Do you think this game will be overly depressing?

[Book Bro]

Actually the Basilio thing bothered me more than the SpotPass characters since it was a huge part of the story you couldn't really ignore or make a headcanon around it.

But uh, this is getting off topic.

Anyway I think it'd be cool to have another Genealogy-scale plot twist. Maybe not the exact same thing but something totally unexpected and emotional like that even if it's depressing.

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

actually there was a way to make bastillo's death and return perfectly ok, you know what it would be?

just don't show his HP reaches zero, like have it cut off before the second scripted battle then we're told what happened.

as long as i haven't seen them actually die, then my suspension of disbelief can still hold.

Edited April 19, 2015 by HF Makalov Fanboy Kai

[NekoKnight]

Actually the Basilio thing bothered me more than the SpotPass characters since it was a huge part of the story you couldn't really ignore or make a headcanon around it.

But uh, this is getting off topic.

Anyway I think it'd be cool to have another Genealogy-scale plot twist. Maybe not the exact same thing but something totally unexpected and emotional like that even if it's depressing.

I haven't played Genealogy but I feel like the more modern games (compared to the pre-GBA ones) have had a strong focus on making you care about the characters, so something as ballsy as killing off several playable characters in one fell swoop would likely be unpopular. A part of me wants a Game of Thrones like setting where no one is safe but I don't think that translates well into an RPG. FE7 did a pretty good job of having a few but poignant character deaths that make players feel the weight of the story without making the experience soul-crushing. What I could see them doing is having a massacre where a lot of people are killed but only 1 of them being playable.

actually there was a way to make bastillo's death and return perfectly ok, you know what it would be?

just don't show his HP reaches zero, like have it cut off before the second scripted battle then we're told what happened.

as long as i haven't seen them actually die, then my suspension of disbelief can still hold.

Whether or not the player sees it, according to Lucina, Basilo is supposed to die in that scene so him surviving because "I knew not to die this time" isn't well justified. The only excuse we can give for Walhart not finishing him off (confirmed kill) is that he just didn't care (which would still be in character).

[euklyd]

I mean

The audience caring about characters a lot makes their death(s) even more poignant; if anything such an event would be more powerful, narratively.

It would suck, but I'd be down for that in Fire Emblem: if, if it made the story that much better.

That being said I agree that IS probably wouldn't go through with it, if they went back on Emmeryn's death, of all things.

[Jedi]

Yes, I was referring to Oliver, but you're literally the only person I've ever seen complain about his reappearence whereas Gangrel and Emm, you can't speak their names without it turning it into the spotpas revival hatred thread.obvious reference to "Don't Speak Her Name" is obvious

I think Olivers reappearance was more heinous honestly as well. Characters who are obviously dead need to Stay dead. You don't see the Genealogy cast rising back from the dead (except ONE VERY ODD CASE. which is explained in the game and is justified).

Edited April 19, 2015 by Jedi

[euklyd]

I think Olivers reappearance was more heinous honestly as well. Characters who are obviously dead need to Stay dead. You don't see the Genealogy cast rising back from the dead (except ONE VERY ODD CASE. which is explained in the game and is justified).

wasn't there cut stuff in thracia about other characters also being frozen as stone and locked away somewhere?

[BrightBow]

Sigurd, Cuan and Ethlin were the only ones who were confirmed to have died anyway. Everyone else was merely missing in action.

[Jedi]

Sigurd, Cuan and Ethlin were the only ones who were confirmed to have died anyway. Everyone else was merely missing in action.

Tiltyu dies after years of torture. Fury died (Sety confirms this in Fe5). At the very least. Its also implied all the Males died.

[BrightBow]

Tiltyu dies after years of torture. Fury died (Sety confirms this in Fe5). At the very least. Its also implied all the Males died.

I know that barely any of them women died during the battle itself but died for different reasons or went missing. Heck, Ayra is the only female PC who may have actually died in the battle itself.

I meant that barely anyone was confirmed to be death back when it looked like they all died, so there were no obstacles towards bringing them back later in the game. Especially since at the end of the chapter, everyone but the 3 I mentioned were specifically stated that their fates were unknown.

Edited April 19, 2015 by BrightBow

[Flamy]

I'd like for FEif to be overly depressing. So much so, it's narmy.

But really now, wouldn't you be sad about uh... killing your family/adoptive family? Or you just feel bad about killing Marx.

