Why don't people use Nino?

[Vorena]

This can easily be split into two very easily summarized categories.

1) If you want to play fast. Nino is terrible.

2) If you do not care. Nino is great.

[DragonLord]

I still like her enough to use her for the fun of it.

[chococoke]

I'm just curious if anyone who favors Nino has ever tried raising her on HHM? It seems like it would be almost impossible to feed her kills without subjecting her to a swift and painful end, from her joining chapter through endgame.

[Florete]

I'm just curious if anyone who favors Nino has ever tried raising her on HHM? It seems like it would be almost impossible to feed her kills without subjecting her to a swift and painful end, from her joining chapter through endgame.

FE7 enemies, lol. It's really not that hard.

[chococoke]

FE7 enemies, lol. It's really not that hard.

I guess that's a valid enough point

[Shadow Mir]

I'm just curious if anyone who favors Nino has ever tried raising her on HHM? It seems like it would be almost impossible to feed her kills without subjecting her to a swift and painful end, from her joining chapter through endgame.

FE7 enemies, lol. It's really not that hard.

The number one problem I have with this is HHM CoD. Nino probably wouldn't do jack to most enemies there. Also, the weak enemies point is as damaging to her case, if not even more so, than the good it does for her.

[chococoke]

Not to mention the chapter before that has a terrible layout for foot units and long range magic/staves. Though I guess she can be fed generals in Ch. 31? It would require an insane amount of favoritism but I suppose it is possible. Chapter 32 is looking a bit sketchier... but hey, what do I know?

[Florete]

The number one problem I have with this is HHM CoD. Nino probably wouldn't do jack to most enemies there. Also, the weak enemies point is as damaging to her case, if not even more so, than the good it does for her.

I was only talking about how feeding kills to her is, not how good or bad she is...

If trained in NoF enough, she doesn't have too much of an issue in CoD, particularly since she should also have decent resistance.

[chococoke]

She also won't be harming any enemies in CoD, either

[Florete]

Killing is something I've found her to have trouble with in HHM CoD.

[chococoke]

So "doesn't have too much of an issue" = not killing any enemies on a map with 60+?

[Shadow Mir]

I was only talking about how feeding kills to her is, not how good or bad she is...

If trained in NoF enough, she doesn't have too much of an issue in CoD, particularly since she should also have decent resistance.

Still, that would be a struggle since feeding kills implies that enemies are good enough to survive someone else and be fed to her. I don't really see that being the case for most enemy types.

As to CoD, I'd see her taking more damage than she deals to anything that's promoted, aside from maybe the bishops.

Edited November 7, 2014 by Levant Caprice

[momogeek2141]

Still, that would be a struggle since feeding kills implies that enemies are good enough to survive someone else and be fed to her. I don't really see that being the case for most enemy types.

Are you referring to CoD or NoF? Because in NoF using iron or slim weapons could possibly weaken enemies without killing them. I'm pretty sure Fox is referring to NoF, because I agree with your point on CoD.

[Paper Jam]

As to CoD, I'd see her taking more damage than she deals to anything that's promoted, aside from maybe the bishops.

Her Speed and Luck growths are good enough that she has a pretty good chance of not getting hit at all, especially if she makes good use of the trees.

[Shadow Mir]

Are you referring to CoD or NoF? Because in NoF using iron or slim weapons could possibly weaken enemies without killing them. I'm pretty sure Fox is referring to NoF, because I agree with your point on CoD.

I'd think it's mostly regarding NoF, though it could apply to the remainder of the game, seeing as the enemy types that could feasibly survive a round with someone else are not exactly common from that point on.

Her Speed and Luck growths are good enough that she has a pretty good chance of not getting hit at all, especially if she makes good use of the trees.

Maybe, but given the layout, you can't guarantee that she'll be on a forest when an enemy attacks, given that aside from the area where you start, there really aren't that many forests without needing to cut a swath through a good deal of the enemy force.

[momogeek2141]

If you are set on training Nino in Cog, you are going to have to hold back your full out assault, and play much more carefully. If you want to train Nino on Cog, you will have to add turns (a lot on HHM). I like training Nino, but I especially enjoyed my most recent play through where the 3 FKs charged through the map and crushed everything (I was too lazy to train her) then one-shotted Lloyd with the TA. If you are willing to add a lot of turns, Nino will turn out great and cut some turns later and add to EXP rank. If not, then just go Pent.

