Guy Starwind Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I'm down for either but I do prefer English since it's my first language. However, it does bug me in the Japanese voices when the 12 year old boy has the voice of a 35 year old sounding man or the adult man in voiced by a girl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I'm down for either but I do prefer English since it's my first language. However, it does bug me in the Japanese voices when the 12 year old boy has the voice of a 35 year old sounding man or the adult man in voiced by a girl. Japanese isn't the only one that has it. Cue Ike and Tomoya there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Purple_Knight Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I don't really watch much anime but when I do i prefer the English dub. Japanese annoys the crap out of me I just don't like how it sounds. I prefer a shit English dub to any Japanese dub really . I can't even tell the difference between a good or bad Japanese dub. It all sounds the same to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maou Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 It's not uncommon to find English dubs of anime that are either on par with or even better than the Japanese audio, but many people just won't accept it. Wait, what? According to your logic, how would you know if an English dub was equal or better than the Japanese audio if you don't know a lick of Japanese? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrostyFireMage Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 Some people prefer the Japanese voices because they think Japan is a happy wonderland filled with giant robots, perky Genki Girls and talking cats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 Wait, what? According to your logic, how would you know if an English dub was equal or better than the Japanese audio if you don't know a lick of Japanese? Because I know and have spoken to people fluent in both languages, plus I've just done a lot of extra research on the subject. Japanese natives themselves even occasionally prefer the English versions, which may support the "because they can understand them" argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blademaster! Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 (edited) Watching something in it's original language with subtitles is generally preferred to dubbing I would imagine? The real reason is likely more to do with the fact that most anime fans are just so used to watching anime in japanese by now and learning about all the japanese voice actors. Maybe general interest in Japan and weeaboo stuff too. Edited June 10, 2012 by Blademaster! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maou Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 Because I know and have spoken to people fluent in both languages But how does that validate your argument? It's just the opinion of a couple of people and there's bound to be others fluent in both languages that would disagree. plus I've just done a lot of extra research on the subject. Such as? Japanese natives themselves even occasionally prefer the English versions, which may support the "because they can understand them" argument. So you are talking about Japanese natives that are fluent in the English language as well, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I can tell the difference between an English dub attempting to say a Japanese name (and mangling it badly) and someone from Japan saying it. The accent bothers me to the point where I'd rather listen to the Japanese version. If it's an anime where all the names aren't Japanese, then I'll be more likely to watch the dub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 But how does that validate your argument? It's just the opinion of a couple of people and there's bound to be others fluent in both languages that would disagree. If you put it that way, there's no point in discussing this. In the end it's all just opinion, isn't it? Topic over. Or you can go with a general consensus. Cowboy Bebop, FLCL, Fullmetal Alchemist...there are series out there that are widely agreed to be on par/better in English, by people who know only one or both languages. Plus, I'm much sooner going to trust the opinions of only a few people who know both languages than many more people who only know English. So would you like to put this discussion on hold until we get at least twenty native Japanese representatives who happen to be fluent in both Japanese and English so we have a bigger sample? In another way, if I watch an anime dubbed in English and everything is done well - voices all fit, acting is good, story is the same, etc. - and I don't know Japanese, there is essentially no way, for me, that the Japanese version can be "better," because anime wasn't meant to be read, it was meant to be watched. People often like to say they watch anime subbed because it's the "original" and/or "that's how the creator intended it," but when you think about it, they intended for their audience to hear what was being said, not read it. So really, English dubs being better than the Japanese isn't very relevant; it depends on how good the English dub itself is whether or not someone who only knows English should or should not watch it. A good, faithful dub is going to get a viewer closer to the "intended" experience than watching subbed. The only people for whom "which one is better?" really matters is those fluent in both languages. I'm not out to say the English version is always better, just that the Japanese acting isn't always as good as people think it is, and some people find this out the hard way, like...Scott Frazier tells a funny story about how he learned one of his favorite anime (Dirty Pair) was horribly acted, once he became fluent in Japanese. Such as? Such as how professional actors work and feel about their work, how the localization and licensing process for anime works, the kind of people who are more likely to prefer one way or the other and the things that cause it, what Japanese natives think on the same subject and how it relates to them, etc. So you are talking about Japanese natives that are fluent in the English language as well, right? Not always. The point is that Japanese natives who don't know English sometimes prefer the English version of an anime, which is quite ironic. Ah, damn. I was supposed to have stopped getting involved in this debate (not this specific discussion going on now, but the sub vs dub subject as a whole). Look what you've done now, Morita Kenichi! