Sorin Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) Uhm when did they ever do this? The only times where something like this happened that i know of are the one with Devdan and Danved(which was an ingame joke in the game),Camus&Zeke(who are the same character with a justified reason in the story) and this bandit duo where everyone assumes they are gay(which is more like a running gag for the series). When have they ever made expys... expies... expi? A-Anyway, they make them all the time. FE6 as a whole was basically one of the original Fire Emblem. Compare the units side by side and tell me you don't see at least a few. This is one of the few times it has been so obvious though.Edit: Well said, NeonZ I would take it being an archetype. But because I just don't see them not using Outrealms as a means of justification otherwise... Maybe if now that Cordelia is around to grow up with her (assuming that this is Severa, and the peaceful version of the future), rather than being bitter about her mother, she grows up to be like her. Pretty much. Most if not all her problems come from her abandonment issues. And if Cordelia knew that future!Severa was that bad, wouldn't she do all she could to make sure she didn't end up that way? Edited June 5, 2015 by Sorin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carter Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Pretty much. Most if not all her problems come from her abandonment issues. And if Cordelia knew that future!Severa was that bad, wouldn't she do all she could to make sure she didn't end up that way? Woo! Then that means Severa confirmed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XialonWind Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Woo! Then that means Severa confirmed!yeah like not!inigo not having to be a philanderer due to shyness or Odin learning magic from his mother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeonZ Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) I would take it being an archetype. But because I just don't see them not using Outrealms as a means of justification otherwise... This seems entirely based on reading that interview quote extremely literately though. If easily could take place in a separate continent in the same planet. Something like that could be referenced as a whole new world in the context of an interview like that (remember, the same quote also said that it was the first time in the series they'd be doing that, so it clearly wasn't to be taken literally), but wouldn't need Otherworld Gate to justify some characters from Ylisse ending up there. Besides, if they're expies, what's up with Odin? He has a completely different base class from Owain, but shares his head sprite and default hair color. Edited June 5, 2015 by NeonZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Geek Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Uhm when did they ever do this? The only times where something like this happened that i know of are the one with Devdan and Danved(which was an ingame joke in the game),Camus&Zeke(who are the same character with a justified reason in the story) and this bandit duo where everyone assumes they are gay(which is more like a running gag for the series). Those are cases where it's the same character going under a different name. What the person you quoted was talking about was about cases where characters from a new FE game are made as references to characters from previous FEs. Examples: Sain is a reference to Johan: Both are mounted units who are wannabe lady killers who are even visually similar. Etzel (one of the FE11/12 exclusive characters) is a reference to Canas: Both are intelligent dark mages who insist that using dark magic does not make you evil and they are also visually similar. Cordelia is a reference to Catria: Both are incredibly talented pegasus knights who hold unrequited crushes on the lord character from their respective games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Book of Ereshkigal Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 I've never seen Sain compared to Johan before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Those are cases where it's the same character going under a different name. What the person you quoted was talking about was about cases where characters from a new FE game are made as references to characters from previous FEs. Examples: Sain is a reference to Johan: Both are mounted units who are wannabe lady killers who are even visually similar. Etzel (one of the FE11/12 exclusive characters) is a reference to Canas: Both are intelligent dark mages who insist that using dark magic does not make you evil and they are also visually similar. Cordelia is a reference to Catria: Both are incredibly talented pegasus knights who hold unrequited crushes on the lord character from their respective games. There is a difference between people who share some story/personality/visual traits and literal copies. It's worse for not!Severa because she appeared in the game immediately preceding FE14. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodperson707 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) ^^well how many people actually think of the similarities between Johan to Sain? Johan is kinda an obscure character anyway and outside of recruiting him which you are locked out of if you chose his brother he doesn't come up much. Also not everyone has played 4' i hardly compared thought of Johan while reading a transcript or watching a lets play where i am not even sure which bro was recruited. Edited June 5, 2015 by goodperson707 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueL Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 I'm surprised this is such a big topic of discussion. I'm in the "it's just a very similar looking character who isn't related to Severa" camp. Then we have Severa herself. If it was her younger self, why is her personality so similar to her older one? If her parents were around, then her having the same kind of complex is... a bit out there. I could also argue that older!Severa's ending says she goes back to yell at her parents every so often for old times sake, meaning her going to some far away land with a possibility of not being able to return is a contradiction with previously established canon. And even then, why serve Camilla? Why would she spend her