If Radiant Dawn Got a Remake

[Anacybele]

I have no problem at all with the IkexSoren thing. ElinciaxGeoffrey makes loads of sense though. Hes totally into her and shes kinda into him. Even more so in RD. Its possible she may have thought of Ike that way but realized he wasnt into her and just was all "oh well...cant win em all." Thats actually how i saw it but she did seem to always have some sort of feelings for Geoffrey.

Geoffrey might have had feelings for Elincia, yes. But I never saw the opposite. The way I saw it, Elincia only saw Geoffrey as a respected and loyal retainer, whereas she's all giggly and flirty around Ike (in PoR). Then she says "My noble Ike... All your plans..." in her deathquote in Part 4 Endgame of RD (which is a major hint, if you ask me). She also asks Ike, NOT Geoffrey, to look after Crimea if she falls in the RD chapter where she's unarmed.

But this just how I see it. Pay it no mind if you wish. :3

[Anouleth]

I have no problem at all with the IkexSoren thing. ElinciaxGeoffrey makes loads of sense though. Hes totally into her and shes kinda into him. Even more so in RD. Its possible she may have thought of Ike that way but realized he wasnt into her and just was all "oh well...cant win em all." Thats actually how i saw it but she did seem to always have some sort of feelings for Geoffrey.

Elincia status: friendzoned

[Killer Poleax]

I'd like to see Brave tomes since most of the magic users have trouble doubling. also give Micaiah at least one authority star when she promotes since she is the commander of the army

also I have no problem with GeoffreyxElincia. even if she liked Ike more I don't think Ike felt the same way about her so it wouldn't work out. at least with Geoffrey they have similar feelings towards each other

[CrashGordon94]

I'd like to see Brave tomes since most of the magic users have trouble doubling. also give Micaiah at least one authority star when she promotes since she is the commander of the army

Actually, I'd totally support this, there was even one in the series before!

[Ciarre]

I think Micaiah should have 3 authority stars because she's the vessel of the goddess and the commander of the army.

[Narga_Rocks]

I think Micaiah should have 3 authority stars because she's the vessel of the goddess and the commander of the army.

I agree that eventually she should have 3. I just don't think she should start with them. Perhaps they couldn't figure out how to increase a unit's authority stars over time and that's why it didn't happen?

[Junkhead]

Really, now. The game developers who developed a whole game couldn't get that done?

[Original Alear]

Geoffrey might have had feelings for Elincia, yes. But I never saw the opposite. The way I saw it, Elincia only saw Geoffrey as a respected and loyal retainer, whereas she's all giggly and flirty around Ike (in PoR). Then she says "My noble Ike... All your plans..." in her deathquote in Part 4 Endgame of RD (which is a major hint, if you ask me). She also asks Ike, NOT Geoffrey, to look after Crimea if she falls in the RD chapter where she's unarmed.

But this just how I see it. Pay it no mind if you wish. :3

Elincia: I've listened to all that you've had to say, Geoffrey. Now it's time

for you to hear me out.

Geoffrey: By your command.

Elinica: You fight too hard and take too many risks to protect me in combat.

Geoffrey: Is that not what a knight is sworn to do?

Elincia: But you put yourself at grave risk!

Geoffrey: It is true. I have felt the bite of steel several times while

protecting you... But I would do so again without a thought!

Elincia: You promised me long ago that you wouldn't needlessly jeopardize your

life for my sake. I guess you don't value your life after all.

Geoffrey: Your Highness...

Elincia: I know you think I should stay at camp and rest on silken pillows

without suiting up for battle. But... There's no way I could stand... Stand

seeing someone so dear to me die just beyond my grasp. So... now you know why

I asked this of you.

Geoffrey: I don't know if you realize all that you've done for the soldiers.

Do you see how you have raised the spirits of the Crimean soldiers since you

began fighting alongside them? Their princess herself leads the charge! She

doesn't ask the soldiers to risk their lives without risking her own. They

adore you. And that is why we win our battles. They fight with a ferocity no

other force could possibly match. They will win at any cost.

Elincia: ...

Geoffrey: I admit I have been fighting recklessly. ...I did so knowing you

were near me. I knew you'd be by my side if I were gravely wounded.

Elincia: Yet... You feel me a burden.

Geoffrey: I can't imagine fighting without you anymore. If you do hold my life

dear, please keep fighting. Lead us to victory!

Elincia: Oh, Geoffrey. I'm so sorry I brought you so much torment. I

misunderstood you. I am... so immature.

Geoffrey: I disobeyed your direct orders. That's no badge of honor, either.

Elincia: I'm sure I'll keep causing you troubles... but please... never leave

my side, Geoffrey.

Geoffrey: Princess Elincia... My life and blade are yours.

I think this is a smoking gun for POR, given an A support between them.

