Undertale

[Balcerzak]

I've been trying really hard to like this game, but it crashes somewhat randomly incredibly frequently. Sometimes I can't even get from save point to save point, other times it'll go for like a full half hour no problems. It's ridiculous.

[Clarinets]

I've been trying really hard to like this game, but it crashes somewhat randomly incredibly frequently. Sometimes I can't even get from save point to save point, other times it'll go for like a full half hour no problems. It's ridiculous.

Really? I've never had that problem with the game before. Perhaps try reinstalling the game?

[solrocknroll]

I don't have this game because I don't really have a non-school issued computer or a Steam, but I've immersed myself in LPs like Steam Train's, listening to the music, and looking at art.

This game's music is phenomenal, but my favourites are

Bergentruckung and ASGORE, Spider Dance, Megalovania, Metal Crusher, and Battle Against a True Hero.

My favourite characters are probably Undyne and Alphys omg, but I like every main character. even asriel

[Dr. Tarrasque]

It is time

[Clarinets]

Here's an interesting question:

How do you think some of the first people to witness the post-Genocide Pacifist ending, who didn't know that the ending turned out to be murdery, reacted?

[HF Makalov Fanboy Kai]

Yandere Dev claims he doesn't want his game to be known as a meme game, then he goes in puts in sans.

genius.

[B.Leu]

It is time

I'm pleasantly surprised, I was sort of kinda prepared to see the game being brutally torn appart..

Yandere Dev claims he doesn't want his game to be known as a meme game, then he goes in puts in sans.

genius.

Wait, what ? sans in... Yandere Simulator ?

Hmmmm... it's crazy and awesome at the same time.

[Erdall]

It is time

EARTHBOUND 2

ECLECTIC MEME-A-LOO

Genius!

Here's an interesting question:

How do you think some of the first people to witness the post-Genocide Pacifist ending, who didn't know that the ending turned out to be murdery, reacted?

Murdery? How isn't murdery killing the goat mom to begin with!

But yeah, if talking about the ending, it was quite unexpected. Frisk already went DIRECTLY berserk against Asgore and Flowey with NO possibility to take control of the situation. This is strongly hinted that Chara took control of Frisk in that moment.

Honestly, it was disgusting and impressive at the same time. You simply made the deal with the devil by yourself.

And the 'best' (wooooooooorst) part? It alters the pacifist ending forever. Damn ...

Edited January 18, 2016 by Erdall

[Clarinets]

EARTHBOUND 2

ECLECTIC MEME-A-LOO

Genius!

Murdery? How isn't murdery killing the goat mom to begin with!

But yeah, if talking about the ending, it was quite unexpected. Frisk already went DIRECTLY berserk against Asgore and Flowey with NO possibility to take control of the situation. This is strongly hinted that Chara took control of Frisk in that moment.

Honestly, it was disgusting and impressive at the same time. You simply made the deal with the devil by yourself.

And the 'best' (wooooooooorst) part? It alters the pacifist ending forever. Damn ...

You might want to put this in a spoiler tag.

While I meant the post-Genocide Pacifist ending, that would've been pretty shocking to see as well. I imagine the players went in thinking they'd fight Asgore only to have the ending happen. And not to mention, they probably pressed 'do not' when Chara wanted to destroy the world.

[Erdall]

You might want to put this in a spoiler tag.

While I meant the post-Genocide Pacifist ending, that would've been pretty shocking to see as well. I imagine the players went in thinking they'd fight Asgore only to have the ending happen. And not to mention, they probably pressed 'do not' when Chara wanted to destroy the world.

I believe Chara was merely teasing you just for their own curiosity. They wanted to know how really far was really willing Frisk's inner desire of destructive power after such genocide path they took. In the end, you incidentally let Chara take control over their very own SOUL, despite you may agreed to destroy the world or not. The very inner demon that YOU gave your own name, which pretty much shows like a partly, yet quite vital reflection of your own persona.

Edited January 18, 2016 by Erdall

[Clarinets]

I believe Chara was merely teasing you just for their own curiosity. They wanted to know how really far was really willing Frisk's inner desire of destructive power after such genocide path they took. In the end, you incidentally let Chara take control over their very own SOUL, despite you may agreed to destroy the world or not. The very inner demon that YOU gave your own name, which pretty much shows like a partly, yet quite vital reflection of your own persona.

I was talking about the Chara jumpscare and the shock factor that would've had. I do agree with your point, though. I haven't legitimately played or watched the Genocide Route, but I know a lot about what happens in it.

[nocturne]

I feel like alphys doesn't get enough credit, she's adorable.

