Korean youth wishes death on all Japanese

[Sunwoo]

Probably a play on "pretty good at speaking," but you know, you're not actually speaking.

Ah, I see. Well, I've had debates with people in both outside the academic setting and within it, so I've learned how to phrase my arguments without trying to be insulting and addressing all counterpoints.

[BK-201]

Regardless of whatever definition you use, he's still a troll. And depending on what you are trying to say here, this is an actual strawman

It addresses the point that he isn't a troll.

I redirect you at my initial statement of: "People should be allowed to think how they want, so long as it doesn't stop people from progressing through life." MLK and Gandhi fought so that people could progress through life normally. In such instances as theirs, actions should be taken.

I'm sure he'd be nice to a Japanese person on the street, oh wait. He's not going to change unless confronted. Confrontation is going to work better than magically making everyone not give a fuck.

Yes they do. If you deny it and realize that it isn't a problem, then it is no longer a problem. I mean, if you're not going to worry over something, how can it be a problem?

You concede that action can solve, but this lacks any chance of feasibility. It's more feasible to have someone confront another than to have everyone stop giving a fuck. I mean, sure if you managed to make everyone stop caring it would solve that problem but we might as well wish away every other problem.

It's actually fairly easy. In fact, I grew up around people "who didn't give a shit" when it comes to race, and pretty much laughed at anyone who was racist. And there are even people in this thread who have done the same.

Yes and there are also people confronted racists. Only one has worked well large scale.

I won't deny that action should be taken at times and say that action can help at times, but in this situation, there is nothing to be done, and you are better off ignoring it and not caring.

If I saw him in real life I'd react just like I am. I think a single person confronting another is much influential than one person in the world not caring.

Yes, I'm sure what MLK and Ghandi fought for was solved immediately too.

Solved faster than inaction did.

Crash is still a hypocrite, but yes most of you are spinning his words

put a spin on something

to twist a report or story to one's advantage; to interpret an event to make it seem favorable or beneficial to oneself or one's cause.

http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/spin

I'm not criticizing anyone for doing so, but it doesn't mean that people haven't spun what he said to make him look like a hypocrite.

Point out where we spun his words. If you're referencing the earlier posts, most arguments still hold. He also clarified things in a way to reinforce what we perceived as his words.

[Blademaster!]

It addresses the point that he isn't a troll.

But he clearly is a troll, as he clearly has the intent of upsetting people.

I'm sure he'd be nice to a Japanese person on the street, oh wait. He's not going to change unless confronted. Confrontation is going to work better than magically making everyone not give a fuck.

He'll never meet one on the street. Only 2% of Korea's population is foreign, half of which is Chinese immigrants, another large portion being Korean's born outside of Korea, and the last portion being English speakers. And I wouldn't call being nice to someone you see on the street a confrontation, and leans more towards my argument of ignoring the issue at hand.

You concede that action can solve, but this lacks any chance of feasibility. It's more feasible to have someone confront another than to have everyone stop giving a fuck.

I would disagree under the circumstances given here, as I have said.

Yes and there are also people confronted racists. Only one has worked well large scale.

No, both have worked well large scale. You have parts of the U.S.A., Canada, and Northern European countries where no one cares and there is very little racism, and then you have places like Africa/middle east where they solve racism through killing people, and places like the U.K. and other parts of the U.S.A. where they make laws pushing for equal treatment (though the U.K.'s are pretty extreme...).

If I saw him in real life I'd react just like I am. I think a single person confronting another is much influential than one person in the world not caring.

To be honest, this really depends on the person who is committing the act of racism, and I would say people react more strongly to being ignored since that limits social interaction.

Solved faster than inaction did.

I don't recall the North having Jim Crowe laws.

Point out where we spun his words. If you're referencing the earlier posts, most arguments still hold.

Camtech's post on the second page is probably the clearest example and pretty much fits the exact definition of changing what someone says in a way to support your own argument aka to spin a phrase. Just because someone spins what someone says doesn't mean an argument doesn't hold, but it doesn't mean that what has been said hasn't been spun.

[eclipse]

Ah, I see. Well, I've had debates with people in both outside the academic setting and within it, so I've learned how to phrase my arguments without trying to be insulting and addressing all counterpoints.

Actually, that's me failing to insult you. See, I'm Japanese.

[dondon151]

Ah, I see. Well, I've had debates with people in both outside the academic setting and within it, so I've learned how to phrase my arguments without trying to be insulting and addressing all counterpoints.

courtesy is overrated

there's a 99% chance your opposition hates your guts

[BK-201]

But he clearly is a troll, as he clearly has the intent of upsetting people.