[Shadow Mir]

If you are set on training Nino in Cog, you are going to have to hold back your full out assault, and play much more carefully. If you want to train Nino on Cog, you will have to add turns (a lot on HHM). I like training Nino, but I especially enjoyed my most recent play through where the 3 FKs charged through the map and crushed everything (I was too lazy to train her) then one-shotted Lloyd with the TA. If you are willing to add a lot of turns, Nino will turn out great and cut some turns later and add to EXP rank. If not, then just go Pent.

But in the context of HHM, there's no way in hell to get her any real training on CoD since she struggles to do damage to any promoted enemies that aren't the few melee enemies on the map. And I don't see the payoff as nearly enough to justify busting my ass to raise her, like, at all.

[momogeek2141]

But in the context of HHM, there's no way in hell to get her any real training on CoD since she struggles to do damage to any promoted enemies that aren't the few melee enemies on the map. And I don't see the payoff as nearly enough to justify busting my ass to raise her, like, at all.

What's your point? I'm just flat out telling the risks and rewards of attempting to train Nino on Cog.

[Paper Jam]

And I don't see the payoff as nearly enough to justify busting my ass to raise her, like, at all.

Beating the enemies within an inch of their lives with other characters and then finishing them off with Nino in Night of Farewells isn't as hard as you make it sound. Jaffar can do the former pretty easily with an iron sword.

[Carmine Sword]

He isn't saying it's difficult, he's saying that it's not worth the time investment.

And I agree with him. There is just no real incentive to waste time raising Nino when the other magic users are already competent and don't need to be babied. All that effort put into training Nino only gets you a slightly faster Pent with a worse staff rank.

Why not just use Pent and save yourself the time? Nino only really beats out Pent stat-wise (barely) at very high levels that are unreasonable to obtain without even more babying, and even then, she'll never have A-rank staves ever, unlike Pent.

[Baldrick]

Nobody's saying she's a good investment. But this discussion is about how difficult it is to train her and whether it's possible in HHM. Case in point:

she'll never have A-rank staves ever

There's no point in raising her staff rank when Pent has base A staves (and Serra/Priscilla/Lucius etc. exist) but it's really not that hard.

[Carmine Sword]

Don't forget Canas and Erk. They can reach A staves by the time warp is available even in LTC. It just shows that Nino doesn't even have some sort of unique utility compared to every other magic user. All she can do is deal damage, which is nice and all, but that's not a function unique to Nino. Other units can kill enemies more effectively and for a larger portion of the game than Nino.

She may be possible to train in HHM, but that doesn't make training her a worthwhile decision.

[Snowy_One]

I use Nino. Course, I realized a while back that tiers were bull and worthless, so I just use the units I like using. I like using Nino, so I use Nino.

[Florete]

The idea that other magic users are better is already on the table, people. Nobody is saying Nino is a good investment. Nobody is saying Pent isn't flat out better. Telling the risks and rewards of using Nino is not defending her ability, it's just telling what using her is like.

Not everything is a damned debate.

I use Nino. Course, I realized a while back that tiers were bull and worthless, so I just use the units I like using. I like using Nino, so I use Nino.

You just have to get your shots in whenever you can, don't you? Even when it's completely irrelevant.

[Vorena]

I am still surprised how often the idea of efficiency is brought up in this discussion. The discussion is about Nino in HHM. I would think it would be clear there is no sort of efficiency goals being met at all.

The moment you bring up trying to train Nino (other than for experience rank) efficiency is out the door.

Otherwise, I have not played HHM in ages, but are there not a few knights to KO? If not, then the wyverns to pick-out near the end of the level are easily good targets for easy training. Otherwise, you can always pick out a shaman, monk, or mage to lure onto a fort. Waste the damage. Have them heal and let Nino generic enemy abuse for experience :D

OH, and Nino is great for CoG actually since if you talk to Lloyd with (maybe linus too) with her he moves off the fort. He is already annoying to KO without having to deal with the extra evasion and defence.

Edited November 13, 2014 by Vorena