entire life fighting, want peace, and then go back to war in another world of her own volition? In addition to what NeonZ, her parents being around wouldn't necessarily stop her from being a tsundere, maybe she just naturally is destined to be that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luun Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) The way I see it, if Luna's nothing more than a simple homage the amount of similarities is overkill. Having a nod at a popular character from a previous game is one thing, but essentially copy+pasting them into another with no connection or reasoning behind it just seems like lazy writing. I don't look at Luna and think she reminds me of Severa, I look at Luna and see nothing but Severa. Even if there are similar cases with past characters, none seem to be taken quite this far. The fact that Awakening and IF have the same character designer and by extension art style makes it even more jarring. I'm not going to say that there's definitely some kind of connection between the two, but I would much prefer there to be. Edited June 5, 2015 by Luun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carter Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) There is a difference between people who share some story/personality/visual traits and literal copies. It's worse for not!Severa because she appeared in the game immediately preceding FE14. bold: why do people do that. "not!Severa" or "Female!Robin" or "Male!Kamui" holy freaking god just press the spacebar Is Luna really thought of as a literal copy? Actually... yeah, why not. I mean visually, ding! They could be twins (if not the same person!). It's even enough to get people to refer to her as NOT SEVERA instead of Luna. Edited June 5, 2015 by Carter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsunami922 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 bold: why do people do that. "not!Severa" or "Female!Robin" or "Male!Kamui" holy freaking god just press the spacebar Is Luna really thought of as a literal copy? Actually... yeah, why not. I mean visually, ding! They could be twins (if not the same person!). It's even enough to get people to refer to her as NOT SEVERA instead of Luna. I have a better question. Since Luna is a subordinate of Camilla, are you going to betray Hoshido and go to the dark side- I mean, Nohr? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sorin Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) This seems entirely based on reading that interview quote extremely literately though. If easily could take place in a separate continent in the same planet. Something like that could be referenced as a whole new world in the context of an interview like that (remember, the same quote also said that it was the first time in the series they'd be doing that, so it clearly wasn't to be taken literally), but wouldn't need Otherworld Gate to justify some characters from Ylisse ending up there. Besides, if they're expies, what's up with Odin? He has a completely different base class from Owain, but shares his head sprite and default hair color. Fair enough. Looking back, I can definitely see where you're coming from. I was a bit too excited when I first read it. But, look at it from another standpoint. Why would you all want the same character to reappear in a story that isn't theirs? I probably could have phrased that better, but this is totally from curiosity. If you liked the character, then letting them have their ending, be it good or bad, is important in my opinion. It'd be like watching your favorite show reach its climax, only to have the end dragged out with an attempt at another climax. And, last I checked, expy only had to resemble their original most, if not all, to count as one. Course, take everything I say with a grain of salt. I have no more canon information than you and will gladly admit when I'm wrong. I'm surprised this is such a big topic of discussion. I'm in the "it's just a very similar looking character who isn't related to Severa" camp. In addition to what NeonZ, her parents being around wouldn't necessarily stop her from being a tsundere, maybe she just naturally is destined to be that way. So, we're in the same camp. Hold on though. While nobody but the developers can say for sure that it would, other notes from her character would lead one to believe this would actually be the case. Note her father-daughter A Support for example. Once the father tells her he loves her despite all of the comparisons to her mother, she softens considerably. If her parents were there as soon as the comparisons started, and HAD PRIOR KNOWLEDGE DUE TO KNOWING FUTURE SEVERA AND WHAT SHE WOULD PROBABLY GO THROUGH, the natural parental instinct is to reassure the child with love. Something future Severa couldn't get because her parents were dead. Her tsun tendencies sprouted because of her abandonment issues followed by her inferiority complex. I should probably cite, but the hints and such are littered across her supports. Even if younger Severa was still a tsun, there would have to be a different reason for it. When you pull destiny into it, especially when already dealing with unknowns, it becomes hard to reach an agreement, or at least a common ground. Why would you all want the same character to reappear in a story that isn't theirs? I probably could have phrased that better, but this is totally from curiosity. If you liked the character, then letting them have their ending, be it good or bad, is important in my opinion. It'd be like watching your favorite show reach its climax, only to have the end dragged out with an attempt at another climax. I would like some answers to this though. If only so I can see it from everyone else's viewpoint. I have a better question. Since Luna is a subordinate of Camilla, are you going to betray Hoshido and go to the dark side- I mean, Nohr? *raises an eyebrow at Carter* When in doubt, go Hoshinohri as I did Edited June 5, 2015 by Sorin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeonZ Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) But, look at it from another standpoint. Why would you all want the same character to reappear in a story that isn't theirs? I probably could have phrased that better, but this is totally from curiosity. If you liked the character, then letting them have their ending, be it good or bad, is