And he's also speaking his mind. Still something that can be corrected.

He'll never meet one on the street. Only 2% of Korea's population is foreign, half of which is Chinese immigrants, another large portion being Korean's born outside of Korea, and the last portion being English speakers. And I wouldn't call being nice to someone you see on the street a confrontation, and leans more towards my argument of ignoring the issue at hand.

Still regarding any possible interaction it's still preferable to confront. If he's spreading bigotry it'd be preferable to confront him. If he's rude rather than just ignoring a certain person it doesn't lean your way. He'd probably react aggressively which is why I think confronting such people is the better road. It's not just a single issue, I'm talking about the best consistent method which is confrontation.

No, both have worked well large scale. You have parts of the U.S.A., Canada, and Northern European countries where no one cares and there is very little racism, and then you have places like Africa/middle east where they solve racism through killing people, and places like the U.K. and other parts of the U.S.A. where they make laws pushing for equal treatment (though the U.K.'s are pretty extreme...).

Really? Nobody in the USA cares about racism? Ok. Also, if they were to see a racist person they would confront them. The words are going to carry their value even if a certain person chooses to not care. Laws that gunned for equal treatment were the stepping stones to mitigating the issue significantly. Not caring didn't really matter when people hate for the purpose of hating.

To be honest, this really depends on the person who is committing the act of racism, and I would say people react more strongly to being ignored since that limits social interaction.

I think people are more likely to change when confronted.

I don't recall the North having Jim Crowe laws.

They had people pushing against slavery, there was action against the mechanisms that existed which is why confrontation is good. Discrimination was pushed against by people to mitigate its impacts. Confrontation by the individual is more powerful than just ignoring the problem. I'm not saying that if everyone were to ignore the problem that it wouldn't vanish, I'm saying the individual confronting another is more powerful than a move to ignore. Feasibly one is going to work better as you can only control yourself.

Camtech's post on the second page is probably the clearest example and pretty much fits the exact definition of changing what someone says in a way to support your own argument aka to spin a phrase. Just because someone spins what someone says doesn't mean an argument doesn't hold, but it doesn't mean that what has been said hasn't been spun.

It was a poke towards Crash's past allegedly or whatever and argued that condemning a certain group for hating on another was hypocritical when the user himself did something similar.

Basically it doesn't matter if the response might fail in this individual instance, but it's always good to show disapproval as anyone who harbors thoughts like this that wander through this thread can realize it's frowned upon. It's more about setting an example rather than saying, "oh it's a hopeless case, let's just not care". Confrontation is preferable to not caring simply because it's more powerful. A majority of the people in the world who haven't seen or reacted to this video are on the side of not caring but it's still going to have value conferred simply because people are always going to be offended. Unless you want to try wishing away every problem in the world I see no problem with the fact that many members on this forum have rallied against this video to some degree. There was no need to be patronizing from the start as it's a perfectly fine reaction that can be beneficial.

[Blademaster!]

And he's also speaking his mind. Still something that can be corrected.

...What? I think you may have chosen your words very poorly here... Being able to speak your mind is not something that should be corrected.

Really? Nobody in the USA cares about racism? Ok.

I never said nobody in the USA cares about racism, just that some places do and others don't. I grew up in one that didn't.

It was a poke towards Crash's past allegedly or whatever and argued that condemning a certain group for hating on another was hypocritical when the user himself did something similar.

But he still had to spin Crash's argument to get that point across. Really, it's not a big deal that Crash's point was spun in this situation, but it doesn't change the fact that it was spun.

There was no need to be patronizing from the start as it's a perfectly fine reaction that can be beneficial.

Given the situation, I fail to see anything beneficial to be made from getting mad at a guy that you can't change in this situation, but I understand the argument you are trying to make. Regardless, I will still keep my opinion since my general experience has shown that such is the better course of action, and that problems like racism only become an issue when we make it one.

[BK-201]

...What? I think you may have chosen your words very poorly here... Being able to speak your mind is not something that should be corrected.

You know what I mean. Racist behavior.

I never said nobody in the USA cares about racism, just that some places do and others don't. I grew up in one that didn't.

And not caring isn't going to change anything in the regions that do.

But he still had to spin Crash's argument to get that point across. Really, it's not a big deal that Crash's point was spun in this situation, but it doesn't change the fact that it was spun.

He's just trying to draw a parallel.

