Prims is Gay Mafia - Game Over

[Da Bear]

You can't really say you're busy if you're posting in CYOR still dude. What do you make of Refa recently?

Yeah, CYOR is higher priority for me rn because it's a prior commitment and I haven't got anything over here. I had very little free time this week and I decided to commit more to the game where I knew what was going on. I'll do stuff with this game this weekend.

Nothing much, I think his case on me is really terrible but I'm not really scumreading him that much, I'm still working on reads and stuff since I'm way behind in the way of contact.

[charlie_]

Why shouldn't we lynch you?

[Baldrick]

If you don't mind me asking, if the stuff keeping you busy IRL sudden or not? Sorry if I sound cold, but I'm inclined to think you're using it as an excuse because it's easy to say you're busy, and it's really not smart to join an OC game while you have another semi-OC ongoing game unless you're positive you can handle both. I'd rather keep someone alive who is putting in effort.

I'm in the process of responding to poly's latest. Just got distracted.

[Eurykins]

...Oh. RVS Vote- I feel really stupid in saying this, but I've neglected the fact that I never changed/moved it over the course of this thread. I'm brilliant. >_>;;

Refa: The only time I really got a poke from him was him asking me about Bearclaw (after the exchange that he and Bear had in-thread). Otherwise, he's been relatively silent (to me at least), and I was a bit wary of that. Null read, but leaning scum.

JSND: Same as Refa (in terms of timing/messaging), but answered my questioning post about the situation, rather than messaging me about what I thought about Refa. Felt a bit more comfortable with his reply, but likewise messaging stopped soon after. Null read.

Paperblade: Refused to even respond to my forum PM, so I'm not liking that. Null read, heavily leaning scum due to lack of communication.

Poly: He's had questionable posts in the thread, and has said a few things that sounded extremely weird to me in PMs with regards to approaching this OC game:

tbh, I was just gonna skip that aspect and just try to coast through without getting mislynched

I also asked him about why he had so many scattered/half-hearted responses with the SB conversation, in which he replied:

I was still ironing out some things elsewhere, unrelated to Mafia.

I understand that IRL things happen... but I don't know if it warrants being that seemingly jumpy/uncertain in the conversation. Lets off a really bad vibe to me- but I don't know if this is more of his reckless townie play, or legit scum vibes.

Shinori: I've talked to him on and off in Skype and elsewhere. He's been relatively talkative and responsive to questions I've asked, and aside from the awkward exchange/conversation with Kirsche, I've not seen or heard anything from him that feels scummy. I'm pullin' a town read on him.

SB: Didn't talk much at first, but poked me again prior to him posting/voting Poly for the logs. Though I wasn't fond of the initial vote on Baldrick based on the Survivor claim (seemed to jump at the first chance to nail what appeared to be the 'easiest' target at the time), he hasn't dropped much scum vibes as far as I can tell. Null, hoping/leaning town.

Kirsche: I only interacted with once via IRC, and it was mostly over the conversation with Shinori; I didn't agree with his method of attempting to scum hunt, as I felt like there were better alternative/means of tackling it than just hunting for the win con. (I also did ask Kirsche if he ended up reaction-testing other people, but he has yet to respond to me regarding that.) I don't know if that makes him slightly lazy end on the scum hunting, or a bit graspy and possibly scummy.

Kay: I haven't gotten around to messaging yet.

Blitz: Same thing as Kay.

Baldrick: He's been pretty talkative/responsive to messaging, mostly over Skype, and as far as I can tell, he's been solid/steady in what he's been saying in correlation to other people/claims. Seemish townie to me.

Life: ...Oh boy. I'm not gonna lie, the times he has messaged me, it's almost scary. Seems very asserting and commanding, which is putting me off a bit in wariness, but I figure it comes with the role of trying to lead the townies. While I'm not sure he's legit in his claims to run the place well to pull out the scum faster (as opposed to a scum trying to get freebie claims from people) and busy being honestly intimidated by him, I'm really hoping he's putting off a legit town leadership role.

