The Lunatic Club

[LordFrigid]

So, after that silly Lunatic Tier Thread, I've been thinking about exactly how much I could milk a 6 Galeforce setup for, and am trying to see how big of an impact it has on the feasibility of a -Def Lunatic+ nogrind run. I'll probably have to run through it several times if it works to iron out a strategy, but earlygame was relatively painless this time around (seriously, Int's strats are -Def proof) so it shouldn't be too bad. Sumia is currently Lv.3 after Cht.3 (with the boss kill). I'll see how things go from here, though I probably won't get more time to work on it 'til Thursday evening at the earliest.

Having used "Gale-rilla Warfare" to bring -Def Avatars through a few Lunatic+ Runs, I'd say you'll probably find it effective. My last one was done with Apotheosis in mind, and used Sumia, Cordelia, Lucina, Lucina!Morgan, Chrom!Cynthia, and Stahl!Severa during the main game. I've never managed a strict no-grind, but from what I've read you can handle it a lot better than I can (patience is my main issue ).

I've been trying to get around to a -Def no-grind myself...but I wanted to see if I could work out the issues in a more aggressive Ch 5 clear first (see? Patience issues).

[Czar_Yoshi]

So I arranged a setup to feed Nowi virtually all of the enemies on CH.8's initial wave, and I'm curious: Do you have to be careful about the dragonstone to make sure she reaches level 10 before it breaks? Are there any tips for that?

It's rarely a problem, but if it is, just buy her a new one from Spotpass. She's best as a Manakete anyway, so there's really no reason to take her out of it.

You can buy it from Spotpass Tiki.

Do note that it's kind of expensive and by Cht.8 the flood of Bullion hasn't started yet, so if you buy one without thinking you could quickly find yourself having financial woes. It's a big ticket item if you're using Nowi, but getting it means one less Javelin forge for the Pegs, one less Seal from Anna, or no Rexcalibur for your Avatar, all of which are very important depending on how you're playing.

[XeKr]

I've saved them without Rescue use before, but it's pretty rough and requires someone with a high amount of offensive power (or, I suppose, extreme Dual Strike luck), since Lunatic level enemies are pretty tanky.

There’s a few ways to do it reliably without Rescue iirc (in Lunatic).

With a tanky unpaired unit (Can be Frederick. Can be paired initially, then have the partner transferred away. Can also use chip) and Sumia unpaired elsewhere on the cliff, you can save them both without Rescue and turtle up.

Alternatively, a very aggressive push lets you save them by forcing units to aggro and be bottled up the middle (Frederick+Sumia can do it without much exp investment, although non-Javelin 1-2 range weapons are nice since lances against Barbs = not fun). Maribelle/Ricken can then sneak by.

Obviously it’s even more lenient if other units have been trained.

(don't know if that's what you specifically were referring to >_>)

I'm about to give up. If frederick misses in the first turn of prologue, avatar misses the mage while in the water, or anybody gets crit, I have to soft reset. There isn't even any strategy, its all RNG.

You don't have to feed all the kills to Robin, resetting if Fred accidentally gets an extra one. You don't have to do the water trick and risk the mage crit. You can reduce critical chances to negligible amounts by giving Frederick a Sword against the Barbs and ohko-ing the mages, switching weapons around. It's on you to accept the risk of the strategy you choose, or adapt and approach the chapter another way.

Regular Lunatic requires very little RNG. You are heavily favored, unless you make mistakes (such as by adopting risky positioning).

If we account for how quick resets and enemy phases can go in Awakening, even Lunatic+ probably has comparable "risk" (of time wasted resetting) to a few previous FEs.

Edited October 23, 2014 by XeKr

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

Nothing happens to your file in the long run, but note that in Cht.6 enemy AI has the Thieves prioritize attacking Marth over unlocking the door. If Marth falls before the Thieves are dead, one of them could open the door and then you're screwed.

They prioritizing attacking in general, even if their buddies are body-blocking them (he'll just patiently line up behind them). So it's perfectly fine to let Marth bite it before all Thieves are down if the player has a unit there to draw aggro.

There’s a few ways to do it reliably without Rescue iirc (in Lunatic).

With a tanky unpaired unit (Can be Frederick. Can be paired initially, then have the partner transferred away. Can also use chip) and Sumia unpaired elsewhere on the cliff, you can save them both without Rescue and turtle up.

