ago, Koops said:

Chapter 12 isn't even that hard anyway so you could argue he's good there too despite the fact that this is pretty much the point where your units become self-sufficient. Chapter 13 is definitely not tho, I think that chapter is the point where some enemies become super powerful.

I actually think he’s still useful on Chapter 13 too. He can deal a lot of damage to the Cavaliers with a Horseslayer, and that Chapter gives you enough deployment slots that you probably don’t have enough units better than him to justify not bringing him. Against Wyverns he can hope for a Crit with a Killer Axe or use a Wrym Slayer. He isn’t great, but he is very versatile. His Rescue/Drop/Canto utility is useful here as well.

Edited April 29, 2020 by Whisky

[The Roger The Paladin]

4 minutes ago, Koops said:

Chapter 12 isn't even that hard anyway so you could argue he's good there too despite the fact that this is pretty much the point where your units become self-sufficient. Chapter 13 is definitely not tho, I think that chapter is the point where some enemies become super powerful.

I've seen him kill Murdoch on hard. Mind @Saint Rubenio has the strangest luck in LPs. You go from seeing "good" units get screwed over to the point they're bad, and you get guys like Matthis or Marcus or Norton wrecking their game.

[samthedigital]

Quote

So I argued with someone that beating chapter 1 without marcus would be practically impossible.

Just out of curiosity why did this argument come up? If it was as simple as wondering if it was possible then sure, the question has some merit, but it isn't a very useful question in any other context.

[Whisky]

5 minutes ago, samthedigital said:

Just out of curiosity why did this argument come up? If it was as simple as wondering if it was possible then sure, the question has some merit, but it isn't a very useful question in any other context.

Diogo was arguing that Wolt is better than Marcus.

[samthedigital]

Quote

Diogo was arguing that Wolt is better than Marcus.

Wouldn't it be much easier to argue Marcus>Wolt by simply stating that Marcus saves more time when playing efficiently?

[Whisky]

2 minutes ago, samthedigital said:

Wouldn't it be much easier to argue Marcus>Wolt by simply stating that Marcus saves more time when playing efficiently?

Well you know, one thing led to another. We were saying that the early-game would be impossible without Marcus, and Diogo said that the early game isn’t even that hard and Marcus isn’t that important.

Also, Diogo doesn’t really care much about efficiency. He says that Amelia is good.

Edited April 29, 2020 by Whisky

[samthedigital]

Quote

Also, Diogo doesn’t really care much about efficiency.

I guess the next thing would be to ask what criteria he is using to judge how good a character is.

[Whisky]

8 minutes ago, samthedigital said:

I guess the next thing would be to ask what criteria he is using to judge how good a character is.

Supposedly, his criteria is being both efficient and effective. He values getting as much exp as possible and wants his units to be as strong as possible at the end of the game, even if it’s unnecessary. I might agree that Wolt can be better than Marcus at the end of the game, but arguing that he’s better overall is pretty silly. It seems like Diogo really doesn’t care how good units are early on. He only cares about how good they can be at the end of the game.

[eclipse]

If you're going by strict growths and averages, Marcus looks bad.  But if you're taking bases into account, then Marcus is good.

[Koops]

Not just bases, but his overall contribution to your success especially on Hard mode. Although Zealot has the better bases he is not as useful as Marcus is because Marcus was around since forever, while Zealot joins at a time where you already have Marcus and is an extra Jeigan.

And even if you field him at a time where his combat is bad, one thing that he never loses is his class.

Edited April 29, 2020 by Koops

[eclipse]

38 minutes ago, Koops said:

Not just bases, but his overall contribution to your success especially on Hard mode. Although Zealot has the better bases he is not as useful as Marcus is because Marcus was around since forever, while Zealot joins at a time where you already have Marcus and is an extra Jeigan.

And even if you field him at a time where his combat is bad, one thing that he never loses is his class.

Marcus does have some pretty good support conversations!  😛

Zealot can phase out Marcus, if you will.  Being able to carry your team until Perceval's no small feat.  Both have their uses.

[Whisky]

5 hours ago, eclipse said:

Marcus does have some pretty good support conversations!  😛

Zealot can phase out Marcus, if you will.  Being able to carry your team until Perceval's no small feat.  Both have their uses.

Why not both?

[eclipse]

7 hours ago, Whisky said:

Why not both?

Kinda depends on the state of the army.  You recruit some really good units, so someone's gotta go.

[Whisky]

8 minutes ago, eclipse said:

Kinda depends on the state of the army.  You recruit some really good units, so someone's gotta go.

Eventually. But I do think Marcus is still very helpful for a little while after getting Zealot.