In terms of reads thus far:

Scum: Poly - Paperblade - Refa - Kirsche - JSND - Life - SB - Baldrick - Shinori :Town

[Leaving off Kay and Blitz due to not having spoken to them at all.]

##Unvote

##Vote Poly

[Eurykins]

*Edit: I had trouble copy/pasting the quotes from the PMs (to get it with the box), so I used his Post #125 (hence the time stamp on them) just for the quote boxes. I need to learn how to format that without directly having to hit the 'Quote' button every time... >_>

[Refa]

Refa: The only time I really got a poke from him was him asking me about Bearclaw (after the exchange that he and Bear had in-thread). Otherwise, he's been relatively silent (to me at least), and I was a bit wary of that. Null read, but leaning scum.

Paperblade: Refused to even respond to my forum PM, so I'm not liking that. Null read, heavily leaning scum due to lack of communication.

From what I gather, you're basing these reads around the lack of communication with yourself specifically. Can you explain why that is scummy? And I'm confused as too how someone can be both a null read and heavily leaning scum at the same time...

Poly: He's had questionable posts in the thread, and has said a few things that sounded extremely weird to me in PMs with regards to approaching this OC game:

I also asked him about why he had so many scattered/half-hearted responses with the SB conversation, in which he replied:

I understand that IRL things happen... but I don't know if it warrants being that seemingly jumpy/uncertain in the conversation. Lets off a really bad vibe to me- but I don't know if this is more of his reckless townie play, or legit scum vibes.

How can you be so unsure of your main scumread?

Kirsche: I only interacted with once via IRC, and it was mostly over the conversation with Shinori; I didn't agree with his method of attempting to scum hunt, as I felt like there were better alternative/means of tackling it than just hunting for the win con. (I also did ask Kirsche if he ended up reaction-testing other people, but he has yet to respond to me regarding that.) I don't know if that makes him slightly lazy end on the scum hunting, or a bit graspy and possibly scummy.

Scum: Poly - Paperblade - Refa - Kirsche - JSND - Life - SB - Baldrick - Shinori :Town

Your priority list confuses me. Your case on kirsche (shown above) has a similar conclusion to your case on Polydeuces, yet he's a few rungs down for some reason. Why is that?

[Eurykins]

From what I gather, you're basing these reads around the lack of communication with yourself specifically. Can you explain why that is scummy? And I'm confused as too how someone can be both a null read and heavily leaning scum at the same time...

I said null leaning scum, because there is nothing else I can pull out of someone not messaging me. It's their choice to respond to me or not, and I put him very close to the scum reads for it. Basically, it's "I have no clue what you are, 'cause you're not talking to me, so I'm tagging you as scummy unless I get to hear from you."

How can you be so unsure of your main scumread?

I recall the times that Poly has essentially self-lynched/hammered or otherwise been mislynched as townie. In all of the cases I remember, he's done really crazy, sometimes STUPID shit. So though he's pinging me HARD on the scumread (hence my vote on him), he's likewise rung that in other games when he's been town. As Life sorta implied. He's either scum, or he's just being really stupid/careless with his OC play.

Your priority list confuses me. Your case on kirsche (shown above) has a similar conclusion to your case on Polydeuces, yet he's a few rungs down for some reason. Why is that?

Refer to above on for this answer. Kirsche is also suspicious due to his reasoning, but unlike Poly, hasn't done much else to warrant more suspicion.

[Baldrick]

@poly.

My guess is that he didn't think it would prove anything, and so decided to undermine the validity of the test.

He did get defensive later, but his response to being called out on it seemed pretty measured ('cause I have no reason to'). Is that the point you were referring to?

I interpret shinori's acceptance of kirsche's test ('so do it') as "do what you like, I don't care" rather than "I think you should do it"

shinori's mention of life didn't come from nowhere, because life's 73 had a plan similar to what kirsche was getting at. That said, he should explain why life doing it is scummy but not kirsche.

