General US Politics

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

chances are i wouldn't vote for Bernie unless he was facing like, Bush or Cruz.

but thats not saying much from a mostly repubican voter.

but i suppose if it was bernie vs hillary, i'd still vote for bernie. but it never was about them as they are both democratic.

Edited August 11, 2016 by HF Makalov Fanboy Kai

[Tryhard]

well, tbh we don't know exactly how it'd have gone had Sanders won the primaries. It's all up to speculation.

I disagree that Clinton should only attack Trump, though, rather than trying to promote herself and her policies and try to convince people why they work. An campaign that is only full of attacks isn't exactly healthy and gets old after a while.

What if they do know the difference, but would rather not vote for a democratic socialist as their first option? I myself would only vote for a democratic socialist (as opposed to social democrats, which are way more moderate and more to my liking) as the lesser of the two evils (which tbf would be true in a case of Sanders x all of the republicans in the primaries). I'm a centrist and I'm sure there are plenty of people who also are, and many of them would take Clinton over Sanders, just because they think her policies are better.

I didn't say that she shouldn't defend herself or her policies, in fact I encourage her to say and outline why her policies are better than Trumps, but from what I've seen she is still trying to make herself liked in the public eye in general. It just isn't going to work. People just dislike her. I expect everyone to get demonized, it comes with the territory, but she has a pretty bad reputation by all means.

Well, I never said anything about that. If you don't like his policies then you don't. I really am still not sure why people prefer Hillary over Sanders though, obviously. The best thing I've heard said about her is "experienced", which isn't really that much of a compliment. I just find it pretty crazy that Hillary, who was already advantaged pretty heavily with her celebrity status, name recognition, and backing from the DNC, almost lost outside of superdelegates to a previously relatively unknown senator from Vermont.

Edited August 11, 2016 by Tryhard

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

oh yeah definitely, that's kinda why i don't see her winning this, if she had trouble stumping a dude that wasn't even on the radar for most people until the election, even with all the media bias and other stuff in her favor, then chances are she's going to have a harder time vs a dude that is not only well known, but also is actually willing to attack her, which is something that sanders never did, if sanders did, then maybe he could've won, maybe.

[CyborgZeta]

It's possible that Bernie could've won the primaries had been on the attack from the beginning.

Then again, I think part of his problem was that he was too far left for a lot of registered Democrats.

[Phoenix Wright]

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! You expect a country that ousted several DS leaders during the Cold War to understand the difference between Democratic Socialism and Communism? Not insulting you, just saying that America literally is that stupid.

Edit: This would've been a great time to use Risitas.

most countries aren't any better. i understand why the united states is always in the spotlight, but it's not actually just us.

---

i wouldn't mind paying for news if it meant things would actually get better. i already pay like $25 a month for music, yt, and hbo--i could fork an extra 10 for quality journalism. i doubt that's how things would go, though.

[Life]

most countries aren't any better. i understand why the united states is always in the spotlight, but it's not actually just us.

---

i wouldn't mind paying for news if it meant things would actually get better. i already pay like $25 a month for music, yt, and hbo--i could fork an extra 10 for quality journalism. i doubt that's how things would go, though.

You're going to be hard pressed to find journalism on either side which is good.

For example, I enjoy Milo Yiannopoulos but that doesn't make him God-Emperor of journalism (mostly because I disagree with some of his points). Same idea with Ben Shapiro and Steven Crowder. And I have yet to find anyone as decent as them from the left (who I would love to read to get the other side's view when it comes from an intelligent person).

Also, Cyborg. I loved Bernie (because while I'm Conservative, I do also believe in social democracy because it just works best due to practicality) and even I realized that he wouldn't have been elected.

Edited August 12, 2016 by Right Wing Nut Job

[Sylphid]

Journalism in the US is almost never honest and is always biased. The media is what got America into the Spanish-American War. They used a design flaw to orchestrate an unnecessary conflict in the Caribbean, not to mentioned they paved the way for the only western-based Communist nation. I'm guessing the association between politicians and the media is much more limited in Finland than in the US, else this wouldn't bother you as much.

