BBM Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 I hope that by ending the game you mean winning the game, because you know, voting either of us would end it atm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Because I wanted to scan Shinori and make sure that either way, we'd win today. If you got vigged and flipped scum, then we won. If you were town, then we just lynched Shinori (who would've likely scanned scum) and... yeah. But since Shinori was town, it just means you get lynched instead. DON'T BLOW IT SHINORI but like FYPOV it made no difference whether I got vigged and Shinori got scanned or vice versa. dunno why but it gives me the feeling that you specifically wanted to be in a 1v1 with Shinori rather than me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRDRHAWK Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Doesn't matter, point is it's a 1v1 and Shinori's got the only vote left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 lol that is clearly an attempt to avoid having to explain your actions wait a sec Shinori, if the same person targeted Refa twice, would that show up as one person or two? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinori Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 I wish we coulda just lynched poly yesterday. Cause then I wouldn't be having this argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinori Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 They're distinct people. Each one's a different person. My phaser hit three separate people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinori Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 OKAY WELL. I'm torn and I don't know. I have equal reasons to think that either of you could be scum. But I'm just gonna go with this and see what happens. If I lost the town this game then I'm sorry and I suck. ##Vote: BBM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 so close Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted December 13, 2013 Author Share Posted December 13, 2013 HAMMER! NO POSTING, ETC! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted December 13, 2013 Author Share Posted December 13, 2013 "If you had to choose a song to describe yourself, what would it be?" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68jIs_TPa1o Unfortunately, no one likes that version. Dear BBM, You are Serra. It's not YOUR fault that everyone is inferior to you! Without your amazing staff abilities, they'd all be addicted to vulneraries! You have the following roles available to you: - Safeguard (may only target a mafia member once during the game, including yourself) - Redirect - Hook - Auto-target kill (you aim for someone, and nothing will stop you from hitting your target; may only be used once during the game) You have four shots. During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Use ABILITY on PLAYER. You will use ABILITY on PLAYER, and consume a shot in the process. Every time a mafia member that's not you is removed from the game, you will regain a shot. You are allied with the mafia. You win when all threats to the mafia are eliminated. "That means we're the only ones left?" Poly asked Shinori. "Indeed. We have won the day." Shinori replied blandly. "Good to have someone logical on my side." Dear Shinori, You are The Doctor. You are a hologram aboard Voyager, and you were activated when the flesh-and-blood doctor ate it. You attend to the medical duties as best as you can. . .well, as best as a computer program can! During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Activate near PLAYER. Your role varies depending on what happens to PLAYER: - If PLAYER survives the night, you will learn the number of people (not including yourself) that visited PLAYER - If PLAYER is killed, you will attempt to stop the killer. However, you can't tell the difference between friend and foe, and your phaser is permanently set to stun. Thus, all people who visited PLAYER will be forced to idle the next night, and you will learn how many people you stunned. As your phaser has a few glitches, you'll be forced to idle, too (but naturally, you won't count yourself as "people stunned"). You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Dear Polydeuces, You are Ryosuke Takahashi. You're all set to go to medical school. . .wait, what do you mean this conference is for medical professionals?! You silently wonder if you should "doctor" everyone's cars. As you're not even a medical student, you have no ability (yet). You're keeping an eye on someone, though, and if you're patient, you may get the chance to do something. Good things come to those who wait! During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Target PLAYER. You'll learn PLAYER's alignment. You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Congratulations to the town for winning Healer Mafia! OTHER NOTES: 1. From the responses in the graveyard, I can't trust several of you to be civil/not spam the topic. Therefore, this topic will be locked until further notice. 2. Postgame will go up sometime this weekend. My stomach hurts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted December 15, 2013 Author Share Posted December 15, 2013 THE POINT: What happens if there's no way for the town to block kills via a doctor or any variant thereof? For that matter, let's get rid of all town version of deathproofs, too. I don't think it would be fair if the town was completely unable to protect itself, though, which is why the town is as heavy on redirection as it is. Since kills are meant to fly all over the place, and I don't think town should rely on lynches alone, I'd need a vig who'd need good reasons to fire. Lastly, I think arsonists are viable roles, provided that the town gets some sort of warning (and not dreamers, because there's no work involved for that information). Thus, the following characteristics were made, and developed around: - Mafia's job would be to mole the town, hard. This means fooling as many investigative roles as possible (but no role should fool all of them at once) - Town's job would be to protect themselves by shunting kills towards scummy people, and/or ensuring that scummy people were collateral damage - The arsonist's job would be to prime, at most, two people before detonating. This way, it wouldn't be a matter of "be invisible and give the game no idea that there's a harmful