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1st Mate Bob Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 It doesn't matter what language you speak, human behavior and emotions are pretty universal. If you can't express that through your acting, then you aren't a great actor. Even without understanding the language, if you read the subtitles you can understand the situation that's going on, and then judge the actor based on that. If it sounds believable, then it most likely is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maou Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 If you put it that way, there's no point in discussing this. In the end it's all just opinion, isn't it? Topic over. Dub vs sub should boil down to preference and I wasn't sure on your stance. And discussions like this exist because of clashing points of view, if any of this was fact then there would be nothing to argue. It may be hard to believe, but people who watch subs have ears and I'm sure there's a good number of them that can tell if a VA is doing a satisfactory job when acting out their character. And for good measure, I'm mostly referring to the drama genre here. I probably don't know whether the Japanese voice acting for generic ecchi series and other random shit is good or not, but I'm sure as hell not going to let someone tell me that I shouldn't praise Tarusuke for an excellent job voicing Kariya in Fate/zero (especially in ep. 21) just because I'm not fluent in Japanese. A good, faithful dub is going to get a viewer closer to the "intended" experience than watching subbed. Maybe for a show like Bacanno, but this generalization does not exist for all anime with a good dub. How would you get more of the "intended" experience watching Bleach dubbed compared to the original when both are good and can be enjoyed equally? (Discounting that Bleach as a show becomes bad past the first 50 episodes) As for that Dirty Pair example, it's a (seemingly) trashy show from the freaking 80's when voice acting wasn't as big a business so stuff like quality control probably didn't even come into the equation. Not always. The point is that Japanese natives who don't know English sometimes prefer the English version of an anime Well, if that's how they prefer to watch some anime, then more power to them. But according to you and Ryan what'shisface those specific individuals don't know the English language so they miss out on enunciation, timing and all that. Shit, how could they ever prefer an English dub without those essentials? Ah, damn. I was supposed to have stopped getting involved in this debate (not this specific discussion going on now, but the sub vs dub subject as a whole). Look what you've done now, Morita Kenichi! And I'm not forcing you to debate this any further, stop whenever you feel like it. :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nano Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 It really depends for me. Some shows have really good English voice acting, and I prefer dubs on them. Other ones are more flawed, in which case I prefer subs because, as Red Fox pointed out, I don't know Japanese so I can 'imagine' perfect voice acting from them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ciarre Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 For video games, I'm perfectly fine with dubbed voice acting because the text is right there in front of you. Unless the voice is Fuuka. Then no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 This is actually really accurate. No joke. People are weeaboos and Japanophiles. They'll get into anime from stuff on Toonami like DBZ and Pokemon and be fine with the dubs then, but then they go on the internet and hear of elitists watching the "original" version and end up jumping on the bandwagon that "all dubs suck" when many are actually very good. It's not uncommon to find English dubs of anime that are either on par with or even better than the Japanese audio, but many people just won't accept it. It's funny when people who don't know a word of Japanese say things like "the acting is better in Japanese!" because they have absolutely no right to judge the acting when they are not fluent in the language. And that's why Hikarusa's post is accurate; they can judge English acting, so they can criticize it, but Japanese is just moonspeak to them, so they don't know any better. This seems to be very much the case. I've got some very negative reactions for watching dubs from some people. For me, it depends on the atmosphere produced by the dub. I liked the Zatch Bell dub better, mostly because the cast made it hilarious. On the other hand, Tekkaman Blade's dub was horrible, so I decided to watch it subbed. Another reason is some people see themselves as "true fans" for watching the original. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRlCO9mP4zg Fear localisation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anouleth Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I can tell the difference between an English dub attempting to say a Japanese name (and mangling it badly) and someone from Japan saying it. The accent bothers me to the point where I'd rather listen to the Japanese version. If it's an anime where all the names aren't Japanese, then I'll be more likely to watch the dub. I think that Engrish in subs is a lot more annoying, and more common too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shroom Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 Sometimes the English voices are better than the Japanese (Baccano!, Yu Yu Hakusho) and sometimes they're not (Soul Eater, anything Vic Magsaklds has been in besides FMA). Some people just like to bitch like anything made by the Japanese is better than if the same thing were made anywhere else. But in reality, it's opinion, or the former. On Youtube, it's usually the former. