Save states, yay or nay?

[Batter the Beast]

I only used save states in FE5 in the last few chapters because the translation patch would crash the game if you hovered over the mercenaries in those chapters since their names were all screwy

[Angelic Phoenix]

pokemon simulators shouldn't be used by anyone because pokemon should be played the way it was made... with tedious hours of breeding and EV training.

toilets shouldn't be used by anyone because people should shit the way they were made to... discreetly into a hole.

Why do we have to take what I said out of context? I"m just saying you shouldn't have to use something that wasn't provided to you in the first place (the example being save states) especially in a game where it's not needed or required to beat the game.

Plus, your above points are optional to just about about anyone. You can breed and EV train your Pokemon if you want to. You can take shit in the woods if you want or need to. You can do all of that with or without an emulator and if you use an emulator you can still do it the normal way without using the convenient feature that comes with it. (I can already predict the next response will have a point using what I said in bold used against me) We are talking about a video game that anybody can beat if they put their mind to it. Hell, I could do all the LTC runs save stateless and on Lunatic that have been done if there was a set path. (And I know there is a set-in-stone LTC path for almost all of the FE games out there somewhere)

On a side note, why is it such a big deal not using save states?

[DreadFighter]

I personally only do it when frustrated or arena abusing.

[Eternal Snowfall]

I don't use savestates. Only in ROM hacks for bug reporting. I agree with those who said using 'em to abuse the RNG, especially to rig a characters' survival, is just not playing the game right. This is the reason why Intelligent Systems implemented the unique saving of every move. It's like playing chess. If you get your ass kicked, you're not allowed to revert and try from an earlier point.

It's Fire Emblem. Death and wrong moves can happen. It's supposed to be difficult.

[CT075]

Hell, I could do all the LTC runs save stateless and on Lunatic that have been done if there was a set path. (And I know there is a set-in-stone LTC path for almost all of the FE games out there somewhere)

good luck with that; FE hasn't used a deterministic RNG since fe8

i mean i *suppose* you could time pressing the start key on the menu down to a fraction of a second

Edited July 10, 2014 by CT075

[piffany]

I use save states so I can stop playing whenever I want to and pick up whenever I want to. Games that don't offer instant suspend/resume are made by bad software developers who should feel bad.

[Jotari]

I use save states so I can stop playing whenever I want to and pick up whenever I want to. Games that don't offer instant suspend/resume are made by bad software developers who should feel bad.

As we discussed earlier in the thread, every game in the series but Holy War gives the player the option to suspend.

[piffany]

I'm a bit of a religious zealot on this. If it takes more than 200 milliseconds for me to get through the UI to save, it's a failure.

With an emulator, i hit one F-key, cmd-quit the game, and i'm done. The whole beauty of emulators for this sort of thing is that it takes the choice of save UI out of the hands of the game developer, who, 40 years of game development history tells us, will inevitably screw it up.

This is actually part of the reason that iPad games are so great in this manner. On iOS, its basically a requirement of the app store that apps perform gracefully WHENEVER they go into the background, period, because the OS might kill them to recover memory. So on iPad apps, the whole idea of an explicit suspend/save state just evaporates. "Turn off the device" or "switch apps without worrying about it" is your save state, which is as it should be.

Edited July 10, 2014 by piffany

[PKL]

My main issue with savestating is that console players can't use them in most games. It's an unfair advantage and you didn't even have to pay for it unlike console players. Just no.

[piffany]

My main issue with savestating is that console players can't use them in most games. It's an unfair advantage and you didn't even have to pay for it unlike console players. Just no.

I will be happy to stipulate that professional players in the International Fire Emblem Tournament, which strictly homologates all competitive fire emblem play, should not use save states. But why does this matter for those of us who are playing the game for fun? Your argument is akin to "People with larger TVs have an unfair advantage when playing Halo, so everyone should use the same size TV as me."

Re: the not paying for it thing, that's a separate issue. I actually own all of the FE games I play, yet I prefer to play on emulation whenever possible, because it's so much more convenient (and because I enjoy the pixel art, and love seeing the GBA games, especially, on a 27" monitor instead of a tiny little screen. But not only is "fairness" something I don't worry about with respect to Fire Emblem, I don't see how anyone should be worrying about it.

Edited July 10, 2014 by piffany

[Chiki]

I'm a bit of a religious zealot on this. If it takes more than 200 milliseconds for me to get through the UI to save, it's a failure.

With an emulator, i hit one F-key, cmd-quit the game, and i'm done.

Look, I don't care if you use save states, but that's a really bad excuse. You must be able to spare a few more seconds.

[Jotari]

I'm a bit of a religious zealot on this. If it takes more than 200 milliseconds for me to get through the UI to save, it's a failure.

With an emulator, i hit one F-key, cmd-quit the game, and i'm done. The whole beauty of emulators for this sort of thing is that it takes the choice of save UI out of the hands of the game developer, who, 40 years of game development history tells us, will inevitably screw it up.

This is actually part of the reason that iPad games are so great in this manner. On iOS, its basically a requirement of the app store that apps perform gracefully WHENEVER they go into the background, period, because the OS might kill them to recover memory. So on iPad apps, the whole idea of an explicit suspend/save state just evaporates. "Turn off the device" or "switch apps without worrying about it" is your save state, which is as it should be.

Why would you even need to save if you're leaving? Do you usually go to the trouble of turning your computer off if you're interrupted playing Fire Emblem? Personally I just throw my computer into standby and leave the emulator window open until I get back.

[Quintessence]

Why would you even need to save if you're leaving? Do you usually go to the trouble of turning your computer off if you're interrupted playing Fire Emblem? Personally I just throw my computer into standby and leave the emulator window open until I get back.

Probably due to more energy consumption? More costs?

[Midnox]

On 7/3/2014 at 2:40 AM, Wafflenipples said:

While playing through a fire emblem game, do you use them or not, and if you do, do you use them often?

I've only abused of save states in Radiant Dawn (funny, because that one is legit XD). Binding Blade and Sacred Stones are the only ones I've played by emulator, but I rarely used Save States. Mostly arena abuse and Lagdou Ruins in Sacred Stones, but only by floor in the latter 

[Integrity]

dude