third-party". So, with those in mind, here's how the roles came about: Mafia - Godfather and ninja were absolute musts - The godfather could be a visiting role that looked town and harmless - The ninja needed to look like a town passive role, while disguising its harmful component - I felt the mafia needed some way to counter the sheer amount of mayhem the town had - originally, this meant a pure safeguard, but I felt it wasn't quite what I was looking for - The final role had to be something that needed to keep up with the thread, without having to post anything in it; this was a holdover from Choral Mafia V, where I asked Rein to give me a role PM with only a name, and then see just how far I could get without knowing my own role and alignment (hint: most of the game) Town - With a ninja, at least one of the watcher/tracker HAD to be town - Likewise, a cop was necessary - The roles I'm most accustomed to seeing, in terms of redirection, are hijacker, driver, and martyr - With no doctor, a hooker would be the town's only chance of blocking a kill outright - I liked the idea of co-drivers back in TotA Mafia, so they got to come back. I don't mind masons, as long as they're not explicitly told who their partner is (as in, leave it related to role, instead of saying who's holding the role). - Due to the puppet mechanics, the town needed some sort of backup in case the cop died on N1 (or something stupid like that); however, outright telling someone they're a Deputy gives the person with that role information about the game setup (and I think miller did that just fine) - I make my oracles millers to give them a reason not to claim that part of their role PM; BBM mentioned that I like oracles, and it's because I feel the ability itself is powerful enough to warrant its cost - The linker/nexus was based around the idea of having the same role affect more than one person (blame Fear the Pika for the linker idea) - My stungun went through several iterations, and I settled on its present state because its investigative component is fairly weak (though in retrospect I think I should've made it a binary "someone visited or didn't visit"), and its delayed hook had the ability to winnow out who was and wasn't mafia based on foreknowledge of who wasn't supposed to act - I felt it would be more interesting if the puppet had some sort of investigation, WITHOUT being part of the watcher/tracker duo Arsonist - Instead of having invisible primes, I stuck them on messages instead - I wanted the arsonist to detonate at least once before things got too tense for the town, so I gave it a public doublevote after three primes, so it would draw attention to itself if it diddled around for too long - Being investigated N1 and subsequently killed sucks for a harmful third party, so I gave it inspection immunity until N2; this worked well, because the mafia decided to inspect kirsche on N1 - The vengeful part was added so that the arsonist could hold people hostage with its role ("guess what jerks, you lynch me and I kill these two people") The puppet and puppetmaster (since that's what a bunch of you complained about) Unlike a traditional hidden player, the puppetmaster could be targeted, by targeting its puppet. This is the full list of things that would've affected them, and how (this time, with player names): - Had Manix targeted scorri while scorri was in nexus mode AND Kaoz was doing anything to him, he would've seen a message that someone was trying to control him - BBM using a safeguard shot on Manix would render Kaoz immune to the same actions, too (hence why Manix was aligned with the mafia) - Grassbridger hooking Manix on the same night that Kaoz took the kill would stop the mafia kill (so would BBM, but I'd assume he's smart enough not to hook one of his own informational roles!) - If Manix was redirected by Elieson/BBM/SB/Refa on the same night Kaoz took the kill, the kill would be redirected - If Prims died while targeted Manix, Kaoz's role PM would be revealed, as well - If Vennobennu/Polydeuces investigated Manix, they would get a mafia result - If Vhaltz decided to rolecop Manix for whatever reason, his result would be "puppet/puppetmaster" - Shin's shot would kill both of them, and he wouldn't use a charge - Objection! would see Manix visit two people if Kaoz killed someone that Manix wasn't using his voyeur on - Eurykins would see Manix AND Kaoz in the same slot visiting a target, and could bus Kaoz if she so wished - Shinori would stun Manix if Kaoz killed the wrong person (as well as disable all of Kaoz's abilities for a night, including his ability to carry out the factional kill); however, his stunner investigation would only return one person (as opposed to two) Notice the lack of arsonist? THIS was the only thing Manix and Kaoz were truly immune to (and that's why I feel that kirsche has all the right in the world to complain) This is the full extent of the puppetmaster, as well as my logic: - The silence was in there because I didn't want a puppet that would stupidly tunnel its teammates - The messages were there to draw attention to the puppet, and for the puppetmaster to mess with the puppet's perceptions - The silent kill was in there partially as a deterrent to chain silencing, and partially to make sure that the mafia had a way of getting rid of the puppet should the puppet become too much of a problem - If Manix had been chain silenced, Kaoz would've come in under extremely dodgy circumstances (he'd be in Manix's place and tell the rest of you that he would take over the former's duties. . .which is stupidly dodgy no matter how you try to spin it) - The redirection was in there partially to draw the puppet's eyes elsewhere, and partially so that the role could draw attention to itself ("hey, I was redirected, too!") This wasn't a true redirect so much as an overwrite - if Manix ran into any redirectional roles after being redirected by Kaoz, the other in-game roles would swap him accordingly - Thus, the puppetmaster could either choose to sit back and do nothing to the puppet (which is what Kaoz decided), or they could actively mess with the puppet, and hope that the puppet's complaining would cement it as a town role Other quirks - Killing one co-driver results in the other co-driver becoming a full driver (which the mafia learned the hard way) - The odd-night and even-night compulsory roles were meant to clear each other (Grassbridger pointed out that a nerfed hooker was bad for the mafia, and I wholly agree with him) - The nexus could allow the mafia safeguard to target himself without breaking the "don't target mafia members and especially yourself" restriction - What happens if a hooker hooks a martyr's target? SOMEONE put me up to that, which resulted in a mess. Honorable mention to N5, which was confusing as all hell. - Had the deputy died before the cop, the cop would transform into a full cop (and get both Kaoz and Manix's true roles if he investigated Manix) - The reason why everything that targeted Manix would target Kaoz is twofold - first, to give the town a chance to find Kaoz, and second, because the only person that can tell the Nurse Joys apart is Brock, and he isn't in this game! - The puppet's given flavor was that her Chansey was doing all the work, and Chansey can't tell the difference between a hologram, an old dude, some bratty teens, a reindeer, and a couple of fabulous men (though how Nurse Joy understood the Chansey is beyond me) - The mafia was made up of pink-haired healers/nurses; the miller also had pink hair. . .and this is why Vanille had to be confirmed as town Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted December 15, 2013 Author Share Posted December 15, 2013 (edited) Dear mafia, The girl is always the healer. Pink is a girly color. You're tired of hearing this nonsense, and you're more than willing to take out your frustration on this hapless conference. The four of you have agreed that the world of medical professionals needs things like pink-haired male doctors with chiseled abs! You know that there's no mayor, watcher, or JoaT in this game (if you're clever enough, you should be able to pass off the roles I gave you AS town roles). Not that you want to claim unless you can help it! Your team consists of: Sakura Haruno (godfather watcher/one-shot janitor) Cheria (ninja mayor rolecop) Serra (pseudo-JoaT) Nurse Joy (puppetmaster and puppet) For the sake of numbers, Nurse Joy counts as one mafia member. As Kaoz is the semi-hidden puppetmaster, if you choose to target him, all effects will target his puppet instead! Under most circumstances, if his puppet dies, Kaoz will leave, so be careful! Feel free to discuss your nefarious plans here. Save any and all complaints about setup for postgame. === Dear Eurykins, You are Sakura Haruno. You started out as the most useless character in Naruto after Konohamaru, and wound up being somewhat more useful once Shippuden rolled around. Still, you're the girl, so you're the medical nin, and that has got to change! Since no one would believe that Yet Another Naruto Female Character was mafia (again), you will look like a member of the town upon inspection. During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Keep an eye on PLAYER. You'll stand watch over PLAYER, and learn everyone who visits him/her. Once during the game, you may reply to your role PM with Night X - Begone, PLAYER. You will hide PLAYER's corpse for the rest of the game. If you do this, you cannot use your other active ability! You are allied with the mafia. You win when all threats to the mafia are eliminated. Was lynched D1 due to having shaky opinions, and basically tunneled Shinori, one of the three people she couldn't afford to do so (his role functioned similar to hers, along with Objection! and Bizz). While this was the correct lynch, I think turbolynching is extremely stupid, and am seriously thinking of designing a game that punishes it heavily. Mafia, you needed to sit her down and literally tell her what to post - if so, she would've escaped detection for a VERY long time! --- Dear Paperblade Vhaltz, You are Cheria. You felt like you were the most even-headed, normal person out of Tales of Graces, and you're probably right. Why Namco made the sick girl the healer is beyond you. Due to the fact that you're so NORMAL, no one will notice you as you go about your business during the night. This means that you can't take the mafia kill consecutively, unless you're the only living mafia player. Since you're so sensible, your vote counts twice. This shuts off in MYLO/LYLO, as determined by me. During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - What's PLAYER? You'll learn PLAYER's role. You are allied with the mafia. You win when all threats to the mafia are eliminated. I needed a believable passive role to cover for the ninja, and mayor was the least scummy thing that came to mind. The doublevote was public as a warning to kirsche - his role gave him a doublevote if he diddled around too long. Was killed N2 by the vig being redirected in the chaos. Otherwise, didn't ping too many radars, except for Elieson. --- Dear BBM, You are Serra. It's not YOUR fault that everyone is inferior to you! Without your amazing staff abilities, they'd all be addicted to vulneraries! You have the following roles available to you: - Safeguard (may only target a mafia member once during the game, including yourself) - Redirect - Hook - Auto-target kill (you aim for someone, and nothing will stop you from hitting your target; may only be used once during the game) You have four shots. During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Use ABILITY on PLAYER. You will use ABILITY on PLAYER, and consume a shot in the process. Every time a mafia member that's not you is removed from the game, you will regain a shot. You are allied with the mafia. You win when all threats to the mafia are eliminated. Probably should've put a hard limit on all of those besides the auto-hit, but bleh - if he didn't exist, the mafia was completely at the mercy of the town's myriad ways of messing with the kill. He was able to pass himself off as the safeguard, but had the unfortunate luck to target the same person as Shinori, which helped lead to his lynch. --- Dear Kaoz, You are Nurse Joy. Your second cousin mills about in the crowd, unaware of her true role. You are the one in charge of her actions. You know that Bizz is Nurse Joy, and the role PM they have is as follows: Dear Bizz, You are Nurse Joy. You'd rather heal Pokemon than people, but you felt you could learn something at this conference. After all, who said that people are the only ones that should get medical treatment? During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Target PLAYER. You'll learn all the roles that targeted PLAYER that