Alternatively, a very aggressive push lets you save them by forcing units to aggro and be bottled up the middle (Frederick+Sumia can do it without much exp investment, although non-Javelin 1-2 range weapons are nice since lances against Barbs = not fun). Maribelle/Ricken can then sneak by.

Obviously it’s even more lenient if other units have been trained.

(don't know if that's what you specifically were referring to >_>)

More or less. I used a similar strategy on my first play through when I was ignoring Paralogues (thereby denying myself the Rescue Staff unknowingly). I ended up having Ricken pair onto Sumia from the cliff. Then the idea was to run Maribelle back behind Fred paired with Chrom. This meant that I likely had to eliminate the initial Barb and Myrm (although, I could get lucky with the Myrm's movement with a dead Barb, I didn't want to rely on that). With his stats as they were, I believe Chrom let Fred double the Barb and put an end to him. I think I ended up attacking the Myrm first (no double), then let the Barb die on enemy phase. The problem was that pushing for this level of offense let the Dark Mage and Barb possibly do a scary amount of damage to Fred.

[isetrh]

I finished Chapter 7 of my Lunatic+ run and did not manage to give Chrom much exp. He's still lv 4.79. Should I give up on him at this point?

My Avatar (16/16.14 Merc) and Sumia (18.16) have been getting most of the exp and are pretty badass. By the way, I'm really liking Sumia in this run. She got to A Lances, and she's way more tanky than a Peg has any right to be with 17 Def and Gae Bolg access, plus she can use Gravidus to OHKO Counter mooks, ORKOing anything else that happens to hit her even through Pavise. They shouldn't run out until long after she promotes.

[Czar_Yoshi]

They shouldn't run out until long after she promotes.

Actually, it'll run out precisely when the enemies start promoting.

If we account for how quick resets and enemy phases can go in Awakening, even Lunatic+ probably has comparable "risk" (of time wasted resetting) to a few previous FEs.

True story: I've wasted more time resetting on Sacred Stones than on Lunatic+ (not counting "intentional" resets in which I was testing strats and ideas rather than trying to clear the chapter).

[isetrh]

Actually, it'll run out precisely when the enemies start promoting.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean. Doesn't how fast the weapons run out depend on how much I use them? Or do you mean that that's how long it will be until Sumia can't tank and OHKO anymore?

I think I'll give up on Chrom. Chapters 9 and 10 seem a bit too chaotic to safely pit Chrom in front, and after that some of the enemies start promoting. Plus, Sumia needs to get 14 levels promoted and Veteranless between Chapters 8 and 13, and not having competition might help.

Once again, thanks for all the help guys!

[Terrador]

I'm not sure I understand what you mean. Doesn't how fast the weapons run out depend on how much I use them? Or do you mean that that's how long it will be until Sumia can't tank and OHKO anymore?

I think I'll give up on Chrom. Chapters 9 and 10 seem a bit too chaotic to safely pit Chrom in front, and after that some of the enemies start promoting. Plus, Sumia needs to get 14 levels promoted and Veteranless between Chapters 8 and 13, and not having competition might help.

Once again, thanks for all the help guys!

It'll be when enemies stop being OHKOable--if memory serves, Lunatic!promoted enemies have what, something like a floor of 60 HP+DEF for a L1 Sage? Maybe a STR-fed unit could be one-shotting with a forged effective damage weapon, but beyond that, nope.

As for Chrom: at very least, take him to 10 for Charm, then toss a spare Master Seal at him for better Pair Up bonuses. I'd think he'd be too difficult to train at this point in L+, but in Lunatic he'd almost certainly still be salvageable.

[Thor Odinson]

What I did with Chrom is actually kept him in the back for a while unpromoted, but fed him entirely on Dual Attack. He actually got a couple solid levels at that. When he hit something that I can get solid 20s across Str Skl Spd Def on promotion to Paladin (30s were not happening), I promoted him. He gets like a solid ~20ish exp as an unpromoted cavalier in pairup in like, chapter 12, if he hits a Paladin on Dual Strike.

