2017 NFL Playoffs - Super Bowl LI Confirmed! Atlanta Falcons vs New England Patriots!

[Life]

Except I also said that Ben was upset that the Browns passed on him due to his Ohio origins. I think he's from somewhere near Cleveland, in fact. And the Browns are a team that haven't ever been to a Super Bowl.

Jesus Christ, stop arguing. 9 other teams passed on Roethlisberger.

Do you really have to make every little thing about the Steelers? Ben Roethlisberger did not win those Superbowls alone.

Brad Johnson has a Superbowl ring. Does that mean that any team that didn't pick him would have won a Superbowl? No.

Edited October 16, 2015 by Life

[Anacybele]

Jesus Christ, stop complaining. Do you really have to criticize me all the time? I was only contributing to the current conversation, nothing more. I don't know the history of other teams as well as I do that of the Steelers. So deal with it.

[Lord Raven]

Also, I've been thinking about serious "What ifs" that changed the course of history. Like if Art Modell hadn't moved the Browns to Baltimore, Belichick might have spent 15 years coaching Ray Lewis in Cleveland and turns the Browns into the current day Patriots.

Or if Belichick was retained in Baltimore :D

We should also keep in mind the following;

- Brady was still only picked in the sixth round in 2000, meaning that the QB carousel that would've inevitably occurred in Balticlevemore would've been resolved by 2001 somehow. I think Belichick would've gone after Brady still.

- Ed Reed was picked quite late in the 2002 draft. I'm pretty sure they get him.

- This does mean no Terrell Suggs from that draft, but having Pete Boulware and friends on that pass rush is enough.

The Belichick/Newsome drafts would've been spectacular.

Edited October 16, 2015 by Lord Raven

[Bullwine85]

25 on the way! Maybe we'll have a chance against Cincy!

Also, I've been thinking about serious "What ifs" that changed the course of history. Like if Art Modell hadn't moved the Browns to Baltimore, Belichick might have spent 15 years coaching Ray Lewis in Cleveland and turns the Browns into the current day Patriots.

Anyone got any?

What if the Packers had drafted either Barry Sanders, Derrick Thomas, or Deion Sanders instead of Tony Mandarich in 1989?

What if the Vikings hadn't done that infamous Herschel Walker trade?

What if Mike Jones doesn't tackle Dyson at the 1-yard line?

[Lord Raven]

What if the Packers had drafted either Barry Sanders, Derrick Thomas, or Deion Sanders instead of Tony Mandarich in 1989?

Coaching changes are different, no Brett Favre, Lions probably don't have a playoff win in the Super Bowl era. That's with Barry Sanders. Deion Sanders may not have significantly altered the course of history that much considering Deion was a mercenary anyway, though the Falcons not having him may fuck things up a bit. Who knows, maybe Deion Sanders may not become a Baltimore Raven (which he's known for of course) and I don't have a faded #37 jersey hanging in my closet.

What if the Vikings hadn't done that infamous Herschel Walker trade?

No Cowboy's dynasty; Bills may win 2 of those Super Bowls they went to.

What if Mike Jones doesn't tackle Dyson at the 1-yard line?

It goes into OT and the GSOT marches down and scores pretty quickly. Better question is if Isaac Bruce didn't take that long pass from Warner all the way, because then the Rams may just go for a field goal and win it instead of relying on their defense for that stop.

[Anacybele]

What if the Chargers had gotten Michael Vick? I heard during the Steelers vs Chargers game that he was almost a Charger.

[Lord Raven]

Then no LT or Drew Brees at all cause they don't make the trade with Atlanta. Chargers had the #1 overall pick in that draft cause they were pathetic for a number of years.

Drew Brees' career is a whole cavalcade of what ifs I don't even want to go into. Especially since it boils down to the picks in 2004 and the free agency period between the 2005 season and 2006 season where he was almost signed by Miami but went to NO thanks to Sean Payton.