night. You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. During the night, you may do the following: - If you reply to your role PM with Night X - You should really visit PLAYER instead!, your puppet will use her action on PLAYER instead of her original target. The one responsible for the redirect (you) will not show up on any investigative reports. - If you reply to your role PM with Night X - Oh cousin, you talk too much!, you will silence your puppet for the day phase. If you use this on two consecutive nights, she'll die of fright, and YOU will have to take her place during the day! If you enter the game in this manner, you will lose your semi-hidden status. Your role will change to your puppet's role, as well (but you will still win with the mafia). - If you reply to your role PM with Night X - I have a message for you!, followed by a message that is 300 characters or less, your puppet will receive it the next morning, with the flavor that she heard it in a dream. Note that this message CANNOT tell her that she's a mafia puppet, nor can it reveal who you are - either of those will cause her to drop dead from shock! If you are uncertain of whether or not something will be allowed, run it by me first. If I feel that your message breaks the spirit of this role, I won't allow it. You may use as many of these abilities as you wish per night. As she is your puppet, you will get her night results as part of your own night result update. You may take the night kill. However, you may be indirectly targeted while doing so, and your puppet may be, as well, which is not something you desire! As you are semi-hidden, the following rules apply to you: - You may not post in the thread, no matter what - You may not cast a vote - You may not be lynched - Any action that targets you at night automatically fails, BUT certain things that target your puppet will target you as well You are allied with the mafia. You win when all threats to the mafia are eliminated. The amount of QQing about this role was phenomenal, and the one I'm most likely to believe is Kaoz's. His fate was completely tied to his puppet's, and if anyone had accidentally targeted Bizz/Manix in the crossfire, he'd be in for a rough time. I gave this role arsonist immunity because I felt that the arsonist kill was the fate of someone who looked like town (which is what Bizz/Manix needed to look like). In hindsight, it should've been a one-time immunity that gave kirsche full info on this role if he targeted it. Kaoz himself did a really good job talking to the various mafia members behind the scenes, coordinating night actions, and figuring out how to dodge the minefield that was the town's night actions. He messaged Manix on N3 solely because the latter had pushed Grassbridger in a less-than-ideal way. Manix wound up being lynched because the town couldn't think of anything better to do (and partially because BBM didn't shoot Poly). === Dear kirsche, You are the GEICO gecko. You're happily sitting on their claims, which in turn means that the doctors don't feel like doing their jobs. What do you mean you don't do medical? You do accident insurance, and the host is the only one who knows what the HEMIC toad is! Now stuff it before the host decides to modkill you before the game begins! Ahem. . . At night, you may do ONE of the following: - If you reply to your role PM with Night X - Here's your claim, PLAYER, followed by a message that is 300 characters or less, you'll submit the paperwork for PLAYER's claim, along with your custom message. For every three claims you have in play, you gain an extra vote. This shows up in votals! Your custom message will be shown to your target. - If you reply to your role PM with Night X - DENIED!, you'll gleefully inform all the people with claims that you're not going to cover them. This will seriously depress them and cause them to leave, essentially killing them. - If you reply to your role PM with Night x - Accepted!, you'll inform everyone with claims that you'll cover them. The medical professionals will be so happy that they'll do their damn jobs for the night, and all kills targeting you will fail. Note that accepting/denying a claim removes the claim from the target, and that you can't accept/deny claims unless there is at least one in play. If you are lynched while you have two claims or fewer in play, those people with pending claims will be lynched right along with you. Lastly, any attempts to pry into your role PM fails until N3 - you're a gecko, for crying out loud! You know that Faust is not here, and there's no courier around. Hmmm. . . You are allied with yourself. You win if you convince these losers that you're their boss (in other words, you need to be the last one standing) There are aspects of this role that I thought were REALLY well-done, and others. . .that I will change. Out of everything, I feel this one was the most underpowered for its alignment, and I apologize. kirsche was busy, and when he did post, wasn't particularly memorable. Prims decided to deathtunnel him, which resulted in the best outcome the mafia could've dreamed of (one dead failed oracle and one less town redirecting role to worry about). If another harmful courier with the option to blow up the message recipient pops up, you might want to make your message read something like, "Keep this message a secret until D4 and something good will happen; hint at it and you get nothing". === Dear Grassbridger, You are Taric. You are absolutely fabulous, and the inspiration behind this theme. Perhaps one of these attendees will be a gem enthusiast! During the night, you MUST respond to your role PM with Night X - Dazzle PLAYER. You will use Dazzle on PLAYER, and they will be so stunned by your shiny shield that they will fail to do their night action. This only happens on odd-number nights, but MUST happen (failure to submit an action will result in a modkill). You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. If you're going to whine about roles being unbalanced, rolespec, etc., then ROLESPEC should've cleared him immediately. Hookers are good at doing things like stopping kills, and without a doctor, this was the town's main source of protection. Grassbridger's lynch was awful (scorri's role left enough doubt in his target such that I would wait for a cop to clear him). I do NOT want to see that much AtE against someone in any game here again. If you need