important in my opinion. It'd be like watching your favorite show reach its climax, only to have the end dragged out with an attempt at another climax. I like that kind of narrative structure. Characters don't need to exist solely for a single conflict and it can be interesting to see how they go forward outside of their original scenario. In fact, I dislike when stories attempt to tie everything together too neatly, like all characters having improbable backstory connections just to tie everything together in a closed chart. I prefer the idea that there are various stories in a fictional world and this is just the one that we are happening to follow to the idea that this is the only story that a universe has to tell. In this specific case, if Luna is just a Severa-expy, we could be looking at just a complete retread of her character. She'd likely be a Nohr native and something happened in her past to drive her to have a similar attitude to Severa's, and now she's fighting for her homeland. Her development in supports also likely would be extremely similar to Severa's in Awakening, even if the cause is somewhat different. However, if she is actually Severa or her younger self, in addition to elements that would be a retread, we'd also be looking at the perspective of someone who isn't even from Nohr originally but for one reason or another chose to fight for them. It can potentially add quite a bit to the setting and interactions with other characters, since that might lead to going into Nohr's interactions with other countries or foreigners, aside from Hoshido, and would actually make her stand out more from Awakening's Severa. Edited June 5, 2015 by NeonZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoKnight Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 bold: why do people do that. "not!Severa" or "Female!Robin" or "Male!Kamui" holy freaking god just press the spacebar Is Luna really thought of as a literal copy? Actually... yeah, why not. I mean visually, ding! They could be twins (if not the same person!). It's even enough to get people to refer to her as NOT SEVERA instead of Luna. Why do people write names like that? The same reason people strikethrough jokes and off topic conversations. No one really knows. But maintaining traditions is important. If not!Severa were here, I'm sure she'd agree with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) I like that kind of narrative structure. Characters don't need to exist solely for a single conflict and it can be interesting to see how they go forward outside of their original scenario. In fact, I dislike when stories attempt to tie everything together too neatly, like all characters having improbable backstory connections just to tie everything together in a closed chart. I prefer the idea that there are various stories in a fictional world and this is just the one that we are happening to follow to the idea that this is the only story that a universe has to tell. In this specific case, if Luna is just a Severa-expy, we could be looking at just a complete retread of her character. She'd likely be a Nohr native and something happened in her past to drive her to have a similar attitude to Severa's, and now she's fighting for her homeland. Her development in supports also likely would be extremely similar to Severa's in Awakening, even if the cause is somewhat different. However, if she is actually Severa or her younger self, in addition to elements that would be a retread, we'd also be looking at the perspective of someone who isn't even from Nohr originally but for one reason or another chose to fight for them. It can potentially add quite a bit to the setting and interactions with other characters, since that might lead to going into Nohr's interactions with other countries or foreigners, aside from Hoshido, and would actually make her stand out more from Awakening's Severa. As much as I'd love the look-a-like characters to have a connection to the respective Awakening characters, I highly doubt it. 1. This isn't limited to Nohr characters as you can see with Hinata and Donnel (http://postimg.org/i...nbk75b9fp/full/). All those friends who happend to fight side by side now battling each other does not make sense without a good explanation. 2. Even if you go that far and assume there could be story elements to make everything plausible, I don't see how IS would fit that into the new game. 3. There is a simple trend IS/Nintendo is following as far as I can tell from what we know so far. They want to maximize profit. Two versions, DLCs coming back, a more casual game or at least the option to play casually, popular game mechanics from other games (love plus/Animal Crossing/etc.) and popular characters from the past game reappearing. Actually this is pretty obvious. Edited June 5, 2015 by Lee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeonZ Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) As much as I'd love the look-a-like characters to have a connection to the respective Awakening characters, I highly doubt it. 1. This isn't limited to Nohr characters as you can see with Hinata and Donnel (http://postimg.org/i...nbk75b9fp/full/). All those friends who happend to fight side by side now battling each other does not make sense without a good explanation. Wait, you were serious about that? Really? They just have a similar scar and the same VA. Otherwise, they're nothing like each other. Look at their eyes, face shape, hair style, hair color... Luna and Several are basically identical, in both appearance and personality, based on what we have right now. The other two who are speculated to be in a similar situation share head sprites with Awakening characters. If Luna were a completely different character who just happened to have twintails and the same VA, you wouldn't see this kind of speculation. 