The Great Awakening - Game Over

[Sunwoo]

Do you feel that BBM is scummy enough to warrant being vigged though? I disagree with his Mancer stance and why he voted him, but other than that I don't have much problems with him. If we don't have any reason to believe BBM is scum aside from "miller claim is not autoclear anymore", I say no.

[charlie_]

I'd say not this early, since we don't know if the vig is restricted in any way. Although maybe shooting tonight to weed out inactives might not be the worst idea.

[MancerNecro]

I think we shouldn't Vig BBM toNight, especially if the Vig's shots are restricted. If there's a hypothetical Vig, saving one last kill for the supposed Miller claim wouldn't be too bad.

Prims brings out a good point about Bluedoom's OMGUS. I hadn't interpreted it as such. What actually pings me more about Bluedoom is the fact that he has a type of selective reading, ignoring things that are hard for him to explain himself out of.

I still think Rapier's vote was a little hasty and opportunistic, but I understand BBM's point of view that a seemingly legitimate vote would be more opportunistic.

##Unvote: Rapier

##Vote: Bluedoom

[BBM]

Oh, I forgot to mention this earlier but SB reminded me.

Since SF has gotten to the point where a miller claim is not autoclear, do you guys think we should Vig BBM?

srsly

If we have a Vig and they're going to shoot tonight (I wouldn't if they're restricted), I'd rather they shoot one of the people being useless, like SB suggests.

[Darros]

So, SgtSmilies, you're not looking too good for me right now. You didn't post until your name came up in a prod, and then you kind of failposted right afterwards. Sure, I get you were trying to be funny, but it's not really a good idea to do that right away. I also know that not much has happened yet this game ((this is no FR Mafia, that's for sure)) but you can't just slide by not posting anything and then writing "I have nothing to post". If you're going to say that you have no reads at least try to expound on why..

My vote's staying on you because this looks a little suspicious to me.

His reaction to the Marth wagon was kind of shaky ("I don't get why it's happening, and have no reads from it", but rather than doing anything about it he goes and prods a newbie, who still hasn't done anything. Then there's rolespec and a feeble attempt to get the newbie to post something of value. I don't remember you giving reads like, ever, either.

My absence from SF Mafia for about the span of a year and a half kind of makes me not know that SgtSmilies is a newbie. Other than the people I previously played with, I have no idea how long people here have been playing for. And I don't really have reads from the Marth wagon. To me, it seemed like silly jokevoting ((because that always happens early D1)) gone horribly wrong, to the point where people were running around like chickens with their heads cut off. I wouldn't call any of what happened opportunistic, I don't think anyone was actually gunning for a lynch. Mancer must have thought that someone was, and then people jumped on him for that. Then we got a big mess which seems to have mostly cleared now. I'm getting a bit of a town read on Mancer now due to metagame things, with him doing the same kind of acting weird thing that he did in FR Mafia, where he turned out to be town.

However, reading again makes Bluedoom like a little scummy to me. After jumping around he seems to be suddenly pushing towards a NL on Day 1. However this might change with the extension ahead and I don't want to jump to conclusions here.

Now, on the topic of shooting inactives I think that's a terrible idea. When you're completely inactive you should probably be subbed out. Not killed for the purpose of being inactive. Killing someone because they're inactive is a terrible reason to kill them, as there's no real reads on them because they aren't here. They could just as well be town as mafia, in fact they're more likely to be town ((unless this game is like horribly balanced but I trust Baldrick knows how to balance a mafia game)) and this is a bad idea.

You're not sitting with me well right now SB because of that statement. Shooting inactive people has potential to be extremely town detrimental. ;/ BBM, your going along with this makes me glare a little at you too.

[charlie_]

Inactives also have the potential to be scum, and can be tricky to find too, since they're not posting as much. I was implying that if the vig were to shoot tonight, they should target an inactive. And of course BBM would prefer someone else being shot to himself, that's the same with any win con, unless he's vengeful or something. I'm also not liking the fact you're not voting your scumread, the Smiles vote is doing nothing.

[Bluedoom]

I claim backup (I dunno which variant I'm Donny btw) and I hoenstly think you guys trying to lynch me sucks but oh well..

Prims is scum IMO for continuing to keeping his vote on me and doing nothing else.

EDIT: Ok I didn't see a 24-hour extension. Uh-huh.

##Unvote

##Vote: Prims

Do you have anything else to say other than stick that vote on me?

[charlie_]

Actually I derped on the last part but I dont see one Smiles vote making a difference.

[charlie_]

Marth that vote reasoning is horrible

Also what kind of backup are you?

[charlie_]

http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=38721&view=findpost&p=2319852

yes prims has said other things about not you

[Bluedoom]

Marth that vote reasoning is horrible

Also what kind of backup are you?