Lucina still had glorious bases thanks to an overfed MU since I went the near-solo route. I'm not sure what stats you have on your Sumia right now, but since both parents have equal share in their child's bases anyway I'd imagine if you feed Sumia to the point where she gets to Galeforce, she'd give pretty solid bases to Lucina by herself.

Edited October 24, 2014 by Thor Odinson

[isetrh]

It'll be when enemies stop being OHKOable--if memory serves, Lunatic!promoted enemies have what, something like a floor of 60 HP+DEF for a L1 Sage? Maybe a STR-fed unit could be one-shotting with a forged effective damage weapon, but beyond that, nope.

As for Chrom: at very least, take him to 10 for Charm, then toss a spare Master Seal at him for better Pair Up bonuses. I'd think he'd be too difficult to train at this point in L+, but in Lunatic he'd almost certainly still be salvageable.

That makes sense. Even less reason to save Gradivus then. If vanilla is anything to go by, I won't need the extra offense until very late game, at which point I probably won't be using Lances since there aren't any non-DLC classes that can use both Lances and Bows. Just beat Chapter 8 and promoted Sumia too, so she can start using Tomes.

Unfortunately I am playing L+.

What I did with Chrom is actually kept him in the back for a while unpromoted, but fed him entirely on Dual Attack. He actually got a couple solid levels at that. When he hit something that I can get solid 20s across Str Skl Spd Def on promotion to Paladin (30s were not happening), I promoted him. He gets like a solid ~20ish exp as an unpromoted cavalier in pairup in like, chapter 12, if he hits a Paladin on Dual Strike.

Lucina still had glorious bases thanks to an overfed MU since I went the near-solo route. I'm not sure what stats you have on your Sumia right now, but since both parents have equal share in their child's bases anyway I'd imagine if you feed Sumia to the point where she gets to Galeforce, she'd give pretty solid bases to Lucina by herself.

Yeah, I've gotten him to lv 5 that way. He can probably eke out a couple more that way, and maybe I can give him some Paralogue exp. It won't matter too much until I can spare him a Master Seal.

I'm not too worried about Lucina's bases. Sumia has pretty incredible stats because I gave her three Renown stat boosters after Chapter 3. I haven't played since promoting her, but I remember her having 18 Str and 17 Def.

After beating Chapter 8 I actually have a Second Seal that I don't know what to do with. I don't think I've had that happen before.

Edited October 24, 2014 by isetrh

[Thor Odinson]

I found paralogue 2 a good place for Chrom on L+. You'll have to give up the physic (it's a pita to get it anyway) but if you follow the first few turns of the interceptor run on para2 and get chrom to that island he can kill enemies in a more controlled fashion. I at least managed to get him to 10/1x/1, if anything (not all in para2 to clarify), and I didn't really train him much before para1 and para2. Para1 is also good if you watch for the counter enemies. If you feed him enough he can front somewhat in para3 with a Fred support if you keep the situation under control with your stronger units.

but since you said you're in chapter 8 it might be too late unless you saved the paralogues. Might as well just dual strike him to 10. If Chrom DS-exp's fast enough you could SS him using the chapter 8 seal to cavalier and then promote at level 10 cav instead. Paladin gives better all around bonuses than Great Lord, especially L+, to supported units since it spreads out the bonuses and the support level equation stacks on top of that. Great Knight is also very good since Sumia's really fast and might not need the extra Paladin speed, but could appreciate the huge tanking power GK affords. Paladin's bonuses are more versatile if you plan on reclassing Sumia to a slower class after 15DF, though, like GK herself, but GK might be better if you keep on rotating DF or go Falco.

Edited October 24, 2014 by Thor Odinson

[Terrador]

Also about the bows thing--it's not crucial to have an entire army of bows. I personally had half my army or so bowing when I did a lowman L+ run; if you expect someone to be mostly backlining or facing action on PP, go ahead and go into a non-bow class, especially for an important skill.

[Kuroi Tsubasa Tenshi]

Also note that while Counter is brutal, a single Counter enemy isn't all that threatening on their own. Proper kiting should allow a strong 1~2 range user to engage 1-2 Counter enemies (depending on what other enemies are nearby) per enemy phase and survive. Since healing items are a dime a dozen, it's possible to continue this somewhat indefinitely (multiple turns may be required for healing until Elixirs if it's not safe to heal with a staff user). Once Galeforce is acquired, only the densest groups of Counter spam should be a problem.

