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Which is why my vote is on Prims; the only people other than myself in the game whom I think could have picked out that crumb are Manix himself, Prims, and Kirsche (who's asleep). I guess the bit about how the dayvig could have waited a few hours to do it to avoid timezones is a good point though. But Dayvigging Manix off night phase before he made the crumb in question doesn't make much sense to me. WHATEVER 12am and I haven't started studying for my Special Relativity quiz tomorrow; later

We've like never had a Voodoo on SF outside of EiMM games (afaicr anyways) so why would you think of that over Dayvig? Also I still want more of an explanation over why Shmo is so scummy. Also I was thinking about the SB kill and it was kind of weird because sure there wasn't a lot of suspicion on him, but I think overall there was less on Manix, Prims, or even Kirsche. It makes more sense to me if someone saw a Mason crumb and killed him because they knew he was confirmed town anyways. Except I'm not sure why Prims would bring up that he saw a Mason crumb in that case. @Refa: The "should be safe to do so" implies knowledge of protection itg, so yeah I thought he was Doc as soon as he made that statement, but I guess thinking about it, it makes more sense for that sort of crumb to come from the Backup Doc than the actual Doc.

fuck it ##Vote: Prims If the mafia just wanted to shoot someone obvtown, they could have also done this last phase because it's not like the one or two posts Manix made today made him way more obvtown or something. Or they could have saved it and used it like Paper used his scum Dayvig in FAYZ. The timing suggests heavily it was because of the Doc crumb, and I think other than me Prims is the only person online who'd be impulsive/decisive enough to shoot within the span of a few minutes of it happening. His Shmo suspicion is also a reaction to just one post that Shmo made and I find it hard to believe he'd really just vote a first-time player right away over something that we just saw a new player do as town like two games ago.

Also I don't think Kirsche is scum because I don't think he'd actually quickhammer someone he knew to be town just because they self-voted. And if, as he pointed out, the Poly lynch was likely, then it's not like he needed to quickhammer to secure the lynch- he could have just waited another 24 hours. Nobody that I can recall actually had a case against Manix except Grass a bit (but lol Insomniac Dayvig) so I find it pretty hard to believe that was a town shot even if they were a new player who didn't know Manix's meta.

Manix, the reason I thought you were town and Prims wasn't even though neither of you were addressing C9++ is because you try to be more logical and less ~vibes/paranoia when you're scum. I don't really have much meta on Prims that lasts more than a game or so because he makes active efforts to subvert it. Prims- why is Shmo scum? You never said anything explicit and implicitly it looks like a reaction to his "I don't need to tell my reasons to you" thing, except Shmo said right after that it was a reaction test of sorts, and you never addressed that. CUT scum Dayvig I guess since Manix crumbed Doc hard when he told the Mason to claim.

The next mini I'm running is OC as well. It's a sort of silly setup and I don't promise balance but hopefully it should be fun!

Yeah, okay. Euklyd, is ~10PM PST good for you tomorrow night? Since that's probably when the chat room will open approximately assuming phase doesn't end early.

Rein, you haven't posted this phase and haven't given a scumread since Grass on D3. Don't lapse! Who do you think is scum? Want to see reads from Shinori too. Just because we think you're town doesn't mean you should just coast or just post stuff in code. Also applies to Bearclaw, eithout the part about the code.

Moulder isn't going to reach his MAG cap for either class even at 20/20. I've never understood why NO AS LOSS ELFIRE is hyped so much when Moulder will probably fight monsters more than humans, and Slayer >> Elfire

I got the idea of a Lover maker because nobody has claimed any item or ability that can make people into Lovers, and I more or less know everybody's roles, so I can only assume that it's a scum ability. Also I realized I forgot to tell Kay to give her item to Shinori. Kay, you should do that tonight if you haven't used it yourself.

I think the "scum forget who they're pushing" point isn't a good one because I forget why I find people scummy at least as often when I'm town as I do when I'm scum (though here I just posted things in a different order). I don't understand why scum would have any extra trouble remembering who they're pushing. Town have to remember who they find scummy, scum have to remember who they're pretending they find scummy. Don't see it as a huge difference. My vote wasn't "Prims is bad at meta". He was using one half of a set of past games to assess my play without paying any attention to the other half, even though he was around for both of the other ones. That's a scummy way to push a lynch. BTW I still want Manix to elaborate more on this- all he said about C9++ was that I was more reactionary in AM/PM than C9++ even though that's not true. Meibum and Shmobum are probably not both scum because I don't think they'd buddy together so obviously if they were. Also while I know Scorri doesn't set alignments and stuff, I think that she'd re-roll if two new players were both scum. As for individually- Mei's reads are mostly bad. I hope at least the one on me is a joke? You know that at the very beginning of the game, people just put down random votes on whomever right? The Boron one is just untrue, as she pointed out, and the Troll one makes no sense- how is being busy with work a townie thing? However, I do sort of agree with what she (and Shmo) said about Poly. Considering the levels of elaborate WIFOM logic he often goes into, jumping on Shmobum seems really easy. Also, earlier when he found me SUPER SCUMMY for temporarily quitting the thread, he said it still wasn't enough to deter him from voting Refa, yet for some reason Mei and Shmo were? Prims's jump was also kind of meh. Prims/Poly, what are your feelings on Shmo now that he outed that it was a reaction test? Can't remember if I said this last night or not, but Troll came in and I get that he was tired, but the one paragraph he did post was sort of low-priority and not really necessary.

