[FE10] Rate the Unit According to Draft Performance

[Stark]

Terrible cat gauge is terrible. Honestly, she really only has one chapter of contribution over Lyre, so I don't see her as being rated all that much higher. Better bases all around, but still needs a lot of help, and she's nothing spectacular in 2-2.

3/10

[Quintessence]

Lethe.

Nice help in 2-2, but nothing special...well...nice avoid. She's just a better version of Lyre.

4/10, cause cat gauges.

[Junkhead]

None of those need Resolve to kill Ike, Soul. Slim Sword Ike anyone? Although I agree that Resolve is better kept in DB. It all depends on who you draft really.

They need to survive, not to deal more damage. It actually helps with Skill procs to have Resolve. So yes, you do need it, unless you're using Jill, Laura or maybe even Aran.

[MacLovin]

Zihark loves Resolve.

As does Eddie, and def:hp screwed Nolans and Jills and Volugs and Lauras.

Now, imagine resolve raising str, like fe9

[Quintessence]

They need to survive, not to deal more damage. It actually helps with Skill procs to have Resolve. So yes, you do need it, unless you're using Jill, Laura or maybe even Aran.Even Tauroneo isn't needing it, even Leonardo, even Meg (well maybe she needs it to double him and have more Luna chances with, I don't know, brave swd perhaps?)...

I think the only ones that need Resolve are Edward, Zihark (they have Astra but still), Volug(while he transforms), Nolan, I don't know if Leo needs it, perhaps Adept is much better, and I don't know if Fiona needs it or will ever get to kill Ike lol, (in LTs, I mean).

Zihark loves Resolve.

As does Eddie, and def:hp screwed Nolans and Jills and Volugs and Lauras.

Now, imagine resolve raising str, like fe9

Isn't it assuming Laura Adept purges Ike?

[Zanarkin]

How the hell is Sothe killing ike? 8 damage max is not getting anywhere near killing ike quickly to guarantee him not getting hit a few times... This is of course considering a max HP def ike... And sothe will not even double naturally. Edward, Nolan, Laura, and maybe jill/Zihark can kill ike. Edward/Nolan are probably the best DB firghters, and by then their strength should be pretty high, plus brave weapons and 3rd tier skills like astra (same applies to jill/zihark). Laura uses magic, i'm assuming she won't have much trouble, plus she can sleep ike. Resolve is basically needed by meg/fiona/aran (depends on spd screwage).

Their durability is different, but lack of resolve is merely a tiny inconvinience when it comes to killing ike. I'll repeat this again though, DB should pobably stick with resolve. Yes i know i said Mordecai can use it, but the DB benfit more, it depends on which characters you have.

[Quintessence]

Even Miccy has no urge to have Resolve because she can dodge cats and tigers pretty well with Sothe+Map Affinity. Maybe it can be useful by 3-12 but a sp capped Micaiah won't need it since she'll be doubling most enemies, and 3-13 she's just a purge/physicbot.

[Zanarkin]

Even Miccy has no urge to have Resolve because she can dodge cats and tigers pretty well with Sothe+Map Affinity. Maybe it can be useful by 3-12 but a sp capped Micaiah won't need it since she'll be doubling most enemies, and 3-13 she's just a purge/physicbot.

Wrong, miccy likes it so she can go apart from sothe and kill stuff (leading to faster clearing of 3-6) herself, plus you know, the more avoid the merrier.

[Junkhead]

I think the only ones that need Resolve are Edward, Zihark (they have Astra but still), Volug(while he transforms), Nolan, I don't know if Leo needs it, perhaps Adept is much better, and I don't know if Fiona needs it or will ever get to kill Ike lol, (in LTs, I mean).

Nolan with Tarvos is pretty beast, so he doesn't need it. Leonardo needs it for the same reason asthe others: Surviving to trip that takes to get up to Ike and increase his chances of proc'cing said skill (specially when Deadeye and Astra are /2% Skill activation). We are not assuming that you can just abuse and never have your character get hit and proc his or her skill as quickly as possible.

How the hell is Sothe killing ike? 8 damage max is not getting anywhere near killing ike quickly to guarantee him not getting hit a few times... This is of course considering a max HP def ike... And sothe will not even double naturally.

Nevermind, I was remembering how Silith did it in her Knives Only playthough, but she took a while.

@Bold: And that's what Resolve is for. I mentioned it in the same post.

Edward, Nolan, Laura, and maybe jill/Zihark can kill ike

Maybe? How can you even doubt that? Zihark and Edward are roughly the same in the end, and Jill has a much easier time getting through the mosh pit of laguz more than anyone. She also has higher chances of killing him because of the Brave axe and the fact that Stun is % Skill activation (in other words, better than Edward, Zihark and Leonardo's chances of proc'cing Astra).

Edward/Nolan are probably the best DB firghters, and by then their strength should be pretty high, plus brave weapons and 3rd tier skills like astra (same applies to jill/zihark).