[Alastor15243]

My thoughts on the game:

I played through Undertale and while I enjoyed it, and found the humor to be brilliant, perfectly channeling and somehow SURPASSING the humor of Earthbound...

...I didn't really find many of the characters as sympathetic as the game probably intended me to, and I really didn't agree with the game's overall moral narrative.

Due to killing only two types of monsters, a one-of-a-kind named one and a generic formless nameless blob monster, I thought that every named enemy was unique and that every time I re-encountered them, it was the exact same one I had just convinced to leave me alone deciding they wanted to murder me again, and so I came away from the game with the feeling that the vast majority of the characters I encountered were terrifyingly child-murder-happy individuals I couldn't relate to with their constant wisecracking during their attempted murder and their constant re-committal to the attempt. Once I found out that Snowdrake was one of only a few one-of-a-kind monsters, my opinion didn't improve, because that seemed exceptionally poor design to have these quirky, personalized and humanized monsters have dozens of identical clones with the exact same appearance, personality and given name waiting in the wings to try and kill me again.

I didn't gel with how the murderous actions of everyone but the player character were played for laughs, I didn't feel that a quirky Earthboundian dramedy was the right genre in which to tackle gamer behavior and in-game violence, as the game's humor created characters that, while hilarious and incredibly charming, would almost assuredly be classified as dangerous psychopaths in the real world, which undermined the moral significantly for me.

I also deeply resented the choice to have Undyne and the general monster population morally judge you based on information that they couldn't possibly possess (the fact that you can warp time and can't be killed, and thus your life is never in danger and self-defense is inexcusable), holding you to a ridiculously high moral standard that they can't possibly know applies to you. It's either bad writing or it has very unpleasant implications for how they could possibly come to that conclusion without knowing about the extreme circumstances.

I also took exception to the fact that the game came dangerously close to giving the moral high ground to a group of people who are attempting to harness the souls of murdered children to commit a genocide. That was a dangerously extreme route Toby decided to go with for the antagonists, and I simply couldn't sympathize with them, because their plan was so distasteful to me and I felt gross when the game tried to make them sympathetic and paint me as a bad person for not being Gandhi about the issue.

I don't regret playing the game, but I wouldn't say it's one of the best games ever, and I think its narrative has significant flaws.

Edited January 30, 2016 by Alastor15243

[Samias]

My thoughts on the game:

I played through Undertale and while I enjoyed it, and found the humor to be brilliant, perfectly channeling and somehow SURPASSING the humor of Earthbound...

...I didn't really find many of the characters as sympathetic as the game probably intended me to, and I really didn't agree with the game's overall moral narrative.

Due to killing only two types of monsters, a one-of-a-kind named one and a generic formless nameless blob monster, I thought that every named enemy was unique and that every time I re-encountered them, it was the exact same one I had just convinced to leave me alone deciding they wanted to murder me again, and so I came away from the game with the feeling that the vast majority of the characters I encountered were terrifyingly child-murder-happy individuals I couldn't relate to with their constant wisecracking during their attempted murder and their constant re-committal to the attempt. Once I found out that Snowdrake was one of only a few one-of-a-kind monsters, my opinion didn't improve, because that seemed exceptionally poor design to have these quirky, personalized and humanized monsters have dozens of identical clones with the exact same appearance, personality and given name waiting in the wings to try and kill me again.

I didn't gel with how the murderous actions of everyone but the player character were played for laughs, I didn't feel that a quirky Earthboundian dramedy was the right genre in which to tackle gamer behavior and in-game violence, as the game's humor created characters that, while hilarious and incredibly charming, would almost assuredly be classified as dangerous psychopaths in the real world, which undermined the moral significantly for me.

I also deeply resented the choice to have Undyne and the general monster population morally judge you based on information that they couldn't possibly possess (the fact that you can warp time and can't be killed, and thus your life is never in danger and self-defense is inexcusable), holding you to a ridiculously high moral standard that they can't possibly know applies to you. It's either bad writing or it has very unpleasant implications for how they could possibly come to that conclusion without knowing about the extreme circumstances.

I also took exception to the fact that the game came dangerously close to giving the moral high ground to a group of people who are attempting to harness the souls of murdered children to commit a genocide. That was a dangerously extreme route Toby decided to go with for the antagonists, and I simply couldn't sympathize with them, because their plan was so distasteful to me and I felt gross when the game tried to make them sympathetic and paint me as a bad person for not being Gandhi about the issue.

I don't regret playing the game, but I wouldn't say it's one of the best games ever, and I think its narrative has significant flaws.