Okay but now that you know that roles weren't actually chosen do you still find Kirsche scummy?

Rocker asked for a sub. I think he's getting one tomorrow or something. Either way, how the hell did you get Insomniac from him being inactive? And why does him being inactive mean he has to be inactive scum? He could just town uninterested in the game. Also you know that while the name of the game is Choose You're Own Role, people didn't actually get to choose their own role right? They picked a character, and then Prims assigned a role for them off that. Or everyone in the town would have been like DEATHPROOF QUESTION ASKER PLEASE. So the mafia couldn't have purposefully grabbed GF + Mayor. And if you think the mafia would try to pick good roles then what's your explanation for them picking Insomniac, if you think that's what Rocker is?

The odds of the doctor having blocked the kill are decent enough that lynching Kirsche just based off the fact that he was hooked is probably not a good idea. And I haven't really found any of his in-thread actions bad since super ED1. Also I think that if he were scum he would have sacced himself and just stayed in the chatroom the whole time and refused to get out, or not bothered showing up at all, but he came and was amenable so meh.

I don't really remember you giving many reads. You said you'd go read some ISOs and then I don't think you ever came back? I forgot to take logs but at most you might have said you found Strege a little suspicious (although that might have been Kirsche).

Kay's not lying about her claimed role. There might be more to it, but everything she's said about what she has claimed is true, including the exact mechanics of it. And she did try to target Paper, as well. Honestly I think she's town because there's no way other than a 1-shot JoaT item swap that we have to transfer items, even if it's super gimmicky. Poly, okay, you've proved your role. Do you have any actual reads though? I don't like how you expected Kay to just drop the vote on you after proving your role.

Already gave my thoughts on SB. It's possible I may be subconsciously overcompensating after getting criticized for not having any reads. idk. I see Trollstool reading the thread though; I want reads from her.

SB and Boron were made Lovers on N3. The most likely explanation I can think of why they both died at once tonight is that they became the sort of Lovers who die together, and one's death caused the other's to die as well. That or we really do have an SK, but the chances of both the mafia and SK getting blocked on two consecutive nights, plus one getting blocked on N1 is sort of low. Going to return to ##Vote: Polydeuces for now. Nothing his slot has done has convinced me otherwise. Also I'd like him to prove his role and post with the anon account.

What do you mean by attention-seeking? Just that he posted a lot?

Paper, do you think that scum made them Lovers on purpose so that they could kill both by killing one? Also Bearclaw who did you hook?

Also, since Grass unvoted to vote Eury, he's made no attempt to analyze Poly's posts, even though they've both had several posts since then. Grass has just been defending his Eury vote. Grass, do you still find Poly scummy?

Okay; I think I'm going to ##Vote: Polydeuces As I said earlier, him listing only one of me and Boron in his scumreads even though the Boron read is completely associative (which is bad in and of itself without a flip) makes no sense. He said in one post that me quitting the thread was super scummy (and that he'd vote me for it if Refa wasn't scummier, just to say 15 minutes later that he's not interested in voting me at all which doesn't make sense. He also just keeps saying that Refa is scummy for playing like Snoop without saying why, at all (in fact, the only time he actually compares specific facets of Refa's play between the two games is to point out a difference). In 132 he lets Eury go because it's her first post, which is sort of a shitty reason, but then 15 minutes later calls her out for being defensive and forced even though the only post Eury made in the meantime was the one where she talked about how she's not going to be friendly or whatever. I can see how he might have thought that was dickish (though not why he thought that was scummy), but considering that post wasn't actually an attack against Grass I don't see how it could be forced or even defensive. Everything he says about Grass in the first paragraph of 132 is positive (or at least not negative), but he still ends it with an ehhhhhhhhhhh which is ehhhhhhhhhhh since he never said anything bad about Grass.

No the main reason was because you were just calling me scum off meta and not even acknowledging all relevant meta cases. @Manix- It's not projecting; it's an expectation that if you ask someone to do something, you would be able to do the same in their situation.

@Manix- The point of mentioning Eury was that it was Prims's only read that wasn't me, and that I couldn't have had that read myself because those posts were after I left the thread. And townies under pressure can scumhunt and have reads, that is true, and I'm making an effort in doing so. But that doesn't make it less hypocritical for Prims to pressure me for having no reads when he wouldn't in my shoes either. (This all pertains to the state of matters at the time I made that post; not really applicable anymore. Anyways my own thoughts about Eury- her "vibes" feel the exact same as in the last two games to me. There's nothing really new she's doing here. I was rereading a bit and Trollstool's one post sort of stood out to me as taking a lot of words to not really say anything of worth about me, Poly, or Grass. Don't really agree with the logic behind her townreads on Prims and Manix but I suppose I can hardly fault people for having reasons for townreads I can't get. What bothers me more than that is in OS, even though he didn't have a lot of reads early on, he still threw out a prodvote on someone and made some scumhunting attempts, even though they were kind of shitty. Here he just stated he had nothing to do. ##Unvote for now since Prims responded to my main stuff. Will think about who to vote in a bit.

Except it is! Offer me a reason that's not covered by this: 1. I'm getting mad and overreacting like I did in C9++. 2. I'm not making scumhunting effort. Me being mad isn't your only point but it is your main point.