Given the situation, I fail to see anything beneficial to be made from getting mad at a guy that you can't change in this situation, but I understand the argument you are trying to make. Regardless, I will still keep my opinion since my general experience has shown that such is the better course of action, and that problems like racism only become an issue when we make it one.

As long as there's a 1% people will change by being confronted it's worth taking it. I don't see at all how it's a better course of action at all since it's empirically denied. At best by complaining you can cause him to change, at worse he keeps his behavior. All that happens by not complaining is that he'll keep his behavior.

[Sunwoo]

Actually, that's me failing to insult you. See, I'm Japanese.

Ah, I see. I actually never would've guessed that. But I have a few Japanese friends. (Actually, while I know more Koreans, I have a friend who's Japanese and two friends who are half-Japanese sisters. I'm closer to them than any of my Korean friends.) But ... yeah. I've heard stuff about the Korea/Japan disputes before, and it just makes me wish people would chill out.

courtesy is overrated

there's a 99% chance your opposition hates your guts

I don't really care if my opposition hates my guts. If that's the case, I'm going to be the bigger person and continue to be polite. If my opposition really does hate my guts, there's no need for me to lower myself to their level.

Edited March 28, 2012 by Boron

[Baldrick]

Eventually, when this child sees the error of his ways, I will be there to forgive him.

I don't really care if my opposition hates my guts. If that's the case, I'm going to be the bigger person and continue to be polite. If my opposition really does hate my guts, there's no need for me to lower myself to their level.

If more people were like you, I'd be out of a job.

Edited March 28, 2012 by Baldrick

[Raven]

And what is your job?

[Baldrick]

I'm a carpenter.

[Blademaster!]

You know what I mean. Racist behavior.

Well, this is where what you are asking for leads us too in an extreme example: http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/UK_student_jailed_for_%27racist%27_Twitter_posts_about_footballer_Fabrice_Muamba

I don't like in the UK though.

[BK-201]

Well, this is where what you are asking for leads us too in an extreme example: http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/UK_student_jailed_for_%27racist%27_Twitter_posts_about_footballer_Fabrice_Muamba

I don't like in the UK though.

I don't like taking it that far :p.

[Bluedoom]

i wish more people would subscribe to my racial philosophy

if you'd fuck it, don't hate it

i think it would solve all of the world's race problems

In that case Heterosexual people must hate people of their same gender. And Homosexual people must hate people of the opposite sex. Its all about being bisexual, folks!

Splendid, really.

I know I'm a tad late on berating CrashGordon for his words, but I just have to say this: people should never wish for death on one another. NEVER. Not even under joking contexts. Because where will it stop? It is as you guys have pointed out: it makes you no better than the person you are wishing death on, and makes you look like a hypocrite. I just wish that everyone in this world could chill out and learn to get along. We're all different, we've all made mistakes, but there's no reason we should keep looking to the past and refuse to move on. Life is short, why should we waste it hating each other and wishing that people would die?

Seriously ... I know that there are some people who just seem to be the scum of the earth, but what gives you the right to say that they should die? You are human, just like they are. I do not believe that human beings have the right to make such a weighty judgement about other human beings. Saying that someone, or a group of people, deserve to die is a very serious accusation and it says something about YOU as well.

Also @ the wishing death upon others: I think this stuff is getting a little too serious. I mean, EVEN IF IT WAS A JOKE, it was a joke after all. I mean really, lets say I hate this shop owner dude so much, I want this dude to die. I don't think I'd be thinking all day about how much I hate this guy, nor would I picture how this person dies throughout the day.

Same here. We say stuff in anger, then we forget about it. Please don't tell me you haven't reached such a rage at all at least once in your life. I know I've got into fights with relatives and I'm on the recieving end of the 'I wish you die.'( of course my retaliation is similar, but...)

Edited March 28, 2012 by Marth

[Thor Odinson]

In that case Heterosexual people must hate people of their same gender. And Homosexual people must hate people of the opposite sex. Its all about being bisexual, folks!

Splendid, really.

He never said "if you would not fuck, hate"

you don't have to hate the things you don't fuck

but if you would fuck it, don't hate it

[IGdood]

VIdeo reminds me of the time I was in Korea. Tour guide said many Koreans still hold a big grudge against Japan for culture erasing back in WW2....but not to this extent. However, they're a lot more nationalistic than other Asian countries...

This kid might even be revered for putting out a video like this...

Idk what I'm saying, I'm never good at talking about things that aren't video games.

Edited March 28, 2012 by skitarii

[Sunwoo]

This kid might even be revered for putting out a video like this...