Have you considered a 2nd playthrough where you don't kill anything? There's a few things that change in the true pacifist ending that might make you think about what the antagonists are really about. The characters ARE always going to judge you (and Alphys is always watching you, she has cameras everywhere after all, and Sans seemingly has a few powers of time-space manipulation himself) but the two extreme endings of true pacifist and genocide tie everything together in a fairly neat bow. Not that the game IS perfect, and I think Undyne in particular is one of the weaker, more one-note characters of the main cast. The frequency of random encounters is also more of a frustration considering how many steps some enemies take to pacify when you're trying not to kill them. Bullet hell is a hurdle and a strange choice of combat system to include in a game with such high appeal for story-driven gamers and non-gamers, even if combat against bosses has set patterns every time. Ending on a neutral path is definitely unfulfilling and leaves more questions than answers. But the game absolutely does NOT treat the monsters as being absolved of guilt for attacking you, no matter what their reasons are. They might justify it to themselves but I think the game makes it fairly obvious that blood for blood leaves no one happy.

[FoxwolfJackson]

I had honestly heard of this game through various internet memes and a .GIF that showed the very beginning of the game (with Flowey)...

I have to say that, after purchasing it on Steam and trying it out, I found this game to be quite overhyped and not deserving of the praise it got. It was a good time-killer and I guess I had some fun playing it (since I made it to the ending), but it's nowhere near "best game of 2015", let alone "best game ever".

The story was minimalistic and I had a lot of trouble caring about what was going on, to be honest. The characters, I really didn't care for, except for Sans and his quirky humor and nature. The whole idea of resetting and having dialogue altered from certain characters was a nice touch, but it felt more of a gimmick or a novelty that it relied too heavily on. Also, Dr. Alphys was probably THE singular most annoying character I have come across in any recent game I've played. The part where it's constantly interrupting you because of Alphys constantly updating social media and you had to endure every post was downright grating on my nerves and really made me consider quitting. The battle system was intriguing, but for a bullet hell, it was FAR too easy, even on a true pacifist run. I only died once, and that was to Asgore.

Although, all of the above is passable if the art style wasn't so bad. Really, it's terrible. And Temmie is CLEARLY an attempt to catch internet humor. The whole game seems to be trying to use internet humor to try to make it more interesting, as if trying to ride a Tumblr wave or something...

The best part of the game (and the part that was even semi-enjoyable to me) was the soundtrack, and even then, that was mediocre at best. Some of the chiptune-sounding music really sounded like he was trying too hard to sound like 8-bit classic chiptunes, which is weird because the game is supposed to be inspired by Earthbound, which is a 16-bit game (and music is my specialty, so I may be slightly nitpicky). There does not seem to really be any cohesion with the soundtrack, as if he just wrote a few good songs, put it together, and called it a soundtrack. There was no particular style it was written in (some tracks were chiptune, some sounded like a piano written with a terrible .VST, some was jazz, and "Hopes and Dreams" felt like a straight rip from Anamanaguchi. I could go on in a more technical aspect, but I think that's enough...

To be honest, I don't know what made it popular, outside of the fact that probably since Toby Fox did the music of Homestuck, he simply had a small plug somewhere in the Homestuck fandom of "hey, I did the music here, check out my game", then some let's player got a hold of the game, and it took off from there.

Honestly, Undertale is right up there with Five Nights at Freddy's in being one of the most over-hyped, overrated games that probably only got popular because a let's player did it. It really doesn't even come close to deserving the hype it got and, honestly, was not worth $8... more like $5 or so.

Edited January 30, 2016 by FoxwolfJackson

[Clarinets]

I had honestly heard of this game through various internet memes and a .GIF that showed the very beginning of the game (with Flowey)...

I have to say that, after purchasing it on Steam and trying it out, I found this game to be quite overhyped and not deserving of the praise it got. It was a good time-killer and I guess I had some fun playing it (since I made it to the ending), but it's nowhere near "best game of 2015", let alone "best game ever".

The story was minimalistic and I had a lot of trouble caring about what was going on, to be honest. The characters, I really didn't care for, except for Sans and his quirky humor and nature. The whole idea of resetting and having dialogue altered from certain characters was a nice touch, but it felt more of a gimmick or a novelty that it relied too heavily on. Also, Dr. Alphys was probably THE singular most annoying character I have come across in any recent game I've played. The part where it's constantly interrupting you because of Alphys constantly updating social media and you had to endure every post was downright grating on my nerves and really made me consider quitting. The battle system was intriguing, but for a bullet hell, it was FAR too easy, even on a true pacifist run. I only died once, and that was to Asgore.