Of course, I personally think this is weaker, since Elincia's stated dream involves Crimea, not Ike, but there is this in the Ike/Elincia support:

Ike: You employed me as a mercenary. I'll give you your money's worth! ...No. It means more than that... To my last breath, I will do all that I can to ensure your dream... Elincia.

Then she says "My noble Ike... All your plans..." in her deathquote in Part 4 Endgame of RD (which is a major hint, if you ask me).

It's not a hint of much of anything IMO, since she could be referring to his plans to, say, save the world from the goddess Ashera's wrath.

She also asks Ike, NOT Geoffrey, to look after Crimea if she falls in the RD chapter where she's unarmed.

This could be attributed to her belief in Ike as the best possible ruler for the kingdom based on the ability he showed in the Mad King's War to, perhaps most of all, inspire those around him.

Elincia status: friendzoned

For Ike, the world is friendzoned.

Edited September 22, 2011 by Blue Mars

[Narga_Rocks]

Really, now. The game developers who developed a whole game couldn't get that done?

If they programmed the 1-stat minimum the way the current theory looks like they did (highest stat goes up), then clearly they are quite capable of taking the easy way out for stuff. Including creating static authority stars with no method for increasing them. The best would have been to relate her authority stars to your performance in certain chapters, like rescuing soldiers in 1-7 and civilians in 1-8. It would have been very interesting if you could do things to achieve 4 authority stars for 4-E by doing nice things in Micaiah's chapters. I can't imagine it is difficult, but static authority stars is the easy way out.

[Junkhead]

If they programmed the 1-stat minimum the way the current theory looks like they did (highest stat goes up), then clearly they are quite capable of taking the easy way out for stuff. Including creating static authority stars with no method for increasing them. The best would have been to relate her authority stars to your performance in certain chapters, like rescuing soldiers in 1-7 and civilians in 1-8. It would have been very interesting if you could do things to achieve 4 authority stars for 4-E by doing nice things in Micaiah's chapters. I can't imagine it is difficult, but static authority stars is the easy way out.

That would've been a cool idea, similiar to FE4-7's ranking system.

[Lord Glenn]

If they programmed the 1-stat minimum the way the current theory looks like they did (highest stat goes up), then clearly they are quite capable of taking the easy way out for stuff. Including creating static authority stars with no method for increasing them. The best would have been to relate her authority stars to your performance in certain chapters, like rescuing soldiers in 1-7 and civilians in 1-8. It would have been very interesting if you could do things to achieve 4 authority stars for 4-E by doing nice things in Micaiah's chapters. I can't imagine it is difficult, but static authority stars is the easy way out.

Being a programmer and assuming that they have something akin to a variable (or array) that stores all of the relevant statistics in FE10, either a forced simple increment of the value for Authority Stars (if based on fixed events, such as Micaiah's promotion to Light Sage) or a conditional statement (that would check how many soldiers you saved) with an increment of the value would be *easily* doable. Easy way out or not, these are basic programming techniques, so either IS is just extremely lazy, they ran out of time to implement it, or they decided that she just didn't need them, for whatever reason. I would guess, given the extreme simplicity of incrementing a value, that it would be one of the latter two options.

[Zanarkin]

I'd add authority to micaiah as well for Part 3/Part 4.

My DB and fliers not named Ulki in part 4 (desert) would love it.

[Anacybele]

Geoffrey: Princess Elincia... My life and blade are yours.

Of course. As I said, Geoffrey probably has feelings for her in PoR.

I think this is a smoking gun for POR, given an A support between them.

Of course Geoffrey is dear to Elincia. They're very good friends. This is the only point in either of the games where she shows it though. Everywhere else she treats Geoffrey like he's a loyal and respected retainer, particularly in RD. Here's an example.

Geoffrey: I am yours entirely.

Elincia: Geoffrey, you are surely my finest and most faithful knight.

I see no love coming from Elincia here.

Of course, I personally think this is weaker, since Elincia's stated dream involves Crimea, not Ike, but there is this in the Ike/Elincia support:

Yes, this shows that Elincia could definitely mean more to Ike than anything. And Elincia says "Oh, Ike..."

It's not a hint of much of anything IMO, since she could be referring to his plans to, say, save the world from the goddess Ashera's wrath.

I was referring to the "My noble Ike" part, actually. Elincia calls Ike her own in some way. As if he were her man. ;P

This could be attributed to her belief in Ike as the best possible ruler for the kingdom based on the ability he showed in the Mad King's War to, perhaps most of all, inspire those around him.

Which could indicate that Elincia would love to have Ike rule beside her, though she knows Ike hates the noble lifestyle. Still, Ike seems to be the kind of guy who would do anything for those he loves and cares about. He takes up the role of general for Elincia even though he doesn't like it.

Ranulf and Shinon also seem to think Ike loves Elincia. Shinon may be drunk at the time, but that doesn't mean he can't suspect anything lol.