Eury: apart from poly and kirsche, your reads seem to be based on how much they've talked to you. Do you have anything else to say about the refa/bear argument? If the main difference between refa and bear is that the former has been a bit more proactive in talking to you, why is he leaning scum and bear null?

Refa why

[Eurykins]

Eury: apart from poly and kirsche, your reads seem to be based on how much they've talked to you. Do you have anything else to say about the refa/bear argument? If the main difference between refa and bear is that the former has been a bit more proactive in talking to you, why is he leaning scum and bear null?

Refa ended up poking me right after the post exchange between him and bear took place. Refa also was the first one who started the Bear/Refa posting to begin with, and the fact that he was soon asking me what I thought of Bear as a result felt weird to me- like he was trying to get opinions formed up against Bear ASAP after what happened. That, and Bear responded to my post/questioning, as opposed of prompting me for an opinion on Refa. So either he was playing more passively than Refa in asking for reads, or Refa was more interested in gaining momentum against Bear for what happened in the thread. I just have the gut feeling that it was the latter as opposed to the former.

[Baldrick]

Eury why

Kirsche seems to have the same amount of interaction as refa and bear, but unlike them you find him suspicious so why is he below them?

[Eurykins]

Eury why

Kirsche seems to have the same amount of interaction as refa and bear, but unlike them you find him suspicious so why is he below them?

Because part of my reaction to Kirsche is not solely based on content/activity level. But also due to his.... personality, you could say? He's seemed pretty head-strong and his logic/tactics before (like with the win con hunting) seemed off and quirky to me. [This might also be prior bias, which is why I'm trying to be careful with my feelings/read of him before I misinterpret his actions as being truly scummy or just untrustworthy townie]

That's why he's above Refa (farther away from scum than he is) but below Bear (closer).

[Baldrick]

I see. Do you think scum is more likely than town to push their cases strongly? Or did Refa say something you found weird?

[Zkirsche]

(I also did ask Kirsche if he ended up reaction-testing other people, but he has yet to respond to me regarding that)

Erm. From our talk on Thursday:

[22:03] <Eurykins> Was there a reason why you chose him over anyone else to do so, or have you been doing similar things with others?
01[22:03] <kirschekitty> I was trying to see what he would say and what he would do
01[22:03] <kirschekitty> I've done it with Sb and PB as well

[Zkirsche]

shinori's mention of life didn't come from nowhere, because life's 73 had a plan similar to what kirsche was getting at. That said, he should explain why life doing it is scummy but not kirsche.

He's voting me right now for it, so I assume he finds me doing it scummy too.

This is what I mean by him calling me scummy in that convo: it was obvious that he actually did find me scummy but he said many times that he didn't. Then he voted me and cut off half the convo.

I interpret shinori's acceptance of kirsche's test ('so do it') as "do what you like, I don't care" rather than "I think you should do it"

If he thinks what I'm doing is scummy enough for a vote, then obviously he cares about what I'm doing.

[eclipse]

HOW TO FORMAT:

Every post has a little "Quote" button on the lower-right corner - even PMs! To get the fancy-shmancy info, click on the Quote button (and open it in another tab/window, if necessary), turn off WYSIWYG (switch on the upper-left corner of the reply box), grab everything and plop it into your reply post.

Thus, to quote this post:

*Edit: I had trouble copy/pasting the quotes from the PMs (to get it with the box), so I used his Post #125 (hence the time stamp on them) just for the quote boxes. I need to learn how to format that without directly having to hit the 'Quote' button every time... >_>

I'd hit the Quote button, then grab the following code:

[quote name="Eurykins" post="2760709" timestamp="1384635364"]
*Edit: I had trouble copy/pasting the quotes from the PMs (to get it with the box), so I used his [i]Post #125[/i] (hence the time stamp on them) just for the quote boxes. I need to learn how to format that without directly having to hit the 'Quote' button every time... >_>
[/quote]

THEN put it in my reply. Hope this helps~! Sub OUT!

[Eurykins]

I see. Do you think scum is more likely than town to push their cases strongly? Or did Refa say something you found weird?