Although, all of the above is passable if the art style wasn't so bad. Really, it's terrible. And Temmie is CLEARLY an attempt to catch internet humor. The whole game seems to be trying to use internet humor to try to make it more interesting, as if trying to ride a Tumblr wave or something...

The best part of the game (and the part that was even semi-enjoyable to me) was the soundtrack, and even then, that was mediocre at best. Some of the chiptune-sounding music really sounded like he was trying too hard to sound like 8-bit classic chiptunes, which is weird because the game is supposed to be inspired by Earthbound, which is a 16-bit game (and music is my specialty, so I may be slightly nitpicky). There does not seem to really be any cohesion with the soundtrack, as if he just wrote a few good songs, put it together, and called it a soundtrack. There was no particular style it was written in (some tracks were chiptune, some sounded like a piano written with a terrible .VST, some was jazz, and "Hopes and Dreams" felt like a straight rip from Anamanaguchi. I could go on in a more technical aspect, but I think that's enough...

To be honest, I don't know what made it popular, outside of the fact that probably since Toby Fox did the music of Homestuck, he simply had a small plug somewhere in the Homestuck fandom of "hey, I did the music here, check out my game", then some let's player got a hold of the game, and it took off from there.

Honestly, Undertale is right up there with Five Nights at Freddy's in being one of the most over-hyped, overrated games that probably only got popular because a let's player did it. It really doesn't even come close to deserving the hype it got and, honestly, was not worth $8... more like $5 or so.

'I guess I had some fun playing it' What whiny, stubborn wording.

To be honest, when people complain about the story, I usually tell them to give the True Pacifist ending a try. But it seems you've already done that from this paragraph? What are your thoughts on the characters other than Alphys or Sans? I get where you're coming from with your opinion on Alphys (even I thought that text thing was kind of overdone) but

1. Would you seriously quit playing a game over a 15-20 minute section of mildly entertaining text dialogue?

2. Can you find a reason to hate this character that isn't as unsubstantiated as this?

Do you dislike the art style because it's 8-bit or because it's quirky and cute (is that how you would describe the art style on a technical level? I think so)? I don't mind your opinion if it's the latter but if it's the former then that opinion is just bad. I don't know how else to say it. I don't know what 'Internet humor' means but according to Wikipedia you're using the term wrong. And aside from some anime and RPG meta-jab jokes what is there that could even be considered 'internet humor'?

'and the part that was even enjoyable to me' Can you stop with this pretentious wording? Anyways, could you give some examples of music that were 'trying too hard to sound like classic 8-bit chiptunes'? Also, soundtracks don't need to have cohesion to sound nice. I understand why it could be viewed as such, but all the songs in a soundtrack being of similar genres isn't necessary as long as the individual songs are good and play at the right times.

I mean, there was a large Kickstarter that made the game popular but you know, who cares about research. He might've spread the game to/through the Homestuck fandom, though, but literally every developer would spread their game to fandoms they have connections to.

Comparing Undertale to Five Nights at Freddy's (the original is the only one I've played so I'll only compare that to Undertale)? That 'horror' game with stale jumpscares (with the exception of Golden Freddy, who was a pretty interesting idea) and boring gameplay compared to a fun RPG with a cute story and a wonderful cast of characters with exceptional, hilarious writing and really good music? And as I said earlier, it's popularity stems from the Kickstarter for it, even if Let's Players probably helped spread word of the game after it's release.

I don't mind your opinion but you presented in such a pretentious manner. Please don't do that when describing your unpopular opinion, people won't like it.

[Samias]

@FoxwolfJackson

The bullet hell being extremely easy for a bullet hell game is intentional... The patterns are meant for beginners to clear through determination, considering people who don't play the genre will almost undoubtably die at least once to Mettaton and Asgore. Maybe even Undyne and Papyrus. There are a large number of people who find the game nearly unbeatable without the high armor and extra invincibility frames of the Temmie armor. I don't think "game too easy" is a fault because bullet hell isn't meant to be a draw. In fact it forces a lot of people out of their comfort zone. I think a common response to the battle system is "I don't like bullet hell as a genre but I put up for it for this game because I liked the characters".

Also Temmie is just one of the artists having fun with a self insert. Yeah she's a bit "LOL ranDUM XD" but it's such a minor component of the game. A lot of artists like to have a derpy representation of themselves and the village itself is mind of a cute homage to Mr. Saturn, but the weird language is instead a derpy one.

