Limit Break is a terrible skill

[BlueFire]

The game is broken enough as it is; why allow it to be further broken by allowing a fifth viable skill? Giving you only four options levels the playing field to some extent.

The OP's main point is: to increase variety in skillsets. Coordinating four skills has less viable arrangements than using five. Especially on more specialized units. And everyone can have access Limit Break.

I don't critique IS for releasing great skills as DLC. It's possible they excluded certain skills during development while planning to release them as DLC. They're still a business and want to make money. Personally, I prefer to buy maps for skills I'll use over story and dialogue.

However, I do think that Limit Break is too good. Limit Break would still encourage sales for being a great choice for a skill if it increased caps by 3-6 instead of 10.

Right now, it's difficult to not justify using it for the final DLC or a Streetpass team as one of your five skills if you have access to it. Deciding to use Limit Break is an easy choice to make, whereas the other skills are easier to debate between which ones to use. If Limit Break was +4 to caps, it'd still be a top tier skill, but it would have to compete with the other skills for one of your slots much more often than now.

[shadykid]

so, Limit Break is in use for.....all of one final DLC map (and streetpass, i guess)

so what gives?

now someone record a clear of the harder path of The Strongest One's Name without Limit Break

[Interceptor]

Here's a list of the balanced Fire Emblem games:

If you don't see anything there, it might be because they don't exist. Maybe we can just enjoy a game with broken shit in it, and use our monkey brains to decide whether or not we feel like partaking personally.

[Paperblade]

I don't really agree with points 3 and 4 but points 1 and 2 are good enough that OP is right

[Redwall]

The OP's main point is: to increase variety in skillsets. Coordinating four skills has less viable arrangements than using five. Especially on more specialized units. And everyone can have access Limit Break.

I am aware; my point was that beating Wave 2 of TSON is more challenging for the player--and that it is better this way, since most of the people interested in TSON probably want it for the challenge--as of now than it would be without Limit Break (precisely because of your extra skill), and with the enemy stats lowered by ten.

[Chiki]

I think you guys misunderstand the OP. When he says terrible skill I don't think he means that it's literally a bad skill, just a bad decision on the part of Intelligent Systems. Regardless of whether that's true or not, it's incredibly immature of you all to gang up on him like a pack of vultures.

Edited April 10, 2013 by Olwen

[Othin]

Allowing fewer skill slots isn't a terrible thing, and doesn't even necessarily make for less variety. In postgame conditions where you can toss Limit Breaker onto everyone and get full use of it, your characters each have access to a lot of skills, and there isn't a huge number that really stand out. Restricting other skills to four instead of five makes your characters have to specialize more, rather than all grabbing a larger scoop from the limited pool of meaningful skills and therefore overlapping more without Limit Breaker than with it.

[TopHatPanda]

Here's a fun old adage about DLC: If you don't like it, don't buy it.

No one is forcing you to use something you don't like. It's not "needed" at all. If you think it lessens your FE experience, then don't give up your wallet. There's some free market knowledge for ya, Ayn Rand.

This thread is the equivalent of a vegetarian complaining about meat tasting TOO good, and those darn restaurants force feeding you delicious barbeque. JUST DON'T BUY IT YOU TREE-HUGGER.

[BrightBow]

Here's a list of the balanced Fire Emblem games:

If you don't see anything there, it might be because they don't exist. Maybe we can just enjoy a game with broken shit in it, and use our monkey brains to decide whether or not we feel like partaking personally.

So what? Just because it's difficult to design a game properly, they shouldn't even try?

Now obviously this doesn't apply to paid DLC. It applies more to stuff like making the most powerful unit not only being available from the very beginning but also give him a variation of the Paragon skill.

Or to give a sturdy variation of a mage exclusive access to an health restoring attack spell that can be bought cheaply and infinitely...

But seriously, this mindset is terrible. It's like in order to have fun with the game, you already have to spend like 100 hours on it just to know how to play the game without breaking into tiny pieces.

Edited April 10, 2013 by BrightBow

[Redwall]

Here's a fun old adage about DLC: If you don't like it, don't buy it.

No one is forcing you to use something you don't like. It's not "needed" at all. If you think it lessens your FE experience, then don't give up your wallet. There's some free market knowledge for ya, Ayn Rand.

This thread is the equivalent of a vegetarian complaining about meat tasting TOO good, and those darn restaurants force feeding you delicious barbeque. JUST DON'T BUY IT YOU TREE-HUGGER.

The original poster clearly does not dislike DLC on the whole, especially given his other topics on the matter; he dislikes one aspect of it. "if you don't like it, then don't buy it" does not actually contest his claims about Limit Break being a bad design choice.

[Interceptor]

So what? Just because it's difficult to design a game properly, they shouldn't even try?

Properly? Your phrasing is rejected. What is "proper" game design for a single player SRPG? Some people enjoy building super-unkillable badass units. What's wrong with giving them the capability?

[Shadow Mir]

So what? Just because it's difficult to design a game properly, they shouldn't even try?

Now obviously this doesn't apply to paid DLC. It applies more to stuff like making the most powerful unit not only being available from the very beginning but also give him a variation of the Paragon skill.

Or to give a sturdy variation of a mage exclusive access to an health restoring attack spell that can be bought cheaply and infinitely...

But seriously, this mindset is terrible. It's like in order to have fun with the game, you already have to spend like 100 hours on it just to know how to play the game without breaking into tiny pieces.