[Czar_Yoshi]

It'll be when enemies stop being OHKOable--if memory serves, Lunatic!promoted enemies have what, something like a floor of 60 HP+DEF for a L1 Sage? Maybe a STR-fed unit could be one-shotting with a forged effective damage weapon, but beyond that, nope.

Forged effective weapons can still do a number on the L+ enemies for a while- getting +5 mt on the Renown Beastkiller and having a spare Arms Scroll is crucial to having Olivia pass Lucina Galeforce in nogrind Lunatic+. It still takes plenty of luck to avoid Pavise+/Counter and Vantage+/Hawkeye combos, but does work with lots of luck.

[isetrh]

I have been keeping all of your advice in mind, and have gotten through Chapter 9.

I found paralogue 2 a good place for Chrom on L+. You'll have to give up the physic (it's a pita to get it anyway) but if you follow the first few turns of the interceptor run on para2 and get chrom to that island he can kill enemies in a more controlled fashion. I at least managed to get him to 10/1x/1, if anything (not all in para2 to clarify), and I didn't really train him much before para1 and para2. Para1 is also good if you watch for the counter enemies. If you feed him enough he can front somewhat in para3 with a Fred support if you keep the situation under control with your stronger units.

but since you said you're in chapter 8 it might be too late unless you saved the paralogues. Might as well just dual strike him to 10. If Chrom DS-exp's fast enough you could SS him using the chapter 8 seal to cavalier and then promote at level 10 cav instead. Paladin gives better all around bonuses than Great Lord, especially L+, to supported units since it spreads out the bonuses and the support level equation stacks on top of that. Great Knight is also very good since Sumia's really fast and might not need the extra Paladin speed, but could appreciate the huge tanking power GK affords. Paladin's bonuses are more versatile if you plan on reclassing Sumia to a slower class after 15DF, though, like GK herself, but GK might be better if you keep on rotating DF or go Falco.

I did actually save just Paralogue 3, since my units were starting to cap their levels unpromoted. At this point I'm considering saving it for the kids. I actually ended up using that seal on Miriel instead since she reached lv 20 and won't get to promote for some time without a lucky Master Seal from Anna. Chrom is growing slowly but surely through DS exp and boss kills. He will still probably promote to Great Lord, but once he reaches lv 10 there I'll give him a seal if I'm past Chapter 16. Thanks for letting me know what the good classes for him are.

Also about the bows thing--it's not crucial to have an entire army of bows. I personally had half my army or so bowing when I did a lowman L+ run; if you expect someone to be mostly backlining or facing action on PP, go ahead and go into a non-bow class, especially for an important skill.

Also note that while Counter is brutal, a single Counter enemy isn't all that threatening on their own. Proper kiting should allow a strong 1~2 range user to engage 1-2 Counter enemies (depending on what other enemies are nearby) per enemy phase and survive. Since healing items are a dime a dozen, it's possible to continue this somewhat indefinitely (multiple turns may be required for healing until Elixirs if it's not safe to heal with a staff user). Once Galeforce is acquired, only the densest groups of Counter spam should be a problem.

In that case, I wonder if Lucina and Cynthia both even need Bows, since once I get Cynthia I'll have three Galeforces, and I have one Bow user decided on with FeMU.

Frederick got to A support with FeMU. I let them without thinking about it, so I may have to bench Fred before they try to S-rank. I do not want that glowing support icon all the way to getting Yarne in postgame.

Edited October 24, 2014 by isetrh

[Alastor15243]

Hey, just wondering, are Flavia and Basilio any use on Lunatic/Lunatic+?

[Terrador]

Hey, just wondering, are Flavia and Basilio any use on Lunatic/Lunatic+?

Both have rock-solid Pair Up bonuses, particularly Flavia, so that's helpful for splitting your team up a bit?

Their real utility lies in Basilio's free Rally Strength, or has anyone else made good use of them in the... what, two maps before Grima? At that point you're pretty much just bumrushing with Morgan and Lucina, or whoever your uberpair is.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Three, but Cht.25 is a joke (it's the easiest map in the game to 1-turn- as long as you use fliers, you can just take a straight line to the boss and ORKO through Aegis+ with a Brave Bow).