Tarvos has much better Hit than the Brave axe, but ok. The Brave sword sucks so much against Ike it's not even funny. I usually just give him a Max Mt/Crit Steel forge, which works better. Nolan won't even have the necessary Spd to double Ike, most of the time. Are we even assuming Ike has capped Spd? Because that makes it much worse for Nolan, who has to get to lvl 20/20/10 to double him...and you aren't getting that far by 3-13.

Resolve is basically needed by meg/fiona/aran (depends on spd screwage).

Their durability is different, but lack of resolve is merely a tiny inconvinience when it comes to killing ike. I'll repeat this again though, DB should pobably stick with resolve. Yes i know i said Mordecai can use it, but the DB benfit more, it depends on which characters you have.

So let me get this straight, Edward and Zihark are alright with having to deal with a mosh pit of laguz despite them having one of the worst concrete durabilities in the DB without Resolve, but Aran, Meg and Fiona need it? All three of those are precisely quite tanky. Even Meg, who despite having a mediocre Def growth actually has a decent base for it. Fiona turns out tanky because of the BEXP favoring her Def alot, that doesn't even need to be said. Reguarding Aran, I understand you know that he might need it because he can get Spd screwed or not, but that's what averaged averages are for. I'm not just assuming what these guys will be able to do by then, I actually drafted most of the DB fighters before, so I can assume without straying away from the truth so much because of that.

The point is, alot of these guys need it, whether is it to double Ike, or to even survive getting up to him.

Quintessence said: Even Miccy has no urge to have Resolve because she can dodge cats and tigers pretty well with Sothe+Map Affinity.

No, she can't. Her chances aren't reliable.

[Zanarkin]

Nevermind, I was remembering how Silith did it in her Knives Only playthough, but she took a while.

@Bold: And that's what Resolve is for. I mentioned it in the same post.

It will stil take a long time :/ without relying on other things.

Maybe? How can you even doubt that? Zihark and Edward are roughly the same in the end, and Jill has a much easier time getting through the mosh pit of laguz more than anyone. She also has higher chances of killing him because of the Brave axe and the fact that Stun is % Skill activation (in other words, better than Edward, Zihark and Leonardo's chances of proc'cing Astra).

I have never used them.

Tarvos has much better Hit than the Brave axe, but ok. The Brave sword sucks so much against Ike it's not even funny. I usually just give him a Max Mt/Crit Steel forge, which works better. Nolan won't even have the necessary Spd to double Ike, most of the time. Are we even assuming Ike has capped Spd? Because that makes it much worse for Nolan, who has to get to lvl 20/20/10 to double him...and you aren't getting that far by 3-13.

I mentioned brave weapons because it equals more times to proc a 3rd tier skill.

So let me get this straight, Edward and Zihark are alright with having to deal with a mosh pit of laguz despite them having one of the worst concrete durabilities in the DB without Resolve, but Aran, Meg and Fiona need it? All three of those are precisely quite tanky. Even Meg, who despite having a mediocre Def growth actually has a decent base for it. Fiona turns out tanky because of the BEXP favoring her Def alot, that doesn't even need to be said. Reguarding Aran, I understand you know that he might need it because he can get Spd screwed or not, but that's what averaged averages are for. I'm not just assuming what these guys will be able to do by then, I actually drafted most of the DB fighters before, so I can assume without straying away from the truth so much because of that.

The point is, alot of these guys need it, whether is it to double Ike, or to even survive getting up to him.

Clearly you misunderstood the whole natue of the post. I said that they (good db picks) don't need it to kill ike but, they do need it for durability. While Aran/Meg/Fiona do need resolve to kill ike.

[Junkhead]

Of course I understood, I just misunderstood the part with parenthesis, thinking you were just referring to Aran when you said he needed to kill Ike.

So does that mean you agree that most of the DB does need it?

[Zanarkin]

Of course I understood, I just misunderstood the part with parenthesis, thinking you were just referring to Aran when you said he needed to kill Ike.

So does that mean you agree that most of the DB does need it?

I said its more worth it to keep it in the DB but, one can certainly survive without it.

[Junkhead]

Marciaxrolf should probably allow the "No Battle Save abuse" rule to the criteria. You know it gets out of hand when you can't argue properly. This would also give alot of characters with mediocre growths much better chances at becoming great (Micaiah, Meg, Fiona, Sigrun, etc)

Edited February 3, 2012 by Soul

[Zanarkin]

Lethe is a 5.5/10

Meh str, cat gauge, makes good adept/tear combo, doubles everything. Normal laguz problem aside from being cat. I like her in 3-1 because she isn't afraid of anything... unlike her sister... LYRE! Y U NO SACRIFISE FOR ME AND PLOT HOLES!

