nflchamp

Yeah, I don't really feel like arguing semantics about what each tier actually means the characters do. But, yeah, if Kyza drops to Bottom then Pelleas should too. The opposite isn't necessarily true, though. Pelleas could fall to Bottom without Kyza. That would, of course, require anti-Pelleas arguments and probably some more pro-Kyza arguments. (P.S. I think Kyza > Pelleas, I just don't want the Kyza 3-4 argument to feel like we're praising Kyza here for some amazing preformance.)

1) Low tier =/= negative. Gareth is low tier, he's invariably positive. Sanaki is low tier, she's invariably positive. 2) Kyza is quickly running out of things he could be considered capable of doing. If he can't even do this without being a negative, Pelleas' ridiculous chip could place him above Kyza. (Not saying that it does, just that it could happen.) You'll have to ask the pope for forgiveness. ;)

Well, when you consider you're letting a unit who sucks at it and is taking away EXP from a unit that is actually being used who could do the same thing better, Kyza doing the job is arguably a negative.

Your question really wasn't about Gatrie, it was about how Kyza can help Ranulf. I just felt the need to point out he sucks at even what you're claiming he can do. They really don't matter because they'll likely be incompetent morons who do something silly like go backwards for healing. Doesn't really change the fact that they'd do a better job than Kyza stat-wise.

Anyone who has been ferried by Oscar and people who have been smited once at least keep up. In fact, they probably get there faster if ferried. *Loads up 3-4 save* Kyza 30MT/22SPD Generic Tiger 43MT/18SPD Generic Cat 33MT/26SPD Enemy Thunder Mage 33HP/12DEF/17SPD Enemy Sniper 37HP/17DEF/19SPD No offense, but they probably could. They even have crappier defensive stats than Ranulf, so they'd probably get targeted first, which is what is really important.

Gatrie isn't going to have 23 SPD by 3-4. That'd require, what, 5 levels? Mia could get that much, but she starts 3 levels lower and probably reaches more enemies. I think it's great that there was a time we thought Gatrie could do this and get use out of celerity, but I think that time is past as efficiency seems to have improved. EDIT: Grammar, how I loathe thee.