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esau of Isaac Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 It doesn't matter what language you speak, human behavior and emotions are pretty universal. If you can't express that through your acting, then you aren't a great actor. Acting isn't about simply conveying emotion, it's also the way you convey it. There are many subtle things a non-native or one inexperienced in the language probably wouldn't pick up on such as terminology used, or differences in tonation of words and phrases from the norm. Even without understanding the language, if you read the subtitles you can understand the situation that's going on, and then judge the actor based on that. If it sounds believable, then it most likely is. But translation is an artform in just about any given situation, and a shaky one at that. Many facets of a character's lines and vocalizations can be lost when brought from audio to text, and of course from one language to another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 Occasionally, there's a meaning that might get lost in translation. Usually, I'd rather try to avoid missing that than hear it in English, unless the dub just flat-out does way more with a scene than the original. For example, I'd rather listen to a voiced version of the last Black Knight fight in Radiant Dawn in the English script, because that version imo was a lot more satisfying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrightBow Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 (edited) Maybe some people just grow spiteful towards dubs when they were exposed to dubs like 4kids's One Piece and they grow irrational biased as a result. Edited June 10, 2012 by BrightBow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 (edited) It may be hard to believe, but people who watch subs have ears and I'm sure there's a good number of them that can tell if a VA is doing a satisfactory job when acting out their character. And for good measure, I'm mostly referring to the drama genre here. I probably don't know whether the Japanese voice acting for generic ecchi series and other random shit is good or not, but I'm sure as hell not going to let someone tell me that I shouldn't praise Tarusuke for an excellent job voicing Kariya in Fate/zero (especially in ep. 21) just because I'm not fluent in Japanese. I watch subbed anime all the time, more than dubbed simply because I keep up with current anime. Well, here we go: you shouldn't praise Tarusuke for an excellent job voicing Kariya because you're not fluent in Japanese. Acting is about much more than you can hear as someone who isn't fluent and unless the acting is really, really bad, you won't be able to tell the difference between a great performance and a mediocre/bad performance. Maybe for a show like Bacanno, but this generalization does not exist for all anime with a good dub. How would you get more of the "intended" experience watching Bleach dubbed compared to the original when both are good and can be enjoyed equally? (Discounting that Bleach as a show becomes bad past the first 50 episodes) Enjoyment all comes down to preference. If you prefer subs, fine. But anime is meant to be watched (and heard), not read. The only type of show where it would not be the case is if a show really relied on the characters speaking Japanese, but I've never seen nor heard of a show like this and I can't imagine how it would work. As for that Dirty Pair example, it's a (seemingly) trashy show from the freaking 80's when voice acting wasn't as big a business so stuff like quality control probably didn't even come into the equation. The point is that he realized it was poorly acted when he became fluent in Japanese. Before then, he didn't know the difference. Well, if that's how they prefer to watch some anime, then more power to them. But according to you and Ryan what'shisface those specific individuals don't know the English language so they miss out on enunciation, timing and all that. Shit, how could they ever prefer an English dub without those essentials? Because they don't understand it. Edited June 10, 2012 by Madam Red Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I think that Engrish in subs is a lot more annoying, and more common too. Since I'm around someone that speaks English with a Japanese accent (my stepmother), I'm somewhat accustomed to hearing this; thus, it doesn't annoy me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowofchaos Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 But anime is meant to be watched (and heard), not read. The only type of show where it would not be the case is if a show really relied on the characters speaking Japanese, but I've never seen nor heard of a show like this and I can't imagine how it would work. Well, there's also the preference of viewing the work in its original language... Like those dubbed Chinese Kung Fu movies... and in that case, I don't know a lick of Chinese, and I'd prefer it if in a certain movie about the Snake and Mongoose style martial arts that Jackie Chan didn't sound like himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightmare Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I'll watch a good dub, but it depends on the anime in question. One of my problems is kind of what eclipse said (about mangling names), another is (I think I've mentioned this before) that for anime that is predominantly Japanese, I prefer it to be in Japanese because I feel that's more fitting and natural, while if an anime is European/American/whatever or in a fictional world/timeline/whatever, I can bear dubs too. (TL Note: This isn't the case for Hellsing Ultimate, because Jouji Nakata and Norio Wakamoto together? Well, yeah.) Usually, though, I find that I prefer video game dubs much more to anime dubs. I don't know why, but they've been a lot more appealing to me (though not all of them). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I don't have a problem with them except some times a little girls voice can be too high pitched which is annoying but I have no complaints because I would rather watch an anime than watch text. This is really annoying sometimes. I mostly prefer dubs when I'm watching an anime that's finished, but when I was watching Code Geass, there was one episode halfway through the first season that I couldn't find dubbed, so I watched it subbed, and I just couldn't go back to listening to Nunally and Euphemia squeak after that. I also watch subs for shows that are ongoing because I'm too impatient to wait for the dub. But that's most people, I assume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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