to use emotion to get your lynch across, your case isn't sound - go find a better justification for it. Given the amount of flak he got, I'd say him losing his temper wasn't unexpected. . .but if the other person isn't listening, then I suggest you take a break and do other stuff. Otherwise, it becomes a painful cycle that'll only make you more upset! --- Dear Elieson, You are Chopper. You have several different forms, but felt that your small, adorable one would work best. You're here to discuss medical techniques, not wreck things! During the night, you MUST respond to your role PM with Night X - Shouldn't PLAYER1 talk to PLAYER2 instead? You will convince PLAYER1 to target PLAYER2 instead of who they'd originally target. This only happens on even-number nights, but MUST happen (failure to submit an action will result in a modkill). You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Did his best to clear Grassbridger based on his own role (which was a pretty good assumption), rightfully assumed that rolespeccing was stupid (keep this up), and posted when he could. The only thing I regret is not making BBM's role match his (the mafia redirect could redirect people to themselves). --- Dear Vennobennu, You are Mark Sloan. When you're not seeing patients, you're solving murders with your son. When you heard that there was trouble at the conference, your detective side woke up. During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Target PLAYER. You'll learn PLAYER's alignment. You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Had Poly died before Vennobennu, this role would've become full cop, and would've gotten Manix's role as Puppet/Puppetmaster and Mafia. I don't think I would've done that N2 inspection (Elieson wasn't that much of a suspect IMO - I think this should've been one of the D1 wagons). While not a bad in-thread showing for a first-time player here (in terms of logic and not getting himself lynched), he crumbed his role WAY too hard when he had no reason to. The mafia quickly figured out that he was the cop, and acted accordingly. --- Dear Kay, You are Zero. You're a surgeon by day and a dancer by night. The host seems to think that your nail polish is. . .unprofessional. During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Dance in front of PLAYER. Your, erm, wild appearance will attract the attention of everyone that would target PLAYER, and they'll target you instead! You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Dear me, hookers and martyrs. . .if a martyr draws a hook, does it negate the martyr's role, or does it make the hook useless? This was a hell of an action chain, and I think I should've resolved it as "the martyr draws the hook and stops protecting the target player". Instead, I resolved it as "the hook can't be drawn by the martyr, so sucks to be you". Kay didn't post much, then made the most amazing N1 mafia save by drawing the mafia kill off of Prims + BBM. I think it would be in bad taste to name her as mafia MVP, though. --- Dear Objection!, You are Kloe. You're a soft-spoken, sword-wielding schoolgirl with a bird named Sieg. The bird's more interesting than you (but don't tell Vincent I said this). During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Sieg, follow PLAYER. Sieg will tail PLAYER, and will tell you all the people PLAYER visited. You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Back in rolespecland, you guys thought that the mafia having a tracker and watcher was perfectly reasonable. On D2. Objection!, ask questions about your role next time! I didn't think #184 was AtE, and his posts were otherwise pretty far apart. I guess being lynched is better than subbing out, but this was one of the roles meant to catch Kaoz (it was the third-most dangerous role after the cops and vig)! --- Dear Shinori, You are The Doctor. You are a hologram aboard Voyager, and you were activated when the flesh-and-blood doctor ate it. You attend to the medical duties as best as you can. . .well, as best as a computer program can! During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Activate near PLAYER. Your role varies depending on what happens to PLAYER: - If PLAYER survives the night, you will learn the number of people (not including yourself) that visited PLAYER - If PLAYER is killed, you will attempt to stop the killer. However, you can't tell the difference between friend and foe, and your phaser is permanently set to stun. Thus, all people who visited PLAYER will be forced to idle the next night, and you will learn how many people you stunned. As your phaser has a few glitches, you'll be forced to idle, too (but naturally, you won't count yourself as "people stunned"). You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Shinori appeared on D1. He reappeared on D5. During that time, he overthought a few things (things such as BBM not voting you is null, at best), but made a damn good point in #1447, which I think everyone needs to address in future lynches, and #1448, which should've solidifed his position as town. --- Dear Shin, You are Tear Grants. You've overworked yourself, and your voice isn't what it used to be. You should be able to make yourself heard over the din of the crowd today, but you know you won't be so lucky starting tomorrow. Perhaps you'd have better luck talking during a time when no one else is supposed to talk. This is the only day phase where your posts will NOT be limited in quantity. Make the most of it. If you survive this day, you will receive the rest of your role PM. It is highly advisable that you're here shortly after phase end, as part of your role is Insomniac. You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Once N1 hit: During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Sing for PLAYER. The resulting fonic hymn will kill PLAYER. However. . .this power comes with a price. You may post, at most, three times during the day phase. The number of day posts is also the number of times you may use your night ability. If you kill a town-aligned player with a fonic hymn, you will lose a day post. If you kill a player that is NOT aligned with the town, you will NOT lose a day post. To compensate for this, you may post as many times as you wish during the night phase. However, you can't vote during the night phase, so if you use all your shots incorrectly, you will be unable to vote. Choose carefully! This role