[Anacybele]

Huh, interesting...

Nooo, Ben won't play vs the Cardinals. :( I was kind of hoping he would because it's the Cardinals... And he really wanted to play against Bruce Arians. They're still good friends, you know. I suppose it's probably for the best though. I'd rather Ben be out one more game than risk hurting his knee further and possibly ending his season.

Vick needs to trust his receivers more though. Just like AB said, he needs to trust him to make plays. He hasn't given AB much of a chance, though in Vick's defense, AB DID drop a perfectly catchable TD pass and was covered pretty well by that one Chargers CB (Jason Verrett, was it?). But this time, AB needs to get the ball more, as does Bell. The Cardinals aren't some scrubby team.

It's just too bad that Shazier STILL won't be coming back either. -_-

[ClevelandSteve]

Except I also said that Ben was upset that the Browns passed on him due to his Ohio origins. I think he's from somewhere near Cleveland, in fact. And the Browns are a team that haven't ever been to a Super Bowl.

He's from Findlay, which is closer to Toledo. In fact, Findlay is nearly as far away from Cleveland (in the other direction, obviously) as Pittsburgh is. You're getting close to Lions territory the closer you get to Toledo (Michigan-loving traitors. We won a war over that shit, ungrateful bastards...)

And, if you want to get technical, Cleveland could've gotten Tom Brady, too. The last QB drafted before him in that draft was Spergon Wynn, by the Browns. So, technically, the Brady-Belichick combo could've been in Cleveland, and with Ray Lewis on defense, too. We could've been fucking godly, pretty much.

Edited October 16, 2015 by ClevelandSteve

[Anacybele]

Oh wow. That is quite a what-if there. lol

[Jiac]

What if the Chargers had gotten Michael Vick? I heard during the Steelers vs Chargers game that he was almost a Charger.

Then no LT or Drew Brees at all cause they don't make the trade with Atlanta. Chargers had the #1 overall pick in that draft cause they were pathetic for a number of years.

Drew Brees' career is a whole cavalcade of what ifs I don't even want to go into. Especially since it boils down to the picks in 2004 and the free agency period between the 2005 season and 2006 season where he was almost signed by Miami but went to NO thanks to Sean Payton.

Man I seriously want to expand on this. If John Butler didn't die of cancer or AJ Smith was fired earlier we could've actually been a scary team. Of course I agree with the firing of Marty was a good decision since he wanted his son to be the OC. John Butler possibly could have hired a more "capable" coach. But that's all speculation and there's no conclusive proof. Any team could've been a dynasty if they made the right moves.

I also want to imagine if the Chargers selected Peyton Manning over Ryan Leaf to see how much this changes everything up.

But if the Chargers in conventional wisdom chose Michael Vick, the imagination of where talent would go would be incredible.

1. The Chargers select their Quarterback of the future Michael Vick, his simply incredibly talent leads the organization in a good spot for upcoming years before his arrest (assuming he'll get arrested as a Charger) leaving the organization in flux for a period of time. The Chargers' roster was talented enough to likely not get one of the first 10 picks in the draft. Likely as a Charger he'll get injured and become a pocket passer earlier than intended.

This significance would probably end up changing the future of many organizations.

In the 2008 draft, I would believe they end up drafting Joe Flacco since Matt Ryan was considered the better Quarterback where there was discussion if Baltimore would move up to get him. (correct me if i'm wrong about this Lord Raven) I doubt AJ Smith makes the move to get Matt Ryan.

The next 3 picks likely go unchanged:

2. Cardinals - Leonard Davis OT

3. Browns - Gerard Warren DT

4. Bengals - Justin Smith DE

5. The Atlanta Falcon's Jamal Anderson just had a 1000-yard season and is still on the roster, so it's very unlikely they take Tomlinson on the board. I believe they decide not to take him for the DE Andre Carter. As they needed a boost in their Defensive Line.