Alphys is definitely annoying... At first. She's irritating on purpose, especially through Hotlands. Her texting constantly interrupting is teeth gritting levels of "Shut up! You aren't helping!" But Mettaton spells out exactly why she was annoying. She wanted to be a hero too. She desperately wants to redeem herself and be a part of your story. And Alphys is extremely self aware of her flaws and has anxiety about revealing the truth behind everything. And after Asriel and the fallen human, she is the third most responsible character for the events of the game unfolding the way they did, unable to talk about her failed experiments in a truthful way. I found her full story transformed her into a character I was annoyed by into one I sympathized with and wished I could help.

That said you're entitled to feel the way you do. The game is briskly paced and doesn't spend more than an hour or two on each character, so they have to cram in a lot of personality into a few moments. For some characters like Papyrus, he has just the right amount of banter and the encounters are brief but funny. He's also very straightforward as a character. But then Undyne has an extremely violent personality played off for laughs after an intense chase scene, and further interaction with her, while funny, doesn't warm the heart the same way Papyrus does. Liking Alphys relies on the premise that you forgive her after her plan to impress you through manipulation is foiled by Mettaton. Personally I feel the game is effective and getting me to feel emotional about the all the characters eevn though the script is not particularly lengthy but I'm not sure I would feel the same way if I spent a ton of time reading people's fanfiction and hyped up analyses online before playing the game.

The music is clearly only a handful of songs rearranged throughout the game. There's only something like less than 10 songs and I disagree it's trying too hard to be chiptuned or that Toby is ripping off Anamanaguchi. That shitty MIDI piano sample sounds entirely intentional, just like some of the sometimes questionable sprite work. If the music sounded too high quality, I think it would be out of place. But compositionally everything is extremely catchy and there are tons of amazing covers and arrangements on the internet.

[Tryhard]

'I guess I had some fun playing it' What whiny, stubborn wording.

To be honest, when people complain about the story, I usually tell them to give the True Pacifist ending a try. But it seems you've already done that from this paragraph? What are your thoughts on the characters other than Alphys or Sans? I get where you're coming from with your opinion on Alphys (even I thought that text thing was kind of overdone) but

1. Would you seriously quit playing a game over a 15-20 minute section of mildly entertaining text dialogue?

2. Can you find a reason to hate this character that isn't as unsubstantiated as this?

Do you dislike the art style because it's 8-bit or because it's quirky and cute (is that how you would describe the art style on a technical level? I think so)? I don't mind your opinion if it's the latter but if it's the former then that opinion is just bad. I don't know how else to say it. I don't know what 'Internet humor' means but according to Wikipedia you're using the term wrong. And aside from some anime and RPG meta-jab jokes what is there that could even be considered 'internet humor'?

'and the part that was even enjoyable to me' Can you stop with this pretentious wording? Anyways, could you give some examples of music that were 'trying too hard to sound like classic 8-bit chiptunes'? Also, soundtracks don't need to have cohesion to sound nice. I understand why it could be viewed as such, but all the songs in a soundtrack being of similar genres isn't necessary as long as the individual songs are good and play at the right times.

I mean, there was a large Kickstarter that made the game popular but you know, who cares about research. He might've spread the game to/through the Homestuck fandom, though, but literally every developer would spread their game to fandoms they have connections to.

Comparing Undertale to Five Nights at Freddy's (the original is the only one I've played so I'll only compare that to Undertale)? That 'horror' game with stale jumpscares (with the exception of Golden Freddy, who was a pretty interesting idea) and boring gameplay compared to a fun RPG with a cute story and a wonderful cast of characters with exceptional, hilarious writing and really good music? And as I said earlier, it's popularity stems from the Kickstarter for it, even if Let's Players probably helped spread word of the game after it's release.

I don't mind your opinion but you presented in such a pretentious manner. Please don't do that when describing your unpopular opinion, people won't like it.

Why would you not mind his opinion but go on to insert your own opinion when he compared it to Five Nights at Freddy's?

Here's the thing: the art style is meant to emulate 8-bit graphics, and it does it. But the actual art style is fairly simplistic, bland and uninteresting, even for NES games. Whether it was a design decision or not, all of the battler graphics are in black and white when they could have easily been coloured. They have little or no shading on any of them and while serviceable are not fantastic. I think it's completely reasonable to say that the art-style is not good. The story is minimalist, and probably purposely so.

You say anything against Undertale and it is treated as an "unpopular opinion". Ain't saying he wasn't overly harsh and in my opinion off the mark with the music etc. but people aren't going to like anything bad you say about Undertale from what I've seen.