CHAPTER 3-4 Sold my new worthless items! Bought Shinon the Silencer with my newfound funds. BEXP both Mia and Neph a level, netting both +STR. Raise Ike x Mia to B. Ranulf is getting Pass + Celerity this chapter, while Haar is picking up Savior. Gatrie is benched for Mordecai. Haar gets a level and procs SPD. Yay! Haar does most of the heavy lifting, taking Ike up the cliffs. Neph and Shinon do most of the heavy lifting in helping Ranulf to the arrive square. Mordecai smites Ike onto the arrive square so Ranulf could finish the chapter. Might have been able to go faster, but this seemed safest. Turns (chapter/total): 7/159 BEXP (chapter/current): 2964/11107 Funds: 9210 Unit Lvl HP STR MAG SKL SPD LCK DEF RES Support Ike 14.76 46 26 3 30 24 14 23 7 B Mia Titania 17.79 37 25 10 23 24 19 22 14 C Oscar Soren 6.44 29 10 24 21 18 11 9 22 C Gatrie Mist 3.75 28 9 14 14 16 17 7 16 C Boyd Boyd 10.24 46 23 2 20 19 14 16 8 C Mist Oscar 13.13 38 20 7 22 22 18 18 13 C Titania Shinon 15.39 44 22 8 30 25 15 22 14 Mia 12.54 38 19 5 30 30 20 15 9 B Ike Neph 12.31 44 19 7 26 27 16 20 18 C Brom Haar 16.73 47 27 2 26 24 17 26 7 Mordi 16.34 57 14 1 9 9 15 16 4 Ranulf 26.04 55 14 6 16 15 23 13 10 CHAPTER 3-5 Made Titania x Oscar and Boyd x Mist B supports. Established a Neph x Shinon support. Titania got Pass, Heathe Shade, Reyson Celerity. Going to see if I can get the Energy Drop. Haar (with Heather in tow), Titanaia, Oscar, and Reyson go straight down. Haar and Titania beat the crap out of stuff, while the other three stay out of the way. Ike, Gatrie, and Mia try to get as much EXP on the right side as possible. Neph and Shinon do the same on the left. No one else matters. Heather steals the energy drop and Titania and Haar combine for a guaranteed boss kill. I thought this was going to be difficult, but it ended up being the easiest chapters thus far. Turns (chapter/total): 3/162 BEXP (chapter/current): 2000/13107 Funds: 9210 Unit Lvl HP STR MAG SKL SPD LCK DEF RES Support Ike 15.23 46 27 3 30 25 15 23 7 B Mia Titania 18.54 38 26 10 24 25 19 22 14 B Oscar Soren 6.44 29 10 24 21 18 11 9 22 C Gatrie Mist 3.75 28 9 14 14 16 17 7 16 B Boyd Boyd 10.3 46 23 2 20 19 14 16 8 B Mist Oscar 13.68 38 20 7 22 22 18 18 13 B Titania Shinon 15.83 44 22 8 30 25 15 22 14 C Neph Mia 12.93 38 19 5 30 30 20 15 9 B Ike Neph 12.91 44 19 7 26 27 16 20 18 C Shinon Haar 17.97 47 28 2 26 24 17 26 7 Gatrie 11.21 45 26 5 18 20 16 25 11 C Soren Heather 7.58 32 15 9 21 25 16 10 14 Reyson 15.21 40 3 5 5 11 31 6 17 CHAPTER 3-6 Haha, I can finally report on the 1-E stats (or the important ones anyways). Unit Lvl HP STR MAG SKL SPD LCK DEF RES Support Micaiah 1 22 6 14 13 12 19 7 14 A Sothe Sothe 5.19 36 19 4 24 22 18 15 11 A Micaiah Volug 15.65 49 13 3 12 13 13 9 7 C Zihark Nolan 17.2 43 15 0 16 14 11 10 5 B Aran Laura 5.8 17 5 10 6 8 11 4 10 C Edward Zihark 5.9 31 18 6 24 25 11 13 11 C Volug Jill 18.24 32 11 1 13 16 16 18 4 Aran 11.11 25 11 0 15 13 9 13 3 B Nolan Anyways, first thing first, BEXP Nolan and Jill to 20 and promote. Might as well get whatever stats I can. I Sealed Aran, too, cause, well, I had an extra Seal. Made a Nolan x Jill support because, well, I doubt 10 avoid is going to change much for Nolan. He can tank 1 Tiger. Yeppers, so long as he’s in range of the new Laura support he has, even a 41MT tiger can’t kill him. Unless it doubles because Aran only has 14 SPD. Whoops. Totally redid skills. Nolan has Vantage + Beastfoe, Sothe has Parity + Renewal, Volug has Resolve + Wrath, Jill has Paragon, Zihark has Cancel + Imbue. Unsurprisingly, this chapter is annoying when anyone worthwhile is RNG screwed. Jill and Nolan became good after a little while and were able to handle the right side. Volug and Sothe handled the top gap, with help from the BK and a first turn screen of allies. And damn it, Leo rocks. Reliable 2-range FTW! Difference between getting a KO and not for my STR-screwed Jill. Oh yeah, got the Brave Bow. Turns (chapter/total): 11/173 BEXP (chapter/current): 2308/3338 Funds: ??? Unit Lvl HP STR MAG SKL SPD LCK DEF RES Support Micaiah 3.04 23 6 16 15 12 21 7 16 A Sothe Sothe 7.28 36 19 4 26 22 19 15 11 A Micaiah Volug 16.98 50 14 3 13 13 14 10 7 C Zihark Nolan 5.52 49 18 5 23 21 15 14 8 C Jill Laura 6.56 18 5 11 6 8 12 4 10 C Aran Zihark 6.38 31 18 6 24 25 12 13 11 C Volug Jill 11.42 43 17 4 18 24 23 23 11 C Nolan Yeah, I finally am leaving out the scrubs. Not worth mentioning them. And I'm serious, Leonardo is the best untrained scrub ever. He probably made it possible for something like an 11 turn rather than 13-14 turns. Oh yeah, just in case anyone cared, Jill is below average in every stat other than HP and DEF. EDIT: Which of Janaff/Ulki should I use my energy drop on?

Yeah, that's probably a good idea. And I finally figured out a support partner for Neph. Neph + Shinon. They'll probably both end up in endgame, too! Score! Alright, in all honesty I was hoping to get a +MT support for Neph, but everyone not named Mia sucks, so it ain't happening.