What concerns me is that I've seen Kirsche push powerfully both as town and scum before. Though the pushing was less impressive in the game Kirsche subbed for Objection (but I'm not sure that counts, as we'd already figured Objection was scum prior to the change). But Refa... his reaction to the RVS vote itself seemed unusual to me- nitpicking something that really shouldn't have been. I wasn't sure if he was grasping as hard as he could given the OC format of the game (not much else to go after besides that), or if he was trying too hard to seem productive in his scum hunt.

@Kirsche: Oh, I remember you touching on that- true. I just thought you would've posted in-thread (mind derp OP).

@Eclipse: Ah, thanks for that! ^_^

[BBM]

Tick tock goes the clock.

VOTALS

Refa (1): Bearclaw

Shinori (1): Polydeuces

Paperblade (1): Kay

Kay (1): Paperblade

Bearclaw (3): Refa, Baldrick, Kirsche

Kirsche (1): Shinori

Polydeuces (3): SB, Life, Eury

Not Voting (1): Blitz

5 to lynch at deadline, 7 to hammer, something like 6 hours and 2 minutes left. There's also this handy thing.

[Baldrick]

Scummy has lost all meaning to me now.

@kirsche

I thought his vote was on the basis of you being lazy as opposed to scummy, but he's maintained it for so long so idk. ISOing him, the only other thing of note he's done is post a log without committing to a view on poly. Not as sound as I remembered.

I meant in the sense of "it's your funeral"

[BBM]

So my parents tell me we have to go somewhere in ten minutes ;///

I may or may not be back for phase end; if phase ends before I get back, either through time running out or hammer, a reminder to stop talking to each other both in and out of the thread until I update, thanks.

[Paperblade]

oink oink oink

[charlie_]

Tired so really brief thoughts coming in.

Eury's readspost bugs me. I feel like her null/leaning scum reads are really weird, especially when they're based on the fact that they haven't been able to talk much. How does that make a player scummy, when Kay and Blitz are both nulls for you when you haven't talked to either of them? Her actual scumreads on Poly and kirsche are also really waffly.

Bear's done nothing to make me not want to lynch him, and I'm gonna sleep in a few minutes.

##Unvote

##Vote: bearclaw

[charlie_]

also blitz should post something, I know he suspects Eury from when I talked with him but I haven't heard anything out of him since.

Need 3 more votes to hammer bearclaw in the next 4 hours, people should consolidate.

[Paperblade]

##Unvote, ##Vote: bearclaw

talk to me instead of claiming mafia

[Refa]

I recall the times that Poly has essentially self-lynched/hammered or otherwise been mislynched as townie. In all of the cases I remember, he's done really crazy, sometimes STUPID shit. So though he's pinging me HARD on the scumread (hence my vote on him), he's likewise rung that in other games when he's been town. As Life sorta implied. He's either scum, or he's just being really stupid/careless with his OC play.

You should not be waffling on your main scumread this hard. :\ Your argument is "I'm finding him really scummy, but he's done that before as town", which comes across as distancing yourself from the vote.

Because part of my reaction to Kirsche is not solely based on content/activity level. But also due to his.... personality, you could say? He's seemed pretty head-strong and his logic/tactics before (like with the win con hunting) seemed off and quirky to me. [This might also be prior bias, which is why I'm trying to be careful with my feelings/read of him before I misinterpret his actions as being truly scummy or just untrustworthy townie]

I don't like how you're being so careful with kirsche, but not with Polydeuces. I smell a double standard.

##Unvote

##Vote: Eurykins

I have to leave to do something for my Religion class, be back in like an hour at the most. Will elaborate more on my case then. In the meantime, please discuss. I'll also consolidate on bearclaw if needed, but Eury's bothering me a lot more atm.

oink oink oink

hey graveyard duck

[MRDRHAWK]

I'd much rather go Shinori since I still really don't like that Kirsche interaction, but I'll compromise since I'm in a very significant minority.

##Unvote

##Vote: bearclaw