Wow, I would be interested to know more about the media connection to these events, but this isn't really the thread for it.

And yes, as far as I know, politicians' connections to media are pretty much non-existent over here.

https://rsf.org/en/ranking

Obviously doesn't envoke quality control in any great quantity (MV-lehti), but completely anecdotally I'd say (and argue that the index reflects that) journalism in general is more respected and much less ideologically saturated or polarized than in the US, even including party-produced publications.

That's a good reference, thanks.

All good points and just based on personal observation, all true.

(To be honest, MV-lehti is the main reason I was even remotely vague about Finnish media being trustworthy.)

And now there's a new problem with the internet, because now that nobody wants to pay for news anymore, news sites have to do clickbait articles and stuff that will net them ad revenue. The whole thing just gets even more muddled.

True, decreasing revenues from just news coverage is definitely a problem, and it's a big reason why Finland's national channel is pretty strong at the moment.

Thanks for the replies. While I was aware Finnish standard on journalism is high, I didn't expect the difference to be that drastic, hence my reaction.

[blah the Prussian]

I will say that the media now isn't nearly as bad as it was during the Spanish-American War; they PROBABLY couldn't cause a war now. But yeah, it's gotten to the point where some sites, like Breitbart, don't even bother to pretend that they're unbiased.

[CyborgZeta]

Breitbart and Huffington Post are the worst, but I have a had time even taking CNN at their word lately.

[Time the Crestfallen]

Breitbart and Huffington Post are the worst, but I have a had time even taking CNN at their word lately.

I've always thought a live debate between a Breitbart journalist and a HP journalist would be the funniest thing to watch.

[CyborgZeta]

I've always thought a live debate between a Breitbart journalist and a HP journalist would be the funniest thing to watch.

That's actually a pretty good idea. Someone should make it happen.

[Life]

That's actually a pretty good idea. Someone should make it happen.

Milo Yiannopoulos and Christina Hoff Sommers tried but they kept getting interupted by SJWs every second.

Long story short, it's already happened.

Edited August 12, 2016 by Right Wing Nut Job

[Moblin Major General]

Milo Yiannopoulos and Christina Hoff Sommers tried but they kept getting interupted by SJWs every second.

Fucking degenerates ruining a category 5 shitstorm.

[Phoenix Wright]

You're going to be hard pressed to find journalism on either side which is good.

For example, I enjoy Milo Yiannopoulos but that doesn't make him God-Emperor of journalism (mostly because I disagree with some of his points). Same idea with Ben Shapiro and Steven Crowder. And I have yet to find anyone as decent as them from the left (who I would love to read to get the other side's view when it comes from an intelligent person).

Also, Cyborg. I loved Bernie (because while I'm Conservative, I do also believe in social democracy because it just works best due to practicality) and even I realized that he wouldn't have been elected.

he's dead now but christopher hitchens was probably one of the best journalists of his time. julia ioffe is very smart.

i mean if your idea of leftist journalists is wolf blitzer or don lemon you're not looking very hard.

[Alertcircuit]

I can't take CNN seriously anymore after they hired Corey Lewandowski as a political commentator. They ask the guy who legally can't say anything bad about Trump, to comment on Trump.

[eclipse]

Milo Yiannopoulos and Christina Hoff Sommers tried but they kept getting interupted by SJWs every second.

Long story short, it's already happened.

What would happen if they filmed the debate in one room, and had a live screening in another room. . .preferably far away?

That way, the audience wouldn't be able to interrupt, and I'd make a profit selling popcorn. But seriously, if the audience can't respect the debators, they should be removed from ringside. I hope the presidential debates are more well-behaved!

[Life]

What would happen if they filmed the debate in one room, and had a live screening in another room. . .preferably far away?

That way, the audience wouldn't be able to interrupt, and I'd make a profit selling popcorn. But seriously, if the audience can't respect the debators, they should be removed from ringside. I hope the presidential debates are more well-behaved!

Here's the thing.

Milo has said multiple times that he loves and respects Christina Hoff Sommers even though he thinks that she's wrong. So the debate would be amazing.