Edited January 30, 2016 by Tryhard

[Clarinets]

Why would you not mind his opinion but go on to insert your own opinion when he compared it to Five Nights at Freddy's?

Here's the thing: the art style is meant to emulate 8-bit graphics, and it does it. But the actual art style is fairly simplistic, bland and uninteresting, even for NES games. Whether it was a design decision or not, all of the battler graphics are in black and white when they could have easily been coloured. They have little or no shading on any of them and while serviceable are not fantastic. I think it's completely reasonable to say that the art-style is not good. The story is minimalist, and probably purposely so.

You say anything against Undertale and it is treated as an "unpopular opinion". Ain't saying he wasn't overly harsh and in my opinion off the mark with the music etc. but people aren't going to like anything bad you say about Undertale from what I've seen.

I don't know. I just didn't like FNaF being compared to Undertale, and sort of overreacted to that.

And yeah, the art style is somewhat boring but I like it's charm. I was just worried he meant he didn't like the 8-Bit graphics in general, which really irritates me. How and why would someone complain about a game not being 'too pixely' if it looks perfectly fine?

Well, considering the size of Undertale's fanbase, I think it's perfectly fair to treat not liking the game as an unpopular opinion. I do have some problems with the game, like the aforementioned Alphys texts. However, I still have the right to have a passive argument with someone (even if I should've been more passive with my response).

[Alastor15243]

Have you considered a 2nd playthrough where you don't kill anything? There's a few things that change in the true pacifist ending that might make you think about what the antagonists are really about. The characters ARE always going to judge you (and Alphys is always watching you, she has cameras everywhere after all, and Sans seemingly has a few powers of time-space manipulation himself) but the two extreme endings of true pacifist and genocide tie everything together in a fairly neat bow. Not that the game IS perfect, and I think Undyne in particular is one of the weaker, more one-note characters of the main cast. The frequency of random encounters is also more of a frustration considering how many steps some enemies take to pacify when you're trying not to kill them. Bullet hell is a hurdle and a strange choice of combat system to include in a game with such high appeal for story-driven gamers and non-gamers, even if combat against bosses has set patterns every time. Ending on a neutral path is definitely unfulfilling and leaves more questions than answers. But the game absolutely does NOT treat the monsters as being absolved of guilt for attacking you, no matter what their reasons are. They might justify it to themselves but I think the game makes it fairly obvious that blood for blood leaves no one happy.

I'd give it another shot, but honestly I don't want to play it again, because recently I've developed this weird condition with my eyes that I'm planning on getting checked out that causes certain types of games, particularly fast-paced, brightly colored ones with tons of moving objects, to screw with my vision for several hours afterwards, and Undertale was one such game. I didn't feel I enjoyed it enough to mess with my eyes another time. I might check it out if I get that eye issue under control though.

[FoxwolfJackson]

'I guess I had some fun playing it' What whiny, stubborn wording.

To be honest, when people complain about the story, I usually tell them to give the True Pacifist ending a try. But it seems you've already done that from this paragraph? What are your thoughts on the characters other than Alphys or Sans? I get where you're coming from with your opinion on Alphys (even I thought that text thing was kind of overdone) but

1. Would you seriously quit playing a game over a 15-20 minute section of mildly entertaining text dialogue?

2. Can you find a reason to hate this character that isn't as unsubstantiated as this?

Do you dislike the art style because it's 8-bit or because it's quirky and cute (is that how you would describe the art style on a technical level? I think so)? I don't mind your opinion if it's the latter but if it's the former then that opinion is just bad. I don't know how else to say it. I don't know what 'Internet humor' means but according to Wikipedia you're using the term wrong. And aside from some anime and RPG meta-jab jokes what is there that could even be considered 'internet humor'?

'and the part that was even enjoyable to me' Can you stop with this pretentious wording? Anyways, could you give some examples of music that were 'trying too hard to sound like classic 8-bit chiptunes'? Also, soundtracks don't need to have cohesion to sound nice. I understand why it could be viewed as such, but all the songs in a soundtrack being of similar genres isn't necessary as long as the individual songs are good and play at the right times.

I mean, there was a large Kickstarter that made the game popular but you know, who cares about research. He might've spread the game to/through the Homestuck fandom, though, but literally every developer would spread their game to fandoms they have connections to.

Comparing Undertale to Five Nights at Freddy's (the original is the only one I've played so I'll only compare that to Undertale)? That 'horror' game with stale jumpscares (with the exception of Golden Freddy, who was a pretty interesting idea) and boring gameplay compared to a fun RPG with a cute story and a wonderful cast of characters with exceptional, hilarious writing and really good music? And as I said earlier, it's popularity stems from the Kickstarter for it, even if Let's Players probably helped spread word of the game after it's release.