CHAPTER 3-2 First things first, I made some supports this chapter. Ike x Mia; Brom x Neph; Gatrie x Mist (that’s all I could do :)). Sold all the stuff I have for money purposes. Made Mia a Steel Sword forge (+5MT/+15CRIT) and Neph a Steel Lance forge (+5MT/+15CRIT). Arrow card gave Neph’s forge +10 hit. Titania used the Speedwing and Dracoshield, Neph used the Energy Drop and Seraph Robe. Bought a lot of generic stuff for use at a later date. Gave Mia Cancel, Neph Adept, Shinon Disarm, Titania Savior, Haar Celerity, Mist Shade. That’s it, I think. Ilyana didn’t get fielded. Haar beat the crap out of the top left, everyone else went down. Mia killed the boss with wyrmslayer. Turns (chapter/total): 5/144 BEXP (chapter/current): 1875/6587 Funds: 3163 Unit Lvl HP STR MAG SKL SPD LCK DEF RES Support Ike 13.27 45 26 3 29 24 14 23 7 C Mia Titania 17.07 37 25 10 23 24 19 22 14 Soren 6.37 29 10 24 21 18 11 9 22 Mist 2.86 28 9 14 14 15 17 7 16 C Gatrie Rolf 2.45 33 18 3 21 20 13 13 10 Boyd 9.89 45 23 1 20 18 13 16 8 Oscar 12.94 38 20 7 22 21 18 17 13 Shinon 14.25 44 21 7 29 24 15 21 14 Gatrie 10.6 44 25 5 18 20 15 24 11 C Mist Rhys 4.48 27 9 24 16 14 21 7 25 Mia 10.54 36 18 5 28 30 19 14 9 C Ike Neph 9.24 42 18 7 26 27 14 16 18 C Brom Brom 3.76 37 19 4 18 17 13 21 10 C Neph Heather 7.48 32 15 9 21 25 16 10 14 Haar 14.64 46 25 2 26 23 15 25 7 Ilyana 13.48 22 7 12 12 14 7 3 9 CHAPTER 3-3 Sold the Secrect Book that I thought about maybe using and bought a Dracoshield with the extra cash. Gave that to Neph. Established Titania x Oscar, Mist x Boyd, and Gatrie x Soren supports. Alright, basically, Haar did stuff. Killed senators cause they’re dumb. Neph doubling SM is ridiculously fun. Honestly, I almost routed this map. Neph got the boss kill. Really, I just wanted to see if I could get her close enough to a level for BEXP. Turns (chapter/total): 8/152 BEXP (chapter/current): 3050/9637 Funds: 2210 Unit Lvl HP STR MAG SKL SPD LCK DEF RES Support Ike 14.35 46 26 3 30 24 14 23 7 C Mia Titania 17.35 37 25 10 23 24 19 22 14 C Oscar Soren 6.44 29 10 24 21 18 11 9 22 C Gatrie Mist 3.52 28 9 14 14 16 17 7 16 C Boyd Boyd 10.23 46 23 2 20 19 14 16 8 C Mist Oscar 13.09 38 20 7 22 22 18 18 13 C Titania Shinon 14.69 44 21 7 29 24 15 21 14 Gatrie 10.79 44 25 5 18 20 15 24 11 C Soren Mia 11.76 37 18 5 29 30 20 15 9 C Ike Neph 10.75 42 18 7 26 27 14 19 18 C Brom Haar 15.7 47 26 2 26 23 16 26 7 So I'm batting around this idea of maybe trying to BEXP Haar to try and get a SPD proc and then Crown him. Problem being that SPD is tied with HP as 3rd highest growth and RES is on .1 behind both. I'm thinking I can wait. I'll probably BEXP Neph. Even though she's a bit further away, she's only level 10, so it should be relatively cheap.