was made so the player had to THINK about whether this person was being shot because they were scum or because someone said to shoot them (hint: the latter is bad play). Shin was extremely wary about who to shoot - so much, that I completely forgot that he existed at times. He did his best to make use of the Insomnia part, though. Called out BBM as the final scum, but was subsequently redirected to Refa. Someone in the mafia reminded me that he was the last to claim his full role, which made it a lot harder for them to figure out why Vhaltz was killed. I agree! --- Dear Prims, You are Fontaine. You're not seen that much, but that's because the students in your school aren't the type to hang out in the nurse's office. You are also a part of Atticus' fan club, and that's ever-so-slightly disturbing. During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - What's this, PLAYER? You will pull up PLAYER's medical records, and if you die during the night/next day phase, you will reveal PLAYER's role PM for all to see. As your signature card is a monster that changes healing effects to harmful ones, anyone that pries into your role PM will come to the conclusion that you're mafia. Perhaps you can use this to your advantage. . . You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Decided to claim the miller part of his role immediately, and be as LOUD as possible. This made the mafia think that he wanted to die. Admitted to being lazy D4, which is why I didn't feel too bad when kirsche went boom. Overall, decent logic, bad delivery. --- Dear Refa, You are Hope. You are one of the starting healers in FF13, and the host thinks that you're annoying. Sadly, you don't improve much in 13-2. During the night, you MUST respond to your role PM with Night X - Targeting PLAYER. Anything that targets PLAYER will target whoever Vanille targeted instead, and vice versa. Oh, Vanille? She's your co-driver, and you know she's allied with the town, just like you! Failure to submit an action will have unpredictable results! You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Gee, was it that hard to read TWO snips in SB's role PM? Once one of the co-drivers died, the other became a full driver who could self-target. Refa did a lot more talking than voting, and was eventually killed in the crossfire. I see my own posting habits in there, so I'll do my best to work on that. --- Dear SB, You are Vanille. You randomly forgot how to fight with your staff in the middle of FF13. You also seem to like the color pink a lot. During the night, you MUST respond to your role PM with Night X - Swap PLAYER. Anything that targets PLAYER will target whoever Hope targeted instead, and vice versa. Oh, right! Hope is your co-driver, and you know he's allied with the town! Failure to submit an action will have unpredictable results! You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. Crumbed his co-driver's name early, which Refa caught and crumbed right back. These two, along with Prims, are the only early crumbs I approve of. Looked like he'd never be mislynched, so the mafia shot him. --- Dear Polydeuces, You are Ryosuke Takahashi. You're all set to go to medical school. . .wait, what do you mean this conference is for medical professionals?! You silently wonder if you should "doctor" everyone's cars. As you're not even a medical student, you have no ability (yet). You're keeping an eye on someone, though, and if you're patient, you may get the chance to do something. Good things come to those who wait! You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. The role name Deputy gives information about the game's setup, albeit indirectly. I didn't want this role to confirm the existence of another role immediately; thus, the vague wording. Poly's early posts were questionable (don't crumb your role unless you're gonna be lynched). However, he made up for this with some pretty good logic throughout the game. It looks like it takes time to hit your stride; see if you can cut this down to D2 instead of D5! This is probably the best case of "listen to other people instead of tunneling your wagon" - he figured out that Grass was town early on D3, but dropped it after that Manix/Grass kerfuffle. It worked in his favor, because BBM thought he could drive Poly's mislynch (Kaoz thought this was a bad idea, and I agree). Since I like the direction he's going in, he gets town MVP. --- Dear scorri, You are Litchi. You do your best to service the Kaka clan, while trying to keep Bang and Taokaka off of your chest (literally). You also try to keep Arakune out of everyone's hair. Your role changes depending on what night it is: - During odd-numbered nights, you may reply to your role PM with Night X - PLAYER1 and PLAYER2 go well together! Anything that targets PLAYER1 will ALSO target PLAYER2, and vice versa. - During even-numbered nights, you may reply to your role PM with Night X - Standing on my staff. You will reflect everything that targets you back to the source. You WILL be affected by whatever targeted you, however. Unfortunately, you won't reflect kills, 'cause you can't reflect stuff if you're a corpse! You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. The official name for this role is Linker/Nexus. scorri sort-of existed here and there, but that was mostly due to RL shenanigans. Was killed because Kaoz realized just how powerful this role was. I think the best advice I can give you is to try to exist a bit more, despite your crazy schedule (or maybe hydra with Rein or something). --- Dear Bizz Manix, You are Nurse Joy. You'd rather heal Pokemon than people, but you felt you could learn something at this conference. After all, who said that people are the only ones that should get medical treatment? During the night, you may respond to your role PM with Night X - Target PLAYER. You'll learn all the roles that targeted PLAYER that night. You are allied with the town. You win when all threats to the town are eliminated. This is one of two people that have a right to be upset over Kaoz's role - this role's alignment is actually mafia, and would've returned that on inspection. Kaoz chose Bizz as a puppet because they're really good about not being lynched. Bizz was pretty good for the time that they were there, and was also really cool about flipping mafia despite what their role PM said. I'm bothered by the reasons they had to sub out - it sounds like