Well I dunno dude it just says I could get powerful sometime so I could be a specific role-backup, normal backup, amnesiac or something altogether different.

Wrt No-lynch suggestion: I still think there aren't enough reasons to properly lynch Mancer since there hasn't been much discussion- we'd be lynching on poor grounds anyway and I think its unfair to lynch ANYONE on really poor grounds just for INFO. We don't lynch for INFO we lynch to find SCUM.

[charlie_]

Well we're not no lynching. Do what you can and make a solid, not omgus filled case.

[Bluedoom]

http://serenesforest...dpost&p=2319852

yes prims has said other things about not you

Yeah I read it over again later. *facepalm*

##Unvote

Gonna try re-reading now

[Darros]

Inactives also have the potential to be scum, and can be tricky to find too, since they're not posting as much. I was implying that if the vig were to shoot tonight, they should target an inactive. And of course BBM would prefer someone else being shot to himself, that's the same with any win con, unless he's vengeful or something. I'm also not liking the fact you're not voting your scumread, the Smiles vote is doing nothing.

Inactives have potential to be scum, sure, but that doesn't mean the vig should shoot them. Being inactive isn't a choice, if players are inactive they're going to be subbed out by the game moderator. I'd much prefer a potential vig not shooting at all than shooting someone inactive because there's a chance they might be mafia, doing so would be foolish and stupid. And I kind of derped and forgot about BBM's standpoint about not wanting to get shot himself, but I would still rather have the vig not shoot at all.= over killing someone who's inactive.

Did you miss the part where I also have a scumread on Smilies. Because I also said that, and really a single vote on you probably wouldn't do much either.

[Darros]

Nice OMGUS Marth.

[charlie_]

Actually I derped on the last part but I dont see one Smiles vote making a difference.

This was directed at your Smiles scumread.

[Darros]

Okay, cool. The problem with my two scumreads is that I seem to be the only person who has then. Swapping my vote over to you would accomplish the same amount of nothing that's being accomplished now by my vote.

That has potential to change though because Marth seems to be digging himself a grave with that very obvious OMGUS over Prims, calling him scum because he (Prims) held a vote on him (Marth), while ignoring other posts Prims has made. ISO's are in the OP, why not look at them?

[Paperblade]

Marth, how do you know you're backup and that there's not a different condition to your role?

[Bluedoom]

Marth, how do you know you're backup and that there's not a different condition to your role?

I don't, but I assume I am one (hence I said in the second post regarding that that I could be something totally different)

[charlie_]

Paperblade should stop posting questions and post reads.

I'm not happy with lynching Marth today, I'd rather he wasn't lynched while I was sleeping.

[Sunwoo]

I'm not happy with Marth pointing fingers at people who pointed at him first, and not really paying much attention to anyone else. I already stated that I didn't understand the Mancer votes, but what was the basis of that Prims vote and immediate unvote? Because he'd be fine with a lynch on you and SB pointed out a flaw in your argument?

As for the backup claim, I can buy that it is his actual role but that says nothing for his alignment.

[Paperblade]

Yeah sorry I'm asking questions to clarify information from the person I'm currently voting

Anyway I think Marth is town, roles like that are uncommon on SF, but even though it's a reasonable scum fakeclaim the way he presented it makes me think he's not lying

##Unvote, ##Vote: Smiles

Do something

@Boron: Why do you think that's his real role but not necessarily his alignment? The way his role is worded I would think it's based on something happening that he's not aware of without making him somewhat informed (such as number of players dead or a certain role dying), which would be more likely town than scum. Granted, it's possible he left that information out, or has another aspect to his role if he was scum.

[Paperblade]

Also, I think that if he was scum, he wouldn't immediately assume it's a backup since his scumbuddies would go "Well what if it's X" "idk" "ask the host" which makes me think he read the PM and made an assumption then thought nothing of it

[Sunwoo]

@Boron: Why do you think that's his real role but not necessarily his alignment? The way his role is worded I would think it's based on something happening that he's not aware of without making him somewhat informed (such as number of players dead or a certain role dying), which would be more likely town than scum. Granted, it's possible he left that information out, or has another aspect to his role if he was scum.

Well, my point was more that even if Marth is amnesiac (more used to this than backup), he might not necessarily be town-aligned. Roles aren't necessarily indicative of alignment, after all. I'd like more than a claim to make me less edgy about him. As for the "way his role is worded", do you mean this post here? If it's so, I am not completely sure what to make of it other than I assume there are certain roles that he cannot copy.

[BBM]

Backup isn't a terribly common scum role, but it is a terribly common fakeclaim, and Marth also seems awfully unsure of exactly what it is that he can even do. The Prims vote wasn't good either, because even if going after Marth had been the only thing that Prims had done, there's nothing that makes Prims's vote worse than other people on his wagon, if that's what he wanted to go after somebody for.