CHAPTER 3-P Part 3. Here we go. Provoke on Ike, Adept on Mia. Turn 1, wonderful missing mishaps on the SM. It was funny. I favored people (namely Mia) and tried to work on adjacents. The laguz AI seemed to think blocking off the boss on Turn 7 so I couldn’t attack it was a good idea, so it took 8 turns. Turns (chapter/total): 8/131 BEXP (chapter/current): 3208/3208 Funds: 5000 Unit Lvl HP STR MAG SKL SPD LCK DEF RES Support Ike 11.66 44 24 2 28 23 14 21 7 Titania 16.35 36 25 10 22 21 19 29 14 Soren 5.25 28 9 23 21 18 11 9 21 Mist 1.78 28 9 13 13 15 16 7 16 Rolf 1.62 32 17 3 20 19 13 13 9 Boyd 8.81 45 22 1 20 18 13 15 8 Oscar 12.44 38 20 7 22 21 18 17 13 Shinon 13.33 43 21 7 28 24 15 20 14 Gatrie 10.34 44 25 5 18 20 15 24 11 Rhys 3.79 27 8 23 16 14 21 7 24 Mia 8.76 35 17 5 26 29 19 14 8 CHAPTER 3-1 There were a couple of bumps in the road, but basically the same as 1-P. Had Lethe and Lyre help with the southwest reinforcements. Their turn reliably comes before the enemy's. Turns (chapter/total): 8/139 BEXP (chapter/current): 1504/4712 Funds: 5000 Unit Lvl HP STR MAG SKL SPD LCK DEF RES Support Ike 12.95 45 25 3 29 24 14 22 7 Titania 16.9 36 25 10 22 21 19 29 14 Soren 6.31 29 10 24 21 18 11 9 22 Mist 2.41 28 9 14 14 15 17 7 16 Rolf 2.36 33 18 3 21 20 13 13 10 Boyd 9.7 45 23 1 20 18 13 16 8 Oscar 12.54 38 20 7 22 21 18 17 13 Shinon 14.12 44 21 7 29 24 15 21 14 Gatrie 10.55 44 25 5 18 20 15 24 11 Rhys 4.26 27 9 24 16 14 21 7 25 Mia 9.45 35 17 5 27 30 19 14 9 Will work on more later. Umm, how many forges should I make guys?

Volug is 3HKO'd and at least 2 need to be Tigers. Zihark is 2HKO'd by any combination of Tiger and Cat. Sure, they're only seeing what, 25% true? That still leaves Zihark at 6% chance of death. Volug, 1.5%. And then he has to actually see 3 attacks (that kill him).

1) You're responding to a post made two days ago that has already been discussed and moved away from. I see no reason for you to bring it back up. 2) Hahaha, Zihark x Volug support before 1-8. Priceless.

CHAPTER 2-E End of Part 2. Yay! Made Leanne + Neal support cause I could. Sending over lots of goodies to the GM. Less important stuff is on Lethe and Mordecai. Gave Neph the Talisman and leveled her to 8 with BEXP. No STR or DEF, but since she’s basically capped SKL/SPD/RES… Goals are to get Nullify and Energy Drop. I’ll get the Dracoshield, too, if possible. Haar gets the Speedwing off of Marcia and uses it. Haar and Calill combine to get Nullify. Haar has to survive an Elthunder mage, but whatever. Both Mordecai and Nealuchi grass on turn 1. They have to or I have no chance at 4 turns. Turn 2 I clear out the middle area (mostly). Turn 3 I finish clearing the area out and have Mordecai shift and tank at the right chokepoint, as he doubles and kills an armor to make room for the energy drop one to be able to attack. Haar blocks the stairs on the left and everyone gets into position for the Draco steal. Turn 4 Mordecai kills the Energy Drop armor, Neph trades for it and kills a priest for free EXP. Calill hits a Longbow dude to weaken him and Neal finishes. I needed to do this so Leanne could get to the right spot. Heather gets dropped and Haar gets into position, taking a free kill while he’s at it. Leanne vigors, Heather steals, Elincia makes a path for Haar, and Haar finishes the chapter. What’s great is that Ledveck is in Worst Bio and Haar is in Good Bio, leaving Haar at 95 hit and Ludveck at 46, greatly reducing the chances of getting crit killed on the attack or failing to kill Ludveck. Haar hit a Cancel to prevent the crit, making that a non-factor. Turns (chapter/total): 4/123 BEXP (chapter/current): 1587/2047 Funds: 7500 Ch. 2-E Unit Lvl HP STR MAG SKL SPD LCK DEF RES Support Elincia 1.79 36 19 17 21 22 29 18 24 Marcia 6.34 35 16 6 17 20 13 16 16 Lethe 21.08 51 9 6 13 12 18 9 10 Mordi 16.33 57 14 1 9 9 15 16 4 Neph 8.48 34 16 7 25 27 13 16 18 Brom 3.68 37 19 4 18 17 13 21 10 Heather 7.28 32 15 9 21 25 16 10 14 Neal 22.15 53 10 4 9 36 24 10 10 C Leanne Leanne 6.6 26 0 4 1 6 28 2 12 C Neal Haar 12.89 46 24 2 25 23 13 24 7 Calill 6.21 23 9 19 18 18 16 11 17 Might start Part 3 later. Depends on how I feel after dinner.