[NekoKnight]

It might be interesting if the family you don't side with suffers a terrible fate without your help. If you side with Hoshido, after the disastrous military campaign in Hoshido, there is widespread civil unrest in Nohr and your family there is murdered by Nohrian rebels. If you side with Nohr, while you are trying to reform your country, Garon completes his invasion of Hoshido and kills off the royal family there.

3rd path DLC is to stop the war before it even begins while dealing with a world ending monster threat. Dancina (maybe revealed to be your manakete mother?) is a more prominent character in this route and sacrifices herself before the end.

[Thane]

It might be interesting if the family you don't side with suffers a terrible fate without your help. If you side with Hoshido, after the disastrous military campaign in Hoshido, there is widespread civil unrest in Nohr and your family there is murdered by Nohrian rebels. If you side with Nohr, while you are trying to reform your country, Garon completes his invasion of Hoshido and kills off the royal family there.

3rd path DLC is to stop the war before it even begins while dealing with a world ending monster threat. Dancina (maybe revealed to be your manakete mother?) is a more prominent character in this route and sacrifices herself before the end.

First paragraph: hell yes!

Second paragraph: hell no!

I've had it with world ending monsters; not only is that way too a convenient villain for lazy stories, but we also just had one in Fire Emblem: Awakening. The whole uniting to stop a common foe can be engaging if it's written well, but here it seems like a cheap solution to the tension between two countries. Nevermind past transgression, cultural differences, victims on both sides - just so long as some soldiers fight together, there'll be everlasting peace. Nay, says I!

Also, I don't think she should be Kamui's mother; far too many people want to romance her already.

[NekoKnight]

First paragraph: hell yes!

Second paragraph: hell no!

I've had it with world ending monsters; not only is that way too a convenient villain for lazy stories, but we also just had one in Fire Emblem: Awakening. The whole uniting to stop a common foe can be engaging if it's written well, but here it seems like a cheap solution to the tension between two countries. Nevermind past transgression, cultural differences, victims on both sides - just so long as some soldiers fight together, there'll be everlasting peace. Nay, says I!

Also, I don't think she should be Kamui's mother; far too many people want to romance her already.

I'm just building off what we've seen so far. I don't like the generic "band together to defeat world ending threat" very much either but monsters are already shown to be a threat of some kind and the 3rd route is stated to be one where you don't side with either faction, so yeah. What I'm really hoping for is the 3rd route not to be the perfect "everybody wins" canon ending for FE14. Each route should have a valid conclusion that required sacrifices to be made and no ending is explicitly better than the others.

It would be kind of like Fate/Stay Night where each route focuses on different characters and each has their own 'complete' ending, but to fully appreciate the whole story, you need to play all three routes.

Edited April 19, 2015 by NekoKnight

[Thane]

I'm just building off what we've seen so far. I don't like the generic "band together to defeat world ending threat" very much either but monsters are already shown to be a threat of some kind and the 3rd route is stated to be one where you don't side with either faction, so yeah. What I'm really hoping for is the 3rd route not to be the perfect "everybody wins" canon ending for FE14. Each route should have a valid conclusion that required sacrifices to be made and no ending is explicitly better than the others.

It would be kind of like Fate/Stay Night where each route focuses on different characters and each has their own 'complete' ending, but to fully appreciate the whole story, you need to play all three routes.

I agree fully, I was just voicing my opinion. However, and maybe this is just me trying to convince myself, I don't think the third route will deal with a world-ending threat, if nothing else because we just had that in Fire Emblem: Awakening. I think it'll deal with Kamui's inability to fight either side, and will try to stop the war by taking out key figures or something. I really do hope we get to see Kamui feeling guilty over the choices he is forced to make.

Ehe...Fate/Stay Night huh? I wouldn't use that to compare anything really, since it's a pretty damn bad piece of storytelling in my opinion. Ah well, it's not Naruto, at least.

[blah the Prussian]

There had damn well better not be a world ending monster in this one, or I'm going to lose my shit.

[NekoKnight]

I agree fully, I was just voicing my opinion. However, and maybe this is just me trying to convince myself, I don't think the third route will deal with a world-ending threat, if nothing else because we just had that in Fire Emblem: Awakening. I think it'll deal with Kamui's inability to fight either side, and will try to stop the war by taking out key figures or something. I really do hope we get to see Kamui feeling guilty over the choices he is forced to make.

Ehe...Fate/Stay Night huh? I wouldn't use that to compare anything really, since it's a pretty damn bad piece of storytelling in my opinion. Ah well, it's not Naruto, at least.