[Alastor15243]

So after feeding Lissa the entirety of chapter 17 in the hopes of getting her galeforce in time to have Owain be Morgan's boyfriend in my lunatic nogrind run, well... I hit chapter 18. Is that chapter notorious for being a difficulty spike, or am I just doing it horribly wrong?

[XeKr]

C17 is the more obvious one since it's the first where all enemies are promoted and get Hit+10. C18 has higher enemy density, though.

Still if you handled the enemy stats in C17, it's just a matter of blocking and positioning with the right weapon types (I think only the Griffons fly?)

[Alastor15243]

C17 is the more obvious one since it's the first where all enemies are promoted and get Hit+10. C18 has higher enemy density, though.

Still if you handled the enemy stats in C17, it's just a matter of blocking and positioning with the right weapon types (I think only the Griffons fly?)

While constantly moving to avoid the rushing lava though...

Hey, what's in the chests in C18? Anything I really want?

[isetrh]

While constantly moving to avoid the rushing lava though...

Hey, what's in the chests in C18? Anything I really want?

If the guide I found by googling "fire emblem awakening chapter 18 treasure" is correct, there's an Energy Drop, a Bullion (M), a Rescue, and a Second Seal.

Not promoting the Avatar is really biting me in the ass on Chapter 10. She's having a hard time stuck at 5 Mov without Bows. She just can't avoid/kill Counter enemiea fast enough though. Since anyone else I deploy gets killed I have been tryinf to duo it with Sumia and Chrom, but Sumia can't handle the whole map by herself as a lv 3 Dark Flier with 23 Def. Interceptor's strategy requires things I don't have (Miriel who can use Tomes, Avatar with 8 Mov and Bows). I still have Paralogues 3 and 4 that I could train Sumia with, but is that a good idea? Seems like the kids might want that exp later on. Does anyone have a strategy for Chapter 10?

My stats:

Avatar @ Merc (16/20)

HP 48/Str 28+2 (Tonic)/Mag 16/Skill 32+4 (Barracks)/Spd 26/Lck 29/Def 23+2 (Tonic)/Res 11+4 (Barracks)

A Swords

C Chrom, C Sumia, C Miriel, A Frederick

Sumia @ Dark Flier (20/3.15)

HP 42/Str 22+2 (Tonic)/Mag 16/Skill 29/Spd 29+2 (Spd +2)/Lck 18/Def 21+2 (Tonic)/Res 17

A Lances, E Tomes close to D

C Avatar, S Chrom

Miriel @ Troubador (10/20 Troubador/4.50)

HP 47/Str 5/Mag 25+2 (Mag+2)/Skill 20/Spd 25/Lck 26/Def 9+2 (Tonic)/Res 20+2 (Res+2)

A Staves

C Ricken (her eventual husband who I am not training), C Frederick, B Avatar

Chrom @ Lord (7.02)

HP 26/Str 11+2 (Tonic)/Mag 1/Skill 12/Spd 13/Lck 10/Def 9/Res 2

B Swords

C Avatar, S Sumia

Frederick @ Great Knight (3.87)

HP 30/Str 14+2 (Tonic)/Mag 2/Skill 14/Spd 11/Lck 7/Def 16/Res 3

C Miriel, A Avatar

Libra @ War Monk (1.66)

base, no supports

Thanks!

Edited October 25, 2014 by isetrh

[Thor Odinson]

I think it's probably best to just feed Sumia the paralogues instead of saving it for the kids. What I do with the kids is that I keep them unpromoted until they cap several important stats, then promote. They join relatively late, but if their parents are really fed, their bases will be solid enough to take a few kills here or there. Veteran child unit reclassed from base to lv 1 gets 1 full level per kill for at least ~10 levels. One without Veteran gets less, but still significant (around 60-70ish on post13 enemies)

Edited October 25, 2014 by Thor Odinson

[Alastor15243]

what's the general strategy for tackling Cynthia's paralogue, particularly getting the Large Bullion the leader's carrying and training up my Chrom!Cynthia? Should I pass down Luna or Galeforce? I'm leaning towards galeforce because it's harder to get and in a more statistically out-of-the-way class...

[57317665314631426351713713]

Hey, question: How in the HELL do you beat chapter 3? I mean, I've read some of the strategies that people have put on here, and they're not really working out for me.