Also, Steven Crowder was part of it and he had this to say.

[Crysta]

hahaha they thought a college would be a good place to host this out of all things. not even liberal comedians can get a pass there.

do it at a convention center or something

edit: also i recall a thing on cnn called crossfire that had this idea in mind

then they invited jon stewart

Edited August 12, 2016 by Crysta

[Phoenix Wright]

crowder is so dumb

also life, what about you is conservative? your only criticism of the left as it seems to me is your perception of it being overly sensitive.

Edited August 13, 2016 by Phoenix Wright

[Life]

also life, what about you is conservative? your only criticism of the left as it seems to me is your perception of it being overly sensitive.

Let's go.

1) I believe in the 2nd Ammendment and believe that only proper policing will cut down fire-arm related murders. Sure, there are things that need to be cleaned up but there is no reason to eliminate guns from American society.

2. I have issues with the way abortion laws are right now. As in, the second that there is a heartbeat going, it does become infanticide. Ben Carson is miles and away better than I am at explaining it.

I do not, however, believe that abortion should be entirely illegal because abortions would still happen but in much more unsafe conditions. But Obama's promise of abortion being "safe, legal and rare" turned into "safe, legal and commonplace".

3. I believe in the power of the free market (I'd love to see more laissez-faire markets) as opposed to the government controlling everything. It's more of a liberal attitude to conservative values.

4. I have serious issues with the left's moral superiority which always ends up being hypocritical at best. Any time Israel comes up in American politics (and we're not talking about presidential bids).

That's a good starter.

Edited August 13, 2016 by Right Wing Nut Job

[blah the Prussian]

But didn't you just say you supported a more social democrat style economy?

[Thane]

1) I believe in the 2nd Ammendment and believe that only proper policing will cut down fire-arm related murders. Sure, there are things that need to be cleaned up but there is no reason to eliminate guns from American society.

What would you say guns contribute to the American society?

2. I have issues with the way abortion laws are right now. As in, the second that there is a heartbeat going, it does become infanticide. Ben Carson is miles and away better than I am at explaining it.

I do not, however, believe that abortion should be entirely illegal because abortions would still happen but in much more unsafe conditions. But Obama's promise of abortion being "safe, legal and rare" turned into "safe, legal and commonplace".

I don't understand this either; why would this be a political topic? Why isn't this left to the pregnant woman and possibly her partner?

[Balcerzak]

I don't understand this either; why would this be a political topic? Why isn't this left to the pregnant woman and possibly her partner?

Why would child abuse be a political topic? Why wouldn't it be left to the mother and possibly her partner?*

*I don't actually believe fetus are children. This is just devil's advocating.

[Ansem]

What would you say guns contribute to the American society?

If I live in the country and I hear a burglar in my home and the police is an hour away, I would like to defend myself. And also in the cases of wild animals coming onto my property as well. I feel that guns that fire one round at the squeeze of a trigger should not be banned, however the military grade ones should not be civilian hands because those were made to kill scores.

[eclipse]

What would you say guns contribute to the American society?

Normally, this is where I'd tell you to read backwards, BUT it's a mess back there, so I'll try to remember what I posted earlier. Also, my cursor keeps changing colors.

America is big. Like, really big. Imagine living in a place where the nearest town is half an hour away, and your neighbors are fifteen minutes from you. Now let's say that something big and dark shows up on your property. You'll want to be able to take care of it yourself, especially if "big and dark" turns out to be something like a bear/coyote/other animal that is a danger to livestock or humans.

Second, some people hunt. Sometimes, it's because the government asked them to (boar hunts, since they're considered pests). Sometimes, it's for fun. And sometimes, it's cheaper to get meat that way. Deer is plentiful here, and edible.

There's also the usual gun debate things, but eh.

I don't understand this either; why would this be a political topic? Why isn't this left to the pregnant woman and possibly her partner?

One reason is so that people don't have to cross state lines to get an abortion. I wouldn't be surprised if some states outright banned abortion if it wasn't under federal jurisdiction.