I don't mind your opinion but you presented in such a pretentious manner. Please don't do that when describing your unpopular opinion, people won't like it.

Really, whiny wording? I cannot honestly express how I feel about a game without having jump down my throat? It is how I said it was. It was a decent time killer and I did play it until the end, but it hardly caught enough of my interest to merit a replay, nor did it catch enough of my interest to really rant and rave about it's qualities or even recommend it to anyone.

Would I really quit a game over 15-20 minutes of annoying text dialogue? Normally, no. But the game itself already was borderline not catching my attention. Call it the "straw that broke the camel's back" if that will help convey why I potentially nearly stopped after having to deal with that. Also "mildly entertaining" is subjective. You might have found it mildly entertaining. I found it utterly annoying. Someone else might disagree with you and say that the texting portion was endearing and amazing and that you're being "arrogant" for only calling it "mildly entertaining".

Also, first impressions make a huge impact on how a character is perceived, mind you. Alphys does become marginally better later on, but it hardly becomes justification for how irritating her initial debut in the story is.

My thoughts on the characters besides Alphys and Sans?

Papyrus honestly annoyed me, but in a kind of endearing sort of way, something like when you have a little sibling and they just want to try so hard to impress you. I mean, there is also the dating dynamic, but if you minus that, Papyrus really reminds me something like a little sibling.

Undyne kinda really annoyed me for the most part. In my humble opinion, I think she was the weakest of the characters that had any focus.

Toriel seems like a weird paradox. One minute, she's acting motherly, and the next she's attacking you. I get her motivation and where she's coming from, but the switchover, honestly, seemed far too abrupt.

Flowey was awesome. I really enjoyed the character concept. However, I do have many gripes with his "final" form when you fight against him in the normal route. Like, the artstyle is such a cognitive dissonance that it's really jarring to the suspension of disbelief. In a game that sports some pixel art, having what looks like a 3D rendered eldritch abomination just killed the character. There is some merit to the phrase "less is more" and, honestly, I think he would have been more intimidating and creepy if he was fought only in his flower form (albeit, with the scary, sadistic face).

But I digress...

I dislike the art style for neither of those reasons. I dislike it, because it is low-quality and highly simplistic. Anyone who knows me well enough knows that I simply love the 8-bit chipart that exists. Much respect goes to those who can do amazing pixel art. This game... takes it to a simplistic level. I could go into a whole spiel about how Earthbound (which this game is a tribute to) is a 16-bit game, not 8-bit, but that's really all subjective and hardly worth going into. Heck, it looks more like something from DOS than from an NES game. The interface from the battle system forcefully reminds me of some of the ASCII games on the Windows 3.1/DOS computers I grew up on.

"Also, soundtracks don't need to have cohesion to sound nice."

That is opinion, and you are quite entitled to that. However, as a music composer and performer and all that jazz (no pun intended), music is probably the biggest make-or-break for a video game for myself. Some of the best video game soundtracks are amazing, because of their cohesion and uniformed nature. Take the soundtracks for Bravely Default, Shin Megami Tensei IV, Skies of Arcadia, Chrono Trigger, or even Earthbound (yes, a lot of Earthbound's music does stay within a specific genre, although the name eludes me at the moment... I think it's "acid house").

"individual songs are good and play at the right times."

Opinion, but one that's widely regarded with a lot of people who listen to music soundtracks. However, individual songs that sound good and play at the right times make a decent (or even good) soundtrack. A cohesive soundtrack that utilizes cyclic form, reinforces and restates musical themes, etc. like the Bravely Default soundtrack (there's a specific musical phrase in the overture that happens at least five or six other times in the soundtrack in various different applications and it is thematically appropriate at each reprise) is what makes a great soundtrack.

"I mean, there was a large Kickstarter that made the game popular but you know, who cares about research. He might've spread the game to/through the Homestuck fandom, though, but literally every developer would spread their game to fandoms they have connections to."

Not every developer utilizes fandoms they have connections to.

"Comparing Undertale to Five Nights at Freddy's (the original is the only one I've played so I'll only compare that to Undertale)? That 'horror' game with stale jumpscares (with the exception of Golden Freddy, who was a pretty interesting idea) and boring gameplay compared to a fun RPG with a cute story and a wonderful cast of characters with exceptional, hilarious writing and really good music?"