[Quintessence]

Marciaxrolf should probably allow the "No Battle Save abuse" rule to the criteria. You know it gets out of hand when you can't argue properly. This would also give alot of characters with mediocre growths much better chances at becoming great (Micaiah, Meg, Fiona, Sigrun, etc)

This SLIGHT abuse makes Micaiah dodge tigers and cats pretty well. I mean, my worst Micaiah had 18 sp by 3-6 base, but her lck is over 25, generally. That's why I don't feel any urge to give Micaiah Resolve, and because she usually is in her highest bio.

14*2(average sp)+25(average lck)+15(Sothe's A support)+5(map affinity)=63-73 avoid (considering worst-highest bio).

Cats and tigers have...err...(considering 11skl)44+90+6-8(lck)=140-145 hit rate, oh, considering bio it's 130-155 hit rate.

That would mean that an average Micaiah (considering Sothe is near) has 67-92% to dodge.

So yeah, an average Micaiah would be needing Resolve to handle tigers and cats.

[Zanarkin]

A micaiah with major favoritism, leading to 20 spd, and 28 luck still has a range of 80-100 in avoid. Which means at the very best bio she faces 33%-55%. Dude, she'll definately needed it unless we leave her in a thicket and hope sothe takes care of most things.

Edited February 3, 2012 by SlayerX

[Ciarre]

Lethe: 4/10

Helps in 2-2, but I hate lolcat gauge. I don't see her being much help.

[PKL]

Lethe's average is 4.4.

Day 32: Geoffrey

He's free. But if he wasnt free, he would save a penalty in 2-3 to the one who drafted him and be an effective unit in 3-9. Then, he comes back in 4-5 and is almost completely unsalvageable. Err, he kinda sucks. +2 points for being a great unit in 2-3 and +2 points for saving 4 turns when drafted in non-standard penalty drafts.

I give him a 2/10 in standard drafts. A 5/10 in old penalties which arent relevant here.

Edited February 3, 2012 by PKL

[Quintessence]

Geoffrey. Herp Derp. He's useful for 5 turning 2-3 and 4 turning 3-9 but after that he's just a filler, he does nothing special apart from the above mentioned. His Part 4 is crappy, he'll be needing BEXP and maybe Resolve, or ParaBlossom to get better gains, since he's usually gaining str, skl and res.

3.5/10

[Quintessence]

Lethe's average is 4.4.

Day 32: Geoffrey

He's free. But if he wasnt free, he would save a penalty in 2-3 to the one who drafted him and be an effective unit in 3-9. Then, he comes back in 4-5 and is almost completely unsalvageable. Err, he kinda sucks. +2 points for being a great unit in 2-3 and +2 points for saving 4 turns when drafted in non-standard penalty drafts.

I give him a 2/10 in standard drafts. A 5/10 in old penalties which arent relevant here.

But we're assuming he's free...I mean those are the rules...

EDIT: Oops, nevermind...

Edited February 3, 2012 by Quintessence

[Junkhead]

The fact that he's free is actually awesome because I don't have to waste a round choosing a CRK when he's just there. He can 5-turn 2-3 and 4-turn 3-9. He's awesome. He's kinda bad in Part 4, though. I actually bother giving him the BEXP and Paragon so we have another unit for the Tower.

5.5.

[MacLovin]

5.5/10

Good when he exists.

Salvageable in p4.

[Zanarkin]

4/10

good for part 2-3 and 3-9. None existant for the rest.

[Junkhead]

This SLIGHT abuse makes Micaiah dodge tigers and cats pretty well. I mean, my worst Micaiah had 18 sp by 3-6 base, but her lck is over 25, generally. That's why I don't feel any urge to give Micaiah Resolve, and because she usually is in her highest bio.

What do you mean by "slight"?

PEMN. Other Micaiahs can be having different Biothythms by then because of the differing turns taken.

14*2(average sp)+25(average lck)+15(Sothe's A support)+5(map affinity)=63-73 avoid (considering worst-highest bio).

Cats and tigers have...err...(considering 11skl)44+90+6-8(lck)=140-145 hit rate, oh, considering bio it's 130-155 hit rate.

That would mean that an average Micaiah (considering Sothe is near) has 67-92% to dodge.

So yeah, an average Micaiah would be needing Resolve to handle tigers and cats.

You proved my point better than I did. Thank you.

A micaiah with major favoritism, leading to 20 spd, and 28 luck still has a range of 80-100 in avoid. Which means at the very best bio she faces 33%-55%. Dude, she'll definately needed unless we leave her in a thicket and hope sothe takes care of most things.

...

"Major favoritism"? More like "Major Battle-Save abuse". Micaiah isn't getting 20 Spd until level 20/17, which is not ever happening at 3-6.

[Zanarkin]

"Major favoritism"? More like "Major Battle-Save abuse". Micaiah isn't getting 20 Spd until level 20/17, which is not ever happening at 3-6.

Soul honestly, what the hell... I was showing that a micaiah still likes resolve. Even one with major battle save abuse/which i called favoritism. Point is, i was sying micaiah wants resolve if she is to be a main fighter. I was proving a point by making an unlikely case without favoritism.