6. The Patriots have just gotten Antowain Smith. A talented runner who has fallen from the coaching staff in Buffalo. With Belichick's arrival and drafting philosophy. I once again doubt he drafts Tomlinson as he believes that running backs are very replaceable position. On top of that, the first running back he drafted in the 1st round using the Browns 9th overall pick in the 1992 draft was, Tommy Vardell, who wasn't much of a hit. So they likely stick with their pick of Richard Seymour.

7. LaDainian Tomlinson falls to the 49ers and likely creates a historical triple tandem of Tomlinson, Terrell Owens and Jeff Garcia. Which doesn't last too long due to the decline of Garcia. Unless Tomlinson changes this somehow. This also affects the 2005 NFL Draft, due to them likely not drafting Frank Gore. Since they already have LT as their franchise running back. This move also could potentially lead the 49ers to a 6th Superbowl.

Moves 8-31. likely go unchanged since the Top 7 picks just got switched around.

32. This one is a real kicker. Atlanta drafts Drew Brees in need as a Quarterback for the future. With the aging Chris Chandler still in front of him, Brees likely stays as a back-up Quarterback. He doesn't have Tomlinson to hand off to or Sean Payton coaching him. He likely never gets his chance as an NFL great.

That move heavily changes the Saint's organization.

Also due to the Chargers' lack of LT and Vick's likely arrest and success. The Chargers probably don't draft Philip Rivers, whose offense was the reason the Colts never truly got further in the 2007 and 2008 post season. It would probably inflate his post season record with more wins since I doubt Manning beats the 2007 Patriots. But it's a nice thought to think about.

[Lord Raven]

I also want to imagine if the Chargers selected Peyton Manning over Ryan Leaf to see how much this changes everything up.

Colts had the #1 overall pick, Chargers had #2. I doubt this would happen.

In the 2008 draft, I would believe they end up drafting Joe Flacco since Matt Ryan was considered the better Quarterback where there was discussion if Baltimore would move up to get him. (correct me if i'm wrong about this Lord Raven) I doubt AJ Smith makes the move to get Matt Ryan.

Imagine the Julio Jones trade. That was what Ozzie was trying to do with Matt Ryan. We kept trying to trade up, didn't work, traded back, then traded back up just in case someone else would go after Joe Flacco.

[Jiac]

Colts had the #1 overall pick, Chargers had #2. I doubt this would happen.

I meant to say if the Colts drafted Ryan Leaf.

I just derped for the second i was writing that haha.

[Lord Raven]

Based on everything I've read, there was 0 chance that was gonna happen. I've generally heard a lot of GMs had Manning over Leaf and this whole Leaf vs Manning thing was something constructed by the media.

[Life]

Here's a great one.

If Rob Johnson sucks in Week 17 of the 1999 season, NO probably doesn't win the Super Bowl in 2009. Yeah, this one is a 10 year deal.

Assuming that Rob Johnson sucks in Week 17, there's no QB controversy going into the post-season and Ralph Wilson doesn't force Wade Phillips to bench Doug Flutie. Bills beat the Titans easily (Johnson sucked that game and the Bills were still ahead with 16 seconds to go) and make it to their 5th Super Bowl in team history, dropping it to the Greatest Show on Turf.

As a result, Flutie stays in Buffalo and doesn't go to San Diego. Since SD doesn't have a solid back-up, they can't afford to trade away their first overall pick and take Michael Vick instead. Brees never goes to SD and as a result, doesn't end up in NO to orchestrate that Super Bowl run.

[Anacybele]

...Uh, the Steelers won the Super Bowl in 09. That was SB 43...

[Life]

...Uh, the Steelers won the Super Bowl in 09. That was SB 43...

Good catch. I meant the 2009 season. But the point still stands.