The quality of the writing is subjective but I was making a comparison to narrative structure. Some characters die in all routes, some are saved in some routes but not others. Each route has a satisfying ending but you'd not be getting the full story unless you complete all routes. I speculate that Dancina will be heavily focused upon in the 3rd route compared to the personal struggles of the Hoshidans and Nohrians in their respective routes.

Edited April 19, 2015 by NekoKnight

[Thane]

The quality of the writing is subjective but I was making a comparison to narrative structure. Some characters die in all routes, some are saved in some routes but not others. Each route has a satisfying ending but you'd not be getting the full story unless you complete all routes. I speculate that Dancina will be heavily focused upon in the 3rd route compared to the personal struggles of the Hoshidans and Nohrians in their respective routes.

Of course, that's why I wrote "in my opinion", I'm well aware that it's a fairly popular visual novel, and I won't argue that every route feels different.

However, the story itself is slow, the characters boring and shallow save for a few like Rin, the power levels make no sense, the villains are bland and infuriatingly stupid and, while this is true regarding most series involving fighting of this kind but even more so here, the plot decides who wins and loses every single fight. What I mean is that you never feel as if the characters themselves are contributing to the fight, but that they're at the mercy of the writing, and there are far, FAR too many "I'll let you live for now because of X" moments in that game.

Oh, and transferring magical energy via sexual intercourse to a genderbent King Arthur? I couldn't make that shit up if I tried.

Edited April 19, 2015 by Thane

[NekoKnight]

Of course, that's why I wrote "in my opinion", I'm well aware that it's a fairly popular visual novel, and I won't argue that every route feels different.

However, the story itself is slow, the characters boring and shallow save for a few like Rin, the power levels make no sense, the villains are bland and infuriatingly stupid and, while this is true regarding most series involving fighting of this kind but even more so here, the plot demands who wins and loses every single fight. What I mean is that you never feel as if the characters themselves are contributing to the fight, but that they're at the mercy of the writing, and there are far, FAR too many "I'll let you live for now because of X" moments in that game.

Oh, and transferring magical energy via sexual intercourse to a genderbent King Arthur? I couldn't make that shit up if I tried.

Haha, I agree with all of those criticisms. The primary antagonist only loses because of mind-numbing stupidity and Shiro survives through massive amounts of plot armor.

So how could the 3rd route be sold with a sufficient amount of drama? We've still got a Kamui-choking-Dancina scene and Fire Emblem unaccounted for.

[Thane]

Haha, I agree with all of those criticisms. The primary antagonist only loses because of mind-numbing stupidity and Shiro survives through massive amounts of plot armor.

So how could the 3rd route be sold with a sufficient amount of drama? We've still got a Kamui-choking-Dancina scene and Fire Emblem unaccounted for.

There's too much to say about that game. I can see what they were trying to do but the execution is dreadful. From Saber losing to a random human fighting with his fists to the ridiculous levels of "trying too hard" with things like love, people's backstory and so on. Granted, it's not all bad; Rin is an intriguing character, Saber is adorable and there are actually a few badass moments in that game, like seeing the Unlimited Blade Works. Of course, these are far too few to make up for bad writing that would fill a LOT of books.

That's not an easy question to answer, which is exactly why it's worth far more than a monster threatening to destroy the world. Maybe the Fire Emblem itself is the villain somehow, maybe the Dancina is going to use her powers for something Kamui doesn't support, maybe they're being hunted by both sides, maybe the third route will simply be a lot more diplomatic and we'll have more than fights to worry about.

Edited April 19, 2015 by Thane

[Ryo]

I like the idea of the Fire Emblem being the final boss.

[MCProductions]

Watch the Third path entail nothing but shipping Marx with Ryouma and Camilla with Nin, I mean Aqua.

[Thane]

Watch the Third path entail nothing but shipping Marx with Ryouma and Camilla with Nin, I mean Aqua.

Relevant:

[NekoKnight]

Relevant:

That's not how it ends!

[spoiler=True Path Golden Ending]

Trust me, my dad works at Nintendo.

[Respite&Nepenthe]

I'd like for FEif to be overly depressing. So much so, it's narmy.

But really now, wouldn't you be sad about uh... killing your family/adoptive family? Or you just feel bad about killing Marx.

Heh, I'd probably just feel bad about killing Marx,,because he's too beautiful to die. But realistically, I'd feel pretty bad about killing Book bro or the little sisters. They look like children!

[blah the Prussian]

Heh, I'd probably just feel bad about killing Marx,,because he's too beautiful to die. But realistically, I'd feel pretty bad about killing Book bro or the little sisters. They look like children!

There have been children in FE before. In 4, I think there were even some enemies who were teenagers.