I'm pretty sure there are only 3 2-range enemies and a healer on the left side of 1-8 and everyone else will suicide into Nailah. I can say this as I'm pretty Naliah cleared the left side on her own in 4 turns for me and had nothing to do on my turn 5, IIRC.

You're telling me I wasn't going crazy when I thought Ike didn't have 4 Iron Swords in my first playthrough of PoR?

Zihark with Beastfoe is just going to get Zihark killed.

The promoted sniper would generally work.

Kieran killed the guy. Marcia took it. Bit of a nuisance, but no big deal. Guess you can tack that onto reasons fielding Marcia is okay.

CHAPTER 2-3 I bought the Hammer, Horseslayer, Killer Bow, and Killing Edge. Not too sure how useful that last one is going to be. Astrid isn’t deployed. Using the Yellow units as a screen to keep guys off me. Took a while to figure out placement to get everything to work. Geoffrey eventually gets a boss kill and sends the Brave Lance to Convoy. We’ll see how I can put that to use in part 3. Got the Arms Scroll. Cause my enemies suck so hard that my partner’s can kill them, 40 left alive. Hugely important factoid (as far as I’m concerned): The spot to the right of the Armor in the center north starts the Speedwing Halb moving. Pretty much guarantees that you can kill him if you get him to start moving turn 3. (Hey, guess where Geoffrey can be on turn 3.) Turns (chapter/total): 6/119 BEXP (chapter/current): 6351/9940 Funds: 10350 Unit Lvl HP STR MAG SKL SPD LCK DEF RES Support Marcia 6.15 35 16 6 17 20 13 16 16 Geof 16.1 37 24 8 24 20 19 19 16 Kieran 11.26 41 21 6 20 20 16 18 11 Makalov 7.03 37 18 5 17 18 20 17 9 Danved 9.15 39 17 8 23 21 18 15 12 Astrid 2 33 13 8 16 15 17 10 14 I’m going to say this now, I think the only reason Marcia was worthwhile in this chapter was because I could keep my group connected and prevent clogging with the spot she took. She didn’t even get a chance to kill the Horseslayer guy because I didn’t have the time of day to kill the Bowgun Warriors. I just sacrificed a partner unit to the Horseslayer guy, who missed and took a counter because his hit rate sucks. Danved kills because he isn’t afraid of Bowgun dudes. Then I had to concoct a way to protect Marcia on turn 5 so she wouldn’t die. I suppose she was an extra unit to try and help kill the Speedwing Halb, if necessary, but I didn't need her in the end. I was originally planning to do 2-E tonight too, but I'm tired as I've been trying to figure everything out for a while now.

Heaven being undesired is a direct effect of hit rates not being a big factor in the game. At least not by the time a support comes around.

The point is, under normal circumstances, Renning is never going to be deployed and Stefan and Volke are useless. Renning/Volke/Stefan/Oliver are already ranked solely on their endgame contributions now. If we're going to drop Oliver under the pathetic people because he's not optimal, then we obviously need to send the rest of our non-optimals down there too.

Sure, Renning, Stefan, and Volke can do fine in Endgame, but there are better choices. Therefore, by the same logic you're saying Oliver is under Fiona/Astrid/Meg, they are too. As for Stefan in 4-3, the chapter is basically over by the time you recruit him; and I doubt his superb movement in the desert will even let him reach any enemies. Volke in 4-5 is as good as any other scrub who's around while Tibarn wins the chapter. Big deal, that's basically nothing.

I will never support Oliver below Astrid/Meg/Fiona. Unless, of course, you want to drop Stefan/Volke/Renning/Kyza down there, too. They're always outclassed by somebody for their entire existences. Sure, they're better than Oliver, but they'll still fall to the same logic that is being applied to Oliver.

I have 3 left with no intention of using them and Kyza will provide me 3 more in part 3. I'm not going to worry too much about them.

Can you even hit a Silencer on Limstella?