I find the hypocritical irony of how you point out my "arrogant" or "pretentious" wording, when you used pretty much the same thing in describing FNAF, to be quite amusing. Some will disagree with your assessments of "stale jumpscares" and "boring gameplay" (clearly, since Let's Players have done this game as well) in addition to other assessments such as "fun RPG", "cute story", "wonderful cast of characters", and "really good music". The thing the two have in common is they have grown to be overly popular and overly hyped and overrated. They aren't bad games in their own regard, but they have been hyped up to the point that there is literally no way that it can live up to the hype that people have given it.

Also, I find it hilarious that I'm being called pretentious and/or arrogant (pretty much the same thing. Being arrogant would be saying "I can make a better soundtrack than Toby Fox did", which I clearly did not do. Not only is "better" a subjective word, but any soundtrack I create is going to be much different than this one, making the comparison between the two null and void. I apologize if my verbose vernacular comes off as "pretentious", but that is the way I speak all the time. I do not look down on other people; merely, I find the most proper way to express something in the most effective way possible.

@FoxwolfJackson

Personally I feel the game is effective and getting me to feel emotional about the all the characters eevn though the script is not particularly lengthy

That right there is probably the main issue. Honestly, I didn't really get emotional about the characters. Perhaps it was the way they were presented. Perhaps it was because everyone and their mother shoved down my throat "YOU'RE GOING TO LOVE SANS!!!!" the way KH fangirls were screaming "ROXAS!! ROXAS!!" in 2006. Perhaps it was just that Toby Fox didn't write the script in a way I could empathize with, but like above, I didn't have much of an emotional connection to anyone... except probably Sans. The only thing that really appealed to me emotionally was Sans whole speech about why he didn't look forward to going to the surface. His implication that he knows what is going on was actually really touching and heartbreaking.

Then again, it's not much of Toby Fox's fault, since there's plenty of stuff out there most people find "emotional" that I roll a "meh" to, like Gurren Lagann or (rather recently) Dr. Horrible's Sing Along Blog. It takes a deeper level of connection and development before I become really vested into something, and a game as short as this really didn't do it for me. Perhaps if it was a 20-ish hour RPG with more dialogue, more interactions, and more ways for me to get immersed with the characters, I probably would have the same reaction as the fandom, but... that's a personal opinion, TBH.

Well, considering the size of Undertale's fanbase, I think it's perfectly fair to treat not liking the game as an unpopular opinion.

Just because something is popular does not mean it is right. Twilight and 50 Shades of Gray are insanely popular books. High School Musical was a cult classic. By your logic, not liking any of the above is an "unpopular opinion". Does that mean if you make a scathing comment about Twilight's quality (or the lack thereof), I have the right to jump down your throat for "pretentiously" posting an unpopular opinion?

Legit question and not rhetorical, BTW.

Edited February 2, 2016 by FoxwolfJackson

[Star and Moon]

I got really angry when the Honest Trailer described Papyrus as "narcissistic" when he's easily the nicest character in the game.

Edited February 2, 2016 by Star and Moon

[Original Alear]

There are enough ppl in the world for undertale to be both popular and unpopular.

[Clarinets]

I got really angry when the Honest Trailer described Papyrus as "narcissistic" when he's easily the nicest character in the game.

Do you know what 'narcissistic' means? It has nothing to do with how nice or rude a person is.

Also nevermind about my response to FoxWolfJackson's post, I disagreed with their opinion and chose to be a jerk about it. Sorry about that.

Edited February 4, 2016 by Clarinets

[Alastor15243]

Actually, I was reminded of another lingering question I had about this game, one that really unsettled me how I couldn't answer it, and I was wondering if somebody who's played all the paths and is familiar with the hidden Easter Egg lore can confirm this for me:

Are the eventual fates of each of the 6 children ever concretely confirmed? Do we know for a fact that Asgore killed all of them? Were any of them killed by other monsters, or one of the bosses like Undyne?

This question really stuck out at me, because unlike the player character child, the six children before them were not possessed by the player, and were therefore not emotionally dead, totally pain-numb avatars with chronomancy-induced immortality. These were, presumably, actual lost terrified children in a hostile environment who were all vulnerable to, and eventually succumbed to, gruesome painful deaths at the hands of monsters.

Needless to say, killing any of these children for any reason, let alone for the purpose of fueling a genocide, is an inexcusable crime. A crime that between 1 and 6 of the monsters in the story are guilty of. Was it just Asgore, who knew full well that what he had done was beyond redemption? If so, how did the belongings of these children wind up haphazardly scattered around the world? And if it wasn't only Asgore who killed one of those children... well that begs the question... who among the cast killed a child?

Edited February 11, 2016 by Alastor15243