Well, tbh, pretty much every FE game is imbalanced in one way or another - FE4 has holy blood, FE6 has Nosferatu (which got nerfed in FE7 through FE9 by making it heavy enough to be impractical), FE7 has Luna (nerfed in FE8 by nerfing its accuracy and crit rate), FE8 has Seth, the Tellius games have BEXP...

Edited April 10, 2013 by Levant Fortner

[BrightBow]

Properly? Your phrasing is rejected. What is "proper" game design for a single player SRPG? Some people enjoy building super-unkillable badass units. What's wrong with giving them the capability?

Nothing is wrong with that. There are opportunities for infinite exp and money. They raised the max stat cap to infinite just so that people can grind units to the point where nothing in the game can scratch them. They get what they want.

But what about the people who expect an actual strategic experience from a self-declared strategy game? What's wrong with giving them the capability?

Edited April 10, 2013 by BrightBow

[PuffPuff]

Well, you gotta admit, if you want to have any real chance at clearing RaR3, you'd need units that are capped or near capped anyway.

That chapter is second hardest in the game!

It'd be foolish to challenge it without proper preparations.

I use all stats+2 on everyone anyways. LB is just going to replace it and raise the stats by 8.

Why not just have that along with Limitbreaker to make it more inevitable?

[Interceptor]

But what about the people who expect an actual strategic experience from a self-declared strategy game? What's wrong with giving them the capability?

They need to fix their expectations, since Fire Emblem has been full of broken shit since the dawn of the effing NES, which was released before some of the people in this forum were even born. You have the "capability" to use your own scrub rules to create whatever strategic experience that you can cull out of the engine.

[dondon151]

boo hoo no one is sad that you have C(n,4) skillsets available instead of C(n,5)

[BrightBow]

They need to fix their expectations, since Fire Emblem has been full of broken shit since the dawn of the effing NES, which was released before some of the people in this forum were even born. You have the "capability" to use your own scrub rules to create whatever strategic experience that you can cull out of the engine.

I don't know. I do think that IS is trying to create an actual strategy game and not a strategy engine.

That's why they bother to include a difficulty setting and apply stats to everything instead of simply allowing the player to choose how much money to pay for something or how much damage they want to deal.

[shadykid]

I don't know. I do think that IS is trying to create an actual strategy game and not a strategy engine.

That's why they bother to include a difficulty setting and apply stats to everything instead of simply allowing the player to choose how much money to pay for something or how much damage they want to deal.

counterpoint: Lunatic+

[Zerker]

I believe Limit Break would be better (and probably more overpowered) if it didn't clog up a skill slot, but was a permanent effect item.

Then again most of your units in Awakening are going to end up overpowered

Edited April 10, 2013 by Ƶerker

[PuffPuff]

Then again most of your units in Awakening are going to end up overpowered

That's what we want in the end.

To turn your most favorite units into crusaders in the end. =)

[Interceptor]

I don't know. I do think that IS is trying to create an actual strategy game and not a strategy engine.

That's why they bother to include a difficulty setting and apply stats to everything instead of simply allowing the player to choose how much money to pay for something or how much damage they want to deal.

Goodness, are we already at the part where the person with the lame argument starts talking nonsense? Awakening is an actual strategy game, and like all FE games before it, it has broken shit included. It's not perfect, and the entirety of the product offered does not align 100% with my personal desires. For some reason, I don't feel inclined to make a thread describing the exact consistency of the sand in my underpants.

I don't like the Barracks.

[spoiler=Oh noes, how does he handle the crushing disappointment?]

Therefore, I choose not to use it.

Spoiler tags to protect the forum population from dying of shock.

[Zerker]

That's what we want in the end.

To turn your most favorite units into crusaders in the end. =)

You know you're doing it right when Morgan starts out with all of his/her stats capped as a Tactician.

[BrightBow]

Goodness, are we already at the part where the person with the lame argument starts talking nonsense? Awakening is an actual strategy game, and like all FE games before it, it has broken shit included. It's not perfect, and the entirety of the product offered does not align 100% with my personal desires. For some reason, I don't feel inclined to make a thread describing the exact consistency of the sand in my underpants.

Ah, I'm sorry. I thought you had a problem with the possibility of a better balanced Fire Emblem because you acted so offended by a thread talking about balance. I accidentally argued against a Strawman here. Sorry, again.

But why do you got so riled up about this thread? Why shouldn't people talk about these aspects?

Edited April 10, 2013 by BrightBow

[Trickster]

What I find is really funny is that people are saying that Limit break, breaks the game, yet Pair up already does that on it's own, and it's not DLC, in fact it's encouraged by the developers.

[arvilino]

What I find is really funny is that people are saying that Limit break, breaks the game, yet Pair up already does that on it's own, and it's not DLC, in fact it's encouraged by the developers.

Well actually limit break itself can't break the game. Grinding to the point at which you can utilize Limit Break pretty much puts you in a position where stat and skill-wise you'd steamroll almost all the content even without it(especially if it's the extent of say maxing Vaike's Resistance with Limit Break).

I guess at the very least it allows the player to use 1st class units and the Villager classes to be usable in some of the late game or post game content if you like the class (or the personal models some characters in those classes) compared to the promoted alternatives. That's something atleast.

Edited April 10, 2013 by arvilino