[Esau of Isaac]

I'm pretty sure that I came here for help some time ago with my fantasy team. Well, it's been going well so far, mainly because I picked up Devonta Freeman on a waiver before he became a Super Saiyan

I'm probably gonna have to switch out Yeldon, but it's really hard for me to find players that are doing better than the ones I have on the bench, and I feel that I wouldn't come out even on most trades. I'm second in the league right now since I lost my first week, but unless Rodgers and Freeman die I think I'm set to win $150 buckarinos.

[-Cynthia-]

Here's a great one.

If Rob Johnson sucks in Week 17 of the 1999 season, NO probably doesn't win the Super Bowl in 2009. Yeah, this one is a 10 year deal.

Assuming that Rob Johnson sucks in Week 17, there's no QB controversy going into the post-season and Ralph Wilson doesn't force Wade Phillips to bench Doug Flutie. Bills beat the Titans easily (Johnson sucked that game and the Bills were still ahead with 16 seconds to go) and make it to their 5th Super Bowl in team history, dropping it to the Greatest Show on Turf.

As a result, Flutie stays in Buffalo and doesn't go to San Diego. Since SD doesn't have a solid back-up, they can't afford to trade away their first overall pick and take Michael Vick instead. Brees never goes to SD and as a result, doesn't end up in NO to orchestrate that Super Bowl run.

I think the '99 Jaguars were better than the '99 Bills. They beat everyone not Titans on their schedule and completely destroyed the Dolphins in the playoffs. I kinda feel bad that that was Jimmy Johnson's last game.

Jags were #2 in DVOA that year, Bills were #6(and Jags would be at home) http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teameff1999

Edited October 17, 2015 by -Cynthia-

[Lord Raven]

I'm probably gonna have to switch out Yeldon, but it's really hard for me to find players that are doing better than the ones I have on the bench, and I feel that I wouldn't come out even on most trades. I'm second in the league right now since I lost my first week, but unless Rodgers and Freeman die I think I'm set to win $150 buckarinos.

Who's still on waivers?

I'd also try to switch out Kaepernick as your backup QB. Surely there's someone available.

Rodgers is going god mode for me too. I'm only 2-3 right now and my last week was shit (lost by 20 only scored 70 or so points) so idk how to feel from this point forward.

[Life]

I think the '99 Jaguars were better than the '99 Bills. They beat everyone not Titans on their schedule and completely destroyed the Dolphins in the playoffs. I kinda feel bad that that was Jimmy Johnson's last game.

Jags were #2 in DVOA that year, Bills were #6(and Jags would be at home) http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teameff1999

Flutie was balling really hard that year with Thurman Thomas and Eric Moulds still playing. I don't think the Bills lose to the Jags.

In any regard, just winning the Wild Card game would keep Flutie in Buffalo if he had played.

[Lord Raven]

Maybe I'm missing something with the eye test but even if Flutie was playing well the Jaguars seemed to have a huge edge with running backs.

Edited October 17, 2015 by Lord Raven

[-Cynthia-]

Mark Brunell/Fred Taylor/Jimmy Smith was also a pretty impressive trio- and the Jaguars were the #1 defense in the league in terms of points allowed. The Bills probably would have beaten the Colts in the divisional round though, by DVOA the '99 Colts were not a strong team despite their record.

And yeah Taylor was #12 in DYAR in '99 and James Stewart was #15 which was a pretty good combination. The best Bills runner was Linton at #26. Thurman Thomas was in the twilight of his career by then(he had like 150 yards total and it was his second to last year).

Edited October 18, 2015 by -Cynthia-

[Team Alucard]

The Lions could lose 100-0 tomorrow and it would still be less embarrassing than what just happened in the Michigan game.

jfc

[Zasplach]

The Lions could lose 100-0 tomorrow and it would still be less embarrassing than what just happened in the Michigan game.

jfc

almost pissed myself that was so unbelievable. My condolences, if my team lost like that, I wouldn't be able to post because I would have thrown my computer out of a window.