Look, as I said, I don't think GeoffreyxElincia should be scrapped. Only that IkexElincia should've been added. That's all. End of story. ^^

Edited September 23, 2011 by Anacybele

[Dark Sage]

Shipping stuff

Ah EternalBond, glad to see you never change, turning a topic about remaking Radiant Dawn into an argument about IkexElincia.

[Vicious Sal]

About Elincia, why the hell does she say Amiti has to awaken from it's long slumber? It's been three or so years only?

[Loki Laufeyson]

She hasnt used it since? I think she was just being dramatic and hammy. ;)

[Light Of Creation Lehran]

Aside from picky little fix-ups like sprite miscolourings and stuff, I'd like to see more battles, so long as they actually fit in. I mean, there's a point in Part 1 where the narrator pretty much announces the successful liberation of pratically every Daein front, despite the fact that you never actually gain control over the fights that take place there; adding them in would be nice, and provide the Part 1 crew with a bit more training for Part 3. Part 2, meh, it was short, but there really isn't room for more. In Part 3, even though they may not be defensive keeps in their own respects, it would've been cool to have Begnion put up a fight as the Laguz Alliance lays siege to Telgam and Seliora. More random encounters in Part 4, maybe one extra per team, would be great, especially for leveling your finale team. Oh, and most epic of all, I think they should've added in a massive clash between the reunited teams and Ashera's reborn Disciples of Order in Sienne, before your elite group leaves for the Tower of Guidance.

[Progenitus]

Balance the game better. This would require a pretty huge overhaul (enemy stats, how much each stat does, along with the obvious changing character bases and growths and such), but each unit should be usable, rather than units like Fiona and Astrid existing only for the people who want to challenge themselves. Because really, there are multiple ways to add challenge to your playthrough (like not use BEXP or something), while there's nothing you can really do to make Fiona not suck ass without significnatly hampering what your team structure looks like.

For example, a casual player who wants to use a bunch of crappy units for any reason (he likes their personalities or something) has to cut corners in his playthrough if he wants it to still be manageable. For example if he wanted to use someone crappy like Danved, he has to devote resources into him so he doesn't suck which means the rest of the team gets less resources, which means your team has to be that much better to compensate. So you won't be able to use Danved AND Kieran AND Edward AND more whatever units. It's gonna be more like "Danved + a few more crappy units + top and high tiers to compensate".

A hardcore player can choose to use Danved just to challenge himself, or he can still use top tiers but put restrictions on himself to add challenge as well.

Meanwhile, if we assume all the characters are balanced, the casual player can simply add Danved to the team and doesn't have to go "well now I have to stack top tiers on my team to make up for Danved's fail" which means there's more flexibility in what that player can use for a team, which will actually add more replay value if he can use more of his favorite units. Meanwhile the hardcore player can still pick danved and just add restrictions to his playthrough if he wants a challenge.

And no, character balance doesn't mean all the characters are exactly equal and interchangeable. Some may be, but not all. For example you won't be able to just use all your low str/high spd units on the same playthrough because that means there aren't enough energy drops/adepts/etc. to go around while your speedwings will just sit in your convoy doing nothing.

[Paperblade]

why would you remake FE10

it's not even old

[Florete]

why would you remake FE10

it's not even old

I think this topic should be seen more as "what would you change?"

Come on, Paper. All you had to do was read the first line in the topic.

[Light Of Creation Lehran]

I actually really missed the Path of Radiance support conversations in Radiant Dawn, as well. Conversing mid-battle was a pain, and there are so many characters in the sequel that we know next to nothing about because of the new system; it really needs to be changed back.

Post-game content would also be much appreciated. I mean, doesn't everyone wanna continue using the team they spent so long planning and strengthening after the main storyline is through? The lack of trial maps and online content was disappointing.

The only other major thing I would've liked to see was a few more recruitable characters. Don't get the wrong idea, 70+ playables is fantastic, but a remake could introduce some new faces altogther, and jeez, bring back Largo! There was also a pair of "baddies" who I really felt deserved a fate better than death towards the end and should have been able to join up with you following their respective fights, namely Levail and Hetzel.

[Anouleth]

Balance the game better. This would require a pretty huge overhaul (enemy stats, how much each stat does, along with the obvious changing character bases and growths and such), but each unit should be usable, rather than units like Fiona and Astrid existing only for the people who want to challenge themselves. Because really, there are multiple ways to add challenge to your playthrough (like not use BEXP or something), while there's nothing you can really do to make Fiona not suck ass without significnatly hampering what your team structure looks like.

I don't think it requires a huge overhaul. Just a buff to growths for Lower Mid characters, and a buff to base stats for the tiers below them. Maybe cut Wyvern movement by one so that Haar isn't quite so dominating, but even Haar needs a lot of help with his speed to double. Maybe cut Titania's speed growth a little bit.