things have strayed too far from a middle ground. I have no intentions of trying to force Bizz to be something that they're not, but I can control how I present myself! Manix. . .yours is longer. I got complaints about the way you were conducting yourself, and after the Grass lynch, Kaoz messaged you to make sure that you weren't next. You were silenced because Kaoz intended to take over your slot - it took a full two nights to kill you in such a way that he would be able to take your spot safely. The fact that you saw the cop scan was completely coincidental. I'm not sure if you're in any shape for the rest of what I have to say, but if you are, I'll do so by PM. Town MVP: Polydeuces Mafia MVP: I'm proud of all of you Worst night: N1, because of that action resolution Funniest action: Kay saving Prims and BBM Luckiest move: kirsche being lynched D4, and taking the oracle with him (mafia)/Shin shooting Vhaltz by mistake (town) Unluckiest move: Manix being lynched despite his silence (mafia)/Grassbridger running into scorri on N1 (town) Best quote: Poly's mention of a mafia miller on D6 (there's an even better personal story behind it; PM me for details) Best move: Shin keeping quiet about his role for most of the game Edited December 15, 2013 by eclipse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted December 15, 2013 Author Share Posted December 15, 2013 (edited) This is the final part, and it deals with general behavior. This is last, because I want this to be read by everyone. These points are NOT up for debate. I'm not typing this out for fun. BEHAVIOR THAT I DO NOT WANT TO SEE AGAIN: - Death tunneling. Once you make your case, you can either move on, or keep it - either way, posting a bunch of spam like "Lynch X, he's scum" has no place in a game, unless you're the cop. I feel like I'm dealing with a preschooler who's having a temper tantrum. For those of you that haven't had direct experience with this. . .it's not fun. - Stupid amounts of spam. If you're going to post, advance the game. It helps to put your initial short post in a text editor, go away for a minute, and then see if you want to add anything to it. - Turbolynches. Figure it out beforehand. I'm seriously tempted to shorten day phases to 48 hours, just to keep things moving. - Complaining before the game setup is revealed. Try looking at it from the other side, not just your own. This attitude can also be applied to things like making a case against someone. - Follow the leader. Each individual person is just that - a person with a lone vote. Each person is capable of making their own decision. Don't worry about being lynched for stating your mind - that's part of the game, and if your logic is sound, the host will probably rail the other members of the town for it. BEHAVIOR THAT I EXPECT FROM EVERYONE: - Be respectful. This applies to other players, as well as your host. I will not be posting the graveyard publicly because I feel the behavior in there is not something I want to advertise to the rest of the world. - Don't take things personally. Lynches can get heated, but this is a game. I'm not going to empty your bank account if you're mislynched. You aren't going to have your computer repossessed if you lose. Your self-worth shouldn't be tied to your performance in mafia - you're all better people than that! - LISTEN TO OTHERS! Everyone has their own information they start with in the game. It is this information that colors a person's posts. - Be kind to the rest of the game! Back when I first started playing, the impression I got was, "play hard, then laugh about postgame over a metaphorical beer." I feel things have gotten more vicious, and it's not a direction I support. THINGS THAT I LIKED: - Vennobennu not getting himself lynched immediately, because he's new. It makes things less intimidating for newer players. - Polydeuces not getting himself lynched, period. I think it's a huge improvement, but that doesn't mean you can rest where you are. Keep it up! - The mafia not giving up despite losing half their force by D3. BBM had it the worst - he was literally the only one that was mafia and knew it. - kirsche: You know why, and thank you. - Questions and comments about scorri and Shinori's respective roles. Those two were highly experimental, and I'm glad that they worked out. - To those of you that behaved yourselves after death: THANK YOU. It makes the host's job easier! - Special thanks to SB for the time and date thing! I was originally gonna lock the thread for a few more days, but I think things have cooled down enough. Please make sure to read this post a few times before answering. If in doubt, PM me. If I feel this thread gets out of hand, I will lock it again, and it will stay locked. EDIT: I asked someone with a cooler head what the problem was. . .and I think I get it. Trying to explain why I don't see it as an issue would take forever (and would probably draw a lot of argument), so unless you want to hear my ramblings via PM, you'll just have to trust me when I say I don't see things like that. However, if that's why you're upset, I apologize. It wasn't my intention to get on anyone's nerves (except for whoever got Hope, but that's a flavor issue), Edited December 15, 2013 by eclipse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorri Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Kay didn't post much, then made the most amazing N1 mafia save by drawing the mafia kill off of Prims + BBM. Dammit, I was actually hoping to get Prims killed and like... I had vague suspicions of BBM which is why I picked him but then I didn't exist and forgot about them... My question that wasn't addressed in postgame: I know that my link didn't report a redirect, but it seems like my nexus did. As in, people who targeted my nexus knew they were redirected to themselves as well, but people who targeted my link target didn't get that. If that's true, why did you choose to do it that way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinori Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Scum could have just lynched me day 1. Don't understand why they didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorri Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 They meant to apparently. Valtz was supposed to stick around to switch off of Eury. But then he posted in thread that he was going to bed and... yeah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted December 15, 2013 Author Share Posted December 15, 2013 If I'm reading my notes correctly, it was because trying to resolve a link and a bus would result in a massive headache (does the bus fail? hit three people? I hit myself over the head for not taking this into account?). While I like the concept of this role, I really need to rethink how to make it work. tl;dr - Good concept, faulty implementation, lazy host Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorri Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Yeah, that would be my one complaint with my role. Because that was a reason that Grass got lynched. People who had been affected by part of my role got informed about that but he didn't so he must be lying, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRDRHAWK Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 From perennial early-game mislynch to Town MVP whoop whoop My ED1 role crumb was totally accidental and I'm shocked SB picked up on it before I did (I saw what I'd done after the fact and swore about it). Funny thing is, aside from the middle part of D1, I didn't play all that differently from how I usually do. It's just that other people sucked way worse than I did. I'll throw up some other shit I wanted to comment on in the morning. having my final on a Monday sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grace Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 (edited) honestly i don't even care anymore, you can send through the stuff via pm if you feel like it going to reiterate though that this was not fun at all. a townie who is basically a mod note miller with nothing in the rules saying so is really bad game design, and being dishonest to one player makes everyone else question if they are being lied to as well. there's a difference about being paranoid about role distribution/people not dying, etc, and being paranoid because the host lied to one player and people not knowing that they could have been too. edit: imagine what could have happened if my playerslot was lynched D1/2 or whatever. people would immediately question whether what they had in their role PM's was true. and if I had asked you that question in PM, you wouldn't have answered. if you had someone else ask you, you'd probably have to say the same and that could make a lot of people feel like they were playing in an unannounced bastard game because of that. edit 2: (i have too much to say) clearly i was in a bad spot emotionally during this game, and the outcome didn't help it at all because it flows against what one can reasonably expect in a closed setup. fwiw i'm just considering myself town because if you had literally said that I was town, instead of mafia, i wouldn't have cared as much. i would have been in a bit of shock but i wouldn't have gotten unbearably mad. well, aside from the whole "mod note miller", i'd be pretty mad at that too. (then the point about "town shouldn't be rewarded after mislynching a townie that isn't vengeful or similar" kick in, but that's a much lesser point) Edited December 15, 2013 by Isaac Dian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Poly played well at the end, but tbh there was nobody else that was available to push a lynch on other than him. I don't regret my choice of leaving him alive. I came out hard-defending Shinori because his role + interactions were the best. Somehow people were ignoring that on D5, but I couldn't just 180 on Shinori that quickly. I kind of had to 180 on Poly too but at least that wasn't as fast as it would have been with Shinori. Scorri's role was too dangerous to leave alive and Shin was clear. The dumb thing with the Co-Drivers was, if we didn't kill either, they were basically Masons because they could back each other up on being confirmed town to each other. The only reason Refa was even a slightly viable lynch was because we killed SB before they fullclaimed, and the part about them being confirmed town to each other got snipped. Also I have no idea how people think this game was mafsided. I can see complaints about Kaoz's role being unfun or lame, but it definitely wasn't strong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 (edited) Also there was literally no reason to Manix actually being a mafia Puppet instead of a town Puppet. He didn't know he was mafia and we didn't know he was mafia and there was no mechanism in the game to let either of us know he was actually mafia-aligned. So he would be silenced and killed at the end basically 100% of the time for the extra kill. And Kirsche should win Mafia MVP IMO; he was the only reason the game got to LYLO. Also Venno had really good Cop targets that took away two people who could easily have been mislynched. Probably not Shin in the end since Vig, but Elie getting cleared sucked. Edited December 15, 2013 by BigBadMarshmallow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted December 15, 2013 Author Share Posted December 15, 2013 BBM - Go back to the VERY first post in the Mafia QT. Read what it says. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grace Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 i was going to edit this into my other post, but here have a new post re D3: people didn't take a step back at looked at what was claimed in the thread. for all scorri had claimed at the time, i figured that grass was probably lying about his action because he didn't claim to have also targeted prims, when bbm/shinori basically got confirms on that instead. like. i couldn't help that the mechanics of the role were screwy, and based around what townreads I had at the time (both shinori/bbm), I could fairly easily make the assumption. remember that I admitted that my result wouldn't get grass lynched sometime during D3, but based on what I just wrote was the logic behind it. no one seemed to acknowledge that in thread at all, which was why I was getting pissy at people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grace Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 So he would be silenced and killed at the end basically 100% of the time for the extra kill.this would have happened anyway, regardless. there's no point to what alignment I was, because if I was mafia i'd just be killed and they'd lose that extra number anyway??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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