I certainly hope not. That'd be an embarrassment to Koreans everywhere.

[Ein]

I certainly hope not. That'd be an embarrassment to Koreans everywhere.

Why only Koreans?

[Sunwoo]

This dude is Korean, isn't he? It's mostly embarrassing to other Koreans, for a member of their race to do something so stupid. Heck, he's making even ME facepalm over this.

[Defeatist Elitist]

This dude is Korean, isn't he? It's mostly embarrassing to other Koreans, for a member of their race to do something so stupid. Heck, he's making even ME facepalm over this.

Just to stir shit up, but don't you think identifying with your nationality like that is one of the causes of problems like this? I mean, let's be honest, what exactly do you have in common with this guy that would make you embarassed by his actions? Just being of the same vaguely defined ethnic grouping isn't much of a similarity, I would say.

But then again I don't understand when people identify with a country if neither they nor their parents were born there so you can probably disregard what I say.

[Sunwoo]

Just to stir shit up, but don't you think identifying with your nationality like that is one of the causes of problems like this? I mean, let's be honest, what exactly do you have in common with this guy that would make you embarassed by his actions? Just being of the same vaguely defined ethnic grouping isn't much of a similarity, I would say.

But then again I don't understand when people identify with a country if neither they nor their parents were born there so you can probably disregard what I say.

The thing is, I don't really identify as Korean anyway. It's just a fact for me. I'm Korean American, that's what I am if you were wondering. But you know how the public can get at times. One person of a specific race does or says something stupid, and you have people suddenly getting on that race's case. And I know that not everyone is like that, but there are people like that. I'm not doing a good job explaining myself, but the point is ... people do have a reason for saying stuff like that. And if you can't understand why some people do feel embarrassed by stuff like this ... well, not my problem.

[Defeatist Elitist]

The thing is, I don't really identify as Korean anyway. It's just a fact for me. I'm Korean American, that's what I am if you were wondering. But you know how the public can get at times. One person of a specific race does or says something stupid, and you have people suddenly getting on that race's case. And I know that not everyone is like that, but there are people like that. I'm not doing a good job explaining myself, but the point is ... people do have a reason for saying stuff like that. And if you can't understand why some people do feel embarrassed by stuff like this ... well, not my problem.

I understand that people will make generalizations about ethnic groups, but I'm sure we can all agree that it's fucking retarded. I just feel that it's also kind of silly to identify with a group that you didn't really do anything to be a part of or something. Like, my paternal grandfather's family lived in Holland for ages until he left, but I would never really identify as Dutch, and neither would my father. I wasn't born in Holland, and I really have very little in common with people living there, it would be silly for me to identify with them. If a Dutch person does something dumb, I wouldn't be embarassed, regardless of whether some half wit made a generalization about Dutch people, because I'm not really Dutch. I guess to a certain degree minorities are forced into more of a cultural ghetto than caucasians, but even still, I don't see how the identification persists. I could see people identifying as Korean American if that meant identification with the culture that exists among Korean Americans specifically (which may or may not be significant), just like black culture, because then they might actually have things in common.

Am I making sense here?

[eclipse]

Think of being employed by a company. What you do on company time reflects on the company, and if you're stupid, it makes the company look bad. Now take that company analogy and apply it to a family/race. That's how my mom tried to bring me up.

My coworkers today were talking about something completely unrelated, and mentioned that a lot of the older Chinese/Korean citizens were forced to learn Japanese during WWII, because Japan invaded them. This kid seems to be reading a script, so I'm pretty sure there's someone else behind it. Maybe one of his older relatives/friends wrote that out for him to say?

[Defeatist Elitist]

Think of being employed by a company. What you do on company time reflects on the company, and if you're stupid, it makes the company look bad. Now take that company analogy and apply it to a family/race. That's how my mom tried to bring me up.

I understand why people think that, I just think it's problematic. Something one "Japanese" person does shouldn't reflect badly on all Japanese people, and if somebody decides to hold a grudge against all people of one vaguely defined ethnic group for something a member of it did, they're not really thinking about it.

I mean, the company analogy is completely messed up in the first place: if you work for a company not only are you choosing to do so, but you are entering into a contract which makes explicit requirements of your behaviour beforehand. Ethnicity is simply a matter of being born. You don't choose it, and you didn't even do anything to gain it, and it alone should (barring racism, etc) have absolutely no effect on you as an individual. Now, culture can be argued, as I said before, but this is going completely beyond culture, and even still it can't just be assumed.