2. Even if you go that far and assume there could be story elements to make everything plausible, I don't see how IS would fit that into the new game. There could be a small reference in the main story about her being a foreigner and they could go more in depth (although still avoiding any explicit mentions of time traveling or anything else that would require Awakening knowledge) in her supports. I don't see why it'd be hard. 3. There is a simple trend IS/Nintendo is following as far as I can tell from what we know so far. They want to maximize profit. Two versions, DLCs coming back, a more casual game or at least the option to play casually, popular game mechanics from other games (love plus/Animal Crossing/etc.) and popular characters from the past game reappearing. Actually this is pretty obvious. Like I've said several times, Severa might have been the 2nd most popular 2nd gen girl, but she was only the 10th most popular girl overall. They're specifically looking at "popular children", not "popular characters" in general. If they're just expies, why the children specifically? Edited June 5, 2015 by NeonZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodperson707 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) uh how does hintata having donnels scar and voice actor= friends fighting? near exact lookalike and class and same voice actor = same scar and voice actor? Ninjad. Edited June 5, 2015 by goodperson707 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueLore Posted June 5, 2015 Author Share Posted June 5, 2015 Archetypes? Granted, this would be a much less subtle one, but sure There are characters like the serious long haired myrmidons and red/green cavalier duos, also, half(maybe more?) of the cast of Biding Blade to Shadow Dragon's. Luna seems closer to Severa that any of those expies to their original base though. When have they ever made expys... expies... expi? A-Anyway, they make them all the time. FE6 as a whole was basically one of the original Fire Emblem. Compare the units side by side and tell me you don't see at least a few. This is one of the few times it has been so obvious though. I am very aware of archetypes,but honestly,this goes a bit too far to be just an archetype. Luna has the same eyes,the same hairstyle(and the same hair color as severas hair color in official artworks),the same voice,the same starting class and even the same expression in her sprite. The similarities aren't like the one between Jill and Minerva,they are more like the one between Danved and Devdan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chihiroos Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 So there are two options here, one, Luna is Severa but under a different name (which I highly doubt because they would have to explain why Severa would help stop one war just to hop into the middle of another one). Or two, Luna is just a little somethin somethin for people who played awakening and has nothing to do with the actual Severa. Am I getting this right? There are quite a few other characters who look a little similar to awakening's but it only reminds me of them, the design doesn't blatantly scream another character's name like Luna's does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeonZ Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) There's also the possibility that she's Cordelia's daughter in the saved timeline, rather than the Severa that we know. That would allow them to include "Severa" (and any of the other children) without making any Awakening pairings canon or non canon, since they could just avoid mentioning their parents and these versions of themselves wouldn't be paired previously, but also would avoid making them completely unrelated characters that just happen to be identical to Awakening characters. Aside from Luna there are two other characters who at least share head sprites and default hair color with Awakening children -Odin, a dark mage who has Owain's head from his Grandmaster sprite (we haven't seen any artwork or battle model for him though), and an unnamed Inigo lookalike mercenary, who also has a combat screenshot. Although it's not confirmed, there's also a mercenary seen in old screens who has Inigo's head sprite with a similar gray hair color. The two Inigo lookalikes are probably the same unit. Edited June 5, 2015 by NeonZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chihiroos Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) Although it's possible that Luna is kid severa its kinda unlikely. Awakening's timeline had two relatively short wars, (many wars went on for at least ten years), but they were still battles where lives were lost so I doubt Cordelia would be so willing to let her child go like that. More likely it is a nod to the past, no? Along with the other supposed look a likes Edited June 5, 2015 by chihiroos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeonZ Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) Why only the children though, assuming that those two as close to the Awakening characters as Luna? That's the big question that the reference idea leaves open. Of course, I guess if it's just Luna it could be that Severa was a developer's favorite, although it'd still be pretty odd considering how FE fairly often has similar characters without making them outright identical like that. Edited June 5, 2015 by NeonZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueL Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 So, we're in the same camp. Hold on though. While nobody but the developers can say for sure that it would, other notes from her character would lead one to believe this would actually be the case. Note her father-daughter A Support for example. Once the father tells her he loves her despite all of the comparisons to her mother, she softens considerably. If her parents were there as soon as the comparisons started, and HAD PRIOR KNOWLEDGE DUE TO KNOWING FUTURE SEVERA AND WHAT SHE WOULD PROBABLY GO THROUGH, the natural parental instinct is to reassure the child with love. Something future Severa couldn't get because her parents were dead. Her tsun tendencies sprouted because of her abandonment issues followed by her inferiority complex. I should probably cite, but the hints and such are littered across her supports. Even if younger Severa was still a tsun, there would have to be a different reason for it. I'm sorry, the bolded is what I was trying to say. I didn't mean to imply or state she'd still be a tsundere for the same reasons as the future Severa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceBuster573 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 If the third route's storyline revolves entirely around the Outrealm Gate, I hope the cries of "bullshit" about its existence will be over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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