I don't have a problem with Ike, Sothe or Volug. Sothe/Volug are really lifesavers in Part 1 and I can't imagine playing it without them; they drop off and become more balanced later on, Volug because of gauge, Sothe just because of... Sothe-ness. Ike is the main character, and really, he's /meant/ to be really strong.

Meanwhile, if we assume all the characters are balanced, the casual player can simply add Danved to the team and doesn't have to go "well now I have to stack top tiers on my team to make up for Danved's fail" which means there's more flexibility in what that player can use for a team, which will actually add more replay value if he can use more of his favorite units. Meanwhile the hardcore player can still pick danved and just add restrictions to his playthrough if he wants a challenge.

I don't know... some characters being better and some characters being worse just seems unavoidable, and it doesn't seem like that's necessarily a bad thing. Part of building strategies is determining what team will give the best results. And you seem to misunderstand how casual players play this game. Casual players are perfectly happy to use Pelleas, or Nino, or Ewan, even though by our standards they're "crap", and I bet they don't think "well now I have to pack the rest of my team with high tiers to still get respectable turncounts and maintain street cred".

[Progenitus]

I don't think it requires a huge overhaul. Just a buff to growths for Lower Mid characters, and a buff to base stats for the tiers below them. Maybe cut Wyvern movement by one so that Haar isn't quite so dominating, but even Haar needs a lot of help with his speed to double. Maybe cut Titania's speed growth a little bit.

I don't have a problem with Ike, Sothe or Volug. Sothe/Volug are really lifesavers in Part 1 and I can't imagine playing it without them; they drop off and become more balanced later on, Volug because of gauge, Sothe just because of... Sothe-ness. Ike is the main character, and really, he's /meant/ to be really strong.

The problem with just buffing growths/bases is that since str/spd/def are basically the only important stats, if you want to balance the characters they all end up with similar builds. A character with a stat spread like Leo/Astrid/Sigrun/Ilyana where they have poor str/spd/def should all be usable, but because the stats and classes aren't equal (let's ignore the fact that some of those listed also have availability problems) they just end up crap.

I don't know... some characters being better and some characters being worse just seems unavoidable, and it doesn't seem like that's necessarily a bad thing. Part of building strategies is determining what team will give the best results.

The strategy in FE should come from determining how to beat the chapter, not figuring out what makes a unit good or bad and then using said good units to break the game (because it obviously takes so much strategy to figure out how to have Haar or Ike solo the game, which requires only slightly more effort than a-moving them across the map) or using the bad units to make a challenge on yourself.

And you seem to misunderstand how casual players play this game. Casual players are perfectly happy to use Pelleas, or Nino, or Ewan, even though by our standards they're "crap", and I bet they don't think "well now I have to pack the rest of my team with high tiers to still get respectable turncounts and maintain street cred".

I rarely play for turn counts, and obviously casual players don't care about turn counts or what some hardcore people who debate tiers for this game think about them.

What I DO care about, though, is not to have the game be a pain in the ass to beat because I just stuffed my team with low tiers and because of that I either have to fill the rest of the slots with the best units in the game or chapters just become annoying as hell. Ever tried using Edward in DB maps on HM? I know you do, you like Edward. But notice how you can't use Edward AND Leo AND Meg simultaneously? Regardless of whether you like Leo/Meg/etc., your team has become very restricted. It's like "Edward plus the top tiers of DB" because they have to compensate for Edward's fail, and you just can't afford to use more crappy units unless you want chapters to become very hard to just beat, screw caring about turn counts. What I want is to be able to use Edward plus anyone else on the DB I wish and still have the difficulty of the DB maps stay about the same.

Casual players will see noticeable differences in difficulty if they chose good characters over crappy ones like Pelleas/etc., and THAT is what needs to be dealt with. Why should these players be punished in difficulty of the game because they want to use certain characters?

Edited October 13, 2011 by smash fanatic

[Paperblade]

Come on, Paper. All you had to do was read the first line in the topic.

I don't come to the RD board to read posts, I come to respond to topic titles

[CrashGordon94]

I don't know... some characters being better and some characters being worse just seems unavoidable, and it doesn't seem like that's necessarily a bad thing. Part of building strategies is determining what team will give the best results. And you seem to misunderstand how casual players play this game. Casual players are perfectly happy to use Pelleas, or Nino, or Ewan, even though by our standards they're "crap", and I bet they don't think "well now I have to pack the rest of my team with high tiers to still get respectable turncounts and maintain street cred".

Some characters being better or worse is obvious, I think what smash suggests (and something that I would suggest too) would just be to try and close the gap as much as possible. It's not a problem if there are characters that are generally more useful than the alternatives, the problem is when the gap is huge or the lower one can't be reasonably argued over the better one.